This is topic I saw Neil Armstrong! in forum Officers' Lounge at Flare Sci-Fi Forums.


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Posted by Veers (Member # 661) on :
 
It was yesterday,at the Experimental Aircraft Association's annual "Air Adventure" air show in Oshkosh, Wisconsin. This year's theme was (surprise) "100 years of Flight." We (my brother and some other people) sat through some awards, a talk by the creator of last year's Flight Across America (honoring 9/11), a musical interlude by a very good 13-year old fiddler, and then two astronauts were introduced (can't remember they're names--one was Rescort or Rescot or something). Then, after they bantered for a bit on stage, Neil Armstrong was introduced! He looks old, yes, and he shakes a bit...and, he seemed shy (i.e., sticking to the show's script). But he did make jokes with the host (ABC's commentator for the Apollo 11 launch. Can't remember his name!).

The amazing thing was, right there on stage, they placed a call to the International Space Station. Some of you may not believe this, but it's true! The astronaut on the ISS was Ed-something, and the cosmonaut was asleep! Basically, the astronaut in orbit talked with the three briefly, and was surprised that Armstrong was there. Then, the talk ended and Armstrong addressed the audience. He didn't say anything new; he just told everyone the story of the Wright Brother's flight. He concluded by saying he would be there when they fly the recreation of the Wright Flyer on December 17, 2003, and he hoped to be there for the bicentennial!

What a way to cap a great day! The EAA air show is at an airfield (Whiteman Airfield in Oshkosh...it's by Lake Winnebago on a Wisconsin map), and it has hundreds of planes. There was a B-17 bomber, an F-4 Phantom, an F-14 (which flew over!), an F-16, T-38's, and a C-141 cargo plane flew over the area! Plus, there was an Orbis DC-10, which flies to developing countries to give eye surgery to people. The main attraction was the Arbus A300-600ST "Super Transport", also called a "Beluga," which is HUGE! See a picture of it and you'll know what I mean!

The Air Show was amazing--many aircraft doing many stunts. Diamond Wing Formations, loops, and rolls. The best part was when a Marine Corps Harrier appeared in the middle of the show. It screamed around in a circle, then stopped in mid-air, flew backwards to a landing spot, and hovered to the ground. Then it lifted off again! It was very loud, but worth it!

Oh, one final note--I stood less than 10 feet from Chuck Yeager, who broke the sound barrier! He had been commentating on the air show, then left the building. We followed him around the building, where he signed a few autographs, then left into a tent. Later, we saw him drive away--in a golf cart!

It was amazing.
 

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Posted by Triton (Member # 1043) on :
 
Pretty cool, thank you for sharing.

Wow! Neil Armstrong and Chuck Yeager in the same day. I've always wanted to go to EAA Oshkosh. I have been going to the EAA fly-in at Arlington, WA for a number of years now. Lots of Glasairs at the show since the factory making the kits is on the other side of the air field.

I think that my favorite plane over the years has to be the reproduction of the Gee Bee R2 built by Steve Wolfe and flown by owner Delmar Benjamin. It is a much larger and more impressive plane than the flying prop they built for the movie The Rocketeer. The replica shown in the film must be half the size of the original airplane and they got many of the design details totally wrong. Boy that plane is fast!

Another airplane that I am fond of is a red Beach Staggerwing that shows up occassionally. Talk about drop dead gorgeous. I have never seen an airplane with a chrome spinner and chrome accents on the leather seats inside. Pity they don't make them like that anymore. All the Glasairs that surrounded it looked small and feeble. Although I would love to have a Glasair.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 
Odd... For some reason, I thought Chuck Yeager was dead.
 

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Posted by Triton (Member # 1043) on :
 
He turned 80 this year. We need to enjoy his company while we can. Anyone see his interview in the re-released The Right Stuff DVD? I could not bring myself to buy yet another copy of this movie. One Beta, VHS, and DVD copy is enough. I'll probably get it again if it comes out in some HD format, whatever format they finally decide on.

Neil Armstrong will be 73 years old in August, so we need to visit with him as well if we can. That's just surreal. I often wonder if man will ever walk on the moon again or travel beyond Earth orbit.
 

