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What's the difference between known & explored space?
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<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="1" width="95%" align="center"> <tr bgcolor="#234c6f"><td> <table border="0" width="100%" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="1"> <tr bgcolor="#234c6f"> <td colspan="2" align="left"> <font size="3" color="#FFFFFF" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>T O P I C ��� R E V I E W</b> </font></td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Shik</b> <br /><small>Member # 343</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,2,30,21,21,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">March 30, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">09:21 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> No, seriously.<br /><br />In the midst of revamping my writing with acceptable, semi-logical interstellar distances & volumetrics (which...don't even get me started...), I snagged myself on a semantic sandbar. The terms "known space" & "explored space" seem to be used interchangeably, but I don't feel they really are. In terms of exploration directives & knowledge ranges, they're different things, but I'm having difficulty setting down concrete definitions.<br /><br />Currently, I'm leaning toward known space entailing all that's publicly accessible through knowledge; it may have been charted by subspace telescope or visited by probes, but the general layout is known. Explored space would be more detailed; actually visited by ships & crews, surveyed, plotted, mapped, all the bits sussed out. That seems a good layout...but.<br /><br />Anyone care to opine? <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>137th Gebirg</b> <br /><small>Member # 2692</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,2,31,1,54,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">March 31, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">01:54 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> ^^^ That's how I look at those two terms, too, yes. <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Lee</b> <br /><small>Member # 393</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,2,31,18,46,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">March 31, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">06:46 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> I zuppose you could take some known examples of stars visited by one of the series' ships, and use that to calculate a radius, then work out how many stars there are in that spherical volume. <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Shik</b> <br /><small>Member # 343</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,2,31,21,7,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">March 31, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">09:07 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Actual Deneb in "Farpoint" is 2800 ly away. Mintaka is 1200. Actual Rigel is 900. <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Guardian 2000</b> <br /><small>Member # 743</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,1,2,43,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 01, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">02:43 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Baby, I got this, from the 8000 light-years back through Kozinski vs. Wesley:<br /><br /><a href="https://st-v-sw.net/STSWcompare.html#Size" target="_blank">https://st-v-sw.net/STSWcompare.html#Size</a> <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Shik</b> <br /><small>Member # 343</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,7,0,42,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 07, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">12:42 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> On a related note, any math geeks here? I need to formulate the volume of a bulged disk (like a galaxy or a discus) & I'm unsure if it's considered an oblate spheroid or if there's an actual disk formula. Also, if the latter, is there an online calculator for it? <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Guardian 2000</b> <br /><small>Member # 743</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,7,23,42,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 07, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">11:42 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> For the Federation volume I've just used a short elliptic cylinder elsewhere, since the thickness is somewhat quasi-uniform-ish out this far. So, if the Federation is 8kly by 6kly and 1kly thick, it goes like this:<br /><br />Volume = πABH/4<br />Volume = π(8000ly)(6000ly)(1000ly)/4<br />Volume = π(48,000,000,000ly³)/4<br />Volume = π(12,000,000,000ly³)<br />Volume = 37,669,080,000ly³<br /><br />37.67 billion cubic light-years, in other words. <br /><br />Going full oblate spheroid would be superior for the galaxy as a whole, but even that would be an estimate. <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Shik</b> <br /><small>Member # 343</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,8,2,32,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 08, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">02:32 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Yeah, but, uh.....I need to do these calcs at various sizes, & I don't follow your shapings.<br /><br />At any rate, I wanted to avoid cylindering, but I guess I've no choice. Back to applying "Hamilton" lyrics as subchapter headings. <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Guardian 2000</b> <br /><small>Member # 743</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,8,12,40,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 08, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">12:40 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> No worries, just giving an example. The oblate spheroid formula uses the radius, not the diameter, and in the below the radius A is for the length and width, with C as the height: <br /><br />Volume = (4/3)πA²C<br /><br />Now, we could also estimate an irregular oblate spheroid, a.k.a. an ellipsoid, like the E-D saucer section, simply by having an ABC form with A being half the length (Ten Forward back to the arboretum), B as half the width (port to starboard), and C as half the height (bridge to yacht).<br /><br />But, as I am not at a spot right this second to pull those numbers, I'll use my 8*6*1 again:<br /><br />Volume = (4/3)πABC<br />Volume = (4/3)π(4000)(3000)(500)<br />Volume = (4/3)π(6000000000)<br />Volume = 8000000000π<br />Volume = 25,132,741,228 ly³<br /><br />So, whereas a box that's 8000*6000*1000 would have a volume of 48,000,000,000 cubic light-years, a disk only has 37,670,000,000 (having removed the corners), and an ellipsoid only has 25,100,000,000 thanks to shaving off the top and bottom of the edges all the way around.<br /><br />There is a calculator for spheroids and ellipsoids here: <a href="https://planetcalc.com/149/" target="_blank">https://planetcalc.com/149/</a> . . . just remember to use radius, not diameter, for that.<br /><br />Alternately, what numbers are you wanting to use? <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>TSN</b> <br /><small>Member # 31</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,8,16,39,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 08, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">04:39 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Have you tried just typing it into Wolfram Alpha? <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Shik</b> <br /><small>Member # 343</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,8,19,53,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 08, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">07:53 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Yeah, I've been using Planetcalc for my spheroids, but couldn't find dick for disks.<br /><br />My numbers vary on point it time. I'm still working out revising what I've written so far for more logic & such. There's also the matter of vertical vs. horizontal expansion, how much space is solid vs. pseudopods & tendrils (or even webbing), & what stated values to adhere to & what to cast aside (for example, Bajor being 52.3 ly from Sol, yet still being "the frontier).<br /> <br /> <small>[ April 08, 2017, 09:16 PM: Message edited by: Shik ]</small> <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Guardian 2000</b> <br /><small>Member # 743</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,9,0,12,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 09, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">12:12 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> 52.3 light-years from Bajor to Sol / Earth? I don't have the DS9:TM anymore, but my understanding was that it didn't say that, either numerically or in text: <br /><br /> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> p.3, Section 1.1, Local Stellar Neighborhood<br />"The Bajoran and Cardassian star systems, some 50 light-years from the core Federation worlds..."<br /></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> p.17, Section 1.5, Support Flight Procedures<br />"Specialized high-warpcourier vehicles can be employed for critical missions and are able to cover the 50.3-light-year distance between the station and the UFP inner perimeter within six days."<br /></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Inner perimeter and core can mean quite a lot given a Federation spread across 8000 light-years, especially when worlds like Trebus in the DMZ were thousands of light-years from Earth. <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Shik</b> <br /><small>Member # 343</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,9,1,52,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 09, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">01:52 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> The implication was intended that they meant Earth, but either way, I wasn't going to abide by that distance anyway.<br /><br />I might just invest in one of those 3D printing pens one day to build a more accurate map when I'm done with all this. <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Guardian 2000</b> <br /><small>Member # 743</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,9,3,20,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 09, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">03:20 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Maybe this will get you started . . . <br /><br /><a href="http://bathsheba.com/crystal/starmap/" target="_blank">http://bathsheba.com/crystal/starmap/</a> <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Shik</b> <br /><small>Member # 343</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2017,3,9,4,28,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">April 09, 2017</span> <span class="timeformat-0">04:28 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> That's kinda neat. <br /> </font> </td></tr> </table></td></tr></table> <br /> <br />
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