Flare Sci-Fi Forums: Independance Day Reflection...

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Posted by Jubilee (Member # 99) on :

Tonight I was dragged out of the house to watch some Fireworks over by the Marina.....
There were the normal crowds of people, loud music, vendors, etc... but there was a presence here that I had not felt for a very long time. As the fireworks started being set off, there was silence. I wondered what was up, and then I realized that there was music going along with the display that I couldn't hear, because I wasn't close enough to a radio. So I moved to somewhere that I COULD hear it. And I was impressed. VERY impressed.

This July 4th, whoever put together the fireworks display must surely be a miracle worker..... because the collection of music included the strongest message for PEACE I have ever seen at a fireworks display in my life.

The peace sign fireworks exploded in the air, and people cheered at them while "Heal the world" played in the background, followed by "Glory Glory Halleujah"... and then a bit of background music from the scene where Simbah's father dies on the Lion King.... it was as if the person putting it together was saying "Remember what has happened to our country in the past few years..... and remember what first won us independance"...

People.... we didn't win independance from Britain by fighting eachother, picking on people, labeling people, calling names, blowing eachother up, and etc. We bonded together as a nation, and overcome something. This goes to show what a nation of people can do when they STOP LOOKING AT THE DIFFERENCES and start looking at the SIMILARITIES.......

*wipes a tear out of her eye* ....

A message for peace between us all .... Instead of shouting things about how much better America is from everything else....we should be centering on what makes America what it is.... and how blessed we all are.

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"Nothing can be altered, there is nothing to decide
No escape, no change of heart, no anyplace to hide
You are all I'll ever want, but this I am denied
Sometimes in my darkest thoughts, I wish I'd never learned
What it is to be in love and have that love returned"

Posted by Diane (Member # 53) on :

Actually, the phenomenon I see around the forums is that people are saying how much THEIR country is better than the US!

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"I would be delighted to offer any advice I can on understanding women. When I have some, I'll let you know."
--Picard to Data, "In Theory"

Posted by Jaresh Inyo on :

I greatly admire America and its people. But, I still prefer Canada. Sorry.

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Josh: I think they're getting to know each other a bit too well, if you catch my drift.
Me: Oh, I agree. I think they're spending too much time together, that is of course, if you catch my drift.
Asher: I think he's *ucking her, and he's cheating on his wife, and he's risking his marriage, and if his wife finds out about it she'll leave him and take their son, and his life will be ruined. If you catch my drift...

Posted by bryce (Member # 42) on :

Yeah, everyone is making an effort to repair the nation this 4th of July

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"You can stand me up at the Gates of Hell, but I won't back down."- Tom Petty :-)

Posted by Jay the Obscure (Member # 19) on :

So, here I sit at work in my cold window-less cubicle on the 4th. Can't see any fireworks...I even went outside for a bit and I could hear the explosions reverberating off of the high rises.

*sigh*

So, I've had to comfort myself with a couple of cd's of Revolutionary War muisc I have.

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For what we are about to see next, we must enter quietly into the realm of genius!

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

After reading Jubee's post, does anyone else feel the sudden urge to break into "Let's Get Together"? *L*

Oh, well... Gives me an opportunity to get a new sig, if nothing else... :-)

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"Imagine all the people, living life in peace..."
-John Lennon, "Imagine"

Posted by Cargile (Member # 45) on :

I had to work.

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I was right in the middle of a gnikcuf reptile zoo. And somebody was giving booze to these goddam things."
Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas

Posted by Jubilee (Member # 99) on :

I'm sorry!!.. ACK. Well... that was more directed at the Americans among us, and i'm sorry if I offended everyone else...

But what I was really trying to say is.. the forums are a community here online.... we're a nation of some sort, too... and we need to be here for one another and enjoy our common threads instead of poking at our differences... that's all.

Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :

And well said it was.

I spent the evening with Mom, watching Westerns.

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WHO ARE YOU

Posted by RW (Member # 27) on :

The United States is not a bad country. It's just ill in many ways. For example, let's talk about lawyers :]

Posted by Baloo (Member # 5) on :

Which reference reminds me of something.

RW: Is it true that the Netherlander government is contemplating a word change to cross-walk control lights from "Walk/Don't Walk" to "Walk/proceed at your own risk"? I heard that some time ago, but never found out if it was truth or rumor.

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"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."
--Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of Digital Equipment Corp., 1977
www.geocities.com/Area51/Shire/8641/

Posted by HMS White Star (Member # 174) on :

Jubilee McGann said "People.... we didn't win independance from Britain by fighting eachother, picking on people, labeling people, calling names, blowing eachother up, and etc. We bonded together as a nation, and overcome something. This goes to show what a nation of people can do when they STOP LOOKING AT THE DIFFERENCES and start looking at the SIMILARITIES......."

I hate to say it but the above statement is completely wrong. In fact during the War of American Independence (I refuse to call it a Revolutionary War because the we where fighting for our rights that we had [or that we thought we had] as British Cizitens, while in a Revolution you try to overthrow the old order and replace it with a new one) only 1/3 of our nation supported the Revolution, another 1/3 was activity against the Revolution, and the final 1/3 didn't care either way (btw this estimate was done by Ben Franklin). In fact a large portion of British forces were colonies still loyal to the crown (I believe they were called Torys). In fact entire battles were fought only by people who in the future would be called Americans. And we did label people, call people names, confiscate property, and even kill each other over in the Revolution (both Torys and those who supported independence did this to people on the other side)[Note in the Treaty of Paris that ended the "Revolutionary War" there was a clase that said property conficated from Torys shall be returned to the owners, of course this wasn't carried out]. The only real reason we actually became independent is the British got tried of dealing with us and because of the French troops and warships. Sorry as nice as it sounded back, then America has always been divided even to the days of our founding fathers.

