But the education system still sucks. I'm going to tutor a girl I know in physics this summer. The reason: she doesn't think she can learn enough in physics next year in her school to get into the college she wants. And this is a PRIVATE school, that she goes to to avoid the public ones!
Thus homeschooling.
I think there are many reasons for this. One of which that the US youth seems to be more excited by the Internet, cable television, and Play Station than by reading, writing, and math. Not that I can blame them, then I used to sit in class dreaming of the day that I would be of legal age to drop-out. However, my parents rode my ass all the way through junior high and senior high school. Which leads me to another I reason that I think exists: parent involvement. Most of my friends in school had both parents working, and their involvement in school work amounted to, "So, what did you do in school today?"
However, I think the main reason could be the teachers themselves. There are a lot of wonderful, dedicated, and highly-trained teachers out there. I know because I have had some of the greatest teachers in the world. But, there are also quite a few teachers who are teaching only because it was their back-up plan. I had a history teacher in 9th grade tell me that Hitler was a pretty good guy and that the US lost Vietnam because the VietComs (yes, that's what he said), sabotaged our equipment. Thankfully, he wasn't my regular history teacher, but I wonder what else he puts in his students' minds? On another angle, there are many people who have the aptitude, patience, and caring to be wonderful teachers. They won't pursue that profession because it is low-paying and, in some parts, not a real respected career.
Because some people who are capable of being great teachers but choose not to pursue it, I think standards have been lowered and many school districts have been hiring anyone competent enough to fill vacancies. Right now, Houston I.S.D. is launching an advertising campaign to fill its 1000 spots for the coming year. I wonder how many under-qualified teachers will be hired and how many qualified teachers will be hired but assigned to teach subjects outside their field?
The teacher on "Who Wants To Be A Millionaire?" I think was simply asked a question that did not pertain to her field. Geography has not really been a big important subject in Texas schools, to be certain. It was only added to the Texas curriculum in 1996 (I believe), and then it was only added as a requirement to the advanced/honors transcript and not the general transcript. Of course, that could have changed by now.
There's no INCENTIVE anymore. It used to be the smartest person in town was the teacher, or one of the women....now you need 70 degrees that don't mean dick, & at least 3 have to be some form of child psychology. Bah. I don't need that shit, & neither do they.
I mean, what kind of a moron talks about his freaking personal life or his/her past history for freaking 15 mins, and then answer: "oh, after all that junks that came out of my big mouth, I think I'll go with answer 'c'".
The show stinks with set-up just like Jerry Springer, or Murry, and etc...
And to tell you the truth, I don't know where this Ural Mountain is either! ^0^
[ June 21, 2001: Message edited by: BlueElectron ]
quote:
I mean, what kind of a moron talks about his freaking personal life or his/her past history for freaking 15 mins, and then answer: "oh, after all that junks that came out of my big mouth, I think I'll go with answer 'c'".
I don't know, but they don't seem to have quite grasped the fact that language was invented to transmit ideas.
Our issues with education date to the beginning of our country's founding and prior to that. A person would argue that a non-education influence-agriculture (1800's), peer groups, non-parent involvement, etc.-was the root of the malaise in the education system. The true is that as a country, we don't value education. We value the prosperity that one can obtain through education.
Ewe-Krane
UNIONS.
Up here in Ontario that is. They are very ignorant about the fact that there are many unqualified teachers in our public education system, and any attempt to remove one of them results in EXTREME opposition.
Union Solidarity forever. The Fights between the Unions and the Government are causing all sorts of problems.
I've heard a remark that Ontario is the only place where Teachers are unionized.
http://www.teachersunion.org.uk/
quote:
Originally posted by Ritten:
The Urals run along the US easter seaboard... Don't they????Ewe-Krane
You're joking, right?