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Posted by Veers (Member # 661) on :
 
Chuck Yeager is still alive and, apparently, still flying! He said so on his air show commentary. Neil Armstrong is still flying, also, according to him.

And, yes, The Right Stuff is a great movie.
 

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Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
 
There were airplanes in The Rocketeer?
 

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Posted by Triton (Member # 1043) on :
 
Veers have you been able to see the bonus material of the new DVD?

The Right Stuff is one of my favorite films. It was the first time that I can remember seeing the NASA footage of the launch failures and the Mercury missions. My father was sick to death of the whole thing when the movie came out. I think it was just bad timing for the movie in 1982 and its too bad that this film and Blade Runner caused the bankruptcy of the Ladd Company. Funny how most of the box office hits of 1982 have been forgotten and both of the previously mentioned films are classics. I wonder what other fascinating films Alan Ladd Jr. was going to green light that we never got to see.

Sol System are you trying to get my dander up? Don't you remember the AA safety yellow and black Gee Bee R2 at the beginning of the film that was shot down by the Tommy gun wielding hood during the car chase, the Curtis Jenny biplane, the Ford tri-motor, the model of the Hughes Hercules (spruce goose), the autogyro, and the white and black Gee Bee R2 at the end? That makes six airplanes, plus the Luxembourg Zeppelin, which is an airship not an airplane. Did you not like the movie and didn't pay attention?
 

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Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
 
Jennifer Connelly. Apparently there was some business about a rocket too, but I wouldn't swear to it.
 

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Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
 
Wasn't the GeeBee at the end red/white?
 

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Posted by Veers (Member # 661) on :
 
Triton: I have not been able to get the new Special Edition DVD...though I should! I knew it came out some time ago, but I never thought to get it. Oh well.

And there is another classic movie about astronauts: Apollo 13.
As well as a mini-series: From the Earth to the Moon.

All of which, with The Right Stuff, have great soundtracks!
 

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Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
 

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Originally posted by Sol System:
Jennifer Connelly. Apparently there was some business about a rocket too, but I wouldn't swear to it.

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Originally posted by TSN:
Odd... For some reason, I thought Chuck Yeager was dead.

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I seem to remember hearing that he had retired from flying Jets just this year.

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I doubt that the retirement was voluntary. Probably Northrup-Grumman didn't let him take up the F-20 Tigershark anymore.

"I get a lot of pleasure out of flying an F-20, but I know a lot of people who have erected barriers, real brick walls, just because they have gray hair, and have permanently cut themselves off from lifelong enjoyments by thinking 'I'm too old to do this or that--that's for younger people.' Living to a ripe old age is not an end in itself; the trick is to enjoy the years remaining. And unlike flying, learning how to take pleasure from living can't be taught. Unfortunately, many people do not consider fun an important item on their daily agenda. For me, that was always high priority in whatever I was doing."

-- From Yeager: An Autobiography

His philosophy about life makes him an even bigger hero to me and role model.

May we be so blessed to enjoy the things we love throughout life.
 

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Posted by Futurama Guy (Member # 968) on :
 
I went to the Oshkosh Airshow in about 1987, and saw the original Voyager which was featured at the airshow following its trip around the world. I was pretty young at the time, so it didn't impact me as much as I wish it would have, other than pictures and home videos I recall quite an impressive array of aircraft there, especially through the eyes of an 8-year old.
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
Hey, Veers -- isn't the Tomcat something? I've been on and around a lot of military bases over the years, and can tell you what kind of warplane is nearby from the pitch of the engines. Most of 'em I don't like, but the F-14 is liquid sugar. I go down to San Diego from time to time just to gaze longingly at them. I hope when they're retired in another five years or so that I'll be able to somehow get my hands on a demilled surplus model. *sigh*

--Jonah
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 

"...the F-14 is liquid sugar."

What does that even mean?
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
If you'd ever heard one, you'd know...

--Jonah
 

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Posted by Veers (Member # 661) on :
 
When I saw the F-14 flying, I couldn't figure out what it was! It looked like a big triangle flying because of it's wings! Then it landed and the two pilots got out, and I was able to see it was an F-14 Tomcat.
Another comment about the Harrier--you don't need to load it with weapons. All you have to do is fly it around and stop in mid-air, and the enemy will run away in fright! I wonder if the Brits ever did that in the Falklands...
 

