So here are the first plot specifics of "Fusion", an interesting-sounding romp into the secretive world of Vulcans. And what attracts my attention? The revelations about Surak's philosophy? The dark secrets of T'Pol's youth? The intriguing design of the Vulcan ship?
If you voted for "Yridians", consider yourself a winner. In TNG, these people were described as secretive information merchants, and a few were mentioned but only one seen up close. In VOY, we learned that Captain Ransom had actually made first contact with them, when everybody else thought they were extinct. So one would think that before Ransom reached at least his early twenties (and could be assumed to have had a leading position in a team that re-encountered the Yridians), the Feds had no contact with Yridian nationals and indeed believed the race to be dead.
Why? How? When? Are the Yridians "dead" already, and T'Pol and her fellow Vulcans are keeping the truth under wraps? Or will something horrible happen in the near future? What if anything will the humans find out about the Yridians?
With the Malurian and Axanari references, I think the writers knew exactly what they were doing. The Encyclopedia entries on them are simple enough, and the original references from TOS are basically confined to single episodes. With the Yridians, I'm less convinced that the writers are on top of the thing.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Hey, isn't that funny.. ShirKahr is also Spocks hometown (a la "Yesteryear"). ShirKahr as capitol of Vulcan?
quote: .. younger T'Pol with longer hair and civilian clothing appears working a scanner. She looks over her shoulder to see if anyone is watching and then starts to remove her clothing! We then cut back to her running in a corridor, and then back again to the forest with a discreet angle as a naked T'Pol descends into the hot spring.
Oh boy, here we go again...
quote: T'Pol was awarded a fellowship at the institute of Yridia Prime as an adolescent
Hmm.. Not only do they know the homeworld of the Yridians, but they even have an institute there. I hope they have changed that name in the final product, because this will cause some ripples in continuity.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:With the Malurian and Axanari references, I think the writers knew exactly what they were doing. The Encyclopedia entries on them are simple enough, and the original references from TOS are basically confined to single episodes. With the Yridians, I'm less convinced that the writers are on top of the thing.
I've never, EVER felt that the writers are on top of things where TOS references go. They just seem to try to name-drop obscure TOS references without really knowing where they came from or researching any background info. Just take the two examples Timo gave.
The Axanar could have been any other alien race who have been shown once & never again. There's no real background info as to what might eventually cause the big 23rd century battle in which their planet was named, unless there's a future Enterprise episode with them.
The Malurians appear to have technology clearly superior to 22nd century humans, with large, well-armed warp capable warships. Yet according to "The Changeling" they are a much more primitive society under study by a Federation science team. According to their depiction in ENT, Nomad would have been no match for them. Unless of course their society suffered some kind of technological regression, anywhere between the 22nd to 23rd centuries, to the point where they couldn't adequately defend their planet.
Plus, now they've shown the Coridans. Was anyone else disappointed that they again were just humanoids with bumps on their foreheads, and that IMO they'll not be shown again? Plus, they have the most advanced shipyards in the quadrant, with ships that can go warp 8. Presumably they become even more advanced 100 years later. So what possible incentive would they have for even joining the Federation? What would they get out of it? Other people using their stuff?
Yet look at how fast TPTB are bringing in TNG races. The Nausicaans, the Ferengi, the TNG'ed Klingons. I suppose it's more of a matter of "write about what you know" instead of doing some real research into TOS.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
I'm most intrigued by the fact that we seem to hear the Vulcan's "real" name in this one...
As to Enterprise vs. TOS, I'd have to agree with Timo here. I strongly suspect we'll be seeing, or at least hearing about, Coridan again. Demanding that the Axanar be nothing but a signifier for some future event strikes me as wrongheaded. And the fact that a few Malurians had a fancy (for the time period) starship does not mean they are representative of their species. (Even though Star Trek has a somewhat embarrassing track record when it comes to homogeneity within alien species.) More to the point, the Enterprise itself was essentially powerless against Nomad, and they were worried about the thing getting to Federation worlds. How does it follow from this that the Malurians, who certainly need not be more advanced than the 23rd century UFP, should have been able to stop the thing?
