Did anyone on the ship complain when the videos were shown? If not, then it seems like they're coming down a little harshly on the guy. Sure it's inappropriate, but that's sometimes the point of humor.
These videos were apparently well known. It seems the only reason he's been fired is because the videos leaked to the public and the Navy wants a scapegoat.
Should he have made the videos in the first place? No. But the punishment doesn't seem to fit the offense.
Posted by Pensive's Wetness (Member # 1203) on :
http://flare.solareclipse.net/ultimatebb.php/topic/10/3956/49.html#000726 your a couple days late, Salty... some folks on FB think it was someone who was passed over for promotion thus backstabbing for 36d10+65 points of lethal Political damage. Cause the date of the video is either before or after Ike relieved the Big E. If anything it just makes the job even more stupid for Media types on ship becuase they might not want to make anything other than bland news, canned news from 'official' sources or Bingo Night. i dont think you can fuck away Bingo Night but all the funny skits (usually by the Safety dept) will likely go away.
shame. the Navy i knew as a recruit was nothing like it is now, or was 6 months ago. Yep, The Virgian-Pilot loves to FUCK OVER NAVY folk with a spoon...
Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
According to the article, the bloke was the XO back when the videos were done and were broadcast to the whole crew, so if the US Admiralty really have a problem with this, shouldn't whoever the CO was at the time be getting a reprimand too?
Honestly though it sounds completely harmless and quite tame compared to my experience with "military humour". I tend to agree that they're only kicking up a fuss because it got out to the public and now they're feeling a need to keep up appearances.
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
I see...so military people aren't allowed to let their hair down and have fun? What a load of tosh.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
There were several complaints back thten that were brushed off- only now are those getting attention.
As to "letting their hair down and have fun", making fun of gays is a great way to implicitly condone their harassment.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Right. There's a difference between not being PC and being bigoted. This guy did cross that line. And if there WERE complaints but they were brushed aside, then that's an entirely different story...
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
Oh yes, totally. Hmm, this is looking bad...
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
Oh good grief. This is such a load of crap. I watched the videos, and it's silly, low-budget stuff, some of it even funny. Glenn Close even participates.
The disgrace is that the US freakin' Navy busted a Captain for having once had a sense of humor.
I truly hate how in this day and age nobody's allowed to be a comedian except comedians without the media getting their panties in a twist. (Hell, even that phrasing might do it for them!)
Frankly, if this is the sort of thing they relieve commanding officers for, I have lost faith not in the Captain's ability to command, but in the Navy's ability to defend.
Posted by Pensive's Wetness (Member # 1203) on :
now that i think about it, i guess, maybe, had Capt Honors considered those videos as potentially bad to his career, that he would have retired at 20 years, at the 1st oppertunity, instead of taking command of the Big E. maybe saving face for himself & the navy.
uh, nope. He's a aviator, a career command-minded individual, who cared about his crew. he said Pussy GAY ASS SWO's right? that most is a slap to gays but to most hetro-probably christian folks who really arent tollerant of that sorta thing, thanks to the truely weird shit that flaming gays pull, thus why most folks are still intollerant to outright bigots. The few gays i know are nothing like the sideshow Mary's on Jerry Springer, (To me they are mom's, dad's, what ever. you know, NORMAL?) but i dont think some folks can make the distinction.
but... but... he was bashing SWO's
i think they stopped it (or at least restricted who got to see it) but IKE's folks that did flight sked's included a single panel joke (usually a photoshopped Far Side or soemthing) that sometimes had running gags about Surface Warfair Officers & the rivally between them & aviators. or how several XO's ago, how much they smoked, during UNREPs, or all the jokes about the RO (got congratulated on making Capt just as the boat scams both reactors)... really funny shit. and yet, now, pretty sure they probably dont even do that, out of fear that someone might cry fowl and get in trouble...
im rambling. though i think it's proper that he was relieved (he should have never took the job, instead talking with his bosses about it, the risks), it wasnt his intention to say a mighty 'GO FUCK YOUR SELF non-hetro's!', he still got screwed. probably by someone who either got kicked out by DADT or by someone who got passed over for promotion... i most certainly sence flanking & ranged backstabbing damage 65D6 points of damage taken by Capt Honors, the crew of the Enterprise & the Navy as well...