Ural Mountains (Russian Ural'skiye Gory), mountain chain in Russia, extending 2,400 km (1,500 mi) from its northern boundary at the Arctic Ocean to its southern limits at the steppes of Kazakhstan, traditionally separating the continents of Europe and Asia. The chain is divided roughly into four main divisions: the Polar, Northern, Middle, and Southern Urals. The Polar Urals (above latitude 64� North) are treeless arctic tundra. The Northern Urals (latitude 64� North to latitude 61� North) constitute a distinct craggy, treeless, narrow range with crests averaging 300 to 500 m (1,000 to 1,500 ft) in height. This range contains the highest Ural crest, Gora Narodnaya (1,894 m/ 6,214 ft). Other Northern peaks include Mount Sablya, Telpos-Iz, and Isherim. The only trees in the area are sparse growths of larch (a type of pine tree).
Numerous plateaus, characterized by broad, flat, marshy valleys, extend in a southwestern direction from the southern limits of the Northern Urals. The entire Middle Ural region (latitude 61� North to latitude 60� North) is covered with dense coniferous forests. A succession of northeastern mountain chains marks the northern boundary of the Middle Urals. The southern boundary is marked by numerous hills of 300 to 600 m (1,000 to 2,000 ft) separated by deep ravines. The Konzhakovskiy Kamen, 1,571 m (5,154 ft) high, is the highest peak of both the northern and southern portions of the Middle Urals. Dense forests, rich soils, and fertile valleys cover the entire area.
South of the Middle Urals (latitude 55� North to latitude 51� North) are three parallel mountain chains called the Southern Urals. The first of these, the Urals proper, is a low chain ranging in height from 670 to 850 m (about 2,200 to 2,800 ft). To the west, a higher range, containing many rivers, reaches a height of 1,594 m (5,230 ft) and is paralleled farther west by an equally high range. All three ranges are heavily wooded with deciduous plant life and contain rich pasturelands. The Urals continue from latitude 51� North toward the Volga River and, under the name of Obshchiy Syrt, comprise a system of plateaus reaching 460 m (1,500 ft) in height and 320 km (200 mi) in width. South of the Ural River, the Ural chain appears as a group of independent ranges.
Geologically, the Urals are the worn-down stumps of an ancient range that rose toward the end of the Paleozoic era, 250 million years ago (see Permian Period), while the American Appalachian Mountains were forming. The divisions of the range reflect distinct episodes in this ancient upheaval, which squeezed thick sedimentary rock layers into large northern-southern trending folds, then faulted and intruded them with a variety of igneous rocks.
Important industrial areas are located in the Middle and Southern Urals. Intensive industrialization in the former Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (USSR) began during World War II (1939-1945), when many industries were established to develop armaments production centers far from the military zone. The region has been a major center of nuclear weapons production since 1948, when the Mayak complex began operations near the city of Kyshtym. Mayak produced the material for the first Soviet atomic bomb, detonated in August 1949. Mayak caused three major incidents of nuclear waste contamination in 1949, 1957, and 1967, which combined released more than ten times the radiation of the world's worst known reactor disaster near Chernobyl', Ukraine. In the 1950s nuclear wastes from Mayak were diverted into nearby Lake Karachai, and the lake soon became highly radioactive. In the late 1960s workers began filling in the lake with rock and soil and planned to seal it over with concrete by the mid-1990s, but a government commission concluded in 1991 that this might force radioactive isotopes into the groundwater. Containment of radioactive wastes and cleanup efforts continue in the Urals amid public controversy over how best to proceed.
The Ural region has extensive deposits of iron ore and coal in close proximity, as well as rich deposits of chromium, manganese, copper, zinc, bauxite, platinum, silver, and gold. Just to the east of the Urals is a major oil-producing area. Among the important industrial cities are Magnitogorsk, Yekaterinburg, Chelyabinsk, Perm', and Nizhniy Tagil.
You said it yourself, in response to Shik's sleezy orations; "I never read anything longer than a small paragraph. It's usually a waste of reading skills".
Wink-wink.
We actually have teachers' unions down here. They suck, too. They seem to oppose any and all attempts at standardized testing, and thus seeing what (and whether) the kids actually learn. Unions as a concept = good idea. Most unions in practice = sucks.
quote:
Originally posted by Tahna Los:
One Word.UNIONS.
