quote:

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Originally posted by Jason Abbadon:
He likes Indiana Jones: he wont even talk about star Wars in interviews.
I think he spent a lot of time distancing himself from the Star Wars character and all that effort really paid off:
He's the only one of the SW actors to break away and build a lasting successful career (James Earl Jones not included).

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He was also the only one that could ACT! Since you are so found of remembering bad episodes... Remember "Corvette Summer"? That was all of Hamill I needed to see. I think he even did an alien thing on Seaquest DSV. Other than Fisher in a couple of bit parts and BillyDee in commercials did any other Wars actor accomplish ANYTHING?
 

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Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
 
Did Alec Guinness have any acting jobs after "Star Wars"? Of course, he was getting on in years, I know, so you can't say that "Star Wars" ended his career -- not in the sense of negative connotations, anyway.

I do know that he absolutely hated the movies in later years, and even told one young fan, "You must promise me that you will never watch that movie ever again!"
 

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Posted by WizArtist (Member # 1095) on :
 
I meant AFTER their SW involvement. I'm not saying it was the END of their careers, but, what else HAVE they done since?
 

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Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
 
"He was also the only one that could ACT!"

Uhm, hogwash. Guiness and Cushing (both Shakespearian actors) had a long and illustrious carreer under their belts when ANH was released, McDiarmid was more of a theater man but no less impressive, Hamill just peaked early, Ford came out of nowhere and got lucky that Lucas was a friend of Spielberg, Fisher suffered a lengthy nervous breakdown a la Drew Barrymore which put her out of commission for a decade and stinted whatever talent she may or may not have had, Earl Jones had by that time already cultivated a very venerable image of himself, Dee Williams held a lot of promise in the sixties and seventies but sort of faded out, and Oz, uh, dangled muppets around for a living (plus he was the spiritual father of Yoda which of course places him right up there with the immortal Charles "Chuckie" Jones) so he doesn't fall under the same criteria as the rest anyway.

That leaves only Baker, Mayhew and Daniels. Three out of what, eight recurring actors? Name a trilogy as culturally influential and with as large a cast as Star Wars of which more than half the members DIDN'T vanish into obscurity, and you MIGHT have a point.

[ January 20, 2004, 04:06 PM: Message edited by: Cartman ]
 

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Posted by WizArtist (Member # 1095) on :
 
And, AGAIN, what have they done SINCE? Guiness was a great actor and Cushing was perfect for Tarkin. Jones didn't ACT, he was a voiceover. While that requires talent, it still isn't acting in these films.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 
At this point in time, I don't think Harrison Ford really needs to distance himself from Star Wars. I mean, unless he really despises it that much. But, if he was just trying to avoid being forever typecast as Han Solo, I think he's accomplished it.
 

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Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
 
Mark Hamill's biggest roles since Star Wars of which I am aware were three Wing Commander games and "Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back". I thought he played a passible Blair, but I never saw "Jay and Silent Bob".

I don't think it'd be very convincing to do Heir to the Empire at this point. Which is just too darned bad, because the books rock.
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
Too bad indeed: the books were the only good continuation of the original trilogy: the books after that are pretty sad.
 

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Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
 
The Zahn books are good, but I doubt that they would make entertaining films, the pace is just too plodding for a Star Wars movie.

As for what Hamill has been up to since RotJ, check out IMDB. He's become quite the accomplished voice actor and does THE definitive Joker for the DC cartoons as well as a not-too-shabby Solomon Grundy.
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
Yeah, his Joker is great.
Watch Batman Beyond: Return of The Joker for some great dialogue acting on his part.
 

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Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
 
"And, AGAIN, what have they done SINCE?"

Does it matter? You said Ford was the only member of the SW cast who could act (which is plain BS) because he built up a carreer while the others all slipped off the radar and never got noticed again. Well, newsflash: there are a LOT of skilled actors out there who have to wait TABLES simply because they never catch a break, and there are equally as many actors out there with resumes reaching from here to the moon who couldn't even act their way out of a cardboard box. What people have or haven't done in Hollywood isn't always an accurate yardstick for their talent, you know.

[ January 21, 2004, 01:30 PM: Message edited by: Cartman ]
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Cartman:
What people have or haven't done in Hollywood isn't always an accurate yardstick for their talent, you know.

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That's the truth: there's pleany of famous hacks out there but I had to explain who John Tutoro (sp?) was to someone just yesterday.
 

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Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
 
I've seen Mark Hammel in half-a-dozen low budget Sci-Fi movies. Most recently he was in Jay and Silent Bob strike back. Check out his CREDITS page:
http://www.markhamill.com/frames.htm
 

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Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
 
Jason: "Turturro". B)

And yeah, he really doesn't get enough recognition for his performances. Just goes to show that resumes aren't worth a cent more than the paper they're printed on.
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
Seen "Men of Respect"?
It's a mobster version of MacBeth with Turturro in the lead role.
Good stuff.
"Miller's Crossing" was great too.
 

