posted
In the first edition of the Encyclopedia, I think. When all the ships that were supposed to be Oberths and ended up reusing the Grissom miniature found their way intot the entries and ship list.
--Jonah
-------------------- "That's what I like about these high school girls, I keep getting older, they stay the same age."
--David "Woody" Wooderson, Dazed and Confused
Registered: Feb 2001
| IP: Logged
quote:Originally posted by Dukhat: Hey Rev, that's a pretty cool illustration! (Although I still hate the design... )
The truth is, what you're all saying makes sense. I'm probably just spiteful about the Oberth because it was used in TNG simply because of the laziness and budget-consciousness of the producers' unwillingness to build new models that would be more contemporary to the Enterprise-D, unless the script specifically called for it.
BTW, although my lousy cut & paste art skills pales in comparison to yours, Rev, for fun I made an illustration of a ship that could have replaced the Oberth, based on the Executive Shuttle from ST:VI. There were at least two of these models built, one that was turned into the Jenolan, and one that was used in ST: Generations. Since the models had what looked to be GCS nacelle caps in the rear, I turned it the second one into a verifiable larger starship a la the Jenolan, only more contemporary. It's flipped upside down and backward, so the Bussard collectors are in front, and the bridge is in the rear. Do you think maybe you could refine it for me? *NOTE* I got the bridge and the lights from the Pasteur illustration from the Fact Files, which was where I got the pic of the Exec shuttle too.
I have to say I'm not a huge fan of the whole cut'n'paste school of thought to designing new ships. Even so, that thing just doesn't say "science Vessel" to me. It looks more like a transport and that would effectively make it a backward Sydney and since we already have an upside-down Sydney, that's be pushing things a little.
quote: I have to say I'm not a huge fan of the whole cut'n'paste school of thought to designing new ships. Even so, that thing just doesn't say "science Vessel" to me. It looks more like a transport and that would effectively make it a backward Sydney and since we already have an upside-down Sydney, that's be pushing things a little.
Oh, believe me, I'm not either...I was just kinda extrapolating what someone like Greg Jein might have done with an older model to make it into a newer model. But that's beside the point. Honestly, I always envisioned the "Oberth" class as more of a miniaturized Galaxy class, since both the Tsiolkovsky and the Enterprise-D were commissioned the same year. You know, kinda like a smaller version of the Enterprise, but having larger windows or escape pod hatches, or a larger bridge, to represent a smaller ship.
Oh, wait a minute. That's already been done...
Registered: Jun 2000
| IP: Logged
quote:Originally posted by Peregrinus: In the first edition of the Encyclopedia, I think. When all the ships that were supposed to be Oberths and ended up reusing the Grissom miniature found their way intot the entries and ship list.
--Jonah
Well, the plaque on the Tsiolkovsky in "The Naked Now" (TNG) said Oberth on it...
Registered: Jun 2001
| IP: Logged
quote: I have to say I'm not a huge fan of the whole cut'n'paste school of thought to designing new ships. Even so, that thing just doesn't say "science Vessel" to me. It looks more like a transport and that would effectively make it a backward Sydney and since we already have an upside-down Sydney, that's be pushing things a little.
Oh, believe me, I'm not either...I was just kinda extrapolating what someone like Greg Jein might have done with an older model to make it into a newer model. But that's beside the point. Honestly, I always envisioned the "Oberth" class as more of a miniaturized Galaxy class, since both the Tsiolkovsky and the Enterprise-D were commissioned the same year. You know, kinda like a smaller version of the Enterprise, but having larger windows or escape pod hatches, or a larger bridge, to represent a smaller ship.
Oh, wait a minute. That's already been done...
Sounds like you're describing the New Orleans to me. Whatever the reasons though, the Grissom was an Oberth and that's that, we're stuck with it. Sure it would have been nice if they spent money on something new, but the budget is the budget and money spent there means taking it from somewhere else. To be fair though, we did eventually get the Nebula and of course the Constellation, which is way more than we got in TOS!
posted
Hmm, TOS, what'd we get earth ship/Federation wise...
I can think of the DY-100, and that blob of light that is the J-class. That's about it.
We're getting more in TOS-R though, so we should be somewhat happy.
-------------------- "Kosh, I'd like to introduce you to our Resident schmuck and his side kick Kick Me."-Ritten
"Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity". -George Carlin
Registered: Jul 2007
| IP: Logged
Daniel Butler
I'm a Singapore where is my boat
Member # 1689
posted
Yeah, I was really annoyed when I saw the other ships used in the wargames with the Ent-nil. Only "twelve like her in the fleet" and apparently they could afford to stick 1/3 of that force in one spot for a wargame!
Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged
posted
You know, a thought just occured to me. WE know that the E-nil went through a refit between the 2250's and the 2260's. ( depending on how the new movie version looks, there might be ANOTHER refit in there somewhere) What if Kirk's line of " only 12 like her in the fleet" referred to post (first)refit Connies. Not all of the Connies need be refitted at the time of that line, so that would allow for more than just 12 Constitution class ships in Kirk's era. Starfleet must have built more than 12 of it's most powerfull ships between 224_, and 2266 ( that is when TOS takes place right?), so maybe the older run of Connies were refitted, and the newer ones left as is and waiting for the TMP refit.
I'm probably wrong though.
-------------------- "Kosh, I'd like to introduce you to our Resident schmuck and his side kick Kick Me."-Ritten
"Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity". -George Carlin
Registered: Jul 2007
| IP: Logged
Daniel Butler
I'm a Singapore where is my boat
Member # 1689
posted
Well we can retcon that line all we like, I think. At the time Star Trek was a far different beast than what it is today.
Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged
quote:Originally posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim: Well, the plaque on the Tsiolkovsky in "The Naked Now" (TNG) said Oberth on it...
Well, yes. That was created by Mike when they thought Rick's design was going to be the ship in jeopardy. The Grissom got stuck in at the last minute. I mean, the VFX people didn't even change the labelling on the miniature.
In this medium, we're not "stuck with" anything. As George Lucas is so fond of saying, "movies aren't finished -- they're abandoned". Same applies here. Especially with the time and budget crunches endemic to American episodic television. There is nothing but will and money preventing Paramount from dusting off the original materials and tweaking things as they did for TOS, TMP, TWOK... The only thing is knowing what to do and where to stop.
--Jonah
-------------------- "That's what I like about these high school girls, I keep getting older, they stay the same age."
--David "Woody" Wooderson, Dazed and Confused
Registered: Feb 2001
| IP: Logged
posted
You're seriously suggesting that if and when they remaster TNG, DS9 and First Contact they will replace ALL appearances of the Grissom/Oberth? No. We are stuck with it, it's not a big deal, get over it.
posted
Actually with today's home computers a fan could do it if they had the skills and the time.
I probably missed it - but is their a picture of the suggested design for TNG?
-------------------- Twee bieren tevreden, zullen mijn vriend betalen.
Registered: Oct 2000
| IP: Logged
Teh PW
Self Impossed Exile (This Space for rent)
Member # 1203
posted
quote:Originally posted by Reverend: You're seriously suggesting that if and when they remaster TNG, DS9 and First Contact they will replace ALL appearances of the Grissom/Oberth? No. We are stuck with it, it's not a big deal, get over it.
Demanding it, actually. Star Wars Remastered back in the 90's proved people will bitch while they wait in line at Best-Buy....
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
)![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic
