http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/prefed_ships.htm
Should I include real-world spacecraft too (like the space shuttle or ISS)? In this case, I wonder if it would make sense to restrict myself to the ones mentioned or seen on screen.
quote:
4) The registry NX-01 is inconsistent with the NX-01-A of the "USS Dauntless" in VOY: "Hope and Fear". Maybe Arturis, who imitated the look and feel of a Starfleet ship otherwise perfectly, made an error here. The Voyager should have wondered why in the world Starfleet would name a ship "Dauntless", but re-use the registry NX-01, as if it were a homage to Enterprise. More here.
I think the registries of Earth Starfleet ships have nothing to do with the registries of Federation Starfleet ships.
The other ships from Up The Long Ladder are missing.
[ November 22, 2001: Message edited by: Spike ]
And even though we all know you hate the "Akira-prise", I don't think it helps the fans with you ranting about it in your list.
Oh, and other ships to add to your list:
SS Columbia
SS Enterprise (the other one)
The three ships from "Fortunate Son"
S.S. HOKULE'A
DY-500(C)
Commanded by Captain Melinda Snodgrass, Launched in 2102 on a Deep Space Exploration mission to the Fiscus Sector
S.S. SEATTLE NAR-18834
Commanded by Captain Wendy Neuss, Launched in 2120 on a ADR Looping mission to the Fiscus Sector
S.S. TOMOBIKI
RT-2203
Commanded by Captain Peter Lauritson, Launched in 2119 on a Deep Space Exploration mission to the Fiscus Sector
S.S. BUCKAROO BANZAI
BBI-993
Commanded by Captain John Whorfin, Launched in 2137 on a Mission to Planet 10 (DIM B) in the Fiscus Sector
S.S. URUSEI YATSURA
DY-430
Commanded by Captain David Glink, Launched in 2146 on a Nebula Survey Project to the Fiscus Sector
S.S. HATTERAS
DY-245
Commanded by Captain Gary Loes, Launched in 2187 on a Deep Space Exploration mission to the Fiscus Sector
V.K. YURI GAGARIN
DY-732
Commanded by Captain Winrich Kolbe, Launched in 2105 on a Colonization mission to the Fiscus Sector
V.K VELIKAN
DY-1200
Commanded by Captain Gene Roddenberry, Launched in 2160 on a mission to Explore Strange, New Worlds in the Fiscus Sector
D.E.V. EAGLE VALLEY
DY-950
Commanded by Captain Dan King, Launched in 2183 on a Colonization mission to the Fiscus Sector
H.M.S. LORD NELSON
DY-500(B)
Commanded by Captain Young Jae Kim, Launched in 2120 on a Deep Space Exploration mission to the Fiscus Sector
H.M.S NEW ZEALAND
DY-732(N)
Commanded by Captain Bob Lederman, Launched in 2135 on a Diplomatic mission to Alderaan in the Fiscus Sector
It's not 100% Cannon (especially with some of the injokes) but it seams consistant and it was onscreen so I think you can get away with it for the most part.
[ November 22, 2001: Message edited by: Reverend ]
Vehicles you might want to add:
- Orbital Nuclear Weapons Platform, from "Assignment: Earth" (TOS)
- International Space Station
- The VentureStar lookalike from ENT's opening credits
- Voyager 6, from TMP
- The Earth-Saturn space-probe from "Tomorrow is Yesterday" (TOS)
- Charybdis
Some background info from that Okudagram in "The Continuing Mission" (Page 81):
quote:
MISSION COMMANDER: Richey, Stephen G., Col. United States Air Force
DEPARTURE: 07-23-2067 LOST: 2-07-2068
DEPUTY MISSION DIRECTORS/PRINCIPAL INVESTIGATORS: SEE 12488.85SPACE VEHICLE CHARYBDIS, BLOCK D GAS-CORE FISSION REACTOR PROPULSION SYSTEM. CREW COMPLEMENT: 15. VEHICLE SYSTEMS AT TELEMETRY CUTOFF INDICATED THRUST ABNORMALITY; VEHICLE ATTAINED 12X SOLAR ESCAPE VELOCITY 2.56 HOURS EARLIER THAN PLANNED. ASSUMED VEHICLE LOST WITH CONSUMABLES RUNOUT, 20% POSSIBILITY OF CREW SURVIVAL WITH HIBERNATION SYSTEMS AT LOW USAGE MODE. DEEP SPACE TRACKING HISTORY: SEE 12489.97. FOLLOWUP MISSION JACOB RESULTED IN NEGATIVE TRACK: SEE 12491.23
MISSION OBJECTIVES: SURVEY OF DEEP EXTRASOLAR ENVIRONMENT TO DISTANCE OF 100 A.U.; INTERACTION OF SOLAR MAGNETIC FIELD AT HELIOPAUSE; LONG DURATION CREW HABITATION; USAF ELECTRIC FIELDS EXPERIMENT MODULE ADAPTABILITY STUDY (INTERAGENCY CO-OP PROG).
[ November 22, 2001: Message edited by: Harry ]
quote:
SS Hateras and DEV Eagle Valley shouldn't be on the list, since their launch dates is AFTER the 2161 date of the creation of the Federation.
I guess that depends on how you interperate pre-fed, literally right up to the signing of the articles of the federation or not until a unified federation fleet is properly established.
Your probably right, but they make a worthy side note.
2) You could mention that the Warp Five Complex was opened in a ceremony 32 years before "Broken Bow", or in 2119.
3) Height of the Nomad: "a fraction over one meter" according to Spock. It's described as four feet tall in "The Making of Star Trek", which would be 1.2 meters. This is all after modification by aliens.
4) The Ares specifications have been given in the episode, I believe. You can also measure the length of the DY-100 in the Encyclopedia. I don't have any of these sources at hand.
5) Are you going to include the Enterprise shuttlecraft? They're 20 feet long according to a Magazine sketch by Eaves.
[ November 22, 2001: Message edited by: Phelps ]
quote:
It is about the tech of trek. Not about how much you hate the pre-E.
That's right. I'm always trying to tell that it's bad tech. The question really is if I should do it so often.
Now, the notch in the front is for two totally seperate things on each ship...no real fault there.
The raised section on the saucer is...well...just a raised section. There's nothing there.
The impulse engines are in the same place...so what, they're in the same place on a Galaxy too.
The P-38 homage I believe is STILL a homage. And besides, they ARE bigger on the NX class then on the Akira class, meaning that they might serve the same purpose, and yet be roughly the same size.
And the windows are again, just windows. No big deal...
Speaking of unclear launch dates, the Valiant is also an unknown entity. Kirk says the ship departed "over 200 years ago" and the recorder buoy was launched "almost 200 years ago". This gives a lot of leeway. The Valiant could easily even be a sublight vessel from the 2050s, since there seems to be a concensus that she could not have reached "the edge of the galaxy" on her own regardless of the drive system she possessed.
The Columbia from "The Cage" would have been launched well after the founding of the Federation, since Vina was a child at launch and an old woman, not a desiccated old corpse, when encountered by Pike. Also, Pike thought the fake males there were plausible. They would have been mature adults at launch, most probably, and still looked reasonably pre-mummified when discovered. Okuda's Chronology suggestions seem acceptable in this respect.
IMHO, the database should be limited to vessels and installations shown or mentioned in Trek, omitting the real-world vehicles whose existence in the Trek timeline cannot be confirmed. For example, we know the Apollo spacecraft existed since we have seen some tabletop models etc., but there is no proof the Gemini or Soyuz programs existed... I think we should play safe here.
Timo Saloniemi
quote:
For example, we know the Apollo spacecraft existed
And it was on a computerscreen in Insurrection:
quote:
Apollo 11
Humanity in spaceEarly space exploration expedition
Launched from Earth in July 1963, the first mission to send humans to Earth's moon. The spacecraft was launched by a huge chemically fueled rocket known as a Saturn V. Apollo 11 astronauts Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin became the first humans to set foot on another world. Describing the achievment as "One small step for (a) man, one giant leap for mankind." The craft was injected onto translunar trajectory just 1.1 seconds later than predicted, and the trajectory again was so accurate that there was no need to make an early mid-course correction. Saturn 5 was a tribute to the industrial wealth of the United States. Only the richtest of nations could afford carriers on the scale of Saturn, even the highly advanced nations had found it advisable to pool thier resources for more modest space programs. An almost utopian city, Mojave is located in the southwestern region of the North American continent, the area boasts sparkling cities surrounded by wide belts of
[ November 23, 2001: Message edited by: Spike ]
quote:
Enterprise type
2) The strange ring structure, where the ring obviously houses the propulsion system, doesn't fit into the Federation design lineage. The ship, however, looks very similar to the Vulcan Surak class. It is possible that humans acquired one or more Vulcan ships, which would explain the name "Enterprise". It is also possible that it is a prototype ship built by humans, inspired by Vulcan technology. If this is so, the project was obviously a failure, considering that all known later Federation starship designs have the familiar nacelles again.
