found this link on the portal of evil, thought it was pretty cool. i would be interested in your people's [is that pc? haha] takes on this, since i know some of you are from CA.
Posted by Proteus (Member # 212) on :
I always considered Canada to be the 51st state, so I welcome this! Our country would be HUGE
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Wow. Posts like that would be the main reason we'd never consent to an amalgamation with the USofA. We've got a basic literacy rate, as I understand.
Also: I was unaware we had many members from California.
Posted by Da_bang80 (Member # 528) on :
51'st state my ass! Maybe the US should join Canada! Give up the stars and stripes, and swear allegiance to the queen...and maybe hippo's are alien invaders (sarcasm)
Similar if not identical accent EH? Well Y'ALL I don't think so.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Why should Canada have to join the US? Why should the US have to join Canada? What about Mexico? I'd rather see a new political entity (like the EU) than see Canada joining the US.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Canada should invade Alaska! "Give us back out Pacific coast line!" Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Alaska never belonged to Canada. It was a Russian territory up until 1867, when the US bought it. At the time, Canada consisted of NB, NS, Ontario and Quebec. The latter two were only the lower parts of the modern provinces. BC was the size it is now, but still a British colony. The modern Alaska-Yukon border was all part of the NWT, also a British territory. IIRC Britain and Russia didn't get along well at the time.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
So Russia had all the way down the Pacific coast? When I look at maps I just think its sorta strange that there's only a little bit of Western Coast line for Canada.
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
The lack of coast is not so terrible. Were any enemy ships to attempt a landing, they'd certainly not find their way, as they'd get lost amid the foggy plumes of the BC Pot Smoke Cloud.
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
Not until they tear this beaver from my cold dead hands.
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Sod that; Canada's ours!! the United Kindom of Great Bitain, Northern Ireland and Canada. Sounds good to me. The Empire will rule again!!!!!! Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
I seem to remember one of the early Clive Cussler novels featured the recovery of a document signed by Lincoln or Churchill or someone like that (it's always 'someone like that' in his books) which ceded Canada to the US. Of course in Cussler's simplistic worldview the document is held to be valid 'today,' never mind the opinion your average Canadian might have about it.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
Why should Canada have to join the US? Why should the US have to join Canada? What about Mexico? I'd rather see a new political entity (like the EU) than see Canada joining the US.
That'd be interesting, actually. I call delegate from Tennessee!
Posted by superslowmo (Member # 875) on :
is it just me, or is ultramagnus an ass?
this was just a lighthearted post, all i wanted were reations, not an attack on my loose grammar...
ugh, and to think, i almost forgot why i stopped coming here after all that crap went down with adam and lee.
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
On a slightly more serious note, a weird fact that few Canadians know about is that the British overseas territory of the Turks & Caicos Islands have made rumblings in the past about joining Canada as a Hawaii equivalent. More tourists and a potentially more representative government structure for them, and a patch of sand that doesn't get snowed-on for us.
Posted by Da_bang80 (Member # 528) on :
I like that idea!
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
It's a shame that those three attempted American invasions of Canada during the War of 1812 didn't succeed... then we wouldn't have to worry about this issue at all!
The idea of a unification of the USA and Canada is so ludicrous for several reasons, not the least of which is the simple fact that Canada would be dominated even more by the current USA states than it is now in terms of culture and economy. Currently, they've got status, a distinct identity in name, and an independent voice in world affairs. Why would they want to give that up?
I could possibly see the US and Canada merging under some kind of continent-wide union similar to what the Europeans are doing now in the EU, but even that would be extremely unlikely given the overwhelming dominance of the US. It's easier to set up a union in Europe because the founding countries that got the ball rolling were more or less equal.
Besides, even if Canada did try to join the US, we'd end up with Great Britain declaring war on us to make sure that the Queen doesn't lose any of the jewels of her crown. (Kidding, kidding...)
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
quote:Originally posted by Vogon Poet: I seem to remember one of the early Clive Cussler novels featured the recovery of a document signed by Lincoln or Churchill or someone like that (it's always 'someone like that' in his books) which ceded Canada to the US. Of course in Cussler's simplistic worldview the document is held to be valid 'today,' never mind the opinion your average Canadian might have about it.
"Night Probe," the 3rd Dirk Pitt book. Signed in 1914 by Clement Attlee & Harvey Shields. One copy was lost on the Manhattan Limited train wreck, another on the Empress of Ireland. Britain buried their copy. They reinstated an old-as-fuck James Bond to stop the anschluss!
I always thought that Canadians referred to us as "Upper Mexicans?"
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
United States of North Mexico?
Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :
quote: this was just a lighthearted post, all i wanted were reations, not an attack on my loose grammar...
Don't let it bother you. Eveyone that joins here gets it from someone.
