Just watched "Conspiracy"...So. Did those Body Snatcher things ever show up again? The episode ended with the bug things having sent off a beacon to some unexplored part of the galaxy...
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
No. They became the Borg. Not that there was any actual connection between the two, but Conspiracy was an attempt to cook up the new Enemy. The Ferengi had failed, and so they introduced space bugs, who were then completely altered in the mind of Maurice Hurley to become the cybernetic collectivists on the top of everyone's list.
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
Ah, that's too bad. I was hoping they were some kind of weapon, sent to weaken the Federation.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Perhaps something species 8472 knows more of?
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
At what point did Hurley (and the rest of the team) hammer out the details of the Borg? Before Q Who? Before Time Squared (which was originally meant to lead into it, I believe), or had they already figured everything out about the cyborg hive mind before The Neutral Zone?
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:Not that there was any actual connection between the two, but Conspiracy was an attempt to cook up the new Enemy.
Actually, that's not entirely accurate. The original backstory about the whole "conspiracy" within the Federation dealt with a group of Starfleet officers who were dissatisfied with the way Starfleet was being run, & wanted to change it. There was no "alien intelligence" behind the plot. This was during "Coming of Age" when we saw Remmick & Quinn for the first time. However, GR didn't want to open up a can of worms about the Federation, since he wanted to show Starfleet & the Federation in a positive, touchy-feely light. Therefore, this story idea was abandoned in favor of the alien parasite infiltrators, a much less imaginative idea than the former backstory. Ironically, the whole Maquis storyline would parallel the original conspiracy storyline later in the series.
Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :
I thought the Borg were dreamed up by Joe Menosky, with the Pomona College connection.
(I just went looking, and found nada)
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
But I'm just talking about the squishy aliens with a taste for grubs, not the larger plotline.
Anyway, I don't think anyone ever nailed down the Borg. They were, for a time, supposed to be a literal hive of insectlike aliens. I don't know if this was after "The Neutral Zone" or not. And then they were cyborgs who consumed technology. They weren't given a hunger for other cultures and ideas and warm bodies until The Best of Both Worlds.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
True. Although in the BOBW, they actually mention that the Borg have changed priorities. "I thought they weren't interested in human life forms, only our technology" (or words to that effect). By the time of "I, Borg" though, everyone had forgotten this. Tsk.
Posted by MrNeutron (Member # 524) on :
As to the Borg, from the interviews I read with Maurice Hurley the Borg were supposed to appear right at the start of season 2, but the writer's strike threw everything off and they didn't show up until Q Who.
I also recall reading that his plan was that the Borg were going to completely destroy the Romulan Empire, and that at the final stand the last Romulan ship finally managed to destroy the Borg (only one ship was to do all this), and Picard and co. would spend a long time trying to figure out what the Romulans had done.
As to Conspiracy, when I pitched some scripts to TNG back in 1989 I wrote a follow-up to it, called "The Unseen", but my agent told me the show wasn't really interested in buying scripts that used elements from previous episodes by other writers, because the show would have to pay them some residuals.
I had fun with the script though. I still think the first three acts are pretty good. I never quite nailed the ending the way I should have. Ah well.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Interesting idea regarding the Romulans facing the Borg. At the SSM forums we got into a debate as to what the Romulans were upto during their "time away", and the Borg were at the top of my list of things that could have kept them busy.
I also wonder howwell (orpoorly) the Klingons would fare versus a Borg cube ripping through their space. Not well at all, I'd guess.
Does anyone here think that the Dominion has had these problems with the Borg? After all the Dominion has lasted for over 2000 years....and the Borg would have certainly explored the Gamma Quadrent waaay before the Alpha/Beta quadrants as the distance is probably much less.
Prahaps the Founders made some sort of deal with the collective (as Guinan tells Picard that the Federation may one day be able to). I can't see a Founder being vulnerable to Borg Assimilation.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
No, but they would be vunerable to being shot with big guns.
At what point did the Borg get to the Alpha Quadrant anyway? Where were Seven's parents when they were picked up?
They were probably there just before the "Neutral Zone", but even if you follow the Voyager idea, they only got into the Alpha Quadrant a couple of decades earlier. And perhaps the Alpha Quadrant is closer to the Borg than the Gamma Quadrent?
