posted
Let's think a bit about planetside transporter facilities on Federation planets. In general, we see so few of them. Even in the TNG era, people use shuttles to get around. But just how common would they actually be?
The only time we've REALLY seen a planetside transporter facility is at Starfleet HQ in "Contagion". Typically, fleet policy seems to mean that you have to beam to another active transporter whenever possible. So, where the transporter facilities down on Starbase 11 in "The Menagerie"?
Also, you'd think that beaming places would be restricted. Sisko used to beam right into his New Orleans living room from San Francisco during his early Academy days. Assuming N.O. had one, shouldn't he beam there? And if you didn't have to, why didn't Picard just beam straight to his house in "Family"?
As for the number of transporters - in a novel based on Captain Kirk (think it was one where he had retired) it was stated that civilian transport was not as advanced as that of Starfleet's. It took days even weeks to travel across the solar system instead of days . . . or something like that. I'll try and dig out the book. Think it was Ashes of Eden . . .
-------------------- If you cant convince them, confuse them.
posted
I think it was about Sisko regarding using transporters to go home for evening meals. It was stated that he used up a significant amount of transporter credits to do this. I can't remeber the line, but it was something like that. So one would imagine that transporters are a carefully regulated resource, and using one is not as easy as getting into a taxi, one, whether military or civilian has assigned/rationed transporter privileges.
(also, Mark I believe you meant to say the episode 'Conspiracy', not 'Contagion'...? ;-)
-------------------- "To the Enterprise and the Stargazer. Old girlfriends we'll never meet again." - Scotty
posted
It's been a while, but didn't Voyager's "Non Sequitur" give the implication that there were subways in use? I have a vague recollection of Harry Kim walking past one of these entrances. Also, in one shot of Starfleet Headquarters, we see a clear tube with a cylindrical train gliding through it. We also saw the use of air trams in The Motion Picture. It's how Kirk arrived at Starfleet Headquarters.
-------------------- The philosopher's stone. Those who possess it are no longer bound by the laws of equivalent exchange in alchemy. They gain without sacrifice and create without equal exchange. We searched for it, and we found it.
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posted
I don't know if this is prodigious memory from me, or just wishful thinking, but in that scene with Kim in San Francisco the entrance was a maglev train access.
posted
While we're waiting, I'd like to speculate that civilian transporters are in fact far more advanced than Starfleet ones. In certain fields, that is. Think of Starfleet transporters as M-113 APCs: they will get you to the destination across rough country under enemy fire, but you definitely won't like the ride. Civilian models would be more like passenger trains: very smooth ride, ten times faster than M113, but you have to go where the rails take you, you have to share with a couple of hundred others, and you have to live by the timetables.
LaForge insists in "Realm of Fear" that transporters are the safest form of travel. This need not directly mean that they are the most used, back on Earth - after all, air travel is the safest form today, but partially exactly because it ISN'T used all that much.
Yet I could see Earth dwellers using transporters far more frequently than Starfleet heroes. Ordinary people would use home or communal platforms in one end and gigantic rapid-throughput terminals near malls and parks and stadiums and whatever draws the crowds in the 23rd-24th century. Privileged folks would have armbands like the one Paris had snatched in "Non Sequitur", for effortless site-to-site. And instead of transporter chiefs and "energize!"'s and pattern buffers and emitter arrays, there would be streamlined automation and hardwired connections from pad to pad.
If this sort of system was in place, then many people would probably prefer *not* to use it. It's a great incentive to take a walk when you know that if your feet get tired, you can beam back to your armchair instantly. If you have to haul groceries, just let the system haul them for you and go take a walk in the meantime. If you want to visit gramps at Palo Alto, you take the scenic route for the thrill - the maglev train or the airship. Only the dull commuting would be done by the transporter.
Things like subways would probably be retained as historical curiosities, in addition to serving as active means of public transportation. A romantic ride on a horse-drawn carriage in Vienna, a scenic tour of San Francisco aboard one of those rustic air trams... The thing that would probably disappear would be "roads through nowhere" - highways between cities etc. People would skip the roads when going from city to city, using either hovercars or public transportation.
capped
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posted
I dont think that theres a transporter in every garage yet. Its a pretty complicated piece of equipment that needs a specially trained operator. (i.e. a specialist, transporter chief).
