When I first found this web page I lurked here becuase it basiclly the best Web Page on ST Starships.
I remember seeing a Fans Idea of what NX-01 Could of looked like. The artist Used TOS Enterprise as a Template.
It was an amzazing Idea! I loved the white look of it and I think it would of fit the Story line better.
Does anyone have That Picture!!?!?! I would really like to add it to my collection!
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Reverend's work, I believe.
Posted by Anti Spark (Member # 949) on :
WOW!
Thats it!
Anymore?? Does this artist have a web page?
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
There are also a few TOSified versions of the ship at EAS.
*resists urge to rant about Enterprise*
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Just after the first top view of NX-01 came out in TV guide, Vektor at TrekBBS did a very good TOS version.
Posted by J (Member # 608) on :
What does it say about something when the people that run it can't even hold a candle to those that enjoy it?
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
A while ago I tried to convince Masao to create an ENT-type ship to show how it's REALLY done, but he refuses to acknowledge "Enterprise's" existence.
I cobbled this one together from pieces of his Hyperion and Paris class designs, with the nacelle from the Gagarin. (image here)
Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :
I think that NX-01 B is too disproportionate. The saucer should be at least 10-15% bigger (the NX-01 stretch out even wider than the nacelles) and positioned less close to the center mass.
That, or shorten those gigantic nacelle pylons, they look like 747-wings.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
I am actually working on a similar ship, but without catamarans.
Posted by Anti Spark (Member # 949) on :
Great Pics & Links!
Thank you everyone!
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Those ships are all better than the NX-01, but still.. this is 2151! 40 years before the Daedalus is phased out, 10 years before the Federation, and even ~5 years before the Romulan Wars. It should really still look a LOT more primitive. Something along the lines of Bernd's Mauretania and San Fransisco classes.
Posted by Bernd (Member # 6) on :
Shame on you, Reverend, for this blatant kitbash!
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
What I find most amusing is all the people who say what the NX-01 should look like. Have they seen some kind of ship from this time period before? I know I haven't.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
I don't know what ships from that era should look like. I do know what they SHOULDN'T look like Posted by Phoenix (Member # 966) on :
The thing is, the NX-01 actually looks like what I think a ship in 150 years time might look like, whereas the NCC-1701 looks like a toy. Hence my theory (I don't expect anyone else to like it, but it suits me):
TOS was a late 23rd century TV show with an extremely low budget which described the adventures of the crew of the Enterprise, which was a really famous ship. Kirk, Scotty, Spock, all existed, but were played by lookalikes. So the major things of TOS happened, like the M5 disaster and the Romulan incident, but not necessarily how they were portrayed in TOS. The nonsense episodes, like one one with the dragon-cave-god thing and the we're-all-nazis episode were just made up, because most of the time nothing very exciting happened on the Enterprise.
Starfleet did not wear those uniforms. Perhaps it was a hippy-oriented TV show (would explain the space hippies).
Klingons always looked like they do in ENT and TNG/DS9/VOY, but the low budget producers couldn't afford makeup.
The movies are real, except for 1 and 5, which I don't like (as you can see this is a very whimsical theory).
The Constitution Class always looked like it does in the movies. It was never refitted.
The trouble with Tribbles was a holodeck program (if they can do it, so can I).
This theory (along with being extremely wierd) allows ENT to look realistic, as it does look okay when compared to the Enterprise-A.
All for the simple reason that my mind is unable to reconcile TOS and ENT being the same universe, and I'd rather have ENT.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
*looks at profile* Ah, you're in the UK. Excellent. This makes it easy for me to hunt you down like a dog. 8)
Posted by Phoenix (Member # 966) on :
quote:Originally posted by Vogon Poet: *looks at profile* Ah, you're in the UK. Excellent. This makes it easy for me to hunt you down like a dog. 8)
Sorry, but I just don't like TOS.
Spock's Brain The Way to Eden Requiem for Methuselah And the Children Shall Lead The Omega Glory For the World is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky Charlie X
etc etc
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Infidel! How dare you take the name of thy Father in vain? Posted by Phoenix (Member # 966) on :
Starship Class? Every single ship the same design? Tacky uniforms that no navy would be seen dead in? Polystyrene rocks? Scantily clad women round every corner? Constant use of Security Guards when they always get shot/vaporised/eaten by killer plants? Space Hippies? Warp 647? No warp core? Only 3 characters, with some token extras? Not even knowing what organisation they work for half the time?