I suspect I'll be greeted with the usual response, that I hate Star Trek and am totally uncritical of Enterprise and eat babies and secrectly play the Golden Girls RPG. But I'm just saying.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
What, you claim you don't do those things?
Anyway, I'm not sure that we hear the Vulcan name for "Vulcan" at all. It's possible that those words actually mean "without logic" and the "Vulcans" is just implied. After all, if the roles were reversed between humans and Vulcans, would you expect to hear one of the Terrans say "You're without logic!" or "You're humans without logic!"?
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
quote: Plus, they have the most advanced shipyards in the quadrant, with ships that can go warp 8.
Was this not a joke by Archer to bug trip?
Posted by targetemployee (Member # 217) on :
Axanar Mentioned in "Court Martial" and "Whom Gods Destroy". Described as scientists and philosophers. Fashioned a treaty that brought greater peace to the galaxy. Major battle fought at their world.
Coridans Mentioned in "Journey to Babel". System described as poor in technology and rich in minerals. (From the description, this system would appear to be equivalent to a 3rd world nation on Earth facing the same issue-stronger, richer nations coveting the resources of a weaker nation.)
Malurians Mentioned in "The Changeling". This species was found on several worlds in the system and numbered far less than our current world population. (I believe the number was ~4 billion were said to be in the system.)
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
And these are all individual Encyclopedia entries. Where do you think the writers would get these names from? The most likely way is that they look them up in the Encyclopedia, and then all the vital statistics of the race in question are there for them to see at a glance. It won't take more than a second for them to read them through. They may get excited and say "hey, let's expand on this" or say "uh, doesn't sound like the race I wanted" or then indifferently think "nothing of interest there, let's use them and *make* them interesting this time".
With Malurians and the like, this works just fine, because it's all there in the single paragraph. With something like the Yridians, the contradictions and complications are not spelled out, though.
There's an alternate way to come up with these previously mentioned races, too. Perhaps the writer vaguely remembers an old episode and wants to expand on something he thinks was said or shown there. Again, he is likely to use the Encyclopedia to find out what it was, or then ask somebody who is in the know (and this somebody probably whips out the Encyclopedia then). It's unlikely that the writer would actually go and watch any tapes, at least not unless he's really really excited about this cool thing and wants to get it excatly right and has the spare time.
In this mechanism, the writer himself may end up not reading the fine print on the Encyclopedia entry. But starting from a vague memory of an actual episode sounds like a less likely alternative than just picking a random name from the book and checking if it can be used.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Or perhaps he just writes something like [insert alien name here] and someone grabs Bernd's T-Name Generator and invents a new alien race.
[ February 20, 2002, 01:40: Message edited by: Harry ]
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
!!!!!!
Did anyone else get two "Enterprise" repeats this week? Bright side: we get two new episodes next Wednesday!
Downside: Guess I'll miss "West Wing" ...
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
I got a Rockets game. I'm not very happy about that, since they were advertising Enterprise coming on right up until the Rockets theme started. It's all a conspiracy against me, I know it.
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
That was the game against the Bucks, right? Damn, that was sloppy. Michael Redd went to town in the 4th, scoring 26. Sheeooott. And went for 5 straight tre's from downtown. Houston's the bitzotch. 115-76. That's Milwaulkee in the gosh dangit house.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
The Rockets haven't been "in the zone" since that shortened-by-the-lockout season several years ago. It's been all downhill since those championship wins. The Rockets were managing to do a bit better here lately, but it looks like the slump is starting again. It's really hurting them to not have Steve Francis in there in top form.
Posted by Michael_T (Member # 144) on :
I just saw part of the new episode trailer. Am I dreaming or is T'Pol in bed with Reed?
