So, like, I've just finished reading 'Consider Phlebas' and it was great, but it has left me yearning for more of those kooky ill-fated privateering stories. I've also been going back through the Firefly with the NZgf, and that has me wanting. But I think what I'm looking for is a videogame. So I know some of you play these games, and some of you may have an idea what I'm talking about.
Basically what I'm looking for is a game where you start out with a cruddy little ship and a little bit of gas-money and then you do missions and pick up crew and as you get more money, you start getting better equipment for your crappy ship and ragtag crew and then eventually you are able to get a semi-nice ship and the missions are tougher, but now your fees have gone up too. And there are big superpowers you steer clear of and other peers fucking up your biz and maybe you make friends. And then, like, the ultimate would be you can actually get some old battlecruiser with all the gunports empty and fill it up. And it has space combat and maybe some ground stuff too. But so it's pretty open ended and there might be plot, but not necessarily. I realize I'm totally dating myself, but who here remembers Tradewars? Yeah, OK I'm old.
Does this game even exist? I used to play something like this on my Dad's old 386 w/CGA, except the gameplay was more or less crap and the graphics were...well they were CGA. It's OK if the game is a little old. It doesn't need to be the 14 kazillion poly real-sampled bone-cracking simulation engine thing. I've been playing Alpha Centauri, TIE Fighter and even a little Freespace lately. So if people know of games or might know what I'm even talking about (NyQuil makes you sleepy!)
Also is there some kind of Everquest environment like this? Because if there isn't there should be. Thanks in advance.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Was that old game Elite?
As to new games, I can't really think of something that covers all those things. Maybe X-2, or Freelancer.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
I remember a friend in the old days was trying to run Wing Commander: Privateer.
They failed.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
You can run it in '98 now. Not that that does most people any good.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
But you see I've got a machine set aside expressly for the purpose of playing those old games running Win98SE.
Liam: I never played Elite, but I remember it. Frontier Elite 2 also looks cool.
I've been poking around MobyGames, and I think I just found the game I used to play. Megatraveller 1. God that was shitty. But the idea was good.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
Also Freelancer looks cool except that they mispelled 'Naval' twice on the box art (the less-common 'Navel' spelling), and then it's made by Microsoft. If by X-2 you are referring to Final Fantasy X-2, then that would be great on the ground, but I don't think there's any space stuff. Thanks though.
Any other suggestions?
[ February 14, 2004, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: Balaam Xumucane ]
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
X-2 as in X-2: The Threat, which, like Freelancer and Privateer and Elite and Hardwar and, uh, some other games of yore, is a space-trading-RPG-combat-sim thingy that matches your specified search parameters to a T.
"Also is there some kind of Everquest environment like this?"
Also: Freespace is cool.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Although most reviews I've seen have said that, while X-3 should be Freelancer eXtreme, it is actually not quite as good. I will play it soon. I've just finished Freedom Force, I'm going to (finally) finish Freespace, and then it's straight on to finishing Wind Waker, Metroid Prime and Deus Ex, before going straight on to Freelancer. Or Knights Of the Old Republic.
I played Megatraveller when I was young. It was based on an old tabletop RPG, I believe. And I think there was a sequel, on the Amiga at least...
And, er, you really wouldn't play Freelancer just because it's published by Microsoft? That's...stupid.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
The American version of X-2 is buggy, but not the garbled mess some review boys make it out to be. In fact, the game's eminently playable once your initial "I'm lost and disoriented" and "what the fuck am I going to do next?" symptoms begin to dissipate. Really.
"I'm going to (finally) finish Freespace..."
I've heard that for the past seven billion years now.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
Freedom Force? Really? What did you think of that game? I so rarely run into people that have played it....unless I force it onto them or something
Knights of the Old Republic is real fun too. Its like a Star Wars game that doesn't suck, which is a rarity now.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
Oh, that X2. Sorry it's just that there are a lot of things being called X and X2 and whathaveyou so it's confusing sometimes. I aparently missed X1. It looks very cool. Might be more or less what the doctor ordered.
