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Firefighters vote to boycott Bush
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jay the Obscure: [QB] Let's get a couple of things straight here and now. Rob presented an opinion. He chose to single out the Democrats as being the party in Congress who attach riders and spends money on "pork" projects. That is an opinion that implies that Republicans would not stoop to such a political tatic. (Sidenote: This is a maneuver that I've seen the present occupant of the White House and his handlers use over and over again with great skill and aplomb. It goes along the lines of: Mr. Bush is above politics and [b]anything[/b] he says or does is only driven by his compassionate, altruistic nature, and as a result is as pure as lambs wool. The other side of this has been to portray the Democrats as an unpatriotic bunch who act only on the basest power grabing motivations whithout a care about the "little people" Mr. Bush cares so much about. The truth, as always, is somewhere in the middle.) I think what Rob wrote is silly and falls into the above politically puerile point of view. I made fun of of this position. I did so by posting my sarcastic and somewhat overdone opinion of his opinion. I even posted a quote from his article that also lays blame** at the feet "members of Congress" which includes members of the same political party to which the present occupant of the White House belongs. This other party is known as the Republicans. As a result I got called a liar. I think calling people liars crosses something of a boundry and I resent it very much. I would ask for an apology for being called such, but I'd sooner expect my cat to write a book before I'd get one. Such is what has become of the flameboard. What I'd like to see on the flameboard follows in my opinion of actual issues discussed in this thread. I think we are in the midst of a very important time. This never-to-be-over war on terror has the potential to change the society and culture of the United States in ways that I don't think that Mr. Bush understands and, even worse, cares to try to understand. A policy of declaring citizens of the United States "emeny combatants" and denying them Constitutional rights and holding them incommunicado in the course of an undefined never-to-be-over war on terror needs full and open debate. Such a policy begins a trip down a very dark road and represents important and seminal changes to the fabric of the United States. Such a decision should not be imposed on the will of Mr. Bush and a very small, select and secretive group in the Executive branch of government without discussion. Nor should the checks and balances of the Constitution be so cavalerly swept aside. Further, If we attack Iraq on the will of this very small, select and secretive group in the Executive branch of government's concept of "unilaterally determined pre-emptive self-defense", I think that the very core of the American system will be shaken. Afterall, wasn't the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor an attack carried out in the name of "unilaterally determined pre-emptive self-defense"? Do we not revile such things? Not to mention the fact that I am personally rather frightened of what might come out on the other side an attack carreid out on such a basis. Such an attack would be a watershed in the history of the United States. It would polarize the Arab world and would draw untold more people into a violent anti-Americanism. The attacks were evil, the people who took part in them and plotted them were and are evil just as those who may be plotting similar actions are evil. But it is utterly foolish to think that United States policies and unlilateral attitute and actions in the world played no role in what happened. So far, Mr. Bush has done nothing publicly to address this. I think history my well condem his simplistic point of view as missing the overall picture and loosing the opportunity at dialog. We're at a cross-roads in history and cultural where the western world as represented by American capitalism and materialism must take into account those left behind. Also, secular Islam must to come to grips with ultra-religious Islam. You might disagree. Great. Respond. Present your opinion. Be serious and don't call me names. **Although I think the blame rests with the present occupant of the White House strangely engough playing politics. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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