Posted by USS Vanguard (Member # 130) on :
Stevey's getting some medical tests done. Can't play when he's got those massive migraines. Hopefully it'll get better.
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
One new and one rerun next week, I think.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
I got two re-runs yesterday, and I'm pretty sure I heard that I'm getting two new ones next Wednesday. Rock on!
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Startrek.com says it's "Fusion" and "Cold Front" next week.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
"Cold Fusion?" That's just a Russian myth. Pshaw.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
Including Fusion, we've got ten episodes to the end of the season (assuming a 26-episode season, that is). Wow. Hard to believe its moved this fast!
Posted by Michael_T (Member # 144) on :
But wait no one answered my question: Who is T'Pol in bed with?
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
A Vulcan. Didn't you see his ears?
Posted by Michael_T (Member # 144) on :
I couldn't see who was under T'Pol, so no.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
Try taking half a minute and doing some research. Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
What's this about two Enterprise episodes a week? Did I miss a new one last week? Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
Nope. Both episodes that aired last week were reruns.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
*phew*
But is this two episodes a week thing going to continue? With possibly two new episodes back-to-back?
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
Now that the episode's ran, I'll just point out that these rumours about T'Pol stripping down in the hot springs and Yridians and all that were way out-there. *shrug*
Posted by Michael_T (Member # 144) on :
Was that Jazz bar she entered in her dream called the Pon Farr? I couldn't really tell.
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
Yes it sounded like a Jazz bar called Fusion. Very strange that T'pol has never heard of a mind meld. Didn't Spock mention in Amok Time that he and T'pring had formed a bond at their sort of betrothal, and Spock also was asked to give the preistess his thoughts at the end of his Kolinar training in TMP. Even his brother Sybock had no problem using it and he obviously never made it through Kolinar, so this must have been fairly common in Spocks time I can't believe that it was not commonly known in T'pol's. I liked the fat Vulcan though.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
I guess there are more varieties to Vulcan touch telepathy than just the mind meld. The varieties used for childhood bonding or deathbed katra-dumping or for sex would not count as "mind melds", not in the sense of communication or interrogation that Spock or Tuvok used them.
T'Pol would probably balk at the mere suggestion of a connection between the proposed mind meld and any of the above three variants. As in, "you suggest we PLAY CHILDREN?" or "you suggest we PLAY DEAD?" or "you suggest we PLAY PON FARR?"...
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
I was not refering to katra giving but in TMP she asked for Spocks thoughts which would be a mind meld.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Sarek said the same thing to Kirk in ST3 ("KIRK! I MUST have your thoughts. Will you allow me to join your mind?") Was that not a meld, or perhaps Sarek dabbles in psychiatry in his off-hours?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Bear in mind, of course, that TOS and the movies are more than a century after ENT. Now, it seems kind of strange that mild-melds would go from being used for three specific occasions to being relatively common practice in just that time. However, I believe that's what people are trying to say happened.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
I'm not sure if being inspected by High Masters of Kolinahr should count as a "common occurrence". And being frisked by an emotionally fraught Vulcan father might be a rare situation, too.
But there's no question that mind melds are a common occurrence in the 24th century, where Tuvok uses them with abandon for both tactical gain and therapy. Perhaps they have also become somewhat "secularized" in that era. Tuvok reveals in "Innocence" that the excistence of the katra is not universally accepted by Vulcans. Perhaps a sacred rite dealing with katra transfer becomes less sacred and more pragmatically utilizable if you don't believe in a katra...
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Well, Spock himself seems to have a hard-on for melding with alien intelligences--the horta, Eminians, Nomad. The best line comes from A.C. Crispin's "Time For Yesterday"--
"Damn it, Spock! This is the second time you've pulled this stunt! First V'GeEr, now the Guardian!I swear, if you ever sneak off to try mind-melding with an alien intelligence again, I'm going to boot you out the nearest airlock without a suit! We'll see if keelhauling is possible in space! Understand?"
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