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Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
 
Mark Hamill also did the William Shatner thing ages before William Shatner: Get extremely prissy and anal, then realise that you've made a shit load of money and just take the piss out of yourself. He always comes across as great and affiable in interviews.

And, alough it's not "proper acting" (stupid Hollywood snobs), his voice work really is very good. And yes, Return of the Joker is great.

quote:

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Originally posted by Jason Abbadon:
Yeah, no one could possibly replace Mayhew under all that fur costume.

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quote:

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Originally posted by PsyLiam:
And, alough it's not "proper acting" (stupid Hollywood snobs), his voice work really is very good. And yes, Return of the Joker is great.

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quote:

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Originally posted by TheWoozle:
I've seen Mark Hammel in half-a-dozen low budget Sci-Fi movies. Most recently he was in Jay and Silent Bob strike back.

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Cock-Knocker: Don't fuck with the Jedi Master, son.

 

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Posted by Bond, James Bond (Member # 1127) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Cartman:

Name a trilogy as culturally influential and with as large a cast as Star Wars of which more than half the members DIDN'T vanish into obscurity, and you MIGHT have a point.

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Godfather Trilogy for one. Die Hard Trilogy (not really culturally influential but it did influence action movies significantly and inspired tons of rip-offs). The Lord of the Rings actors are already getting parts in other significant movies like Billy Boyd in "Master and Commander", Orlando Bloom in "Pirates of the Carribean", and Viggo Mortenson in "Hidalgo". The Indiana Jones Trilogy actors went on to other big roles.

Not a trilogy but the two Predator movies produced three politicians. Jesse Ventura as Governor of Minnesota, Arnold Schwartzeneggar as Governor of California (or Kal-eee-forn-ya as he says it), and Ruben Blades as President of Panama. And they all went on to further roles as well.

The Aliens movies produced a lot of work for the actors as did the Superman movies (sorry but it's hard to find a lot of significant trilogies anymore).

So I would say that the Star Wars actors for the most part didn't exploit there "It Factor" (I hate that term but it fits) at the time and turn it into other prominant roles as actors from other huge franchises have.
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
Viggo Mortenson had a career before LOTR.
He was amazing as Lucifer in The Prophecy.
His 5 minutes of dialogue makes the movie.
 

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Posted by Bond, James Bond (Member # 1127) on :
 
Don't forget his role as the total pussy who couldn't make up his mind in "Crimson Tide". "To nuke or not to nuke..."
 

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Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
 
My old Grandma who has no head and perhaps has Alzheimer's can name almost every character from the first Star Wars trilogy.

She probably can't with the Godfather trilogy.

"The Don Guy and that Hoo-ah Guy" notwithstanding.

Cultural points to SW like a Scott Stevens hipcheck to a yawning Paul Kariya.
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
She has no head?


huh.

She must be fun at Halloween.

I've never bothered with Crimson Tide or The Godfather.
Just not my intrests, mind you.
 

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Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
 
I really liked Crimson Tide, but then I'll watch just about anything with Gene Hackman in it.

If it makes you feel better both Star Trek and Silver Surfer get a mention in it.
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
Cool.
Mr. Hackman's wife occasionally visits my work (though I dont know why exactly- they own a yacht here) and the man himself came in twice when I was off.
Someone should have called me.
 

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Posted by Bond, James Bond (Member # 1127) on :
 
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jason Abbadon:

I've never bothered with Crimson Tide or The Godfather.
Just not my intrests, mind you.
__________________________________________________

Blasphemy. Don Abbadon sleeps with the fishes tonight.

You've got to watch Godfather 1 & 2 but avoid 3 as if it were The Plague.

Crimson Tide is a good movie as well. Any time you see two great actors like Gene Hackman and Denzel Washington go head to head it's good stuff.
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
My Mom's a fan of The Godfather...mabye it's just the idea of watching a loooong movie that she likes that bothers me.

I dig some mob movies though: Miller's Crossing, Men of Respect, Things to do in Denver when you're Dead, King of New York....those are all classics in my book.
 

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Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
 
So I would say that the Star Wars actors for the most part didn't exploit there "It Factor" at the time and turn it into other prominant roles as actors from other huge franchises have.

OK, time for some mental gymnastics.

Of the Die Hard flicks, who have exploited their It Factor, again? Samuel Jackson was pretty much everywhere after Pulp Fiction, Rickman went back further, Irons had long theater roots, and most of Willis' work has been of the straight-to-video type. Next...

