posted
I have a few questions about the conjectural five year mission after The Motion Picture. This was the supposed setting of Star Trek:Phase II.
Was Will Decker supposed to have been the new Enterprise commander for Phase II? And if so, *did* he actually command that fifth five year mission?
------------------ "You know, putting up a tent is like making love to a beautiful woman. You undo the zip, pop in your pole and slip into the old bag." - Swiss Toni, The Fast Show (British comedy show) --- Titan Fleet Yards - Harry Doddema's Star Trek Site
posted
Well since Decker was lost at the end of TMP (right?) I think it's safe to say that he didn't command a five year mission...
As far as Phase 2 goes...I think Kirk was always slated to command it with a new Vulcan science officer (Skon?). But the first episode was turned into a movie. And Leonard Nimoy decided to do Spock again.
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[This message has been edited by Aban Rune (edited May 24, 2001).]
quote:Well since Decker was lost at the end of TMP (right?) I think it's safe to say that he didn't command a five year mission...
What, dead people can't have command positions?
What was I thinking??
Let's just change the subject then: What was Kirk doing on the 1701 from 2262 to 2265?
------------------ "You know, putting up a tent is like making love to a beautiful woman. You undo the zip, pop in your pole and slip into the old bag." - Swiss Toni, The Fast Show (British comedy show) --- Titan Fleet Yards - Harry Doddema's Star Trek Site
posted
The replacement Vulcan was named Xon. And after the pilot movie ("In Thy Image"), Kirk's role would start to be "phased out" to let Decker take over as the new, young, dynamic captain. They were considering something maybe even so extreme as to kill Kirk off on an away mission, but never actually planned out anything concrete past the first thirteen episodes' story treatments.
--Jonah
------------------ "It's obvious I'm dealing with a moron..."
After the first five year mission in 2269, Kirk gets promoted to Admiral and transfers to Starfleet Operations, and Decker becomes Enterprise captain. Two and a half years later (after one and a half year of refit work and one mystery year), in 2272, TMP takes place. After the V'Ger incident, Kirk does what? He could have gone back to his duties as SF Admiral, leaving someone else as Enterprise captain (Spock? Was he captain already in TMP? And did he finish his Kolinahr first?) . Kirk could've also commanded the post TMP mission himself, as an Admiral, although I find this hard to believe.
Somewhere between TMP and TWOK, Kirk resigns and later becomes an Acadamy instructor (with the rank of Admiral again). During this time, Captain Spock is commanding the 1701.
Is there any evidence as to who commanded the last five year mission of the Enterprise?
------------------ "You know, putting up a tent is like making love to a beautiful woman. You undo the zip, pop in your pole and slip into the old bag." - Swiss Toni, The Fast Show (British comedy show) --- Titan Fleet Yards - Harry Doddema's Star Trek Site
posted
Captain James Kirk couldn't have commanded the USS Enterprise before 2265. First, the episode "Where No Man Has Gone Before" stated that Capt. Kirk had commanded a ship prior to the USS Enterprise. Second, the episode "The Menagerie" occured two years after Capt. Kirk had assumed command of the USS Enterprise.
Canonically speaking, here I am referring to the episodes and films, there were two captains of the USS Enterprise before 2272-Capt. Pike and Capt. Kirk.
My idea of history- USS Enterprise is commissioned in 2250, assuming three five year commands under Capt. Pike. She is given a small crew at the beginning of her career-203 crew members. Captain Pike is her first captain and achieves legendary status.
In 2265, Captain Kirk assumed command of the USS Enterprise. Her second captain has more first encounters with any species before or after.
In 2270, at the completion of a mission, the USS Enterprise is refitted.
In 2272, TMP.
In 2286, USS Enterprise is a cadet ship. She is destroyed that same year.
posted
I reckon that there was another five year mission after TMP... Then, yes Kirk probably went on to become Academy Instructor, and Spock took on the Captain position... training cadets, so he wasn't really away from Kirk/McCoy that much.
