quote:Originally posted by thelastguardian: ...I believe the 'explanation' I posted earlier for the 1701 refit being 'Enterprise Class' and the 1701-A being 'Constitution Class' is a sound one that harmonizes everything we've seen on-screen, and it works for me.
To celebrate, here is a lovely new logo.
I'm definatly in a logoy mood this month...but fear not, I shall be back onto starships soon enough.
I like how you used Phase II design elements. Nice touch!
-------------------- "Well, I mean, it's generally understood that, of all of the people in the world, Mike Nelson is the best." -- ULTRA MAGNUS, steadfast in curmudgeon
Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
On the issue of "renaming" the simulator...
Isn't putting an "Enterprise Class" label by the door a much more modest operation than "renaming"? Something more comparable to taping a printout of the week's schedule there?
It should be trivially easy to produce a different "plaque" there every day, or perhaps even every half-hour or so. There are graphically far more impressive "plaques" by the doors of the university here, printed out as needed. And yes, they do include unchanging information (comparable to that "Mark IV" thing) in addition to the changing bits (like "Enterprise Class") - it's easier and cheaper than permanently putting the unchanging info there on one printout and reprinting just the changing bits.
quote:Originally posted by Timo: It should be trivially easy to produce a different "plaque" there every day, or perhaps even every half-hour or so.
Hell, there are already companies today working on technologies which would produce a kind of "paper" in which jillions of little balls (dots) could be realigned so that the text could change whenever you want it.
-------------------- "Well, I mean, it's generally understood that, of all of the people in the world, Mike Nelson is the best." -- ULTRA MAGNUS, steadfast in curmudgeon
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quote:Originally posted by thelastguardian: ...I believe the 'explanation' I posted earlier for the 1701 refit being 'Enterprise Class' and the 1701-A being 'Constitution Class' is a sound one that harmonizes everything we've seen on-screen, and it works for me.
Well I'm convinced. Just so long as it's just a semi-official nickname used for ease of reference until all the old TOS Connies were eith refitted or decommissioned. To celebrate, here is a lovely new logo. I'm definatly in a logoy mood this month...but fear not, I shall be back onto starships soon enough.
Now, that's cool. Perhaps, it was another piece donated to a museum. How 'bout another note attached to the logo from Kirk to Scotty.
Scotty,
Here's to the next five-years. Let's make her look as good as new.
posted
A question about the nacelles on that patch: What made you decide on those little red slots on the front? I know the TMP nacelle has those black slots, but the Phase II model and Mike Minor's painting of same don't feature this. Also, I think the model that was under construction didn't have the Impulse Deflection Crystal thingus.
So, were you extrapolating between the two?
(Also as I recall, on Minor's painting there was a sizeable NCC-1701 on the side of the secondary hull.?
-------------------- "Well, I mean, it's generally understood that, of all of the people in the world, Mike Nelson is the best." -- ULTRA MAGNUS, steadfast in curmudgeon
Registered: Feb 2001
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quote: Now, that's cool. Perhaps, it was another piece donated to a museum. How 'bout another note attached to the logo from Kirk to Scotty.
Scotty,
Here's to the next five-years. Let's make her look as good as new.
JTK
Nah, the note thing has been done.
quote: A question about the nacelles on that patch: What made you decide on those little red slots on the front? I know the TMP nacelle has those black slots, but the Phase II model and Mike Minor's painting of same don't feature this. Also, I think the model that was under construction didn't have the Impulse Deflection Crystal thingus. So, were you extrapolating between the two?
(Also as I recall, on Minor's painting there was a sizeable NCC-1701 on the side of the secondary hull.?
More or less a combinations of several models and Sketches I've seen, so yeah.
The glowing bussards were just a little touch I added myself, to strike a parallel with the old connie.
I tried to put a reg on the primary hull but I couldn't get the angle just right so I settled for one on the secondary hull.