Up here in Ontario that is. They are very ignorant about the fact that there are many unqualified teachers in our public education system, and any attempt to remove one of them results in EXTREME opposition.
Union Solidarity forever. The Fights between the Unions and the Government are causing all sorts of problems.
I've heard a remark that Ontario is the only place where Teachers are unionized.
Please excuse my spelling. It's genetic. LOL 
Possibly. My mom is part of the school faculty down here in Georgia, and union is a 4 letter word down here. The lack of one is causing huge problems down here.
On the Austin Roads show (A local talk radio show) A nurse called up and started bitching on how teachers have it so easy. She gave examples like: (1) A teacher's work day is only from 8 AM to 4 PM. (2) A teacher gets 3 months off every year with pay.
A couple of minutes later an actual teacher called up and roasted the nurse alive. A teachers day does NOT go from 8 AM to 4 PM. Teachers down here usally have to get to school by about 7 AM to prepare for classes and they usally stay untill 5 to 5:30 PM to grade papers and so forth. I don't have to mention that many teachers have to bring there work home with them too. The teacher that was talking in paticular stated that she sometimes had to take her work home with her and continue working on it untill 10:30 PM. This is something I can confirm because my mother sometimes has to do that.
Then there is this bullshit that teachers get 3 months off every summer. Here, it's only a 8 weeks and a couple of days. Teachers DON'T get payed for this time.
Also our Govonor, Roy Barns, in all his infinite wisdom got rid of teacher tenure and shot down a proposal for raising a teachers pay by 10%. Also, a teachers performance in his/her occupation is measured by his/her students grades. This totally screws the teacher over and I'll tell you why. Should a teacher suffer the misfortune of getting a class that is composed of idiots and ass holes who have no interest in learning he/she will look bad because of it. Unfortunatly, classes like that aren't that hard to find in Georgia.
One more thing. You guys are gonna love this. My local newspaper, The Augusta Chronicle, did a little article on a teachers salery. It compared the salery of a teacher to those of a store clerk, burger flippers at McDonalds and other low position jobs. This made it look like teachers have a kick ass salery. In turn, it supported the idea that teachers have it so easy.
On an semi-related topic, if you come down to Georgia you will notice that very few schools are 2 or more stories. In Augusta, it appears that these pre-fab type schools are popular. The problem is that these schools are built so that everything is on one floor. This makes the school wide and......well....large. When overpopulation becomes a problem, the school doesn't have any room to expand. If they would only make their schools 2 or 3 stories tall, not only would the school take up less land, they would have room to expand if need be. I also like to say that I've seen some of these prefab schools. They look like rundown offices from the 80s with very few of the roof tiles unstained. I won't even describe the bathrooms to you. DAMN IT! I'm being long winded again aaren't I? I'll stop now. 
They seem to oppose any and all attempts at standardized testing, and thus seeing what (and whether) the kids actually learn
Why oppose it in the first place?
Lawyers have to take tests every year to ensure they do a good job and maintain their lawyer's licence.
Accountants have to take test every year to ensure they do a good job and maintain their accountant's licence.
Doctors have to take test every year to ensure they do a good job and maintain their Doctor's licence.
Insurance Salesmen have to take test every year to ensure they do a good job and maintain their Insurance licence.
Real Estate Salesmen have to take test every year to ensure they do a good job and maintain their Real Estate licence.
A Teacher's position is, and should be treated as, a specialized position. Specialized positions require specialized testing.
MIB
A couple of minutes later an actual teacher called up and roasted the nurse alive. A teachers day does NOT go from 8 AM to 4 PM. Teachers down here usally have to get to school by about 7 AM to prepare for classes and they usally stay untill 5 to 5:30 PM to grade papers and so forth. I don't have to mention that many teachers have to bring there work home with them too. The teacher that was talking in paticular stated that she sometimes had to take her work home with her and continue working on it untill 10:30 PM. This is something I can confirm because my mother sometimes has to do that.
I understand and respect the things some teachers do to get their work done. Some governments do not. Especially in Ontario.