Posted by Josh (Member # 1884) on :
quote:Originally posted by Guardian 2000: snip
I completely agree with you. This is on the extreme end of political correctness spectrum. At most the guy should be getting a reprimand on his service jacket. If people had that big of an issue with these dumb videos, I'm sure there are proper channels to go through without throwing the guy under a bus on CNN.
Posted by Pensive's Wetness (Member # 1203) on :
ROFL, under the bus. That shit was common on Ike.
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
I knew once of a video posted to YouTube made by a NFO I knew. The net-nannies at the Pentagon found out. The video got pulled right away to keep anyone from getting in trouble. After all, videos showing sailors having fun would clash with the serious tone you see in recruiting commercials.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Guardian 2000: Oh good grief. This is such a load of crap. I watched the videos, and it's silly, low-budget stuff, some of it even funny. Glenn Close even participates.
Bullshit. Her image was clipped from some interview she had nothing to do with it and has some out against the stupid thing.
Anyone can be edited to look like they're "participating" in such nonsense- just loki at youtube.
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
Uh, she was filmed in his chair, with a hat and the parakeet. It's not some super-Photoshop action.
I'm not suggesting that anyone who participates in low-budget local stuff agrees with all that came before or after. She was involved in no more than what she did. If you get hired to appear in a company's commercial, does that imply your support of all that they do and all their commercials before or after?
So like I said, "it's silly, low-budget stuff, some of it even funny. Glenn Close even participates."
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
If I take all your posts out of contect to make you appear to hate gay people, then "you participated" in that? Yeah, Right. Creative editing has been used time and again for comedic purposes to make someone look like they endorse the absurd- and I'm not saying the commander was doing it from malice, only that it's not what she intended (read her version of that footage nad see for yourself).
Any way you look at it, the commander used very poor judgment in making that video- and now it's come back to kill his career- and that's sad, but not terribly unfair.
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
Ugh . . . you are SO not getting it.
Okay, analogy time:
Let's say that all of the sudden Lorne Michaels of Saturday Night Live was dethroned for all of SNL's racy skits. And I say "hey, I watched SNL, it's silly, low-budget stuff, some of it even funny. Glenn Close even participates."
You, to be consistent, would then claim bullshit and that she was photoshopped into the show off some interview or something.
Except (a) that never happened, 'cause she was indeed on it and (b) I never make any suggestion that she was involved in any racy skit.
Don't you see why I find your outrage more than a little ridiculous?
And yes, it's as unfair to Honors as you're being to me (much moreso, actually), because all the sudden the captain of a nuclear-powered warship who has spent months at a time away from home putting himself on the front lines for his country is being taken out of context just as severely, treated, not like the XO he was at the time with a duty to maintain morale, but like he just dropped his tux trousers and peed in a crystal wine goblet at a posh Victorian-era dinner party.
It's a frickin' Navy warship, not a White House dinner. If it makes my airmen feel good in the cockpit to post silly plaques over washing machines and that helps them come home, then I'll bloody well pay for it.
My god, it sounds like they'd bust Captain Picard for his Dixon Hill programs, at that rate . . . "We're sorry, but you're busted to Ensign for running programs set in a misogynistic era when extra rights for homosexuals had not been passed into law . . . "
Seriously? That's what you're defending?
In any case, the greatest disgrace here is our Navy brass . . . they desperately need to man up, put their britches back on, grow a pair, stop being pussies, and all the other evil misogynistic ways of saying that they're being spineless idiots who've deployed too often out of soft San Fran with the song's "flowers in their hair". I don't want such gentle (and genteel) people running my military.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
By our thnking, it would have been just as okay for the commander to disparage black people or asians or jews- after all, "it's a navy warship!" it's all in fun if it lets sailors blow off some steam....right?