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Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
 
I'm not a airplane junkie and I don't know a whole lot about jets. I do know that they haven't designed a plane yet that looks anywhere near as cool as the F-14 to me. But then I like the F-4 too, so what do I know?

Happy birthday, Neil.
 

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 
I didn't think the F-14 could fly w/ its wings folded. I thought that was only for "storage".
 

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Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
 
The F-14 is one of the few planes in the US Navy without folding wings. For storage they merely sweep them back to take up less space.

Now I have the Top Gun theme stuck in my head because of you people...
 

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Posted by Triton (Member # 1043) on :
 
Peregrinus wrote:

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I hope when they're retired in another five years or so that I'll be able to somehow get my hands on a demilled surplus model. *sigh*

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It's a very nice dream to have. Although even if you could afford to purchase a decommisioned one, you would spend much more money on fuel and required maintenance. The internal fuel capacity is 2,385 gallons and on afterburner you would probably burn through this fuel in no time at all. Plus you would also have to have a trained mechanic or maintenance team to rebuild the two jet engines when its required and perform other required maintenance.

Its probably much more reasonable to set your sights on a retired MiG, though its not as sexy, requires less fuel and is mechanically less complicated, meaning that if you were rich enough you probably could affort to maintain it. But then most civilian airfields wouldn't let you take off or land it because of noise complaints and municipalities would enact legislation restricting what hours you could fly it.
 

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Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
 

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Originally posted by TSN:
I didn't think the F-14 could fly w/ its wings folded. I thought that was only for "storage".

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from centennialofflight.gov:
The F-14 adopted by the Navy incorporated a swing-wing that could be manually controlled by the pilot or shifted automatically according to the plane's speed. It moved forward to allow the plane to land on tiny aircraft carrier decks at relatively low speeds and backward as the plane dashed out to intercept Soviet bombers. More than 700 F-14s were produced, in several variants, and more than 70 of them were exported to Iran in the 1970s. It first entered service in the mid-1970s, and still serves today in 2001, although it is being retired. Despite its long service, the F-14 has been the most expensive interceptor aircraft to operate in the U.S. military.

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Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
 

"The F-14 is one of the few planes in the US Navy without folding wings. For storage they merely sweep them back to take up less space."

Okay, fine, "folded", "swept back", whatever you want to call it. I just didn't think they flew when the planes were "triangular". I thought the wings had to be in their "sticking out" mode.
 

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Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :
 
Well that is the whole reason the F-14 has swing wings. For low speeds the wings are spread outward for more lift, and at high speeds the wings are spread back so the plane is more aerodynamic, hence faster.

See also: F-111 Aardvark, Tornado, B-1B Lancer, Tu-22 Backfire, Tu-160 Blackjack, Su-24, MiG-23, MiG-27...
 

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Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
 
Woah, woah, Soviet-era military surplus not sexy? Nothing's sexier than some romantic opium bandits firing off a few celebratory AK-47 rounds from the conning tower of their repurposed Kilo.
 

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Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
 
The maintenance requirements of the F-14 is something I am right now educating myself on, along with appropriate civilian avionics and other gear to furnish the cockpit etc. (plus an inert ballast where the 20mm cannon and its ammo were), and so on and so on... I don't plan on pulling a lot of aerobatic maneuvers or putting other such stresses on the engines and airframe. I don't have to take off from carrier decks, so I don't think I'll ever have to use afterburners. I need to find out if there's any difference between military and civilian standards for engine servicing.

*sigh* Lot to think about, but then this is nicer than a Cessna.

As for the wings, they are at full extension for takeoff and landing. They are at mid-point for subsonic cruising. And they are fully swept (forming a delta wing with the elevons) for transsonic and supersonic flight.

A friend of mine who used to be in the Navy once told me that the common joke among carrier crews through the '60s and '70s was that the F-4 was proof that with enough power, even a brick could fly. And the F-14 was proof that with even more, you could make it do tricks.

--Jonah
 

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Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
 

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Another comment about the Harrier--you don't need to load it with weapons. All you have to do is fly it around and stop in mid-air, and the enemy will run away in fright! I wonder if the Brits ever did that in the Falklands...

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