Ok, so EVE looks kind of good. I don't like the way their artist draws faces, but hey that's a pretty keen MMOG setup they've got there. Neato Homeworld-style ships. Lot of potential there. Maybe I'll wait for EVE2. Anyone here play Eve?
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: And, er, you really wouldn't play Freelancer just because it's published by Microsoft? That's...stupid.
Well I didn't say I wouldn't play it, I'd just be very cautious about it. From the reviews I'm reading, the game seems like it shepherds the player far more than a persistant universe-type game ought to. Plus in the same manipulative gameplay vein, I get the impression Digital Anvil got a taste of some M$ pressure. Having had some..let's say history...with the Microsoft Gaming Gestapo, I'm more than a little biased.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
I'm afraid your bias is justified here. Freelancer, at least in unmodded form, is a simplistic shoot 'm up with sandbox depth and no lasting appeal beyond the odd multiplayer frenzy, but then you don't have to fork over $15 a month to Microsoft's SS just to retain your account (yet) so likening it to EVE is perhaps a bit unfair to both games.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
They are bad men.
So, I'm sorry I'm blathering through this thread, but I've finally remembered the other one I used to play. Starflight As I recall it wasn't all that much fun (It's very likely that I was just been too stupid.) I found a shareware version of Elite 2: Frontier and version of WC: Privateer I'm downloading now and very curious to try.
It's weird going through these old games. The designers would have killed to have display technology like what we've all got now. Like the graphics have come so far, but overall, the depth has suffered as a result. Before all they had was depth. It seems like you could license and use the guts of one of these classics with a Freespace space-combat-sim clone, slap some skins on a squad game engine and put out a killer sequel with nostalgia audience built-in. You wouldn't even need to pay a second-string celebrity voice actor to get TEH KILLAR GAME!!11!!!one!
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Braben is working on Elite 4, apparently. Frontier style physics with Elite-style fighting. And hopefully Elite-style fun, rather than Frontier survival-oh-god-I'm-bored now.
Cartman: Are you talking about the multiplayer or single player Freelancer? Cause the single-player got good review scores from PC Format and Gamer over here, and they're pretty trustworthy publications.
And I've just been playing Freespace. Up to the point in the Nebula where you realise that there's a Second *gasp* subspace portal thingie, and more Really Big And Scary Ships. I actually got to this point once before, and then lost my save game when upgrading my computer. Arse. Still, it's nice playing it on my 2800+ with Radeon 9600 GPU. Look! I'm flying over the Collossus with no slowdown! Woo!
No-one spoil anything, or I will kill them.
Mucus: I just...finished...last...night. It was delightfully silly. I'll probably play it again with "real" superheros, but I went through it with the built in ones to see every cliche bought to great life. Although it's not really a copy of 60s comics like some reviews have said - more of a piss-take, but an affectionate one.
So, yeah, really pretty good. 81%, if you insist on arbitary numbers to back up opinions, as computer magazines tend to do.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
Ohhhh, freespace TWO! Well, yes, we wouldn't want to spoil any of the astounding revelations about the Shivans. Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Well, I tend to suspect that the back of the game box has slightly ruined the plot anyway, with its:
"The Shivans were big and scary and almost killed humanity, but they were killed. Yay!"
And then:
"But now, the Shivans have returned, and they're wondering what happened to their scouting party."
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
"Are you talking about the multiplayer or single player Freelancer?"
Both. Single player is entertaining while you're playing the campaign, but then the game dumps you back into newbie territory and there just isn't much left to keep you engrossed in it. The random missions you can accept, for instance, are incredibly repetitive and dull and predictable, and the universe you fly through is as static as, well, a still life painting.
"Well, yes, we wouldn't want to spoil any of the astounding revelations about the Shivans."
Yes, we would. But Liam has at last gotten off his lazy arse again, so we won't. B)
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
I did finish Freespace 1, y'know. Ages ago.
And now I go back to do a mission in the Nebula where good ships are pulling out. This is not an opportunity to make a rude joke. Why am I only a Lt JG? And are the Ace medals a combination of kills and assists, or just kills?
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
You ARE playing FS2 on "hard" difficulty, aren't you? Otherwise you'll never be promoted beyond the rank of Lt.