And in any case, the Borg have never struck me as a race that feel the need to rush things.
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
The Conspiracy Bugs were pencilled in to reappear during TNG's sixth season. But of course it never came into being.
As Sol System said, the Borg were initially meant to be insect-like, similar to large ants - much more like the eventual Species 8472.
Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
its always sad, a 7 year show always lays down so many storylines that deserve followups. but then again, nowadays whenever they followup on a story, different writers change all the premises so much that its obvious they didnt plan any and it makes little sense compared to the original (Trill, Borg, wormhole Prophets).
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
There was a fanfic out there somewhere in which it was said that the Founders founded the Dominion to protect them from the Borg. *shrug*
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
As far as I can remember, we know of the following Borg activity in tha Alpha Quadrant:
-There was a cube in the AQ that the Hanson's were following but they got pulled into the DQ before being assimilated. Apparently there was at least a bit of noticeable activity since the Hanson's knew at least a little bit about them (p.s. I HATE what 'Dark Frontier' did to the Borg).
- There was Borg activity of some kind in the AQ just before "The Neutral Zone"
- The cube that the Ent D ran into in "Q Who" was apparently on a course for Federation space. At that point, it hadn't been established that they used any kind of subspace technology. The Hanson's story line hadn't been written yet, either, so the idea of them heading here after their encoutner with the Hanson's doesn't seem likely. Especially since they had obviously already been in our vincinity. This ship was probably already in the AQ since the Ent only got thrown 2000 light years away, IIRC.
-Wolf 359 needs no explanation.
-We saw scenes of a Klingon battle with the Borg in Chakotay's flashback. That might have been at Wolf 359 since Hanson said the Klingons were sending ships.
-Didn't 7 remember assimilating someone from the Excalibur? Also Janeway read several captain's comments about the Borg and mentioned "squirmishes" so apparently there have been encounters close to Federation teritory that we've not seen.
-Then there's the First Contact incursion.
$ $ $ $
-And of course the "End Game" near incursion.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
quote:Originally posted by Aban Rune: The cube that the Ent D ran into in "Q Who" was apparently on a course for Federation space.
No it wasn't. It was assimilating the natives of system J-25.
quote:At that point, it hadn't been established that they used any kind of subspace technology.
Do you mean transwarp? Everyone uses subspace technology. And a basic element of "Q Who" was that the Borg ship could move much faster than the Enterprise. It showed no signs of having reached its top speed in the pursuit, so it seems it had already been decided that the Borg were arbitrarily fast, regardless of the terminology.
quote:This ship was probably already in the AQ since the Ent only got thrown 2000 light years away, IIRC.
The Enterprise may have been in the Beta Quadrant when they encountered Q, though. They were keeping an eye on the Romulans, after all.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Wolf 359 is in the Beta quadrant in real-world terms. And the RNZ is likely to be largely in Beta, according to all that backstage "info" and assumptions and sketchy Okudagram maps. And the Hansens crossed a "neutral zone" (gotta be the Romulan one, since there were no other known NZs at that time) in their hunt for the Borg, and thus probably ventured to Beta, too.
One could then indeed suspect that the region of Borg interest at that time was in the Beta direction. And it certainly makes for interesting plots if the Borg were bothering the Romulans at the time. One could easily believe that the Romulans proved both too mundane to assimilate, and so violent that they actually destroyed a cube or two.
Imagine a Romulan warbird in "Q Who?": "Sir, a cube-shaped ship approaches. Shall I hail it?" "Why bother? Fire all weapons." "Firing, sir. Major damage to its..." "Not interested. Ease your finger from the trigger only when it's space dust. I'll be in my quarters." Given how much initial success Worf had with his three shots, the Romulans would easily have inflicted the required ca. 80% damage that would prove fatal to the cube.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Yeah, but the Borg would have probably adapted to the Romulan's weapons.
Sol: I think it was the Jaradans (The Big Goodbye/Smaratin Snare) who were supposedly going to be the Borg-esque adversaries.
Something else to think about:
The Hansen's go off exploring Borg Space... 20 years later Admiral Hansen leads the task force at Wolf 359!
Something ELSE to think about - it sorta just came into my head...
First Federation v Borg... Big-arsed Ball v Big-arsed Cube!