Posted by First of Two (Member # 16) on :
Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.
I've never considered Canada the 51st state. They're the 51st through 63rd state.
Imagine, the Canadians would finally have what they've always wanted, the ability to strongly influence US policies at the most important level.
Canada won't join all at once, however. It'll most likely start slowly, with the economically depressed Maritimes. Ottawa has ignored them long enough.
And after this is complete, we move on northern Mexico. Half of them are here already, so why not?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
This would only ever seriously be considered if Quebec separates, which is becoming less likely as time goes on. And even IF this happens, it'd be a very slow and generally disliked process of necessity rather than choice. The only province which stands a chance of staying as an independent nation would be Alberta, 'cuz we're so frickin' rich.
Mark
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I always figured the middle provinces--Alberta, Saskatchewan, Manitoba--would join first. For decades, they've had close ties with our wheat-producing states as well as the northern plains states.
The Maritimes would be next assuming Qu�bec decided to be stupid & hairy & arrogant & French (shocker that) & go it alone. If that were to happen, the MPs would be cut off form the rest of the Confederation, so it'd be in their best interest to join up; think of all the fishing rights! BC & Ontario would fall into line soon enough, there's really no difference between Alaska & the Yukon, & eventually Qu�bec would want in, too. I wouldn't, though. Nunavut could go independent for all I care.
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Alberta as a seperate nation is as plausible as Nobel Laureate Dustin Diamond.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
He will win the prize for literature in 2016. I am the new Newton!
Anyway, surely the typical Canadian reaction following the departure of Quebec would not be "Well, time to pack it in, then." but "Thank God."
But I kid the French and francophone nations.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'm a Vietnamese-Canadian born here to immigrant parents, living in Alberta, who speaks English and French fluently, but not much Vietnamese at all. Now, how Canadian is that?
Alberta's got the oil. If anything, we're more comparable to Texas than to any of the granary states. And there IS in fact a small minority of separatists who gain note every now and then - most notably, when Canada accepted the Kyoto protocols. Alberta could be fairly successful as a country - sorta like Switzerland, but with more cowboys.
Mark
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
The only reason the separatists gain note is because the SUN has nothing better to print. Except for the suspiciously clean and neat "Sunshine Boys." Not that there's anything wrong with that.
That, and the amazingly interesting news of Wally Buono's CFL adventures and whatever meagre whiny comments Klien has said today to further alienate himself from the east, would make for a tremendously boring country.
So, maybe Alberta can be the beginning of the new Middle West, but you know, man, it'd be boring.
Are there any good dollar stores in the South West that sell Knockoff Bruticus toys? If so, then I relike Alberta, and sign up for the seperatists.
But, I mean Cowboys and bad Hockey? Who would move here?
Posted by Cartmaniac (Member # 256) on :
"...would make for a tremedously boring country."
It isn't already?
*ducks*
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
If you're talking the Stampede, then yes. It's a very boring place.
But we've got the Heebee-Jeebees, and their immortal song "Use the Force" which will become the seperated Alberta's new national anthem.
Mark
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
But seriously: Gestalt knockoffs. Anywhere?
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote:Alberta, 'cuz we're so frickin' rich.
Till your oil runs out, then you got nothing. Beside half of your population already wishes they were Americans. Ontario will be the last bastion of Canada, the only province since confederation to always stand on it's own two feet and support the rest of the country. Canada's heart, soul, and economic engine.
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ultra Magnus: The only reason the separatists gain note is because the SUN has nothing better to print. Except for the suspiciously clean and neat "Sunshine Boys." Not that there's anything wrong with that.
That, and the amazingly interesting news of Wally Buono's CFL adventures and whatever meagre whiny comments Klien has said today to further alienate himself from the east, would make for a tremendously boring country.
So, maybe Alberta can be the beginning of the new Middle West, but you know, man, it'd be boring.
Are there any good dollar stores in the South West that sell Knockoff Bruticus toys? If so, then I relike Alberta, and sign up for the seperatists.
But, I mean Cowboys and bad Hockey? Who would move here?
You have summed up that swarthy land forty minutes from my house far better than I could ever hope to.
Unexpected upside if Canada were to join the U.S.: 50ish safe Democrat electoral votes in essentially every Presidential election ever. In other words, the elimination of the Republican Party as an organization capable of setting a superpower's policy.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
I'd expect your political parties to carry over, though, especially given the general suckiness of both our parties. One lies about what it stands for, and the other doesn't stand for anything, so why wouldn't you? I'm still leaning towards the whole "vote in order of preference" thing, frankly. Two-party systems suck.
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
?! Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
Omega isn't allowed out of the house in case he's currupted by non-Christian values, otherwise I'd be tempted to ask if he left a computer logged in somewhere. . . 8)
Posted by Tora Regina (Member # 53) on :
Wow, yeah, what did you do to Omega, Omega?
