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Vanguard: Call these people out on their hypocrisy, yes. Though I think this has little to do with Obama. I voted for him and contributed to his campaign because he's inclusive and fair, and he does not model or encourage that sort of behavior. Not everybody listens though - being on the "winning" side can bring out the best or worst in people (think of the kid who gets abused at home then turns around and bullies classmates).
Those who don't get it think that Obama is the Savior and going to solve all our problems. Those who get it know that real change is not going to be easy, and it takes effort from all of us, starting with ourselves. He has been saying this all along: "We are the ones we've been waiting for." A good leader with a vision can inspire us to achieve the kind of changes we need as a collective, but he can't do it for us.
quote:Originally posted by Diane: [QB] Vanguard: Call these people out on their hypocrisy, yes. Though I think this has little to do with Obama.
It doesn't, which is even more frustrating. It's the insane support and this BELIEF (TM) that suddenly all the worlds' ills will be relieved in a series of 30 minute sit-coms with Obama as the star.
It also doesn't help that so many idiots really do think that Bush was worse than Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, and Mao Tse Tung combined. The perspectives are completely and royally screwed up here.
There's never been in our history, with the possible exception of Buchanan, a President more set up to fail spectacularly than Obama. The main reason is that it's just IMPOSSIBLE for him to live up to the hype his supporters have created. Even if he does, on the score, do an incredible job as President, he'll fall short of the 'left-wing utopia' that the worst of his supporters demand.
And the same supporters are insanely flighty. When Obama fails to deliver EVERYTHING by .. hell, this time next year at the outside, they'll be starting up the 'derangement sydrome' all over again. Only this time, there's literally NO Republicans that they can pin it on.
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I fail to see how UM proves your point. Given that he's in the wilds of Saskatchewan and all. Canadian born and raised. Plus he mostly lurks and only posts when something should be said.
-------------------- I haul cardboard and cardboard accessories
Registered: Mar 1999
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Daniel Butler
I'm a Singapore where is my boat
Member # 1689
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quote:Originally posted by Vanguard: Daniel... considering how I've personally been treated over the past four years, and the amount of sheer hatred that 'red staters' have had to live with for no other reason than thinking Kerry and Gore were a little bit more of gits than Bush was... well, fuck it.
If these asshats can't even be gracious in victory, I see no reason left to be friendly. They drew the battlelines, threatened terrorism, advocated violent acts, squelched freedom of speech, etc, and so on, and spent the majority of their lives dwelling in hate. Why should I respect them?
Anyway, day Three of Obama (posted early since I've got a full plate tommorow): Gitmo detainees trials' cancelled, will be held without trial for 120 days.
Hope and Change!
What in fuck are you even talking about? What asshats? Who's hating you? You're awfully bitter, aren't you?
Registered: Jul 2005
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WizArtist II
"How can you have a yellow alert in Spacedock? "
Member # 1425
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quote:Originally posted by Vanguard: It doesn't, which is even more frustrating. It's the insane support and this BELIEF (TM) that suddenly all the worlds' ills will be relieved in a series of 30 minute sit-coms with Obama as the star.
It also doesn't help that so many idiots really do think that Bush was worse than Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, and Mao Tse Tung combined. The perspectives are completely and royally screwed up here.
There's never been in our history, with the possible exception of Buchanan, a President more set up to fail spectacularly than Obama. The main reason is that it's just IMPOSSIBLE for him to live up to the hype his supporters have created. Even if he does, on the score, do an incredible job as President, he'll fall short of the 'left-wing utopia' that the worst of his supporters demand.
And the same supporters are insanely flighty. When Obama fails to deliver EVERYTHING by .. hell, this time next year at the outside, they'll be starting up the 'derangement sydrome' all over again. Only this time, there's literally NO Republicans that they can pin it on.
An ugly, ugly mess to come.
With the extreme polarization that is occurring in the not-so United States, I really see there being a potential for a second civil war. There just seems to be no moderation anymore, only extremism. America was supposed to be a 'Melting Pot' of different cultures but instead it has turned into 'Vitriolic Stew'. The sheer amount of desperation that is being attached to the Obama administration will ensure that only further dissolution will occur. What bad things occur the next four years will be laid at the feet of the former administration, whether rightly or wrongly.
To me, watching the worldwide reaction and acceptance of BHO sets a precedent for the move to a voice to speak great things and put itself in position to rule the planet. While I know that many if not a majority of my fellow Flareites are typically anti-religion or anti-christian, it is rather eerie that things are seemingly coming into place that would allow the events of the Apocalyptic end times prophecies to be fulfilled.
Please do not confuse that as me calling Obama the Anti-Christ. I am merely trying to point out the similarities of the meteoric rise of a political force with seeming worldwide support and acceptance with what would have to occur for an Anti-Christ to take control. What will happen in the next few years if the desperation of the world population only grows?
-------------------- There are 10 types of people in the world...those that understand Binary and those that don't.
Registered: Nov 2004
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Vanguard always talks in hyperbole and black/white language, "blogspeak" as I call it, it's the way he thinks he'll get his point across.
I watched Rush Limbaugh's "I hope Obama fails"-speech this morning, it was so entertaining. Apparently he's scared and angry at the coming de-privatization of certain areas in society at the hands of the new administration, and hearing that made me glad. I hope these fatcats, Halliburters, neocon-libertarians and lobbyists of the US really squirm and suffer in the coming year, seeing their abilities to stuff their pockets without supervision slowly wither away, and I'll be watching it with a not insignificant amount of satisfaction. Of course, those people always find a way to cheat the system, but at least it's a step in the right direction.