And I dont think mass transit (shuttles, trams & trains) would be around quite so much if everyone could transport easily
If you were Joe Q. Public in the 24th century, and you needed to get across town, it probably would be much easier to use mass transit (subway or train or somethin) or a vehicle to go there, rather than take a vehicle to a transporter station.
Although it seems likely transporters are commonly used to get OFF the planet, i just cant see the justification of using one to get AROUND the planet, unless you are trvelling cross continentally, as Sisko did (and it seems that they limit usage, possibly because it creates inefficiency to have a lot of people transporting for dumb reasons all the time)
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posted
Sisko probably enjoyed the special services of Starfleet Academy, where personnel transporters would be in abundance. For training use if not for anything else.
Still, I think a transporter in every garage sounds quite reasonable. Remember that we are not speaking starship transporters: these would be completely different machines, probably slaved to a central unit and lacking any user-adjustability. Instead of an independent station, there would be the barest essentials and a long solid cable leading to a transporter system hub.
And a lot of it would be site-to-site in the TNG era, too. So all you would need would be that "Non Sequitur" bracelet and a big government-operated machine hidden somewhere beneath the city or in orbit.
Something like that would probably be a lot easier to do than designing and building a starship transporter. We had trains long before we had automobiles, and telephones long before radio transceivers, even though the former seemingly required a greater infrastructure than the latter. When the infrastructure is "allowed" to be bulky and immobile and centralized, the operations themselves become smoother and cheaper and simpler.
posted
That sounds reasonable, Timo. We already do the same thing today with our basic utilities such as water, power, and sewage. In that time frame, transporters may be included as a normal utility.
However, I don't know if site-to-site transporting would be as common as you think. When Sisko was discussing with Jake how he always beamed into the dining room for dinner, he seemed to emphasize the point that his parents didn't make anything of it. He could have been emphasizing the entire "I'm in the Academy but I'm beaming home for supper," but he also could have been emphasizing that "I'm not only beaming home because I'm so homesick but I'm beaming right into the dining room."
I guess I'm just looking at this from an etiquette point of view. I would consider it very rude for my parents to just beam into the entry foyer of my house. I'd be willing to bet that secretaries may not enjoy random people just beaming into their offices as well. Uninvited guests and all that. I can see transporter units set up on street corners much like we have telephone booths today. You can still get fairly close to your destination, but, damn it, you need some exercise!
-------------------- The philosopher's stone. Those who possess it are no longer bound by the laws of equivalent exchange in alchemy. They gain without sacrifice and create without equal exchange. We searched for it, and we found it.
quote:It's been a while, but didn't Voyager's "Non Sequitur" give the implication that there were subways in use? I have a vague recollection of Harry Kim walking past one of these entrances.
Yes, and the maglev/subway was labeled as "Trans Fransisco", IIRC
posted
Sisko's dad also once mentioned "beaming in the furniture" when someone was moving. It could be that portable "cargo" transporters, for non-organic material only, are even more common.
Also remember, this is a utopian society where people take the time to smell the roses and do things the long way because the have the time and are unafraid. I would imagine that there are people who walk or take conventional transportation simply because they prefer it. Transprters may be an "in case you need it" kind of feature.
It's also possible that use of transporters has been restricted from individual use for security reasons. There's the possibility that only liscened facilities can operate these. They may even all be Starfleet operated.
capped
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posted
If it was so common, why did Sisko have to specify 'i beamed into the living room' .. wouldnt everyone around him say 'well of course you did you idiot, everyone does' if it was really common?
I dont say 'i drove right up to my dads driveway' i say 'i drove home for dinner' if it was really that common he wold have just said 'i beamed home for dinner' not 'i beamed right into the living room' he was trying to point out he did an odd thing because he was a homesick kid, and not everyone beams around the country.
-------------------- "Are you worried that your thoughts are not quite.. clear?"
capped
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posted
I dont think it cleared anything up.. just making a point. Given the lack of any evidence from the show, im not even really sure what the state of 24th century beaming is..
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