Flare Sci-Fi Forums: The Ten Commandments vs. the Constitution

This is topic The Ten Commandments vs. the Constitution in forum The Flameboard at Flare Sci-Fi Forums.

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Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :

With a name like Tencommandments.org, how bad can a site be? You expect essays on things like "Thou shalt not kill" and "Honor thy father and mother." Sounds good to me.

But that isn't what you'll find. Instead, such lovely passages as the following grace the pages:

"We, the corporeal citizens of America (and the world community), should acquiesce to the fact that many of the so-called "rights" and "freedoms" guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States, its Amendments and the United Nations' Universal Declaration of Human Rights are not genuine rights and freedoms, but moral evils in the sight of God.

We should, therefore, not be the least disquieted at the thought of such "rights" and "freedoms" being abridged in any way, as long as only those so-called "rights" and "freedoms" which are truly evil in the sight of God are taken away, and as long as our genuine God-bestowed rights, freedoms and responsibilities to do that which is right in God's sight become state-embraced, state-established, state-guaranteed and state protected, under a new, righteous and perfectly antithetical Constitution - the Moral Law of God, without such a holy Constitution ever being amended in any way, and without the least abridgment of the holy rights, freedoms, responsibilities and rewards such a holy Constitution guarantees."

It goes on like that. I need to go swab out my eyes.

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"And though I once prefered a human being's company, they pale before the monolith that towers over me."
--
They Might Be Giants

[This message was edited by Sol System on April 08, 1999.]

Posted by Curry Monster (Member # 12) on :

Yikes....taking things to a bit of an extreme there. However it is their right to hold that belief....no matter how much we may disagree with it.

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I drink therefore I am.

-Descartes

Posted by Montgomery (Member # 23) on :

Another ugly facet of the human psyche revealed through the prism of the internet....

Whoah, that's a bit deep!

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"Is there anyone there with a gun?"
- On the Hour

Posted by Jubilee (Member # 99) on :

That's just plain scary.
My mother belongs to a group of people that are like that... we call that whole church a cult. I swear, it's gotten to the point where she would do anything "In the name of God" if she could find a passage in the bible that backed it up.
You can imagine what it's like living with her, Me being a Bi-sexual Wiccan. *LOL* .. we get in some very loud arguments sometimes.

But imagine this... if these people, for some reason, begin to make their opinions law, and we end up all living under the Moral Law of God or whatever .... Imagine that. *shudders*... I don't want to live in a world that thinks there are some rights that should be taken away. It's bad enough that people still don't think that women and negros and gays are equal .. but at least we are entitled to SOME rights under the constitution ... and if the moral law of god is put into effect, women can kiss thier freedom goodbye, because they're treated as less in the bible.
Augh!
Not a pleasant thing to think about.
I'm going to go hide under my blankets till it goes away.
*hides*

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If Galileo had lied to save his life, would America, or the West, or Space have been discovered?
And if Columbus had never set sail, would the Earth still be flat?

[This message was edited by Jubilee McGann on April 08, 1999.]

Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :

And I'm a devout agnostic who has been called the AntiChrist at least four times this week for criticizing Governor Bush's stand on the new Texas hate crime bill. I bet I'd last all of two days under that sort of system before I was stoned to death.

*hides under the blankets with Jubilee*

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"Some people call me the Space Cowboy. Yeah! Some call me the Gangster of Love. Some people call me Maurice. Whoo hoo! 'Cause I speak of the Pompatus of Love!" - Steve Miller Band's The Joker

[This message was edited by Siegfried on April 08, 1999.]

Posted by Jeff Raven (Member # 20) on :

You know what? Without The Constitution's evil "Rights" and "freedoms", they wouldn't even be able to say stuff like that!

Kind of ironic, don't you think?

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"Bickering is pointless." - Spock, Miri
"I'm real easy to get along with most of the time, but I don't like bullies, and I don't like threats." - Janeway, State of Flux

Posted by Chimaera on :

This kind of thing is not surprising, since a lot of religions have radical or fanatical elements, and unfortunately this includes Christianity as well. I'm not a religious person myself, so I find it rather unsettling that some of these groups (though not this particular one) find some kind of legitimacy in Western society, especially in the US where they seem to be developing a firm hold on parts of the Republican party.

