Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
It has been some time since I did some Trek-related art (or better: anything Trek-related at all). Now, two weeks after my final exams are over, I'm looking forward to a summer full of work on the stuff that has been lying around. First a little warm-up.
The DS9TM-Warbird - allthough surprisingly accurate in shape - has always annoyed me. Think it's time for a new attempt. I hereby declare the "Romulan Week". This is the result of todays work and will of course be cuntinued tomorrow. Based on publicity photos and the DS9TM-art. (And don't tell me there are lines that don't belong there or there are lines missing, I know that. It is just the extrapolation of the shadows)
Back again. What a good feeling.
-------------------- "This is great. Usually it's just cardboard walls in a garage."
Registered: Nov 2001
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Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
Uh, I just noticed something; the differences between the physical model and the CGI-model are bigger than I thought. Seems I have to do two different versions. The one you see - and Drexlers Warbird from the DS9TM - are just based on pictures of the physical model. I thought the only difference is the level of detail, but obviously there are certain other differences, for example longer nacelles and a different nose section.
-------------------- "This is great. Usually it's just cardboard walls in a garage."
Registered: Nov 2001
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posted
There are lines that don't belong there or there are lines missing, but it's a really good start.
Gonna make my week and do a Valdore schematic for me to build a model from?
-------------------- Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering. -Aeschylus, Agamemnon
Registered: Aug 2002
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Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
Sure, why not. Actually, that was my intention when I started this one. Problem is: I have to look for some good images first.
Topher: My initial reaction: , then , followed by and , I hope you understand.
-------------------- "This is great. Usually it's just cardboard walls in a garage."
Registered: Nov 2001
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Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
Doug Drexler is a good artist. Really. But when it comes down to accuracy, he could handle thing a bit better. In my initial post I said I didn't find any larger errors on his image, but the situation has changed. After going into detail with the additional images I gathered I was able to make out several things that needed to be changed. Took me hours to do so. And thanks to Mr. Anonymus who provided the surprisingly good 5-view drawings of the D'deridex (you can find them on ship schematics and other sites). That was my only source for the bottom wing structure. I think I know which image he used to create the pictures so it isn't 100% spot-on either, but IMO he did a better job than Drexler at recreating the ship. Here's the final 2-color-WIP, some things look better now (my favourite is the wing structure), some look ugly (the asymetrical tail, but I've checked various references, that thing looks like that and is not symetrical as the DS9TM and other sources suggest), overall I am quite satisfied with that old bird.
Additional information: After checking dozens of images, beauty shots and screen caps I am now convinced there are at least four different variants. Variant 1: Seen above, the ship that appeared throughout the first few seasons of TNG Variant 2: For example seen in "Data's Day", this could have been the first appearance. Most notably there are more windowed sections and an additional 'thing' on the nacelle's outside; if any we have just light coor changes. Variant 3: First (and probably last) seen in "The Die is Cast", DS9. No changes to the model as far as I can see, but the thing now has a strange dark grey color instead of the usual green. (Maybe the Tal'shiar variant of the ship?) Variant 4: CGI. Less detailed, some minor changes, the green color is back.
I guess - since I want to finish this first - I'll do all four variant's sideviews before either approaching the topview/frontview or starting the Valdore (at my current state of mind I'll do the Valdore first. I can't stand that damn Warbird anymore. And it has always been my favourite alien ship... )
-------------------- "This is great. Usually it's just cardboard walls in a garage."
Registered: Nov 2001
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posted
Isn't there some detail different in two of the versions? There are claw-like structures on the underside leading edge of the secondary hull as seen in "The Mind's Eye" that I don't recall seeing in "The Neutral Zone".
I know these structures are not on the AMT model of the Warbird, but are there on the Playmates toy.
Amasov Prime
lensfare-induced epileptic shock
Member # 742
posted
I need to check this. Let's see if I can find something. But images of the underside of the Warbird are rare, especially images of the toys. I have the micromachines Warbird and the Innerspace Warbird, but I'd need an AMT model to check it.