Sorry, it may be a stupid idea and have Quantum-Leap-Guy as the captain, but i'll take Enterprise any day Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
You can have my portion as well Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
..and mine. Actually, I don't mind Enterprise, it's OK (or at least the ones I remembered to watch were), but I'm firmly in the Starfleet Museum camp . I've never been especially fond even of the Akira class and I just don't like the E-nil, even without all the continuity errors.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"Starship Class? Every single ship the same design? Tacky uniforms that no navy would be seen dead in? Polystyrene rocks? Scantily clad women round every corner? Constant use of Security Guards when they always get shot/vaporised/eaten by killer plants? Space Hippies? Warp 647? No warp core? Only 3 characters, with some token extras? Not even knowing what organisation they work for half the time?"
You seem to have a strange understanding of what the show was all about...
Posted by Phoenix (Member # 966) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN:
"Starship Class? Every single ship the same design? Tacky uniforms that no navy would be seen dead in? Polystyrene rocks? Scantily clad women round every corner? Constant use of Security Guards when they always get shot/vaporised/eaten by killer plants? Space Hippies? Warp 647? No warp core? Only 3 characters, with some token extras? Not even knowing what organisation they work for half the time?"
You seem to have a strange understanding of what the show was all about...
I enjoy watching TOS. The characters (those that get developed that is) are amusing and interesting. The stories are usually entertaining (except the ones which try to preach a moral message). However, I don't think its realistic at all, and it doesn't fit in with how all the other Treks present the future. So I am perfectly happy to watch it, and enjoy it, but I just can't reconcile it being in the same universe as the others, especially now Enterprise is here.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
"Charlie X" is good TV.
Well, sort of. It is not aggressively bad, I think, as certain others on that list are.
Posted by Matrix (Member # 376) on :
I might be retrending on old 2001 issues here, but after rereading Bernd's little rant on the subject, really got me thinking.
How come everyone who hates or just generally dislikes the show's look always have to look at the Daedalus and the E-nil for a comparison. Look, both designs came from the 1960's, and both of them were built on a rather low budget to begin with. The Daedalus class model is of real low quality.
So if we were to design something that looks like a 22nd design, should it look like a real smooth rocket with nacelles on it? I mean is it really far fetched that perhaps the Akira class perhaps is using some design elements to achieve what other designs cannot? The NX class cheats to get up to Warp 5, whereas, E-Nil and up do not (or at least we do not know about it).
In the Flying Wing and B-2 pic, the designers fell back on that design to use some of the elements to creat the stealth bomber. Not only that the JSF, possesses two plane designs, and from the looks of it, they have picked the F-35 design because it's not that harmful to look at.
I guess that's the end of my little rant.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Whenever I have doubts about the look of Enterprise, I just keep the following phrase in mind:
"Enterprise does not happen 100 years before TOS; it happens 100 years AFTER First Contact."
That helps make things a little clearer for me, in terms of looks. It's all about perspective.
Mark
Posted by David Templar (Member # 580) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: It's all about perspective.
In that case, I need to start coloring my perspective with a couple shots of hard liquor everytime I watch show.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
I would just like to point out that, canonically, sphere-and-cylinders ship != Daedalus.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Well, if we're going down that route, the only time we've ever seen the spere and cylinders ship is as a desktop model, and for all we know Sisko was just a really, really crap model builder. Perhaps it never even existed as a real starship.
Which would be a good thing. It is as bad as "And the Children Shall Lead".
But, when was warp 647?
Posted by Futurama Guy (Member # 968) on :
Never was that warp....wasn't something like warp 14 or 15 the highest achieved?
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
Whatever the highest warp number used on TOS was, Phoenix obviously doesn't realize that a different warp scale was used back then.
Posted by CaptainMike (Member # 709) on :
warp 14 in "Is There In Truth No Canon?"
unless you really want to consider the warp 36 from "The Counter-Canon Incident"
BTW in the WF^3 scale they sometimes claim to have used before the absolute 10 scale, the Warp 14 is about 2744 times the speed of light, which is somewhere near warp 9.8 on the TNG scale.. and the TAS reference of warp 36 is like 46,000 times the SoL.. and is warp 9.99545 on the TNG according to Curt Danhauser's site
Posted by Phoenix (Member # 966) on :
quote:Originally posted by Dat: Whatever the highest warp number used on TOS was, Phoenix obviously doesn't realize that a different warp scale was used back then.
Yes I do, I just don't like it. I think single digit Warp factors going up to a theoretical maximum of 10 makes more sense that increasing it geometrically like TOS does. I mean, in the 34th century, they really would get up to Warp 647 or whatever, and that would just be silly.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
Which is, um, why they changed it in the 24th.
If you're a young race just starting out with warp travel, what makes more sense? Basing your initial scale on known achievable and theoretical (based on the what they knew at the time) speeds and revising it later (and, in the meantime, having a lot of ships only able to do warp 2 or 3); or, just going all out and picking a scale from 1 (light speed) up to 10 (amphibian speed)? Because the way things were going in the later shows set in the 24th century, it looked like another recalibration was almost due, with speeds of warp 9.increasing9s common.