Andrew
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
The Borg were specifically planned as being an insectlike race, though, separate from the Jarada, though I can't say I ever heard anything about the Jarada being a potential Big Enemy.
Come to think of it, there were Jarada references all over "Samaritan Snare," though, weren't there? What was with that?
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Oh, and it's Magnus(!) Hansen, but Admiral Hanson. Or no?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Ug! One of the WORST things to be seen on Voyager was all the Alpha Quadrant races assimilated by the Borg! When (and how!) did the Borg assimilate crewmen from the Excalibur? The Excalibur is hale and whole in "Data's Day" and I that was well after BOBW! And any self respecting Klingon would rather kill himself with honor than become a drone! I agree that an initial devastating attack from a Warbird could have destroyed a Cube....but only as a one-time event. Any other Borg ships would have adapted to the attack and countered future attacks. Something else that Voyager dropped the ball on was the Borg not retaining their adaptation of a species' abilities overtime: The Queen (in Dork Frontier) has to "turn on" the ability to detect the Hanson's stealth technology. In short: Voyager so sucked.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Yeah. "Hansen" sounds like Danish or Norwegian, while "Hanson" is more probably Swedish stock. Both of course mean "The Son of Hans"... In Swedish, "Hansson" would be more typical than the anglized "Hanson", but clearly the admiral wasn't a first-generation emigrant from Scandinavia.
(The booming, reverbing voice of the Borg Collective at Wolf 359. A tint of curiosity in it: "Hanson. Sounds Swedish.")
(The nasal voice of Adm. Hanson at Wolf 359, as the attack begins to go south: "Boorg, boorg, boorg!" Throws padds and debris and what looks like cooking spatulas over his shoulders. People behind him duck.)
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Whoops. Somebody types too fast for my reaction speed.
Yeah, the Borg forget. But that's their defining characteristic. They also lose a few drones to phaser fire every time, despite having familiarized themselves with that weapon type many times over. Either their memory cache just can't hold too many countermeasures at a time, or then the actual countermeasure systems would interfere with each other if operated simultaneously.
And "I, Borg" happened after Wolf 359. The Excalibur could have responded to a similar crisis in a different manner. The Borg would have performed a low-key hostage rescue operation, not a major battle, and would have fled with a few assimilees.
And Picard in "FC" claims the Borg have been advancing, and the Federation has been falling back. We never saw that. Perhaps the crew of the Excalibur did.
As for Klingons falling prisoner to the Borg... We know they have fallen prisoner to Romulans and the like, which is no wonder in the era of long-range stun weapons. The Borg don't use long-range stunners, but then again, the Klingons don't fight at long ranges. They bring themselves to within easy reach of the assimilation tubules. It's only a matter of how many drones they manage to slay before the tubes are inserted.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Sol: Yes, I meant transwarp technology, not subspace. My bad.
I rewatched the opening part of the episode this morning and the Ent actually got thrown 7000 lightyears away. Interesting note: Data said it would only take them 2 years to get to the nearest starbase, not back to where they were. They had just picked up omez and others at Starbase 173, but the nearest base was Base 185. Whereever they ended up after Q's snap could've been on the other side of the Federation from where they were.
I do like th idea that the Borg have been bothering the Romulans, though. They had been poking around the Neutral Zone. But the Romulans didn't seem to know who was destroying their outposts... so maybe that means their contact with the Borg had only been recent.
Posted by Snay (Member # 411) on :
^ IIRC, someone in "Q, Who" mentions that the damage to Guinan's planet is very similar to the damage inflicted to the Neutral Zone outposts.
Posted by Woodside Kid (Member # 699) on :
quote: Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: Ug! One of the WORST things to be seen on Voyager was all the Alpha Quadrant races assimilated by the Borg!
Amen! That was the thing I found hardest to swallow about "Unity" and its ex-Borg. The Borg are a collective race, with billions (if not trillions) of beings, God knows how many cubes, and no sense of individuality outside of the Queen. Why would it bother to send all these newly created Starfleet drones down some transwarp teleportation unit into the Delta Quadrant when the cube blew up at earth? Do you worry about saving your red blood cells when you get a paper cut?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Now, if we saw the Kazon and Okompa races totally assimilated I surely would not protest....