Of the Indiana Jones franchise, who have exploited their It Factor, again? Ford was already on the Star Wars bandwagon, Rhys-Davies was an acclaimed stage man like Irons, and Connery also went back further. Next...

Of the Alien quartet, who have exploited their It Factor, again? Sigourney Weaver hasn't done much more than Fisher, Hurt, believe it or not, went back further, and Biehn and Henriksen have kept their profiles below sea level in recent years. Next...

Of the Superman movies, who have exploited their It Factor, again? Certainly not Reeve (even before he was paralyzed), and Hackman and Stamp went, guess what, back further. Next...

Of the Predator popcorners... erh, those shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence as Star Wars, and that's irrespective of your political persuasion. B)

Now, I'll grant you The Godfather, because it had heavyweights like Brando and Pacino (Brando... heavyweights... get it? GET IT?), but, really, only the Lord of the Rings trilogy (which stands on the shoulders of veterans McKellen, Lee, and Rhys-Davies) is anywhere near Star Wars in terms of influence and ensemble cast, and it's too early to tell what it will do for the carreers of Woods & co.

So, in the words of another Aliens actor who has since undeservedly slid from the silver screen: GAME OVER MAN!!
 

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Posted by Bond, James Bond (Member # 1127) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Cartman:

Name a trilogy as culturally influential and with as large a cast as Star Wars of which more than half the members DIDN'T vanish into obscurity, and you MIGHT have a point.

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I don't see anything in that challenge saying that the actors had to maintain the same quality in there subsequent body of work (which is a very subjective discussion anyway), merely that they didn't vanish into obscurity, of which I have sited numerous examples of actors in huge trilogies (or quadrilogies et. al.) who didn't vanish afterwards.

I think you called game over a tad too early there Corporal Hudson (ie. Bill Paxton whose certainly not vanished into obscurity and whose career has gotten better in both quality and quantity and has branched into directing with "Frailty"), it's only a rain delay.
 

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Posted by Austin Powers (Member # 250) on :
 

quote:

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Of the Alien quartet, who have exploited their It Factor, again? Sigourney Weaver hasn't done much more than Fisher, Hurt, believe it or not, went back further, and Biehn and Henriksen have kept their profiles below sea level in recent years. Next...

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Ahem, that's not really true.

Sigourney Weaver did quite a few successful films, some of which are also critically acclaimed:

Heartbreakers
Galaxy Quest
The Ice Storm
Jeffrey
1492: Conquest of Paradise
Gorillas in the Mist: The Story of Dian Fossey
Ghostbusters I and II

Even Michael Biehn managed to slip into some great movies:

The Abyss
Terminator 2 (granted, his scenes were cut for the theatrical release, but they ARE on the DVD )
The Rock
The Art of War
And...Clockstoppers, directed by Jonathan Frakes
 

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Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
 
Recently Weaver appeared in Holes, and unlike some of the other cast (*COUGH!*Jon Voight*COUGH!*) she got her characterization from the novel spot-on.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 

"...most of Willis' work has been of the straight-to-video type."

Pulp Fiction, Twelve Monkeys, The Fifth Element, Armageddon, The Sixth Sense, The Whole Nine Yards, Unbreakable, Bandits, Hart's War... I'm not saying they're all good movies, but they're hardly "straight-to-video". I've even seen most of them.
 

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Posted by Bond, James Bond (Member # 1127) on :
 
Exactly, and I think all of those would certainly qualify for the original premise of the actor not "vanishing into obscurity" after appearing in a huge trilogy or franchise.

Some actors even move on to other huge franchises:

Alan Rickman went from Die Hard to Harry Potter.

Cristopher Lee is in the Star Wars Prequels and Lord of the Rings simultaneously. Not to mention appearing in the longest running screen franchise of all time, James Bond, in "The Man with the Golden Gun".

Patrick Stewart in the Trek movies and X-Men and Ian McKellan in X-Men and Lord of the Rings.
 

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Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
 
Twats.

Corporal Hudson...

That's PRIVATE Hudson! Philistine.

Bill Paxton whose certainly not vanished into obscurity and whose career has gotten better in both quality and quantity and has branched into directing with "Frailty"

I didn't say he vanished, I said he slid from the silver screen. Off the top of my head, Paxton had only five prominent roles after Aliens: Titanic (which I disqualify for being a sappy love story that sucked from here to the next dimension), U-571 (which I disqualify for grossly distorting historical facts), Vertical Limit (which was a so-so action flick), Apollo 13 (which I disqualify for exhibiting overt patriotism), and True Lies (which at least had him don some of his Hudson idiosyncrasies). So there. B)

I don't see anything in that challenge saying that the actors had to maintain the same quality in there subsequent body of work (which is a very subjective discussion anyway), merely that they didn't vanish into obscurity, of which I have sited numerous examples of actors in huge trilogies (or quadrilogies et. al.) who didn't vanish afterwards.

