since im new here and dont know as much as you all do,im not gonna say much..but personally i think the warbird is a sexy ship and i was wondering if you all knew where i can find a book with pics and specs on all of the star trek ships..if you do please let me know..email me if ya could. thanks again. Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Rather than e-mail, what if we talk about it here? That is rather the point of the place, after all.
Your request does not have any easy answer. The Romuland Warbird does not feature prominently in any tech book, aside from a brief mention at the back of the DS9 Technical Manual. I suppose you could pick that up. If it's just pictures you want, I'm sure there are several people here with a list of websites for you to check out.
Welcome to Flare.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Ooohh, nudie pics of a Warbird!! Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
Sweet! Look it that warbird strip her hull.
Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
oh...look at the nacelles on that bird....*drool*
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
Whooooooa, that bird has one damn fine quantum singularity.....
Posted by Davok (Member # 143) on :
Yeah, I'm pretty sure most singularities are attractive.. Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Bet you'd like to get in her event horizon, eh?
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Jonathem Lethem wrote a novel called "As She Crawled Across The Table" that features a scientist who falls in love with a sentient black hole named Lack.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
A sentient black hole?
This proves that even Bush *can* be intelligent.
Posted by Jeff Kardde (Member # 411) on :
Sentient black holes? I know lots. Kerry, Susan, Amy ... er, ah, um ... nevermind.
Posted by HALON (Member # 610) on :
Hmmm,well does anybody have any pics or links to some? on the ds9 manual, how much info does it give on the warbird? Oh yeah thanks for tryin to help me out..
Posted by Ryan McReynolds (Member # 28) on :
The DS9 Tech Manual gives all of the stats on the warbird... but you should be aware that the starship listing in the book is somewhat questionable in terms of accuracy. Rick Sternbach, author of the book, has confirmed as much. For what its worth, here's what it says...
******
D'DERIDEX-CLASS WARBIRD
PRODUCTION BASE: Unknown; Romulan Star Empire TYPE: Heavy Cruiser ACCOMMODATION: 1500 plus officers, crew, and troops POWER PLANT: One artificial singularity-drive warp core feeding two nacelles; two impulse systems. DIMENSIONS: Length, 1,041.65 meters; beam, 772.43 meters; height, 285.47 meters. MASS: 4,320,000 metric tonnes (est.). PERFORMANCE: Warp 9.6 (observed). ARMAMENT: Six ship-mounted disruptors; two photon torpedo launchers.
******
-=Ryan McReynolds=-
Posted by HALON (Member # 610) on :
Hey thanks Ryan that helps me out alot..you really didnt have to go through the trouble...but thanks alot though now i just gotta work on pics and i have a question for everyone who wants to reply.. How does the warbird hold up against federation ships? ie... galaxy,nebula,and soveriegn class ships..
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Lack is male, by the way, at least in as much as a black hole can be said to have a gender. And it wasn't self-aware originally. That was the English department's fault.
It's a curious sort of book.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Interesting side-note: The seem to be at least two types of Warbirds, since one of them was called 'Class-B' by the Enterprise's resident nitpicker (aka Data).
Since a D'deridex is about twice the size of a GCS, I'd think it is a serious threat to any Fed ship. Perhaps the best chances are for Defiants and Intrepids (which singlehandedly can destroy the entire Collective...*sigh*). Another point in favor of the Warbird is the sheer number of them. Even on non-vital missions, there are several of these huge vessels.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Er, sheer number? We've never seen more than three or four of the things onscreen at any one time, even during the last episodes of DS9.
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
HALON: According to some books that I've read and other Internet stuff the impression is given that the Romulan Warbird is more powerful than a Galaxy. The only problem is that they are so big and take a long time to build that only so many can be in active service. Also, with requiring more crew, the Romulans can only afford to maintain so many of them.
Check out: http://www.ditl.org/ - the site covers a lot of actual facts and canon about ships in the Star Trek universe and has a few pictures too. This particular site guesses that the Romulans only had 785 Warbirds with the rest of their fleet being made up of smaller ships. Compared to Starfleet's 9,000-odd fleet, that's not many. With so many having been lost in the Dominion War (about 42% of those 785), the Romulan fleet is not quite as threatening as it once was.
Posted by TheF0rce (Member # 533) on :
ditl is a crap place to quote from. sorry.