It would be great to see the Borg retalliate for the loss of a Transwarp Hub by backtracking Voyagers flightplan and asssimilating all of the losers that made silly "alien of the week" apperances: starting with those dinosaur-sleestack rejects that supposedly evolved from earth! If anynone in sci-fi needs a pimp-slap, it's the jerk that wrote that script! Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
^^^^
I thought the Kazon where too primitive to be assimilated?
The Conspiracy-creatures appeared on Voyager, 'Good Shepard'. There was no connection made, but it was obvious that the creature that took over the redshirt guy in the flyer was a member of the conspiracy-species. Data said they sent a transmission to the other end of the galaxy (didn't he even mention the DQ?), the Voyager-worm took over the guy by crawling into his neck (I think they even had the "nipple" we saw in Conspiracy), and the outer appearance was similar, allthough CGI.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Data said the damage to one of the planets in system J-25 was "identical" to the damage of the outposts along the neutral zone. It wasn't Guinan's planet, though she does say that her people have been in that part of the galaxy.
What wasn't really made clear was whether the Cube that chased the Enterprise had just finished with system J-25 or whether the Borg had been in the area for some time. I seem to remember reading (probably in the Encyclopedia) that the cube was on a course for Federation space and the Ent was thrown into it's path. But that wsn't really made clear either.
Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
last i checked the DQ was inside this galaxy.. data said the signal was being sent 'out' not to the other side.
waitaminnit.. i only saw a few minutes of good shepard.. was that really the same creature?? buh?
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
I think the worm thing in Good Shepard was longer than the one in Conspiracy. I don't remember thinking they looked at all the same. But maybe I was too busy looking for the moving cursor on the escape pod's montior.
Does this mean I'm going to have to re-watch that episode to figure this out?
Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
I'd at least give it a try. The species looked extremely similar (the legs and head and everything). If there is no dialogue about it, fine, that's the writer's "fault", but maybe the art departement thought it would be cool to throw in such a reference.
quote: last i checked the DQ was inside this galaxy.. data said the signal was being sent 'out' not to the other side.
Maybe the signal would have been able to contact *something* outside the galaxy, but who says you have to phone Hongkong just because you can do it? Data could have had just the basic direction of the signal, nothing specific.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
"last i checked the DQ was inside this galaxy.. data said the signal was being sent 'out' not to the other side."
"DQ"? Dairy Queen?!? Man, that explains sooo much!
I doubt that the writers on Voyager ever made intentional connections to TNG....or anything else! I've read several interviews with the Voyager writers where comments werre made like "I really haven't watched many of the TOS/TNG/DS9/completed third grade". Crap like that really made me want to tune in next week.....much like Barga "admitting there were a few poopy episodes of Enterprise"!
No professional should demean all the people working on a complex, high quality show like Enterprise with comments like the ones he made. Bakula should give him one of his patented "Quantum Leap Roundhouse kicks"!
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
? "Yeah, we made a few mistakes." vs. "EVERY EPISODE IS PERFECT. WATCH TREK MONKEYS. AND DANCE FOR US. DANCE." Curious.
Also, "Distant Origin" is a fine Voyager episode, and I would be happy including it in the "Good Star Trek" column when the final judgement arrives.
Also, it is ironic that the Voth are probably one of the few species in the Galaxy who could go toe to toe with the Borg, at least for awhile. Transporting starships = Do Not Mess With.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
How do you figure he demeaned everyone? He didn't say the acting was bad, or the sets, or the special effects, or anything like that. He said it was the stories that didn't work. And, since he was the one who (co-)wrote the stories, it seems like he's pretty much directing it at himself.
[ August 28, 2002, 21:52: Message edited by: TSN ]
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
BB: I think the show was good.
fanboy: You suck! You're lying and remkaing trek in your own image! Take responsibility for your shitness!
BB: I think we made mistakes.
Fanboy: You suck! You're insulting other people! You piss on Gene Roddenberry's ashes! I hate you and all the people who laugh at me.
Posted by Thoughtcancer (Member # 480) on :
"Shitness"?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Admiral Hans*n is with an "o"? Cause Annkia's family name is DEFINATELY with an "e".
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Yeah. That's one of the few times the Encyclopedia is consistent throughout about vowels in a foreign name. Hanson is always Hanson, the Hansens are always the Hansens. There's no "Noonian/Noonien" ambiguity about it.