Also, a teachers performance in his/her occupation is measured by his/her students grades. This totally screws the teacher over and I'll tell you why. Should a teacher suffer the misfortune of getting a class that is composed of idiots and ass holes who have no interest in learning he/she will look bad because of it.
I bet even Omega would agree that Testing is the best way to gauge a Teacher's performance.
One more thing. You guys are gonna love this. My local newspaper, The Augusta Chronicle, did a little article on a teachers salery. It compared the salery of a teacher to those of a store clerk, burger flippers at McDonalds and other low position jobs. This made it look like teachers have a kick ass salery. In turn, it supported the idea that teachers have it so easy.
Should they be paid even less? A Teacher is, and should be treated as a specialized position of sorts. And a specialized position should not earn any less then a burger flipper, store clerk, or other low paying jobs. This is just a pure bad comparison.
[ June 22, 2001: Message edited by: Tahna Los ]
I agree that teachers should be tested to see if they do their jobs, but the way it is now, down here at least, a teacher's performance is rated by a student's performance. As I said before, if you get a class filled with nitwits, the teacher can be screwed big time. And a class filled with nitwits isn't hard to come by in Georgia.
You take exams in the second last year of high school right? And those exams affect what college you can go to, right? Are those exams not standard over the whole country? If someone has a B (or whatever) at History at one school, would that be different to a B in History at another school?
Does the same thing apply to universities?
1. Social Engineering - That is, the supposition that schools ought to teach 'morals,' 'values,' and 'self-esteem', rather than reading, science, math, geography, art, literature, etc.
2. Non-teachers in leadership positions (which is the main cause of #1.) You will find that the higest posts among the folks who determine our education curricula are almost NEVER career teachers. Rather, they tend to be sociologists, union leaders, psychologists, politicians, and other people whose jobs have very very little to do with what teachers in the classroom actually face. They are out-of-touch.
3. Parental / student apathy. It is next to impossible to teach someone who isn't interested in learning... beyond when the next N'Sync album is coming out, who's gonna be the WWF champion, or what Pokemon card is hot today. Similarly, long experience has shown that parental participation in a child's education (from making sure they do their homework, to helping them with it, to actually GOING to parent-teacher conference day) is essential to their growth. Most parents who 'get involved' today are either denying something that their child did wrong "my Bobby would NEVER do that" (despite evidence to the contrary) or doing something idiotic like trying to get the Harry Potter books taken out of the school library.
4. "Mainstreaming." I'm all for 'fairness,' but let's face it. All kids are NOT equal. Teach to the top, and the middle and bottom kids get left behind. Teach to the middle, and the kids on top lose interest and the kids on the bottom get left behind. Teach to the bottom, and the middle kids lose interest and the top kids... forget them, they're gone. It doesn't help their self-esteem to be mashed together like that.
And I do think that is a standardized test.
quote:
Originally posted by BlueElectron:
All Americans who want to go to university also have to take the SAT isn't it?And I do think that is a standardized test.
It never used to be like that. As a matter of fact, universities are starting to lower the SAT requirments if not get rid of them completly because they are finding that a persons SAT score really does not accuratly predict who will be more likely to perform well in college.
The two subjects covered on the SAT I, math and english, are each graded on a scale of 800 points, making a total maximum grade of 1600.
The PSAT is the Pre- or Preliminary SAT which many sophomore and juniors take as "practice" for the real thing.
The SAT II's are subject specific, and at least three, (one math, one science, and the writing), are required to be accepted into many high-level colleges.
New Yorks State, the state which I am unfortunate enough to reside in, is the only state that mandates standardized Regents Competency Tests for specific subjects.
On the topic of teacher's unions, this is another thing New York State is lucky enough to be blessed with *rolls eyes*. Our local teacher's union is the strongest in lower New York, and our teachers are the best paid in all districts of the said region.