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posted
Generations implies Kirk retired after the second five-year mission, before ditching his log cabin life to return to active duty. Whether he was permanently involved with the academy at the time of TWOK or just visiting Spock's training mission is never really nailed down, IIRC.
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posted
In my understanding Kirk remained captain from the end of TMP (2271) to the beginning of TWOK (2284). But there simply is no additional canon information to prove any theory either way.
But the facts are simple:
1. Decker is lost at the end of TMP. End of story. 2. Spock alludes to the fact in TMP that his business on Vulcan in regards to the Kolinahr is complete. So he reinstates himself into Starfleet and remains under Kirk as science officer or XO on the Enterprise for another 5 years at least. 3. Xon was never a canon character so never existed. 4. Any information before the installation of Pike on the Enterprise has to be seen as conjecture...
Because:
Captain April was never a canon character, although I'd very much like the idea that the Enterprise was indeed commissioned in 2244, with April taking command for a period of 10 years. After which Pike takes over in 2254-55 for another ten years (two 5 year missions). Then Kirk becomes captain 10 years after that......
BUT. It was cleary stated in 'The Search For Spock' that the Enterprise was to be retired because it was then 20 years old. This was in 2285, meaning the Enterprise was commissioned in 2265, right at the beginning of Kirk's reign, but this can't be true at all, because of Pike. So maybe this 20 year figure relates to the last refit? But this can't be correct either as the TMP refit took place only 14 years earlier. So what the hell this statment means I can't guess. But I'm nitpicking here, though it still throws the whole thing into a bit of doubt.
posted
Morrow's line has been ranted about at length over the years. The fact of the matter is that at that point, Star Trek III was released twenty years after Star Trek premiered. So in the real world, the Enterprise was twenty years old. That's the first case I know of where the writer(s) seriously stuffed-up continuity by ignoring the backstory of the Enterprise as established during TOS -- that there was at least ONE captain of the Enterprise prior to Kirk.
At the extremes of interpretation, on the one hand we can read canon facts as establishing Pike only for the Enterprise's maiden voyage that led to the First Contact with the Talosians, with Kirk taking over after that for the ship's first five-year mission, and thus giving support to Morrow's line... Or on the other, we can take Spock's line that he served under Pike for eleven years to all be on the Enterprise and Gene's comments in the series bible that the Enterprise was at least twenty years old by the time TOS started, but this blows Morrow's line out of space. One's gotta give.
--Jonah
------------------ "It's obvious I'm dealing with a moron..."
posted
Well, maybe 14 years - he meant roughly... as twenty...
or maybe between Pike's FYM and Kirk's FYM - there was a big arsed upgrade/refit - but not so cosmetic as TMP's...
Andrew
------------------ Homer: I'm gonna miss Springfield. This town's been awfully good to us. Bart: No, it hasn't, Dad. That's why we're leaving. Homer: Oh, yeah. [pokes his head out the window] So long, Stinktown!
posted
There *was* a refit between Pike and Kirk. Crew accomodations went from 200 to 400, and the nacelles were changed (pointy things removed, ball things added). Also, the interior was altered, as were the uniforms and equipment (laser to phaser).
And BTW, Robert April appeared in an animated episode, which was, at the time, considered just as canon as TOS. Only later did TPTB declare TAS non-canon.
posted
What I'd like to know is how the year for TWOK and TSFS are established. They are most commonly placed as 2285 - but why? There are three statements that I know of that can place these movies-
1.In TWOK Bones gives Kirk a bottle of Romulan ale for his birthday that is dated 2283 and says "it takes a while to ferment".
2.In TWOK Kirk, referring to Khan, says that "there's a man out there I haven't seen in 15 years trying to kill me". Since "Space Seed" would have taken place in 2267 TWOK should then be 2282. Funnily enough, TWOK was released in 1982 which is 15 years after Space Seed first aired (1967).
3.The dumb-ass admiral in TSFS declares that the Enterprise is 20 years old at the time. God only knows how we're supposed to interpret that.
So where or how was 2285 for these movies established - it's just been messing with my head.
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