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
As well as the Borg threat, it's my opinion that the Feds began building more advanced and offensive ships to answer the quite relevant Romulan threat, as the Galaxy class, the so called flagship class would in many cases have come off second best in a one-on-one with a Warbird. So we now see the likes of many more Defiants, Akiras, and the new Soveriegn. It was indeed interesting to see those two Defiant and one Akira class ships take on three Romulan warbirds in 'Message in a Bottle', and win.
I doubt tho that a lone Interpeid would stand much of a chance. In my book the Intrepid can be no more than a Medium Cruiser insofar as a hardware designation goes.
Posted by HALON (Member # 610) on :
I know that the defiant and akira class ships are powerful indeed,but to take on 3 warbirds and win? my friends...cough(bullshit)cough. I think thats more of the writing of the producers cause the good guy no matter how out gunned and out numbered doesnt lose..cause there wouldnt be a show if that happend. But thats my own opinion. What do the rest yall think about it?
And how do you put your quote at the bottom of the reply? Im new at this please bear with me on it till i catch on.
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
TheF0rce: I'll admit that it's not the best site available, but at least it is a start.
HALON: I believe that they call it "deus ex machina"
Posted by TheF0rce (Member # 533) on :
sorry i didn't mean crap-don't get me wrong it took time and effort to come up with that site.
but...alot of the statistics and general fleet # presented there is biased toward the feds and carries not any more credibilty as someone else making another site stating there were 2000 warbirds.
Posted by HALON (Member # 610) on :
I looked at the site,besides some technical stuff that may be indifferent to other species some of it was useful.Some of my friends had a hard(really hard)time believing that the warbird was twice the size of the galaxy..and still made the sovereign look kinda tiny..well sure ass shit i proved it to them.lets say I made them my bitches for the rest of the night cause we had a bet going. They swore up and down that they were near to equal size. I couldnt help but bet a a couple beers on it.
Posted by Nimrod (Member # 205) on :
Can someone please tell me Harry's comment about the Intrepid and the Borg up there is NOT "Endgame"-related? That would really help in keeping me from ripping his head off.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Nope, that was just a reference to things like Voyager destroying a fancy 'Class Four Tactical Cube', whereas an entire Federation *fleet* can't destroy one standard cube. IIRC, Voyager destroyed multiple Cubes in history.
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
The only reason that 2 Defiants and an Akira won against 3 Warbirds is because the good guys always have to win. The writers put in what is called "deus ex machina". In other words, they were lazy.
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
This is the reason why the Federation won that battle against the Romulans in Message ina Bottle:
The Akira, Defiants and three Prometheus sections fired on one warbird and destroyed it. Quite obviously.
That left two (or three) Warbirds against one Akira Class starship, two Defiant class ships, and three equally powerful Prometheus sections. So in simple terms the Romulans thought to themselves, "hmm, okay then", and made a swift retreat.
This wasn't lazy writing it was highly plausible. And remember, this was the first time ever that a warbird had been destroyed by Starfleet forces on screen.
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
Fair point well made.
I never considedered that . . . pretty damn plausable - nice one.
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
It does seem possible that this is what happened, and perhaps the Romulans also wanted to avoid any further possibility of a very serious interstellar incident. I mean, if the Federation didn't have their hands full with the Dominion at the time, they may very well have declared war against the Romulans for pulling that stunt, ie a hostile takeover of a Federation ship and the murder of her crew. Talk about audacity. The Romulans are also known to be somewhat reluctant in over committing themselves, so perhaps that's another reason for their retreat.
Going briefly back to one of Harry's points, I know no information on any other type of Warbird other than the D'deridex, or 'Type-B' as Starfleet designates it. It's possible that a 'Type-A' was an older warbird variation from earlier in the century, and the new, more powerful version was then classes as the 'Type-B'.
[ June 08, 2001: Message edited by: The Red Admiral ]
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
quote: I mean, if the Federation didn't have their hands full with the Dominion at the time, they may very well have declared war against the Romulans for pulling that stunt
Um, unless the Federation defrosted Ronald Reagan to supervise foreign policy, that strikes me as a bit out-of-line with what we've come to expect from them.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Just coming into this thread in the middle... quite literally I started reading and am posting my reply at the end of the second page...
1. D'Deridex and type A/B Warbirds. I've been giving this explanation for a long time - and it sorta fits so here tis again...
The D'Deridex is the 'smaller' of the two types of Warbird as dubbed the 'B-type'. I believe this to be the most common type of Warbird we see through the rest of TNG.