-------------------- "This is great. Usually it's just cardboard walls in a garage."
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Shik
Starship database: completed; History of Starfleet: done; website: probably never
Member # 343
posted
I have the AMT model (well, I have it in sections) & I can tell you that there is NO "clawlike structure" that I can see or otherwise discern.
-------------------- "The French have a saying: 'mise en place'—keep everything in its fucking place!"
Registered: Jun 2000
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posted
What I'm saying is I can tell you for certain there's a difference between the details of the Playmates Warbird and the AMT model...what I was asking was whether there's a difference with onscreen evidence. I don't have as many ready at hand resources to check with.
I was used to the details of the AMT kit for a long while. When I first saw "The Mind's Eye" and I saw the warbird hanging over Geordi's shuttlepod, I noticed the claw-like details that the AMT kit also has on either side of the bottom neck connection were also repeated on the bottom of the warbird on-screen. I haven't gone back to check if prior warbird appearances have had this detail all along. I wish I had the DVDs to reference.
posted
I also have the AMT Warbird and I can confirm that it's lacking the claws that should be on the ventral surface.
I'm pretty sure that there's two physical studio miniatures of the D'deridex. A guy that claims to have worked on TNG VFX, his name is Mitch Jones, informed me some time ago that a smaller, lighter, and more detailed Warbird was built to replace the cumbersome original miniature. This is quite possible considering they did the same thing for the Ent-D (the 4-footer replacing the 6-footer).
As far as I can tell, the new Warbird miniature was first utilised in "Defector" -- it's the first time the Warbird seems to have a shit load of lights/windows in the tail section. I'm pretty sure "Defector" was the first time the 4' Ent-D was used too.
posted
Makes sense... then soon after in "Tin Man" we start to get the 'multiple' D'Deridex appearences.
I maintain that the "B-type" Warbird - the D'Deridex is the smaller type seen in episodes like "Tin Man" and the "A-type" is the big muthafukka we saw in "The Neutral Zone" - which presumably had two Captains or something... since they spoke on equal footing. It also would have been the ship of choice to 1. Investigate someone who is scooping out Romulan bases along the Neutral Zone and 2. To freak out the Federation in their first contact in over 20? years. AND that it was the Federation's Flag ship AND it was the Enterprise (presumably a name that makes most Romulan commander bristle) that was sent to the Neutral Zone for that reknewed contact.
-------------------- "Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica." - Jim Halpert. (The Office)
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: I maintain that the "B-type" Warbird - the D'Deridex is the smaller type seen in episodes like "Tin Man" and the "A-type" is the big muthafukka we saw in "The Neutral Zone"
I maintain that all D'deridex looking Warbirds are B-type and that A-type Warbirds are an earlier class that we've never been shown. The A-types IMHO would've been the kind that destroyed the Ent-C, for example. Following this trend, the Valdores would be C-type.
I prefer avoiding the scaling paradox within reason, and I really don't see it necessary to classify "TNZ" Warbird as something different. It's just a shame that the truly massive size of the Warbirds rarely came across.
posted
Cpt. Kyle Amasov: In "Shadows and Symbols", during Kira's blockade, I believe one of the Warbirds makes a banking pass in front of the camera viewpoint, giving a good ventral view, IIRC. Also, an excellent up-the-kilt shot. (sic)
Here's one, there are other passes too, but if someone with the DVDs could make some snapshots, that would be gold.
Of course, they haven't gotten furter than, what, Season 2 now? >:-(
[ July 20, 2003, 03:27 AM: Message edited by: Nim ]
-------------------- "I'm nigh-invulnerable when I'm blasting!" Mel Gibson, X-Men
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![[Smile]](smile.gif)
It is just the extrapolation of the shadows)
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
, then ![[Embarrassed]](redface.gif)
, followed by ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
and ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
understand.
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