I hope thelastguardian will forgive me for the thread hijacking
posted
For the first time I can remember, a thread is so long and convoluted that I may have lost track of part of the arguement. I was going to state my personal interpretation - but it may have already been stated.
Hell, I still will. If it corresponds to one already posited - point me in the 'right' direction.
1. Of the 'first-flight' Heavy Cruisers, Constellation was the first built. Therefore the class was named after her.
2. Of the refitted 'first-flight' Heavy Cruisers, Enterprise was the first refitted. Therefore the refit class was named after her. (to distinguish between the original and refit configurations).
3. X years later, when the original Constitution was refitted, the refit class was renamed after her.
4. Any surviving pre-refit Constitution-class vessels (such as the one Picard alluded to in a museum) are also designated 'Constitution-class' - but are referred to as pre-refit.
This seems the simplest explanation to me. Comment?
-------------------- 'One man's theology is another man's belly laugh.' - Lazarus Long
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quote:Originally posted by Treknophyle: For the first time I can remember, a thread is so long and convoluted that I may have lost track of part of the arguement. I was going to state my personal interpretation - but it may have already been stated.
Hell, I still will. If it corresponds to one already posited - point me in the 'right' direction.
1. Of the 'first-flight' Heavy Cruisers, Constellation was the first built. Therefore the class was named after her.
2. Of the refitted 'first-flight' Heavy Cruisers, Enterprise was the first refitted. Therefore the refit class was named after her. (to distinguish between the original and refit configurations).
3. X years later, when the original Constitution was refitted, the refit class was renamed after her.
4. Any surviving pre-refit Constitution-class vessels (such as the one Picard alluded to in a museum) are also designated 'Constitution-class' - but are referred to as pre-refit.
This seems the simplest explanation to me. Comment?
Assuming you mean "Constitution" in 1 and not "Constellation", then that's the theory thelastguardian and I believe in.
The other theories seem to be:
1) They are all Constitution Class - the sign on the door indicated something else (like "the Class being taught on the Enterprise")
2) They are all Constitution Class, but the refitted 1701 is Enterprise Sub-Class, commonly called Enterprise Class
From this theory, however, and looking at the 1017, 956 and 1600s registries we have, if we accept that refits have different class names while looking similar, there seems to be no reason why we have to designate TOS-Connie-type ships as Constitution Class - they could be members of other Classes, which either (in the case of the 1600s) look identical to Connies, or (in the case of 1017) look slightly different. Or possibly 1600s used to look slightly different and have been refitted to Connie-specs by the time of TOS, although, seeing the 1017, this seems unlikely (why upgrade the newer ships and not the older ones?).
Hope you can understand all that...
Registered: Jan 2003
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petergunn1701
Ex-Member
posted
Greetings All...
I believe this may have been mentioned in a previous post, but I will state my opinion anyway.
The Enterprise was originally a Constitution Class Starship. This ship did undergo some upgrading and refits through the years under April, Pike, and Kirk (ala Photonic Topedos...lol). After Kirk's return from the 5-year broohaha...Starfleet decided that it was time to fish or cut bait...they decided to fish!
The Enterprise was THE FIRST Connie to undergo a massive overhaul, the likes of which deserved a seperate designation...ENTERPRISE!!! Why? Because there are obviously several older Connies running around doing their thing. It would be silly to consider the "Refit" Enterprise a Connie after the work she received. You may also want to consider that Starfleet was pretty proud of the old girl. Heck!!! The whole fleet adopted the Enterprise insignia as a their own. So it would fit that the fleet, in the same manner, would see fit to bestow a new class designation on the refit starship.
However, once all the older Connies are either refit or retired, it makes perfect sense to restore the original designation of Constitution or Constitution II to the class. Now why didn't SF stick with Enterprise as a Class Designation? I have no idea. Maybe it was only temporary anyway. Maybe it came to a vote and some folks hated Jimmy and the Band. Heck, the sub-class makes sence to.
In any case, Starship Class, Constitution Class, Enterprise Class...What's the difference? We know what we see when we see it! Right?!
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