And you receive medals for, erh, doing your job really well. Which usually entails killing everything in sight and not letting a single friendly ship be destroyed EVAR. I think.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Really? I've been playing it on Medium. Arse. Will it make a difference at this point? (I've just done that pain in the neck mission where you have to follow ten bouy thingies while your sensors go crazy from random EMP pulses. And then I went on a recon for 15 minutes and saw 9 Really Big Sathanus MegaScaryShip Things).
I thought that the Ace medals were purely awarded for kills, rather than doing good things. Hence, "Ace".
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
Oh, THAT mission! I nearly chucked the game at that point. SOOO off-pissing.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
I actually did it first time this time around, although I remember it taking a billion years originally. I am hardcore with dumbfires. The only bad thing is that my eyes killed from squinting at the tiny blips on the radar.
There was one a few before, with ships in the nebula, you had to protect one while...something happened. I can't remember. I think I blocked it out, it took so long to do.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
I've been playing through Freespace on my gamebox. I've only played through the first three or four levels. Tell me when you start getting better ships it feels like you're moving faster. Although the 'debris' in TIE and X-Wing was kind of annoying it really did add to the sense of velocity.
quote:Originally posted by Omega: You can run [Wing Commander: Privateer] in '98 now. Not that that does most people any good.
Say Omega, I don't suppose you've gotten Privateer to run in WIN98 yet have you? I've been pursuing two different tacks on this: neither with any success. One being the supposedly now compatible DOSbox-0.61 and the other beng a program called MYJEMM designed more-or-less expressly for the purpose of running Privateer by duping your shiny fancy 2003 box with supar-cool DDR memory into using a clumsy bug-ridden 1994 memory scheme. Which seems to be the main stumbling block. There's apparently really no substitute for that classic 386 EMS feel. WTF is my XMS manager and why the hell isn't it doing it's job?!
Actually aside from this, I've been kind of surprised at how successfully I've been able to run some of these really old DOS games. I found out about DOSbox trying to figure a way to make Starflight2 playable, and was pleasantly stunned to discover that with a little tweaking I could get the heretofore useless shareware version of Elite: Frontier going.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
What on earth is a gamebox?
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
I should have said gaming-PC. I wasn't trying to be cheeky, honest. It's the GAEMING PC I set aside expressly for playing older less-hardware intensive games. Essentially a passel of cheap parts (~$400) thrown together so I could go pick on poor, slow, little Y-Wings whenever I was feeling frustrated or inadequate... Which, obviously, is depressingly often these days.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Ahh. Okay. Freespace. I've never really had a problem with sensation of speed in space combat games, because I've never really gotten one. Even in Alliance. In fact, less so in Alliance, due to it's lack of afterburner. The only time I've felt speed in any of those games is when I first got a TIE Defender in TIE Fighter.
Freespace itself seemed to concentrate on two other things to make people go "oh my god". One of them is ship size. And the other is beam weapons. The first time two capital ships started carving each other up...scary. Er, you are talking about Freespace 2, aren't you?
Although, in the area of speed, there is at least one point in the game where speed combined with size will make you shit your pants. "Dive dive dive! Hit your burners pilots!"
I don't think my heart calmed down for days.
Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :
GOOD scene.
And as for Privateer, MyJEMM is supposed to make Privateer run reasonably well in '98. Never tried it, though, of my four computers, two are running XP home and the other two are running Linux.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
Ok, very much looking forward to that scene now. (Stupid work not letting me play videogames all day!) No spoilers though. I'm still only in FS1. And I apparently REALLY suck and having a hard time properly leading my targets. I did get the Ace eventually, but it took some doing.
Now in my travels hunting for ways to make frickin' Privateer play, I have found a couple people who've apparently succeeded in making it work under XP. I'm running out of ideas. I've been really straining my rather pathetic DOS skills on this one amending my config.sys file, writing batch files, etc. I'm starting to wonder whether it's because my CPU is an AthlonXP. I've got an old busta-P2-350 collecting some dust bunnies on the other desk. Maybe I'll have to try that out. Later.