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"Sometimes you get the bear, and sometimes the bear gets you."
-Commander Riker, USS Enterprise

Posted by Charles Capps (Member # 9) on :

Sol, where do you come up with these things? This is better than the Time Cube.

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"Okay, so I'm not "SANE" so to speak, but uh... I'm the lovable kind of psycho"
http://solareclipse.net/

Posted by RW (Member # 27) on :

If you rely on that outdated book as a basis for your government, no thanks.

Posted by RW (Member # 27) on :

(in which you is, of course, a generic person.

Posted by Jordan on :

For further details on a Theocratic Christian Facist America, I direct your attention to Margaret Atwood's "The Handmaid's Tale."

Read it. And be afraid. Be VERY afraid.

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Goodnight my love...the brightest star in my sky...

Goodnight...you have been my sky, my sun and my moon...

Posted by The First One (Member # 35) on :

I second that. . .

Posted by First of Two (Member # 16) on :

I wouldn't even last two days.
Mostly because on the first day a government like the one they describe took power, I'd do my darndest to overthrow it, for the good of humanity.
Sickening. It's people like these that launched the Inquisition and the Salem murders.
This is as bad as someone promoting white supremacy or other such nonsense.

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*I only SEEM Normal*

Posted by Jeff Raven (Member # 20) on :

I actually read parts of it, and I noticed something. They use quotes from the Bible to justify themselves. Thing is, one can use any part of the bible to justify their actions, no matter how wrong. Case in point, The Temptation of Christ shows how the devil himself did it.

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"Bickering is pointless." - Spock, Miri
"I'm real easy to get along with most of the time, but I don't like bullies, and I don't like threats." - Janeway, State of Flux

Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :

Atwood? Did somebody say Margaret Atwood?

*Begins breaking things.. lots of things....*

*scarspeak* Do not mention that name in my presence!

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"......"
��-The Breen at Internment Camp 371

Posted by Jubilee (Member # 99) on :

True.. one can easily use a quote from the bible to justify smoking Pot ... After all, "Any fruit or tree in the garden except the tree of knowledge"... leaves the Hemp plant fully legal and able to smoke.
And the poppy plant, as well.. which is where Liam's Opiates come from ... and Belladonna, which is a very FESTIVE little purple flower... and Marjoram.... Millions of drugs. *L*

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If Galileo had lied to save his life, would America, or the West, or Space have been discovered?
And if Columbus had never set sail, would the Earth still be flat?

Posted by Jay the Obscure (Member # 19) on :

To quote The Beatles: "Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see."
~Strawberry Fields Forever

And to further prove that I don't have an original thought...to quote the ever mediocre Forrest Gump: "That's all I've got to say about that."

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To make an apple pie from scratch, we must first invent the universe.

~Carl Sagan

[This message was edited by Jay on April 09, 1999.]

Posted by Aethelwer (Member # 36) on :

"Jay is not allowed [to ever come up with a single original thought]..."

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http://frankg.dgne.com/
Robot: "Hey, I'm stuck up here!"
Cyclonus: "Everybody's got to be somewhere."

Posted by Enterprise (Member # 48) on :

With myself being a Christian, I must say that I am apalled about what those 'people' said about the Constitution of this great country I live in.

I believe that we are blessed to have the Constitution, and am sworn to uphold it (both from a personal oath and the one I took at county gov. day).

Also, should I point out the fact that there are a lot of right-wing 'religious terrorists'(hey, that is the only phrase I can think of) out there?

I leave this thread for the time being with the following quote from a very cool song:

quote:

sorry I'm not your cup o' tea
but I don't mind
Yeah, I said I don't mind
at least I know you're thinking about me
yeah, I don't mind
yeah, I said I don't mind

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Brandon "Enterprise" Grasmick
Commanding Officer, USS Sovereign (NX-74222)

"Captain, the Sona crew are willing to negotiate a cease fire. It may have something to do with the fact that we have 3 minutes of air left."
-- Worf

Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges
-- In time of war the law falls silent.

Posted by Baloo (Member # 5) on :

[disclamatory statement: I am a Christian.]

These people are playing God.

God allows us to choose whether to follow his precepts or not. If it isn't a choice, then why doesn't he just slap us all upside the head and tell us: "Cut it out! If I wanted you to have free will, I would've beaten it into you!"

I was once in a "Christian cult" that believed somewhat like that. Perhaps not so extreme, but eventually I felt led to get out. So I did.

