------------------ "Goverment exists to serve, not to lead. We do not exist by its volition, it exists by ours. Bear that in mind when you insult your neighbors for refusing to bow before it." - Jeffrey Richman, UB student
The First One
A lovely little thinker, but a bugger when he's pissed
Member # 35
posted
Oh, Christ. I REALLY wish you lot would f***ing get over it already. This constant, endless, interminable, Clinton-bashing!
You elected him. TWICE. But of course you, personally, didn't vote for him. Most of you will probably say it was because you were too old, and you'd have voted against him if you could. And therefore the whole democratic process is invalid. Who cares that most people DID vote for him? You didn't, and that's what counts.
Naturally I guess the whole thrust of your argument is "President Bush/Quayle/Dole/Gingrich/Buchanan wouldn't have let rocket experts go to China." Of course. He'd have sent them to Iraq/Indonesia/wherever already. More likely given the way the Republicans like to see business do whatever they want, they'd still have gone to China.
But please, DO GROW UP. It's as boring as the "Bill Gates is evil" rants. You tried to impeach him and you f***ing BLEW IT. And all because the guy's wife worked for the committee that brought down Nixon, thereby depriving you of your little Republican dictatorship.
posted
Wow....you've managed to reduce a whole nation of 300 million(give or take a couple thousand) independent free-thinking people to one single stereotype. That must take effort.
posted
Hilary helped "take down" Nixon? I didn't know that.
Personally, I'd take Nixon over Clinton any day. Nixon's people took one file, and the rest of the Republicans helped try to get rid of him. And he had the decency to resign. Clinton took hundreds of files (or was it thousands?). He took campaign money from the Chinese. He stood by while they stole three decades of nuclear secrets, possibly leading to another cold war within the next decade. He commited perjury. He dragged this country through an impeachment. He has been found in contempt of court. He has violated his presedential oath of office. He blocks every investigation he can, and runs a smear campaign against those he can't. And yet the majority of the Democratic party continues to stand by this pathetic excuse for a man. And yet some people say that the Democratic party is "morally superior". Go figure.
I don't know about traitor, technically, but the rest of what he's done I consider far worse.
------------------ Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons; for you are crunchy and good with ketchup.
posted
Oh, why bother anymore. I'd rather argue with my friend's dog.
But from now on I'm going to get all my news from Bubbaland!
Yeeeee Hawwww!
------------------ If you can take advantage of a situation in some way, it's your duty as an American to do it. Why should the race always be to the swift or the jumble to the quick-witted? Should they be allowed to win merely because of the gifts God gave them? Well, I say cheating is the gift man gives himself! ~C. Montgomery Burns
[This message has been edited by Jay (edited November 22, 1999).]
God protect the world from another republican US president. Hell, God help the world from the US period.
Ah, my crystal ball foretells many strange things, but surely the irony of a Europe united by the mentality, "Jeez/Mon Dieu/Mein Gott! We'd better stick together because those americans are CRAZY!"
A final volley: At least democratic presidents HAVE a foreign policy that involves more than lining borders with nukes and daring anybody to look at the US in a funny way!
------------------ "You will be swept away.... You, your men, your ship, your WORLDS!"
posted
So I suppose this wouldn't be a good time to point out that we're (the US, I mean) giving back the Panama canal to the precarious control of the Panamanians next year....
And they've already signed a deal with the CHINESE to administer BOTH sides of the canal for the next 50 years.
This does not bode well, given China's declared intent to reconquer an independent nation which the US has close ties with, namely Taiwan. Nor does it bode well for South Korea, Indonesia, or any other area the Chinese have designs on.
Why does this bode badly? Well, where do you think the US sends reinforcements through when the Pacific Fleet is busy? The Canal. If the Chinese are taking Taiwan, do you really think they'll freely allow US warships through a Chinese-controlled canal?
I kind of doubt it.
These are the same Chinese, by the way, that stole nuclear secrets, once threatened to nuke the West Coast if we interfered with their plans for Taiwan, and recently launched an ICBM-worthy space vehicle.
Are you concerned yet?