Guess what? the captain sets the example for the rest of the ship- anyone looking at those tapes would think that it's fine to speak that way of gays servicemen and women.
It was a dumb thing to do and he did it anyway- now it' time for him to accept consequences- just as any military officer would- for his conduct.
as long as you're making Trek comparisons, I'll give you one- we never saw Picard get on the shipwide and tell jokes about Orion Slave girls or Klingons being sissys- it would be conduct unbecoming an officer. See the comparison?
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
I could see Riker doing it, though... (kidding)
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: By our thnking, it would have been just as okay for the commander to disparage black people or asians or jews- after all, "it's a navy warship!" it's all in fun if it lets sailors blow off some steam....right?
Nope, not right, 'cause the last thing that needs to happen is for someone who doesn't get it to start trying to put words in my mouth.
And as far as disparaging, who'd he disparage? "Chicks"? The deckhands who got called queer? I guess I missed it. Oh, I'm sure one can strip the stuff out of context if you try hard enough and make it look evil and whatever, as all such panty-waist "omg so offensive" morons do, but that is by its nature stripping it out of context.
But then, any comedy involving stereotypes is bad, right? Unless it's comedians doing it, then it's considered funny and they get rich, but you can't have a part-time or momentary comedian because then they're evil and bad and wrong. With the possible exception of jokes against those damn honkies.
It's so ridiculous.
quote:as long as you're making Trek comparisons, I'll give you one- we never saw Picard get on the shipwide and tell jokes about Orion Slave girls or Klingons being sissys- it would be conduct unbecoming an officer. See the comparison?
Bad comparison, because you'd actually need to be talking about Riker, who was XO like Honors was at the time. And Riker was quite the jovial joke-teller, wasn't he? Too bad we didn't get to hear more than one or two of them.
And of course stereotype humor was never allowed, was it? Oh, wait, I seem to recall some joke having a punchline involving Ferengi told to Riker, don't I? Or how about Kirk's Klingon aphrodisiacs, hmm? I mean, if you get right down to it, that sort of thing could be terribly offensive to those groups.
Put simply, it's a slippery slope from punishing a truly offensive or thoughtless moron, which is good when done to a reasonable level, to the end of the road where so much as hearing a stereotype and not reporting it is some sort of thoughtcrime. I say punish assholes for being assholes, don't trump up stupid stuff stripped out of context.
If the guy'd indicated sexism in official actions, that's one thing. But in a comedy skit, it's something else.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Yeah? If it's so harmless, why were the onjections of several crewmen not followed up on at the time? If it's so harmless, why were members of his crew offended at all?
Face acts- the commander acted in a manner unbecoming an officer and paid the price- and now Naval officers will have to behave at a more professional level.
This is hardly the first incident involving Naval officers behaving poorly and it causing a scandal- -though this is minor compared with the Tailhook incidents.
If only the army held it's officers to such high standards, we would have seen that fucktard Allen West dishonorably discharged instead of joining Congress.
Posted by Pensive's Wetness (Member # 1203) on :
*sigh* the thing is, nobody will be willing do even pale jokes out of fear some will fuck them over with a bus because their pussy hurt, they got a shitty eval, or passed over for promotion, etc...
it'll just INCREASE the tension and increase the fatalities. The job's hard enough as is...
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Yeah, because speaking with respect when talking about crewmen is going to lead to fatalities.
Riiiight.
By that same thinking, the entire Code of Conduct manual can be tossed out- it'll make the military much safer not to have to think before speaking.
You're talking about stress, but how stresseful do you suppose it is for a gay serviceman to hear his XO talking like that? You think maybe that stress serves as a distraction? Just a little?
It's a shame that nothing was done regarding this incident back when it happened- if they could say the matter was addressed and the now-Captain had been coached- and that it was no longer an issue- then his command might have been spared.
It would not even have been a story.
Instead the navy brushed off crewmen's complaints and now here we are.