Anyway thank you all for you input on this. If nothing else it's gotten me excited about a genre I haven't played since the early 90's. If anyone has any technical ideas about how to trick my machine in believing that it believes in EMS, I'd love to hear them.
Also has anyone actually played Battlecruiser Millenium Gold v2.9.5.r.79, Ph.D.? I've heard it's verging on playable.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
Of all the spacesims I've played, Prophecy and Starlancer had the best sense of speed. Shame they were such crappy games on other fronts.
And the most pulse-pounding moment in FS2? Reaching that subspace node in the final mission with three seconds to spare before ********* and then just staring in disbelief at that jaw-dropping cinematic of ********* (damn you Liam, hurry up). In all my years of gaming I have never felt palpitations quite like those, man. Though going for a quick dart in your miniscule fighter between fleets of capships slicing each other to pieces with those mammoth beam weapons is something else, too.
"Really?"
Maybe. When I played through FS2 on Easy (yeah, so, my joystick broke), I was still only a measly Lt by the time the credits rolled, even though I had a perfect record and racked up a bazillion kills, but when I played it again on Hard, I reached the rank of Cpt despite doing sheer pants on just about every mission. From this TRUSTY empirical evidence I conclude that the game's rank system must be governed by the difficulty level you select. Don't try to prove me wrong, or I will smite you.
"And then I went on a recon for 15 minutes and saw 9 Really Big Sathanus MegaScaryShip Things..."
I shall now spoil you anyway by saying that you will see them again.
[ February 17, 2004, 05:14 PM: Message edited by: Cartman ]
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
quote:Originally posted by Balaam Xumucane: Now in my travels hunting for ways to make frickin' Privateer play, I have found a couple people who've apparently succeeded in making it work under XP. I'm running out of ideas. I've been really straining my rather pathetic DOS skills on this one amending my config.sys file, writing batch files, etc. I'm starting to wonder whether it's because my CPU is an AthlonXP. I've got an old busta-P2-350 collecting some dust bunnies on the other desk.
Hmm. I'd do an install of native DOS6 on a second partition to eliminate Win98 as a suspect first, and then rule out the CPU. It worked for me, and my hardware is pretty exotic (well, from the POV of 1994 software, anyway), so don't despair just yet.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Is this Privateer 1 or 2? I'm guessing 2, because, well, that's more likely. I got quite far in that, and then lost the dics, and could never quite be bothered picking up another one. Tsk.
quote:Originally posted by Cartman: "And then I went on a recon for 15 minutes and saw 9 Really Big Sathanus MegaScaryShip Things..."
I shall now spoil you anyway by saying that you will see them again.
I suspected as much. After all, you don't show something like that from a distance and then not show it again. That was great though...build up this monster ship as a big threat, have your biggest ship just about destroy it, and then reveal that there are 9 more. Great
I'll try not to spoil FS1, but I did really love the beginning of that game, where the war you are fighting is abruptly turned on its head. And that final mission...I can't remember how many times I did it.
Okay, back to FS2, with a difficulty upgrade to Hard.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
No, believe it or not, I'm still working on Privateer 1. Privateer 2 sounds like it's more linear and plainly I'm not all that interested in following such a set script. Or I'm far more interested in, well, privateering.
quote:Originally posted by Cartman: It worked for me, and my hardware is pretty exotic (well, from the POV of 1994 software, anyway),
You and your crazy 2004 Velveeta-Optical storage devices.
No, but so with some more tweaking aroud under the hood it's working now with MyJEMM. I suspect the culprit was the 'Speech' expansion I had d/l'd and installed before even getting it running in the first place. So it runs now. Sorta. The sound is a bit whacked (which I'm told is normal) and I'm having difficulty getting it to comprehend my wizbang Saitek X-45 joystick/throttle. Hard to dogfight with the keyboard. Can't believe the chopiness of these graphics. Maybe I need a smaller monitor.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
Well, OK, maybe not that exotic, but still quite, erh, foreign. Or something.
And you don't need a smaller monitor per se, just a selective memory wipe of all graphics advancements made since 1993. B)
God that was shitty. But the idea was good.
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