The A-type, I reckon is the much bigger (almost twice the size?) Warbird from "The Neutral Zone". It would make sense to send the biggest ship they've got to investigate a threat that could 'scoop' their bases out of the ground. Also it would be PERFECT for meeting the Federation again after so many years of isolation. I feel there aren't many - maybe only 1 or 2 of these big babies. The rest of the time we have seen type B's... i.e. in Tin Man when we get a very nice size comparison between the E-D and the warbirds.
Also reguarding the Romulans in Message in a Bottle, I've always felt that the Romulans shouldn't have been the 'force' behind the capture of the Prometheus. I feel it would have made much more sense for Rogue Ferengi - or just Ferengi... to be stealing the ship. (It wouldn't have been their first time). It would have made much more sense - the Doctor's "I don't care attitude" towards the healing of the injured patient. The fact that the ship was being stolen and there were no 'repercussions'. That the enemy ship was destroyed (relatively easy). Also that it would have been nice to see some Marauders doing some nasty work - seeing as they are nearly as powerful as a Galaxy class... and this sort of 'picking off starships' is more of a Ferengi thing - than full scale attack. ALSO the Ferengi would have used such a ship to strip it down and sell of its secrets for a great profit. ANNNDDDDD that the whole paranoia thing with the Captain would have worked better coming from a Ferengi - especially one pulling of such a dangerous thing as stealing a Fed starship...
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
I also agree that the Federation would not declare war against the Romulans. They prefer peaceful methods and would probably just cut their losses with the Romulans as they may be potential allies against the Dominon (as they actually became). Just try declaring war in BOTF while playing the UFP - the people don't like it. I'm assuming that the same applied to the series (plus it's much more difficult to fight two wars than one).
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
Don't like the idea of Ferengi stealing the Prometheus. I for one couldn't believe those dumb Ferengi numbskulls were able to take over the Enterprise-D (the Federation flagship!) so damn easily in Rascals. No, I just don't buy it. Rascals was the most nasty cringe-worthy TNG episode ever, and for them to then take the Prometheus, no way, they just A.) don't have the military skill, and B.) the nerve to do it.
For me, the Romulan Tal Shiar wanting to possess the Federation's most secret and advanced starship poototype makes infinitely more sense.
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
Oh yeh, and akb1979, I love BOTF too, and you're right it is indeed realistic how the Feds morale dips severely when declaring war. But wadda you do if the Romulans are marauding through your systems raiding and taking out starbases, you've just got to respond haven't you! And sabotage events, damn doesn't that ever get on your nerves...
Posted by akb1979 (Member # 557) on :
SABOTAGE! WASH YOUR MOUTH OUT! HOW DARE YOU USE SUCH FILTHY LANGUAGE IN MY PRESENCE!
Yes, sabotage is a bugger - especially on the Impossible level. Romulans ignoring your boarders? Just build loads of ships and blow them up. That'll boost you population's moral, making them more productive and more sympathetic to the military too. Then whe you keep on blowin' Romulan ships and outposts up, they'll declare war on you. This will again increase support for your military and all you have to do then is keep the Rolulans from attacking one of your systems. This is made all the more difficult with them owning cloaking devices - just have loads of Ambassadors or Constellations.
Of course, all that is more than enough for a seasoned BOTF player to deal with. But of course, when playing on the Impossible level, the computer throws a Borg cube at you - several million dead and over forty ships lost.
"WHAT! A second cube! Oh shit! Where's my defence fleet?" You ask.
"Erm, between these wars with the Romulans, Klingons, Ferengi and Cardassians and the recent Borg assault, we have no ships left and the soonest that a military ship can be built is 23 turns." Replies a military officer. But at this rate you'll be dead in 7 turns. Ah the joy of getting your ass totally kicked on the Impossible setting. Good job I've got some cheats for just such an occasion - instant fleet, YEAH! You start on Tech Level 1, with all other opponents on Tech Level 8 and you still kick ass! HEHE!
[ June 09, 2001: Message edited by: akb1979 ]
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Would having cheats just make the game immediately boring.
Also, I wish there would be some advancement in these turn based strategy games, the all feel the same. Can't there be some sort of 'original' reaction by the computer - instead of the usual 'morale down' 'build ships' 'attack' 'research' etc. It all comes down to MUDs... it's all just hack and slash wehn you get down to the nitty-gritty.