------------------ Calvin: "No efficiency, no accountability... I tell you, Hobbes, it's a lousy way to run a Universe." -- Bill Watterson
posted
I propose, which came from a good friend of mine, a SEATO. South-Eastern Asian Treaty Organization of the U.S., Japan, South Korea, Philippines, Vietnam, and Taiwan. Think of what would happen then!!
------------------ "Goverment exists to serve, not to lead. We do not exist by its volition, it exists by ours. Bear that in mind when you insult your neighbors for refusing to bow before it." - Jeffrey Richman, UB student
posted
Seato already exists, it's just ineffective. And China has too many border problems of it's own to ponder doing anything in the western hemisphere. Hell, they don't even have rapid enough national movement to defend their own territory, thus the large standing army. Not that I would advise attacking them .
------------------ "Diplomacy is the art of Internationalising an issue to your advantage"
posted
The Chinese military designs upon the Western world consist largely on preventing the Western world from interfering with them if they make any moves on their neighbors.
IIRC, China has had several border disputes with India (and possibly Pakistan, but I'm not certain). They have the military might to make anyone's day unpleasant if they should choose to do so. I think I'd rather deter China than have to go toe-to-toe with them in a military manner.
--Baloo
------------------ It is less important that you agree with me than it is for you to to understand what I'm saying.
posted
If we would just listen to Buchanan, we wouldn't have to worry about any of this. Come on, perfect security, and all we have to do is convert into a theocratic dictatorship. Frankly, I have a hard time seeing the down side. Er...aside from my personal beliefs delivering me to a quick death, of course.
------------------ "And if we weren't good to you, Dave, you shouldn't take it all the way to your grave." -- Will Rigby
posted
Well, Sadie the Wonderdog (my friend's dog whom I have been arguing with about this, and other issues) will be more than happy to hide you out Sol should the time come.
Either the time when we are overrun by Christian Right Wing or by nuked back to the stone age Chinese missles built on stolen technology launched by warlords bent on taking over the rest of the western world.
Should the second option happen, I'll save you some space in my bomb shelter which was built during the administrations of Roosevelt and Truman, two more traitorous democrats. See, they like Clinton (who callously, and with mallice and forethought allowed the Chinese to grab secrets in return campaign contributions), opened the doors to America's early nuclear arsenal those insidious Soviet spies.
I wonder if Stalin ever got to sleep in the Lincoln bedroom. Hmmm.
Then again Sadie the Wonderdog can't read so she doesn't know her history the way that those fellers at BubbaLand do.
------------------ If you can take advantage of a situation in some way, it's your duty as an American to do it. Why should the race always be to the swift or the jumble to the quick-witted? Should they be allowed to win merely because of the gifts God gave them? Well, I say cheating is the gift man gives himself! ~C. Montgomery Burns
posted
Jeff you know SEATO actually got the US into Vietnam, seriously that the way it was justified to send troops there.
------------------ "Think of all the delightful aspects of the reproductive process: menstruation, pregnancy, labor. And the part we're trying to eliminate is sex?" Cecil Adams the guy who does Straight Dope.
posted
OK, here's what I think will happen over the next couple of decades as a direct result of Willy selling the Chinese our nuclear tech. That is, assuming a conservative doesn't get into office soon and do something about it. One: China will blow Taiwan into the ocean. We will stand by and do nothing, except break off all diplomatic relations. Two: China will become increasingly more agressive toward their neighbors in much the same way Russia was toward the other former Soviet states. This will eventually lead to China grabbing territory from many surrounding countries, possibly including Japan and the Phillipenes. Three: A cold war between us and China will ensue. Four: Eventually, China will come into conflict with Russia, who will still have a large arsenal of nukes. This will lead to a war, possibly involving the limited use of nuclear weaponry. Russia will request our assistance. We'll refuse, and Russia will break off relations with us. Events afterward can not be predicted with any degree of certainty.
There is one way to avoid this. Make alliances protecting US interests around the world, much as we had with Kuwait. This would include Taiwan, Japan, and Russia. We must then make it clear that any agression toward our allies will not be tolerated, and we must back up that claim. I don't think China will be willing to risk war with the US AND Russia simultaneously. Chinese agression must be stopped before it starts. We must "nip it in the bud", as it were.
------------------ Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons; for you are crunchy and good with ketchup.
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