The Pharisees had a similar deal going in Judea around 2000 years ago. That's why they felt they had to kill an upstart who explained that the law wasn't designed to get you into heaven, but to illustrate the fact that if you had to do it yourself, you weren't going to make it.

Grace is a gift. Obedience is a gift too, but it's also a choice. If you have no choice, it isn't a gift, nor is it obedience, it's coercion.

The constitution is designed to allow all of us (Americans anyhow) to seek God or not without "official interference". It has been said that you can't legislate morality. The assumption is that it's hopeless to stand against immorality so why bother. I believe that you can only have morality when you yourself choose to uphold the standard.

These people don't want to persuade, but to enslave. They are immoral.

--Baloo

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I'm a Dirtling and PROUD OF IT!

Posted by Enterprise (Member # 48) on :

*Beams Baloo up to the Sovereign, shakes his hand, offers him a ride in the Captain's yacht or a shuttlecraft*

Well said, Baloo. That is kind of the point I was trying to make, only I'm not that good with words (and to think I'm seriously considering becomming a chaplain in the US Military)...

*Offers Baloo a chance to use the helm station and fly the ship*

BTW, you may recognize the quote in my last post from the song 'Cup O' Tea' by the Christian rock group 'Newsboys.'

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Brandon "Enterprise" Grasmick
Commanding Officer, USS Sovereign (NX-74222)

"Captain, the Sona crew are willing to negotiate a cease fire. It may have something to do with the fact that we have 3 minutes of air left."
-- Worf

Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges
-- In time of war the law falls silent.

Posted by Baloo (Member # 5) on :

Sorry. My ignorance runs in brightly-colored wide swatches.

I have heard of the W's, however.

(D*mn! I keep forgetting to whiten his teeth!)

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I'm a Dirtling and PROUD OF IT!

[This message was edited by Baloo on April 10, 1999.]

Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :

*nods approvingly at Frank's TMBG reference*

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"And though I once prefered a human being's company, they pale before the monolith that towers over me."
--
They Might Be Giants

Posted by Cargile (Member # 45) on :

As God, I don't know anything about this. Sorry. I'm kind of busy trying to get life started on other planets. Isn't very easy you know.

But according to your Constitution, they have an unalienable right to express that. Silly as it is.

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What do you mean I'm not kind. Just not you're kind.
--Dave Mustaine
"Peace Sells"
MEGADETH

[This message was edited by Cargile on April 10, 1999.]

Posted by Baloo (Member # 5) on :

Cargile: You make that sound like some sort of tragedy. If the cranks and hatists (coined term) weren't legally allowed to vent their spleens in public without fear of retribution, how would we know who to keep an eye on?

The enemy who loudly announces his intention is your friend. It's the ones who keep their plans a secret that can catch you unawares. Free speech is a double-edged sword. It can cut the wielder as well as the one being attacked with it.

Don't shut the people up who are saying what you don't want to hear. If you succeed, they'll still think it, but you won't know who they are. If they decide to act upon their beliefs, they will catch you unawares.

--Baloo

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I'm a Dirtling and PROUD OF IT!

Posted by Chimaera on :

It is websites like this that make me thankful that Canada has only limited freedom of speech (although this website would probably still be allowed, its only the distribution of hatred that is not).

Baloo: So that's how you find out who the wacos are down there, eh? Up here, we keep them quiet and let CSIS keep an eye on them (CSIS: Canadian Security and Intelligence Service).

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"Sometimes you get the bear, and sometimes the bear gets you."
-Commander Riker, USS Enterprise

Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :

Uh...that's a rather disturbing comment.

The idea behind any freedom of speech is that it only counts when you protect speech you don't like. Anyone can support a right when it doesn't bother the majority. The true test of any moral philosophy is when it is extended to cover your enemy as well as your friend.

To quote Voltaire, "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." More dangerous than a world where some people say things like this is a world where people are not allowed to say things like this.

I agree with Baloo. The reason I posted this thread was because the content of the site violently disagreed with me, and I think it is important for us to always be aware of such things.

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"And though I once prefered a human being's company, they pale before the monolith that towers over me."
--
They Might Be Giants

Posted by Cargile (Member # 45) on :

The Constitution should be amended to replace the words "Right" and "Freedom" with the word "Responcibilty".

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