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
Now tell me, when was the last time you saw a Republican actually doing any of the things I advocate as far as domestic policy goes, outside of Bush's tax cuts? Why do you think I was so eager to come up with a way to eliminate the two-party system a while back?
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
I had this post planned out in response, it was both amusing and full of wisdom, musing on such diverse topics as the problem in fainding a political party you feel can really represent you, and so forth. It wasn't even insulting to anyone! But then my wife walked into the room stark naked, and I forgot all about it.
So, bad luck. And, er, gotta go. Bye! 8)
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I'm shocked. Shocked & appalled. I truly am.
There's a "flip her the bird" joke somewhere here, but I'm not Professor Challenger enough to hunt it down.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
I had this post planned out in response, it was both amusing and full of wisdom, musing on such diverse topics as the problem in fainding a political party you feel can really represent you, and so forth. It wasn't even insulting to anyone!
Who are you, and what have you done with Lee, Lee?
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote:I had this post planned out in response, it was both amusing and full of wisdom, musing on such diverse topics as the problem in fainding a political party you feel can really represent you, and so forth. It wasn't even insulting to anyone! But then my wife walked into the room stark naked, and I forgot all about it.
One wonders why he wasted time typing this out.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
He didn't. He telepathied it at us.
Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
Where's my naked girlfriend coming to distract me?
Oh, right, South Carolina....bastard 9 hour drive.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
*grin*
Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
Stop rubbing it in, you lucky sexed up bastard Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
Actually, I have someone else to do my rubbing for me. }B)
Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
*Adds Vogon to the 'To Kill' list...*
Posted by First of Two (Member # 16) on :
My gf was quite naked this morning as well. I think we scared the nextdoor neighbor's dog.
Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
Did you just call your girlfriend ugly?
Posted by Cartmaniac (Member # 256) on :
No being, human or otherwise, should ever have the misfortune of witnessing that sexual freakshow.
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Okaaaaaay...
The Canadian constitution (Canada Act (1981)) is actually a hell of a lot better than the US one and makes a whole lot more sense; proper balence between politicians and those who have actually achieved something (I assume there does actually have to be a reason to let people into the senate ). I very sincerly doubt that there are all that many Canadians who want to join the US- the US may be very influential but Canada is still seperate. Would the US allow Canadian political parties to continue?
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
Why not? I mean, they might not SPREAD, but they'd surely continue to exist, if only on a state level.
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote:Would the US allow Canadian political parties to continue?
Some Americans would have a fit if there was a Liberal Party.
Posted by First of Two (Member # 16) on :
No, mostly we'd snicker at the redundancy of having two of them.
Or watch the Democratic party finally splinter off its fringe.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
Leaving...?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
If it happened, would the US then consist of forty-six states, four commonwealths, and thirteen provinces? Or would they become states, nominally?
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN: If it happened, would the US then consist of forty-six states, four commonwealths, and thirteen provinces? Or would they become states, nominally?
Well, Canada is divided into both provinces and three territories, so its going to break down even more. Then you guys have your messed up protectorates.
Speaking of messed up, I'd hope that we wouldn't use that thing you call an electorial system. Primaries. *shudder*
As for party redundancy, the liberals wouldn't really have that much to worry about. They'd have to wait till both the PC and the CA get bumped off first, and even then they'd have more in common with the Bloc than the Democrats. I mean roughly speaking the order from left to right would be:
New Democratic Party, Bloc/Liberals, Progressive Conservatives, Canadian Alliance/Democrats, Republicans.
The Bloc would survive no matter what, the Candian Alliance might merge with the Democrats (the Republicans would be too far to the right...which would also nicely split up the southern US religious vote ), the PC would be stranded as usual, and the NDP would see a huge resurgence of votes as large numbers of voters in Florida start confusing the Democrats and the New Democrats...fancy new voting machines notwithstanding Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Well, I'm still pushing for a New Empire. Democratic union of the former colonies; a power block to challenge the US... .
Actually on the subject of supranational government/world government, back when the East India Company was in charge of India they used to have a system whereby the sovreignty of a state would be assured by the HEIC in return for the state giving up the right to make war on it's own behalf- perhaps something similar would work?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Mucus: So, what you're saying is that the Democrats are only as far left as your rightmost party?
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
Without having done significant research, my gut feeling is that while you *could* make a convincing argument that the Democrats would overlap with the Canadian Alliance, the differences between the Liberals, the PC, and the (US) Democrats are just too large to be written off.
In a horrible situation such as Canada joining the US, I'd place odds on the PC joining the Liberals before the Democrats.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN: Mucus: So, what you're saying is that the Democrats are only as far left as your rightmost party?