HMS White Star

Posted by Deep6 on :

There you go, just when we had a nice message of unity, you had to go and completely turn it around. What you speak of is in the past, I believe she was trying to promote unity in the future.

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"The brocolli must die!"

-Stewie, The Family Guy

Posted by HMS White Star (Member # 174) on :

Well unity is nice, but I perfer the truth over the the childhood dreams our parents feed us as children. If we going to remember the mistakes of the past so we won't repeat them wouldn't it be nice if we actually knew what there mistakes where. O well I always thought the truth would set you free. Or perhaps things that give us a warm fuzzy feeling inside is better than knowing the truth which is simple that humans haven't changed much in 200 years that violence, hated, greed, and the other "good stuff" aren't much better or worse than they are now. Btw did you know that 100,000 Torys left the nation that would be called the US after the British left, and there were actually 15 British Colonies in colonial America, with Canada and Florida generally considered amoung the British held Colonies (Florida was gained from Spain in the French/Indian War [in was around 1763] was finally under complete british control about the same time) of course Canada didn't really want to revolt and the colonials tried to take it over and failed. I don't know what happened to Florida, they didn't seem to want to revolt, but perhaps most of the cizitens where Spanish and not English, well later Florida was given to Spain for some reason.

Posted by Jay the Obscure (Member # 19) on :

There are a couple of ways to look at the armed conflict that eneded the British rule over the colonies that had been founded in the Americas.

In a very strict political sense it was a revolution in that it replace a system of limited monarchy. The British, since the time of the Magna Carta had had ckecks and controls on the Monarchy and with creation of the House of Lords and Commons those checks became more and more codified. In the place of the British system, the Americans, by 1787 came to realize that a complete overhaul of the old system was a necessity. Therefore they convened a convention to create a Reupblican form of democratic goverment.

However, in a cultural sense, the conflict resembles more a civil war than a revolution. The British government sent troops that worked long and hard to try and quite what they saw as hotheads of Boston and other that rallied to their cause. In addition to the fighting between regular armies, there was a great deal of un-civil bloodshed between the Revolutionaries and the Loyalists or Torries as they have been called. In fact, many of these Torries moved to Canada or back to Britian after the war in a very large way to get away from the atrocities commited by both sides.

The numbers given above regarding the splits in the populace for, against, and not giving a rat's ass either way are pretty well set. Althouhg I think it was John Adams who said it, but that is not important. However, what is important is that in a very real way, the sucess of the American Revolution came to be seen as a blueprint on how to conduct and win a revolution in other countries facing the extremes of a harsh Monarchy.

Lafayette returned to France after the conflict and while still a person of noble birth, was seen by the general populace as a man with stong connections to them becasue of his participation in the American Revolution. He was often a mitigating factor, when the French Revolution broke out, between the extremes on both sides. However, his moderation was overcome by the revolutionary zeal of the San Coulots (sp) and as he was pushed out of the leadership role, the French Revolution became much more revolutionary than the American Revolution ever did.

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For what we are about to see next, we must enter quietly into the realm of genius!

Posted by Cargile (Member # 45) on :

Hey! At least Jubes was 1/3 right! 1/3 of them stood together for their freedom. GO 1/3 THAT WON!

WOOHOO!

(My maternal ancestor was one of those victorious 1/3.)

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I was right in the middle of a gnikcuf reptile zoo. And somebody was giving booze to these goddam things."
Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas

Posted by Jubilee (Member # 99) on :

*shakes her head and sighs*..... we can't even agree on a message of peace and unity .... how are we supposed to get along at all?

Posted by HMS White Star (Member # 174) on :

I can agree on peace and unity, I want peace and unity as much as anyone. However how is that going to happen if ignore the inconvientant truth. Is it going to become like Japan where there part in WWII isn't even taught because it makes them feel bad. I want all this stupid infighting to stop as much as anyone. However I believe knowledge is one of the most important thing to the path on enlightenment and incorrect knowledge is harmful to that, even if the intentions are good. If that doesn't make me friends fine, I walked this road alone for many years. I respect your noble effort Jubilee, but understand that my seeking of the truth is just as important to me as peace and unity.

HMS White Star

Posted by Jay the Obscure (Member # 19) on :

Peace and unity is my ultimate goal.

I even have a bumper sticker on the back of my car that reads "work for peace and social justice."

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For what we are about to see next, we must enter quietly into the realm of genius!

Posted by Baloo (Member # 5) on :

[Apologies to Jubes in advance, but I can't resist the inspiration.]

I have a bumpersticker that reads:

"Visualize world peace...
...and shit in the other hand.
Guess which one fills up first?"

I now apologize to anyone else I may have offended.

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"There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home."
--Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of Digital Equipment Corp., 1977
www.geocities.com/Area51/Shire/8641/

[This message has been edited by Baloo (edited July 06, 1999).]

Posted by Jubilee (Member # 99) on :

*shakes her head and walks away*

Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :

made me laugh!!

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WHO ARE YOU

Posted by RW (Member # 27) on :

Yay. Bumper sticker politics. great.

I don't even get Baloo's joke. I'm stupid.