This thing about "Good Shepherd" is really intriguing. I never saw the episode, sort of glossed over it in net reviews, and never got a good look at the bugs in the promo shots available at Vidiot's and elsewhere. Does anybody have a good picture available?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I have enough time under my belt managing large projects (that many people have worked on)to know how much morale drops when a leader or supervisor publicly says deragatory statements. Who really gives 100%, when you know that the big boss may one day trash the project you and everyone else are working hard on? I wonder how Bakula and the other cast members feel about that comment? You just know that some interviewer will call them on it. Probably on national T.V., no less!
Posted by Magnus de Pym (Member # 239) on :
NOT NATIONAL T.V.!! Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
Jason didn't read TSN's post, did he?
Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
does Jason read?
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Oh, knock it off. Let's not run another new guy off. This isn't DARKSTAR, or BWC material...
Posted by Thoughtcancer (Member # 480) on :
As a rule, I like anyone who is named after an aspect of Armageddon.
For example, in Hackers, my favorite character was Mr. Da Plague.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
OK so mabye a bit of my personal distaste for the little creep snuck in..... Still, it's tough to watch Bakula in one interview really boost the show on Conan O'Brien and give a great interview, and then a couple of months later we read killjoy stuff like that. It would have been alot better to just say that there was room for improvment on some episodes: after all, there's a million websites of fanboys always screamin' "You Suck!" without hearing it from the creators themselves.
...as for running me off....good luck! As an incarnation of mischief and destruction, I've won staring contests with cockroaches! Posted by Magnus de Pym (Member # 239) on :
"a bit of my personal distaste for the little creep snuck in"
Looks like it snuck in again. I can see people hating Mr. Bin Laden. He did, after all, blow you up. I can see people hating Mr. Hubbard. He writes poorly, and created a money-vaccuous cult. I can even see people hating All-Star point guard Steve Nash. He doesn't cut his hair.
But, what, in the name of the Thetans (FUCK YOU RONNIE! RELIGON MY ASS! FUCK YOU AND YOUR GRANDMA TRAVOLTA!) has Mr. Braga ever personally done to you? I've never found him to be anything less than a relatively normal human, if a bit Hollywood-Producer-esque, but I can't think of any reason why that would be. At all. The dude is making a TV show. He is making much moneys, and snorting coke and dicking Jeri Ryan and doing all of the things that many of us wish we could do, but are too lazy or boring or FatLikeTim to do so. For producing Television for the last decade or so, the man deserves at least a little nodding of the hat.
Retarded-Ass fanboy shouting at Braga is so very fucking 1998. Get over it, provide some real criticism, or you might as well end your diatribe, because it sure as fuck isn't anything we've ever heard before.
Lousy Braga, that goatfucking whore, the paedophilic child-abducting pornographer.
What good it?
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
quote:It would have been alot better to just say that there was room for improvment on some episodes
Strange, because that's what Braga said.
Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
Yes, but this person doesnt READ.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
MEOW! I can sure see how you guys have "chased off" posters in the past. I got here from a link one of your posters made for my models and have met several nice folks here, but as the last two posts have shown, some of you are rather childish. Mabye you are only kidding with someone you are good friends with, but "FUCK YOU AND YOUR GRANDMA" posts was quite old about a week after electronic bulliten boards were invented.
hmmmm......I wonder if Bill gates was the first "FUCK YOUR GRANDMA" poster... Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
I think you'll do allright here. This was only the first test though. ( I know that some newbz would be calling us gays and lesbians and canceling their AOL at this point. )
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
I suspect an extremely crucial point has been missed.
"FUCK YOU AND YOUR GRANDMA" is, you know, the subterranean level of posting.
"FUCK YOU AND YOUR GRANDMA TRAVOLTA," when aimed at Scientologists AND designed as an extreme example of behavior to be avoided, is at least in the geosynchronous orbit of posting.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Ah.....The "Travolta Point". I missed it: and with one of those kooky "assembly halls" just a few miles from here too.
Seems we (or rather I) have gotten away from the thread's topic: CONSPIRACY
TNN just aired "samaritan Snare" with the Pakleds. As someone pointed out earlier on this thread, there are several references to the "Haradans" in the episode. Have these boogey men ever been shown? They must be tough, as they are compared with the Romulans.....