3) If the SS Enterprise (note that the prefix SS is only conjectural) is no Starfleet ship, there is no naming conflict, and it may have been in service at any time prior to 2271 when it appeared in TMP.
4) The Star Trek Chronology suggests that the SS Enterprise should have been a 300m long starliner for 800 passengers. As Paul Cargile pointed out some time ago, this is complete bogus. At 300m, the bow section would be smaller than the Defiant, and imagine 800 people on such a small ship!
I always thought of this as a sublight cruise ship and that those rings are actually rotating sections that create gravity for the passengers...do you think 800 people would it in that instead?
Whether they happened in the ST universe depends on when you think it started to diverge from the real universe. The first unmanned Gemini flight was in April '64 and the first manned flight was in March 65. Unmanned and manned flights of Soyuz first took place in 1966 and 1967, respectively. So, did ST and reality start diverging when ST was in its planning phases, when the first pilot was made, when the series started airing (Sept 8, 1966), or at some time latter (For example, when Enterprise beams aboard the F-104 pilot or when Gary 7 showed up to monkey with the missile platform)?
Also, although I agree with the 2050s placement of the Eugenics Wars, they were definitely mentioned in "Doctor Bashir, I Presume", and possibly in three other TNG or DS9 eps as well. This is what I found in the scripts -- however, I don't have all the eps on tape, so I can only confirm the reference from "Doctor Bashir....":
"Doctor Bashir, I Presume":I don't think so. Two hundred
years ago, we tried to "improve"
the species through DNA
resequencing and what did we get
for our trouble? The Eugenics
Wars. For every Julian Bashir
that can be created, there's a
Khan Singh waiting in the wings --
a "superhuman" whose ambition and
thirst for power have been
enhanced along with his intellect.
The law against genetic
engineering provides a firewall
against such men and it's my job
to keep that firewall intact.
(to Richard)
I've made my offer. Do you accept?"Statistical Probabilities":
BASHIR
It happened before. People like
us did try to take over.JACK
I knew it! I knew you were going
to trot out the Eugenics Wars.
"Up the Long Ladder":RIKER
How could a spaceship leave Earth
without some kind of a record?DATA
Perhaps it was deliberate. They
may have wished to escape
detection.RIKER
You're suggesting they were
fugitives?DATA
During the Eugenics Wars a group
of genetically superior humans
ruled the world. After their
defeat some did escape.
"A Matter of Time":PICARD
(interrupting)
I know, Professor, "What if one
of those lives I save down there
is a child who grows up to be the
next Adolf Hitler or Khan Singh?"
(MORE)
[ November 25, 2001: Message edited by: Phelps ]
I suppose Paramount at one point realized the sheer amount of intellectual property unleashed on these CD-ROMS, and decided to keep quiet...Seriously, if I hadn't heard about them from David Henderson and seen one at a Virgin store, I wouldn't have known they existed.
No doubt the best Trek buy. You get Klingon language translations, cut scenes, cut lines, spellings, you can search them and whatnot.
quote:
Each Companion costs about $20 on Amazon, but they're not shipped outside the US
are you quite certain? I'm sure I've seen those in shops over here (UK)
[ November 25, 2001: Message edited by: Phelps ]
quote:
Originally posted by The359:
SS Hateras and DEV Eagle Valley shouldn't be on the list, since their launch dates is AFTER the 2161 date of the creation of the Federation.
Why couldn't Earth (or organizations thereon) still send out vessels independently?
They could have been part of UESPA, after all.
(Also, a decent rationalization for Kirk's use of the phrase "United Earth Space Probe Agency" in TOS might be that occasionally the Federation vessel was occasionally sent on missions for the UESPA . . . they may have also performed missions for the Vulcan Science Academy, the Andorian Whatchamacallit, et cetera. Indeed, these planet-specific bodies might serve as explanation for the manifold terms of TOS for their operating authority . . . I'm thinking of a Tellarite "Star Service" ("Conscience of the King"), the Andorian "Space Central" ("Miri") . . . )
Guardian 2000