I get the libertarian/objectivist attitude to Obama, they are only interested in private gain and not that of society, of course they hate him. Doesn't change anything though, which is nice.
Registered: Aug 1999
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quote:Originally posted by WizArtist II: With the extreme polarization that is occurring in the not-so United States, I really see there being a potential for a second civil war.
I've thought about that before, but I've often wondered exactly how that would happen. Even in the 1860s, opinions weren't exactly divided up along state lines, but a lot moreso than now. Our opinions may be pretty polarized, but for the most part, we're all mixed together.
Registered: Jul 2002
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quote:He didn't tell you to shut up, he told you to chill out, so that childish and quite embarrassing response of yours actually provided his QED.
But you feel the need to defend his childish and embarassing response.
quote:I watched Rush Limbaugh's "I hope Obama fails"-speech this morning, it was so entertaining. Apparently he's scared and angry at the coming de-privatization of certain areas in society at the hands of the new administration, and hearing that made me glad.
And this is a lot of what I'm talking about. You don't want to have Obama succeed because it would be good for the nation, or your family, or so on, you want him to succeed out of your hatred for those on the other side of the poiltical aisle.
Me? I've got three kids to worry about, one enterting the workforce for the first time. I definately want Obama to succeed. To his credit, he seems to be cloning Clinton as much as possible, which eases my concerns somewhat.
You're confusing my contempt for the 'Obama Supporter' that sing his praises as is he was Christ (literally), start dressing their kids in Obama uniforms (which, sadly enough, were BROWN), and start printing out huge posters to hang in their houses like he was Kim Jong Ill. They adopt all the trappings of fascism while all the while decrying anyone who disagrees with them about ANYTHING as the 'real' fascists.
quote:I get the libertarian/objectivist attitude to Obama, they are only interested in private gain and not that of society, of course they hate him. Doesn't change anything though, which is nice.
Libertarian's are NOT just interested in private gain, they're interested in the government getting out of so many aspects of our lives. Considering the federal government's success record in how it microlegislates, as well as the success records of other nations with more socialist or outright communist leanings, Libertarians do have a point.
quote:You don't want to have Obama succeed because it would be good for the nation, or your family, or so on, you want him to succeed out of your hatred for those on the other side of the poiltical aisle.
Haha, again with the black/white. I don't have to defend or explain the nature of my appreciation for the new President to you, despite you putting words in my mouth. Furthermore, there is no way he can improve my rights or standard of living. My wish to all americans for wellbeing and a new chance, and the idea of seeing pundits bite their own tongue and taste the poison, the two are not mutually exclusive.
Yes, I don't know how you will be able to survive the terrible onslaught of Obama lackeys and their quest to quench free will and wield absolute power and steamroll kittens, but I suspect the solution might occupy a medium sized fanfic or two. Maybe Ron Paul can establish an underground railroad to New Hampshire for self-appointed martyrs. Either that or a subterranean vault.
Vanguard:
quote:start dressing their kids in Obama uniforms (which, sadly enough, were BROWN)
You broke Godwin's Law, you lose the argument.
Did anyone see that interview with people on the street in Israel, the day after the election? Apparently many of them discount Obama completely on the grounds of his name, thinking him muslim. How uphill does that feel.
Registered: Aug 1999
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You're confusing my contempt for the 'Obama Supporter' that sing his praises as is he was Christ (literally), start dressing their kids in Obama uniforms (which, sadly enough, were BROWN), and start printing out huge posters to hang in their houses like he was Kim Jong Ill. They adopt all the trappings of fascism while all the while decrying anyone who disagrees with them about ANYTHING as the 'real' fascists.
I live in New York City, a place I guess you can say is a bastion for liberalism. Yet I don't really see what your describing. I don't see Obama uniforms or large crowds beating up on conservatives, and believe me there are quote a few in this town. So what your experiencing is either relegated to where you live, or your overreacting, or your exaggerating the truth.
Registered: Feb 2005
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You can't invoke Godwin unless it was unrelated. The 'brownshirts' those guys in California did... I didn't know to be worried, just creeped out, and concerned for their lack of intelligence.
And, oddly, I see this more in the 'neveaux rich' areas, those suburban areas where people flip houses annually, have lawn you can mow in seconds, etc... the 'upper middle class' as you will, who seem to have latched onto Obama as a spiritual focus.
I can probably dig around for more local pictures and rallies and stuff, but it's just a bizzare melding of Baby Boomer narcissim, 'rich man entitlement', and WASP self-loathing or something. Thing is, the thinking is actually so alien to me that I really can't rationalize it or explain it.
These are moderately successful upper-middle class people for whom Obama has become their God, their focus for all things 'great and beautiful' in the world.
And, of course, I don't mean that all people who voted for Obama are like this (hell, I very nearly voted for him myself, and would have if the GOP controlled Congress). It's a subset from a group of should-bes that really seem to be looking at Obama not as a political figure, but as their personal redeemers.
"You don't want to have Obama succeed because it would be good for the nation, or your family, or so on, you want him to succeed out of your hatred for those on the other side of the poiltical aisle."
Or, it's possible that some people want him to do what we on the left think is best for the country because it's what we think is best for the country, and seeing asshats like Limbaugh freak out is just icing.
Registered: Mar 1999
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