....you guys ever notice how much the Pakleds look/sound like "Moron" from the old Freakizoid! cartoon? Errie. ...and moron was from outer space...
Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
Recommended reading/watching:
> "The Big Goodbye" [TNG season 1] *now available on DVD* The crew attempt to make contact with the reclusive Jarada, but their alien scanning apparatus traps Picard in the holodeck, and he is the only member of the crew that can make contact!
> "Imbalance" by V.E. Mitchell [Pocket TNG] The crew visit a hive of the reclusive Jarada, insectoid being who are obsessive about protocol. When the hive goes mad, can the away team survive?
> "Demons of Air and Darkness" by Keith R.A. DeCandido [Pocket DS9] As the Gateways crisis continues, refugees from Europa Nova must escape their dying world through an Iconian gate.. but they end up on the homeworld of the Jarada. Can Vaughn convince the bugs to let the humans live? > "Twilight" by David R. George III [Pocket DS9] Before Mission Gamma can begin, Vaughn must first escape the Jarada hive, angered at a slight caused during the evacuation of Europani colonists! (actually the Jarada are only in chapter one...
and yes, i wrote all this off the top of my head).
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
So, no, the Jarada are never seen, and outside "The Big Goodbye" and "Samaritan Snare" they are never mentioned.
At least, I don't think they are. But then I had no idea they were mentioned in "Samaritan Snare" until I rewatched it recently. That mention is in the encyclopedia, though.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
For what it's worth Jason, UM does more good than he does harm. Imagine how pleased you'll be when scary anal rabid 733t fanboys break in and we sick him on them.
Just, y'know, be a bit careful on the Braga thing. It's a sore topic round here, due to Scary Irrational Hatred. And which always results in someone doing the tiring "whenever people list the top ten episodes of TNG and VOY, Bragass name pops up an awful lot" argument. And then Vogon Poet gets in a mood. And then someone insists that the Enterprise-class exists because it said to on a plaque in TWOK, and I shoot people.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I'll have to re-read the "Demons of Air and Darkness" book again! I don't remember Vaughn doing much of anything in that book..... mabye it was "off camera"
It's just as well....if TNG had shown them, they likely would have had to fly around in a re-dress of the cruddy Merchantman freighter, like the Shelliak did!
Ja-rada....not Ha-rada....mabye Miata? ....Sonata?
Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
can you RE READ?... j/k
there was the whole scene at the Gateway.. Vaughn knew the fumbly language perfectly that even Picard tripped over, he convinced the Jarada to set up a refugee camp for the Europani on their planet through the Gateway
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Hey, *I* mentioned the Jarada!!
The thing is with their comparison to the Borg is - according to the Companion/Compendium what ever that the Jarada were supposed to be an insectoid race... and I think the Borg were supposed to be as well...
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
So the Jarada are bugs like the Shelliak? But do they wear cool moo-moos like the Shelliak?
That Vaugn is good for lots o' stuff! .......and he's been in Starfleet for 80 years? We could read 'bout him in the Stargazer series (if I had time to read anything just now!
Posted by Captain-class, Mike-variant (Member # 709) on :
the new book has dropped some fascinating hints about a flashback aboard the Enterprise-B when Vaughn was a young officer.
and were the Sheliak bugs? didn't look like it to me.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
New book? man, it has been awhile. Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Nothing to see here, move along...
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
New book == Mission Gamma, I think.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
The Sheliak were lumpen things, though they did appear to wear a stylish (if completely nonhuman) jumpsuit. The one we saw looked vaguely like an Excalbian, actually, minus the rockiness. They are an "R-3" lifeform, whatever that means. They have a charming fondness for hard radiation.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
I thought the Sheliak looked slightly like Armus, that cheerful oil-based chappy?
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
So did I. But taking another look confirmed that the only real thing they have in common with him is their color. The Sheliak have arms, for instance. Only roughly defined arms, but arms.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
The Sheliak were never bug/insectoid people. They were Xenophobic and look like Armus regects, but they were never "bugs". I'm gathering a lot of people are taking the pocket-book novels too much to heart/as fact.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Hmmm....I never read the pocket books. Don't know why I thought "insect"....mabye I'm just tried as hell of bipedal, humanoid aliens everywhere in Trek.
The fondness for hard rads is charming, however a whole race of attorneys is not.
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