That is not to say that I don't think they should be well paid. Teachers are as valuable to the well being of the world and it's future generations as any other person, and I think they should be paid much more for what they do. However, I also think they should be better trained and monitored.
quote:
Originally posted by First of Two:
The faults of the US education system can be traced to several sources:1. Social Engineering - That is, the supposition that schools ought to teach 'morals,' 'values,' and 'self-esteem', rather than reading, science, math, geography, art, literature, etc.
2. Non-teachers in leadership positions (which is the main cause of #1.) You will find that the higest posts among the folks who determine our education curricula are almost NEVER career teachers. Rather, they tend to be sociologists, union leaders, psychologists, politicians, and other people whose jobs have very very little to do with what teachers in the classroom actually face. They are out-of-touch.
3. Parental / student apathy. It is next to impossible to teach someone who isn't interested in learning... beyond when the next N'Sync album is coming out, who's gonna be the WWF champion, or what Pokemon card is hot today. Similarly, long experience has shown that parental participation in a child's education (from making sure they do their homework, to helping them with it, to actually GOING to parent-teacher conference day) is essential to their growth. Most parents who 'get involved' today are either denying something that their child did wrong "my Bobby would NEVER do that" (despite evidence to the contrary) or doing something idiotic like trying to get the Harry Potter books taken out of the school library.
4. "Mainstreaming." I'm all for 'fairness,' but let's face it. All kids are NOT equal. Teach to the top, and the middle and bottom kids get left behind. Teach to the middle, and the kids on top lose interest and the kids on the bottom get left behind. Teach to the bottom, and the middle kids lose interest and the top kids... forget them, they're gone. It doesn't help their self-esteem to be mashed together like that.
Damn. You are good. Would you mind if add something?
5. Teachers have had almost all disiplinary rights striped away from them. If a teacher so much as tries to punish a student for acting like an ass or something like that, the student's parents are going to be on the teachers case so damn quick!
6. The zero tolorance policy is becoming one of the largest disruptions in a childs learning. I hear stories about how a little girl got suspended for having a Tweety bird key chain in her possesion with which the chain was like an inch too long. I heard another report about how a young boy got suspended for drawing a picture of his father with a knife in his hand. His father was in the military.
I thought the ACT was more, mmm, not important, but accepted as the an entrance exam....
I have never even heard of ACT is short for....
Academics Competency Test???
The point is, most of these things aren't the teachers' fault.
BTW, I just got my SAT results back. 800 verbal, 790 math. 1590. Fifteen-frikin'-ninty. I'm happy.
Of course, the slight problem is that the school I want to go to is one of the ones that Jeff couldn't think of. They base entry on the ACT. Though my 34 from last year ought to be sufficient.
As to exams, they aren't standardized, so far as I know. They're just a MAJOR test, that you take at the end of the year. Not every year, from what I understand of local schools, but your first through third years of high school. It's basically to see if you actually know the material.
Tahna:
Why oppose it in the first place?
Why would teachers' unions oppose testing? Perhaps they don't want it known that the vast majority of them CAN'T TEACH? Just a thought.
And I think "ACT" stands for "American College Test".
Intelligence is how well you learn.
Wisdom is how you use what you learn.
And about the PSAT scores:
If you break the PSAT down into Verbal, Math, and Language (or whatever that third part is), if you add your verbal and math scores, multiply that by 10, you get your equivalent SAT I score. So, if the PSAT were an SAT I, I would have gotten a 1420. 80 (800) verbal, 62 (620) math.
Omega, that was a RHETORICAL Question.
Why else would I put all that stuff about professional testing?
But I wouldn't go as far as saying that the majority can't teach. I will say that a significant portion of the teachers are unqualified in the first place.
[ June 23, 2001: Message edited by: Tahna Los ]
Now he's working in a discount video store.
I, on the other hand, got a modest 1320, with influenza.
As for the ACT and SAT being available online, not in their original forms. The test is copyrighted. You might find an example test somewhere, though.
I said that we have PEs (provincial exams) that we have to take in grade 11 for math and english. If you don't pass the english PE, well, you have to stay in HS an extra year at least to pass English 11 and English 12. I don't know if there's anything that has to be taken for entry into secondary education.