If you don't maintain the same quality in your work, you're either kicked out of Hollywood or you're exiled to B-movie land. That's obscure enough for me. B)

Sigourney Weaver did quite a few successful films...

Galaxy Quest was a niche (but hilarious) comedy, Heartbreakers another light comedy, Jeffrey idem dito (though seeing Stewart as flamboyant queer was worth the entry fee alone), and Conquest of Paradise an overblown drama that mucked up history and whose only saving grace was Vangelis' soundtrack. But, yes, Weaver's a good character actress, I won't deny that.

Even Michael Biehn managed to slip into some great movies...

The Rock and The Art of War were hardly what I'd call "great movies" (the fact that I like mindless action notwithstanding), Terminator II doesn't count because he was in it for less than two minutes, and Clockstoppers was a kiddy family film. You can do better. B)

I think all of those would certainly qualify for the original premise of the actor not "vanishing into obscurity" after appearing in a huge trilogy or franchise...

But my original challenge was to name a trilogy as culturally influential and with as large a cast as Star Wars of which more than half the members DIDN'T vanish into obscurity. You should know, you quoted it twice. B)

Now, I already made an exception for Rickman, who (and I'm going to risk my neck here) would have gotten where he is without Die Hard on his resume, presumably. That also goes for Lee and McKellen, who were both powerhouse actors years before they were cast as Saruman/Dooku and Gandalf/Magneto, and I don't have an inkling of doubt that they will be remembered for their lifetime achievements rather than their individual LotR/SW roles.

SOOO... again you are beaten. It is useless to resist. Don't make me destroy you. B)
 

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Posted by MarianLH (Member # 1102) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Cartman:

That also goes for Lee and McKellen, who were both powerhouse actors years before they were cast as Saruman/Dooku and Gandalf/Magneto, and I don't have an inkling of doubt that they will be remembered for their lifetime achievements rather than their individual LotR/SW roles.

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quote:

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name a trilogy as culturally influential and with as large a cast as Star Wars of which more than half the members DIDN'T vanish into obscurity

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quote:

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Originally posted by Cartman:
Jeffrey idem dito (though seeing Stewart as flamboyant queer was worth the entry fee alone)

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Although thanks to Frasier, we can watch that for free now.
 

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Posted by WizArtist (Member # 1095) on :
 
Not eactly what I was saying. I have never said that lack of work = lack of talent. I know I have seen many opportunities go to lesser talents because they were either willing to prostitute themselves or slick their way into jobs that they had no business being in. I have even had my own artwork "typecast" if you will. "Oh, this guy does such and such get him." Same goes with most actors. "I need a cool/weird guy for my script....get Steve Buscemi...yeah" How many chances will someone get to expand their range if all anyone thinks is "Oh, yeah...Jedi-guy" or "Starship-guy" or "Andromeda-babe"?
 

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Posted by Bond, James Bond (Member # 1127) on :
 
I'm issuing a challenge...

Name an actor who was in both Star Wars and Star Trek.

Clive Revill - Was the voice of the Emporer in "The Empire Strikes Back" and played Sir Guy of Gisborn in TNG "Q-Pid"

Wrong! He only did the voice of the Emporer in Empire Strikes Back, he wasn't "in" the movie. You lose sucka!

But you just asked for people who were featured in both franchises. So technically that's correct.

But "Q-Pid" was such an stupid premise to begin with that I reject that answer totally. Haha, I win!

But that's not what you asked for.

Silence insolent dog! I won, quit trying to deny it.

Hey, let's quit arguing and play Ping Pong instead. Best 2 out of 3 wins.

No, I meant best 3 out of 5.

5 out of 7?
 

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Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
 
Both Mark Hamill and Kate Mulgrew were in Batman: The Animated Series.

That's the best I can do. But since Batman: TAS is awesome, it should be allowed.
 

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Posted by Capt.Blair245 (Member # 1113) on :
 
Originally posted by Omega:
Mark Hamill's biggest roles since Star Wars of which I am aware were three Wing Commander games and "Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back". I thought he played a passible Blair, but I never saw "Jay and Silent Bob".

I thought he was good as Blair...
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
I liked Wilford Brimley as Blair.
...of course, that was a good movie though.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 
EAT OAT MEAL
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
Or get infected by an alien and rip off someone's face....whatever works for you.
 

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Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
 
OAT MEAL reference... lost... ngh...
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
Ahhh... it helps if you hit me over the head with tyhe the pun.

If you'd said "It's the right thing to do and the tasty way to do it" I'd have laughed.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 
OAT MEAL reference... found...

Robotic Wilford Brimley
 

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Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
 
huh.
 

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