I thought this was a step up from the last few episodes.
First, we finally break away a bit from the Mariner-Boimler and Tendi-Rutherford pairings. Rutherford's not in the episode much, Mariner's too busy interacting with her old Academy buddy, and Tendi and Boimler go off on the Osler together.
Amongst the freaks onboard the Osler is a "Threshold" salamander.
And we get to see our first Edosian in a long while as the "evil" captain of the Osler.
And speaking of the Osler... Definitely different for a Starfleet design, which I suppose is why it has an NX prefix. Was it the designers' mandate to come up with something as evil-looking as possible?
The guest cast was awesome this episode. I was especially happy to see Jennifer Hale voiced both the Vulcan officer and "The Dog". I'm a big fan of her.
One thing I'm still a bit confused on... So at the end of the episode, the lifeform causing trouble on the Rubidoux seems to be revealed as one of the creatures from "Encounter at Farpoint". However, before it grew that big, it seemed to look and act a lot like the creature from "Vox Sola". So which is it? Or is it both?
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Or just something else! After all, if bipedal often-mammalian species can be so prevalent, why not glowy tentacular ones too?
So the visiting captain came from the USS Oakland, which we could probably safely say is another California-class vessel, as indeed is the guest ship of the week, the USS Rubidoux (OLD registry too, NCC-12109, so the class really has been in use a long time). Should we be rolling our eyes that the list of designs we're seeing is so limited, when the first 3 or 4 years of TNG it was all just Mirandas and Excelsiors?
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
The 12109 registry is more evidence of my pet theory that the California class is contemporary to the Ambassador class.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
I'm under the impression the show has already given us more ships and classes than VOY and ENT.
We have 5-6 new ship classes so far and appearances of an Olympic and Antares.
New ships mentioned so far: 8 (9 if you count NCC-502)
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
Divison 14 seems to be a spoof of Section 31.
Second time the FC uniforms appeared and I think the woman in the Pike-chair wore a DS9 jumpsuit.
Next week's episode features some sort of Starfleet ship museum. There's a Tholian ship, a Ferengi shuttle, a Jem'Hadar bug, a workbee, a D7, and a Type 6 shuttlecraft.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
We’ve only really seen the California and Parliament classes so far. Doubt we’ll see much of the Osler-class again. And there are two or three more classes we know of from the Starbase scene, including the one seen flipped in the same scene. I really think e should be seeing more older classes, I wonder if we ever will? Going out of their way to have an Olympic class is encouraging, anyway.
How old IS Mariner? I’m assuming her classmate perhaps isn’t a captain by rank but only by position (like we suspect the captain in “The Trouble With Edward” must surely have been), otherwise she’d have to be one of the fastest-promoted commanding officers ever.
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
Seems like Captain Alita Battle Angel (the actress was like 34 or 35 so I assume the character was too) and Captain Ramsey really did get their own ship in 8 years like Pike told Kirk in the 2009 Star Trek. I figured that meant 8 years after graduating the Academy. Which is still way too fast in my opinion.
Assuming most officers join the Academy around age 18 and it's a 4 year program, they'd be about 22 upon graduation. Honestly though I don't know if there's a minimum time in rank rule. I'm trying to remember if I've ever heard a character say something like, "I've study for the lieutenant exam coming up." I know there's tests they've shown in TNG with Troi about being a bridge officer and getting promoted from LCDR to CDR.
The registry numbers seem to be all over the place which is driving me nuts. I remember once getting an email from Mike Okuda who confirmed they were at best semi-chronological in that newer ships had registry numbers.
As for the episode itself, I enjoyed it more and laughed more than the previous episodes showing there's hope for STLD yet.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:Originally posted by Hobbes: The registry numbers seem to be all over the place which is driving me nuts. I remember once getting an email from Mike Okuda who confirmed they were at best semi-chronological in that newer ships had registry numbers.
While I would prefer the registries to be better organized for the California class (especially given that the Parliament class shares some design attributes with it, especially the low bridge domes), I'm ok with the registries given so far. But if they throw a monkey wrench into the works by giving the next California we see a registry of NCC-2135 or something, that will really get on my nerves, because it will make zero sense chronologically and design-wise, and basically prove that registry numbers don't matter at all, which the TNG era shows went out of their way to show that that wasn't the case. Unless they're really implying that a TNG-era-styled ship was built during the TMP-movie-era, but that would be just silly.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
Well, Kirk went from cadet to captain in the reboot-movies, so it seems you can advance pretty fast in rank in Starfleet but you won't necessarily get a top-tier vessel.
Personally, I would've been ok if captains of California-class vessels were only commanders (like most destroyers in the USN have a commander as CO), but I guess TPTB didn't want to confuse viewers.