People claim similar things over here, that the Conservatives are pretty much in the same place left/right as your Liberals. But it's not true in all cases, and the Conservatives are usually pushing right, while the Democrats are pushing left. Or something.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
I think the big problem here at the moment is that New Labour have moved so far to the right, they're now occupying the ground held by the LibDems, meaning Kennedy spends all his time either saying "we agree with the governnment" when he should be saying the opposite, and vice versa. And that's when he's not appearing on game shows.
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Exactly; new labour seems to have moved so for to the right that even the Conservatives agree with The Dear and Beloved Leader a lot of the time. In fact, the opposition at times seens to consist of Labour backbenchers and the BBC. I honestly hope the Conservatives get their act together and come up with some decent policies (and a decent leader) soon. I think they'd probably have more success if they moved back towards the more traditional conservatism, rather that Thatcherism which is more like the 19th century Liberal party.
quote: And that's when he's not appearing on game shows.
A whole five minutes?!?
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
He hosted Have I Got News For You, which is longer than 5 minutes.
I'd love to see Tony presenting it. No, scratch that, I'd love to see Bush presenting it.
The Tories are only partially agreeing with New Labour, I think. They're still to the right of them. Which means they spend all their time moaning about immigrants and trying to invade Poland.
I'm not keen on the Conservative party at all, personally, by Labour desperatly need an opposition party. I'd like it to be the Chuckster, but at the moment The National Union Of Boring Twats has more political savvy than the Tories.
Posted by MaGiC (Member # 59) on :
I think the shake up the Conservatives need is Michael Portillo as leader... No more of this Ian Duncan who? nonsense... At least Portillo makes an impression and people remember who he is...admittedly not always for the right reasons....
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Liam: That two minutes would be the two that he isn't on chat shows.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Courtesy of Rick Mercer from This Hour Has 22 Minutes, CBC Television:
On behalf of Canadians everywhere I'd like to offer an apology to the United States of America. We haven't been getting along very well recently and for that, I am truly sorry. I'm sorry we called George Bush a moron. He is a moron but, it wasn't nice of us to point it out. If it's any consolation, the fact that he's a moron shouldn't reflect poorly on the people of America. After all it's not like you actually elected him.
I'm sorry about our softwood lumber. Just because we have more trees than you doesn't give us the right to sell you lumber that's cheaper and better than your own.
I'm sorry we beat you in Olympic hockey. In our defence I guess our excuse would be that our team was much, much, much, much better than yours.
I'm sorry we burnt down your white house during the war of 1812. I notice you've rebuilt it! It's Very Nice.
I'm sorry about your beer. I know we had nothing to do with your beer but, we Feel your Pain.
I'm sorry about our waffling on Iraq. I mean, when you're going up against a crazed dictator, you wanna have your friends by your side. I realize it took more than two years before you guys pitched in against Hitler, but that was different. Everyone knew he had weapons.
And finally on behalf of all Canadians, I'm sorry that we're constantly apologizing for things in a passive-aggressive way which is really a thinly veiled criticism. I sincerely hope that you're not upset over this. We've seen what you do to countries you get upset with.
Thank you.
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
Well, first of all, a fifty-word-or-less treatise on the current state of the American political system:
Our two major parties are so emasculated by trying to appease each other to the point that their opposition won't block the legislature they want passed that nothing ends up really happening. Add to this the problem that career politicians are totally out of touch with both reality and real people. The only possible exception being Al Gore in his younger days. Now, I'm not so sure.
We need to stop electing politicians, and we need to take responsibility for our voting power. There are times that I really hate people...
In closing, there's a reason the two continents in this hemisphere are called "the Americas". We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own, from Cape Morris Jesup to this half on Antarctica.
I don't want world domination -- just this side of it...
--Jonah
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
'cause this is my United States Of Whatever'
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
A comedy show over here had Dubya singing his own version of that song. Itwas fantastic .
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
Some unknown indie band here sent a British version in to the radio station XFm. It was called "United Kingdom of Whenever." Sample verses went thus:
quote:It's Sunday night and there's nothing on BBC2 but Snooker. I phone the BBC to ask what time the X-Files is on and they say "Whenever."
and
quote:I see Ken Livingston and ask "Oi, Ken! As part of your Integrated Transport System for London, what time is the 38 bus to Clapham?" and he says "Whenever."
Posted by CaptainMike (Member # 709) on :
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: People claim similar things over here, that the Conservatives are pretty much in the same place left/right as your Liberals. But it's not true in all cases, and the Conservatives are usually pushing right, while the Democrats are pushing left. Or something.
and the conservatives drive on the left side of the road too. figure _that_ out...
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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"Give us back out Pacific coast line!" ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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(Kidding, kidding...)