Posted by Phoenix (Member # 966) on :
quote:Originally posted by Vogon Poet: Which is, um, why they changed it in the 24th.
If you're a young race just starting out with warp travel, what makes more sense? Basing your initial scale on known achievable and theoretical (based on the what they knew at the time) speeds and revising it later (and, in the meantime, having a lot of ships only able to do warp 2 or 3); or, just going all out and picking a scale from 1 (light speed) up to 10 (amphibian speed)? Because the way things were going in the later shows set in the 24th century, it looked like another recalibration was almost due, with speeds of warp 9.increasing9s common.
Just out of curiosity, what is Warp 14 in the TNG scale?
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
quote:Originally posted by CaptainMike: . . . Warp 14 is about 2744 times the speed of light, which is somewhere near warp 9.8 on the TNG scale. . .
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
It seems that at least in one possible future they did indeed recalibrate the scale again (Warp 13 in "All Good Things..").
And yes, I do think the NX-01 should look more like a 'smooth rocket with nacelles' than the Akira. So there.
Posted by Cartmaniac (Member # 256) on :
"Not only that the JSF, possesses two plane designs, and from the looks of it, they have picked the F-35 design because it's not that harmful to look at."
No. Cosmetic considerations had absolutely zilch to do with the decision to select the F-35 candidate.
Posted by Matrix (Member # 376) on :
You never watched the show on Nova did you? Read the magazines like Popular Mechanics. Because they were practically even except for a few minor details, they were consdering F-35 because it didn't look like it was a short pregnant airplane like Boeing's was. It looked like a conventional plane based off of the F-22 (which it was).
I find it funny that people are basing the entire 22nd century sytarship design off of a non-detailed model off of Sisko's desk. Like some have pointed out, Sisko could have been a bad modeler.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Or the proud yet embarrassed father of one.
Yeah, I'm quite willing to believe that the general just said to his adjutant "that monstrosity is gonna win over my dead body - invent the necessary jargon for flunking it". But if aesthetics play such an important role in USAF selection processes, then pray tell, why was F-22 picked over F-23?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Bernd (Member # 6) on :
I don't need the lack of details on the Daedalus or the Constitution to show how NX-01 just isn't fitting. On the contrary, I'm all for visible weapons and thrusters on these two classes. Believe it or not, it's getting on my nerves how fans frequently claim that a 22nd century ship should look exactly like that.
Phoenix's rant about TOS, on the other hand, is mostly concerned with style and taste questions. I wouldn't be surprised if a future generation in 35 years would mock about Enterprise in quite a similar fashion.
Any attempt to retro-engineer NX-01 must get rid of Akira details and proportions. The rest, as I have to admit, is much a matter of style as well. Most of the alternative designs, including Reverend's, my own, and Masao's SF Museum designs (although he made them independently of Enterprise), are very closely based on the look of TOS, maybe too closely. That's because we love TOS. And we are not making a TV show. But for the TV show, only something radically different from anything we have seen yet would have been fitting. No Phoenix rocket, no TOS simplicity, no Akira clone. Anything different to give the series a distinct feel.
Posted by darkwing_duck1 (Member # 790) on :
A couple of misc points:
1. Highest Warp reported on screen in TOS: Warp 30. Mentioned in "Journey to Babel" as the attack speed of what turned out to be an Orion ship.
2. Who's to say that the Daedalus class and the NX class can't BOTH exist in the 22 century? Why is everyone acting like it has to be either one or the other?
Posted by MrNeutron (Member # 524) on :
quote:Originally posted by darkwing_duck1: A couple of misc points:
1. Highest Warp reported on screen in TOS: Warp 30. Mentioned in "Journey to Babel" as the attack speed of what turned out to be an Orion ship.
I just watched the DVD of the episode to check, and below are all the references to the Orion ship's speed.
Orion ship's first pass: SPOCK: Interesting. They were traveling at approximately warp 10.
Later as the ship attacks: CHEKOV: Captain. The alien ship has changed course and speed. Moving directly towards us at warp 8.
Finally... as it closes in: CHEKOV: Range decreasing. Speed dropping to close to sublight.
That's it. No warp 30.
Posted by NightWing (Member # 4) on :
quote:Originally posted by Timo: Or the proud yet embarrassed father of one.
Yeah, I'm quite willing to believe that the general just said to his adjutant "that monstrosity is gonna win over my dead body - invent the necessary jargon for flunking it". But if aesthetics play such an important role in USAF selection processes, then pray tell, why was F-22 picked over F-23?
Timo Saloniemi
Hear hear! The F-23 is my all time favourite airplane.
On topic: I remember Warp 14 being the highest number mentioned on screen in TOS.
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. I've never been especially fond even of the Akira class and I just don't like the E-nil, even without all the continuity errors.
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