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
quote:Originally posted by Spike: Personally, I would've been ok if captains of California-class vessels were only commanders (like most destroyers in the USN have a commander as CO), but I guess TPTB didn't want to confuse viewers.
True. I was on a DDG and our CO was a commander while the XO was a lieutenant commander. But you still call the CO captain regardless of rank. Even DS9 touched on that in a conversation between O'Brien and Nog on the Defiant IIRC.
But I agree, that these smaller support ships would only have an O-5 as the CO. Hell, Sisko was only an O-5 and put in charge of an entire space station. True at the time it was considered some backwater middle of nowhere station before the wormhole was discovered.
Riker wanted to be a captain by the time he was 35. So I suppose in Starfleet it is possible. Maybe not common, but not unheard of. As for Mariner's age, I would say maybe in her early 30s with maybe 5-10 years of time in Starfleet, while her fellow lower deckers are still in their early 20s.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
For what it's worth her voice actress is 37.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
If they still had pay grades it’d make sense, you could have non-captain-grade officers commanding ships and yet being called captains, which we suspect basically happens.
It would also allow for officers to be at captain pay grade yet still be commanders, like Riker who received a full battlefield promotion yet reverted to commander-by-position afterwards. And you could have Picard as being above captain-by-grade, enabling him to “take command of the fleet” without anyone quibbling about it. And it would explain how he went from captain to FULL admiral in less than five years.
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
Maybe Starfleet plays it a little loose with promotions too. Like in ST '09 Pike gave Kirk an acting captain position which honestly made no sense as Spock was his XO and should have been made acting captain, but whatever.
Or if a captain wants to promote say an ensign to LTJG they can give a "field promotion" but the paperwork still has to be sent to an admiral at Starfleet Command for final review to make it official. And if someone with Picard's reputation vouches for you, that's probably good enough.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
quote:Like in ST '09 Pike gave Kirk an acting captain position which honestly made no sense as Spock was his XO and should have been made acting captain, but whatever.
Uh, I do not believe this is correct. When Pike decided to go aboard the Romulan ship, he made Kirk acting first officer: Spock was acting captain until he removed himself from duty at which point Kirk was elevated to acting captain. But yes, it's weird the ship didn't already have an actual second officer.
[ September 19, 2020, 03:12 AM: Message edited by: Malnurtured Snay ]
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Yeah but then they were crewing multiple starships (which were presumably in layover or out of action for upgrades and servicing) with cadets, they didn’t seem to have a chief of engineering either (though apparently that was Olsen - RIP - but was it ever stated in dialogue he was?).
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
I was under the impression the cadets would be serving as supplemental assistance to the existing crews.
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
quote:Originally posted by Malnurtured Snay:
quote:Like in ST '09 Pike gave Kirk an acting captain position which honestly made no sense as Spock was his XO and should have been made acting captain, but whatever.
Uh, I do not believe this is correct. When Pike decided to go aboard the Romulan ship, he made Kirk acting first officer: Spock was acting captain until he removed himself from duty at which point Kirk was elevated to acting captain. But yes, it's weird the ship didn't already have an actual second officer.
You're right. It's been a while since I watched it.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
There IS TNG's The Arsenal of Freedom where Picard puts LaForge in command when he beams down to the planet, despite the fact that chief-engineer-of-the-week Logan is a full Lieutenant (LaForge at the time is only a j.g.); and Logan even comes to the bridge to request that LaForge hand over command. He can't just assume command because it would countermand Picard's orders; granted if Picard had known the Enterprise would have come under attack I don't think he would have left the ship.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Bringing up LaForge reminds me that he went from Lt.(jg) to Lt.Cdr. in about a year. So rapid promotions are possible. Though he’s hardly a poster boy for it, having taken eight years to get to Lt. and stayed a Lt.Cdr. for at least the next 13..!
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
I mean, if you want to talk rapid promotion -- weren't LaForge and Riker in the same Academy class?
And yeah, LaForge jumped in rank rapidly -- Lt. JG in season 1, Lieutenant in S2, Lt. Commander in S3. I do wonder what the production rational for something like that is when compared to keeping Harry, Travis, and Hoshi as ensigns for the entire runs of their show.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
Better not to think too much about it. Harry graduated in 2370 and was essentially a department head and senior office in 2371 while still an ensign.
As for Hoshi and Travis, Earth Starfleet seemed to have fewer officer ranks (we never saw a Lt. JG or Lt. Cmdr.) and at least 3 different crewman grades.
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
With Voyager it was kind of lame how officers really didn't get promoted. Especially in the case of Ensign Kim. By the time the series ended he should have easily been a full lieutenant.
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