OH, Re the Ferengi - Ignoring 'Rascals' and thinking about it logically - Ferengi have become the 'laughing stock' but when the time was right and when the right Daimon came along (with enough Latinum) I believe the Ferengi could be quite a formidable force - as long it was justified in Ferengi ethics for them to steal something like the Prommie, I believe they could do it. That is Ignoring 'Rascals' - cause well, what was the method behind that Daimon's madness??
Also, I just got Voyager 7.3 and caught 'Inside Man' - not a bad episode AT ALL! A Marauder! Although the CGI of it sucked badly... very dodgey compared to our last views of that ship. All fuzzy and stuff - even not when near the Red Giant...
Anyone notice the 'schematic' shown... was EXACTLY the same schematic as found in the Fact Files!?! - sorta looses the believability when you see this...
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
If the Ferengi ever illegally set foot on a Federation ship again I'll eat my TOS phaser. The Ferengi are but a minor military force, a bunch of hucksters and scavengers. Starfleet are well aware of whatever threat they represent and would be more than ready.
Back to BOTF, i'm a seasoned player as well and have whooped ass on impossible level. Two Borg cubes? - that's a luxury mate! I recently had a three Borg cube invasion, whilst also having a Terrelian ship, the Dreadnought AND the Calamarian swarming through my space. They took out ninety percent of the Romulan empire before starting on me. That allowed me to position a 94 strong fleet in the Yridian system, (with a 580 population - a starship building mass production line basically). The force was made up of 30 Dreadnoughts and Defiants and about 20 backup Galaxy-X heavy cruisers and 10 Nebulas. In front were 30 more Constellation heavy destoryers. I cornered each cube in turn and sent them home crying.
You just gotta love this game.
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
And I don't ever use the MUDD cheat command, it spoils the spirit of the game. I only used it once on perhaps the second or third time I played the game - ages ago when i was totally decimated by the Ferengi. I survived the onslaught the best I could and quietly built a 70 strong Dreadnought force with the ill-gotten credits. I had just Sol left, and I set out to confront the Ferengi fleet, and lost, horribly to a force of more than 150 mauraders et al. That was painful! And that was also the first and only time the Federation fell while I was playing them. I lost another time as the Cardies tho.
Posted by HALON (Member # 610) on :
what game are you all talking about? I play armada but it doesnt sound like that what your playing..oh and another question..was there really 2 types of warbirds? if so which was bigger or better?
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
Sorry, I went off on a tangent. we were talking about 'Star Trek: Birth of The Federation' -distributed by Microprose. It's a game for the PC. Never played it? If you love Trek, which you obviously do because you're here, and you like exciting strategic turn-based games I sincerely urge you to buy it immediately.
(warning: it is highly addictive, and may end up seriously disturbing ones daily routine of life.)
BTW.. any other other type of warbird (than D'deridex)is conjectural. there's no canon info to suggest the specs of a Type-A variant. But as there's a Type-B, a Type-A must exist, or have existed at some point
Posted by HALON (Member # 610) on :
Leet...well thank you for the name of the game,i do believe ill be running out to the computer store today to pick me up one.
hopefully they have some in...
Posted by The_Evil_Lord (Member # 256) on :
I should warn you though. It's buggier than Armada, DO NOT even attempt to run it without the patch (upgrades the game to version 1.02, fixes some bugs - though not the serious ones (MEMORY LEAK) - and creates a few others), or you'll regret it.
Don't let that spoil the fun though, once you get into the game it's quite entertaining if you're willing to look past its weak points - diplomacy being the worst one. Multiplayer is the best way to experience BotF
[ June 11, 2001: Message edited by: The_Evil_Lord ]
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
Agreed, the 1.0.2 patch is essential. But I'm not sure where it's available to d/l, as Microprose and their site no longer function, as they were bought out by Hasbro. They supposedly now support the game but haven't supplied the patch (about 12MB). So good luck with that.
Multiplayer is a great laugh, a standard 56K modem connection isn't so reliable. You might have to network two machines to play in this mode as Micrsofts Gaming Zone no longer runs this game for multiplayer.
Posted by EdipisReks (Member # 510) on :
you can get the patch here: page with 1.02 patch Posted by NightWing (Member # 4) on :
Isn't there a 1.03 patch already??
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
I thought this thread had long kicked the bucket... Anyhoo, I'm not aware of a 1.0.3 patch, but you may be referring to add-on mods for the game, which do exist. If there is though an official 1.0.3 patch, I would love to know where to get it....
