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A starship by any other name...
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<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="1" width="95%" align="center"> <tr bgcolor="#234c6f"><td> <table border="0" width="100%" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="1"> <tr bgcolor="#234c6f"> <td colspan="2" align="left"> <font size="3" color="#FFFFFF" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>T O P I C ��� R E V I E W</b> </font></td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>TSN</b> <br /><small>Member # 31</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2000,4,22,0,39,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">May 22, 2000</span> <span class="timeformat-0">12:39 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Remember the E-nil's dedication plaque? It said the ship was "starship-class". Why not <I>Constitution</I>-class? My favorite theory is that, at the time the dedication plaque was put in the ship, "starship" was a specific classification of ship, like "transport" or "scout" or "frigate", &c., rather than being what we now call "class" (i.e. named for the prototype ship). By this theory, we would have to presume that sometime just before or during TOS, the "starship" classification was dropped, and the ships became something else (the E-nil became a "heavy cruiser", for example). Also, the word "class" took on its current meaning (current both today, literally, and in the "present-day" of Trek).<P>Now, why do I bring this up? Well, I just saw "Relics" again (or, at least, the second half; <I>Red Dwarf</I> was on at the same time as the first part...). When Scotty is on the holodeck E-nil bridge, talking to Picard, he says he served on (I think I got this right) "freighters, cruisers, starships...". Now, to me, this would seem to confirm the idea that "starship" was once a classification, rather than just a generic term.<P>Thoughts?<P>------------------<BR>"Numerous painful experiences can be caused by having (and especially using) a large penis."<BR>-J. Ralf Lenz, president, Large Penis Support Group<p>[This message has been edited by TSN (edited May 22, 2000).] <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>AndrewR</b> <br /><small>Member # 44</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2000,4,22,2,56,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">May 22, 2000</span> <span class="timeformat-0">02:56 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Or it might have still been a Constitution class, and that dedication plaques from that time only stated, Starship, freighter etc...<P>OR that the constitution class ships might have been the first class of ships to be deemed actual Starships... who knows what they ACCURATELY define a Starship as? Maybe, a ship that is capable of a five year mission?<P>Andrew<P>------------------<BR>"Who wouldn't be the one you love <BR> Who wouldn't stand inside your love." - <I>Stand Inside Your Love</I>, The Smashing Pumpkins<P> <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>TSN</b> <br /><small>Member # 31</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2000,4,22,20,36,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">May 22, 2000</span> <span class="timeformat-0">08:36 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Regarding that first thing you said... That's what I'm saying. It was still <i>Constitution</i>-class, as we define "class" now, but the dedication plaque only reflected what sort of ship it was (cruiser, starship, scout, &c.), and happened to use the word "class".<P>------------------<BR>"Numerous painful experiences can be caused by having (and especially using) a large penis."<BR>-J. Ralf Lenz, president, Large Penis Support Group <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Timo</b> <br /><small>Member # 245</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2000,4,23,5,58,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">May 23, 2000</span> <span class="timeformat-0">05:58 AM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> There would seem to continue to be a difference between "starship" and "spacegoing vessel" in the TNG era and beyond. We hear in "Peak Performance" how the Ferengi are frightened when "A Federation ship approaches - a STARSHIP!". In "First Contact", it is a big event that halts all action aboard the Defiant when another STARSHIP approaches the battle zone that already has dozens of spaceships flying around.<P>"Starship" probably still is synonymous with a certain category of spacegoing vessels. This is probably much broader than "cruiser" or "frigate" - perhaps all these spaceships of military designation are collectively known as "starships" while freighters and tankers and the like are excluded? This would jibe with Scotty's comments in "Relics". It would also explain the Ferengi angst. <P>It would not be sufficient to explain "First Contact", though. Starship definitely sounded somehow special there, wrt the ships we saw. Perhaps only the Akiras in the battle were big enough to be considered "starships", and the probably constant arrival of reinforcement Sabres or Steamrunners was not equal to the spectacular arrival of a new true starship?<P>This would mean that military ships from certain size category up would be starships. Perhaps those above and including cruiser type? Then even an old Daedalus would fit the bill if she used to be a cruiser in her heyday.<P>Timo Saloniemi <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#A3B9CC"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>Dat</b> <br /><small>Member # 302</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2000,4,23,15,39,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">May 23, 2000</span> <span class="timeformat-0">03:39 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> Actually, I tend to think differently for the FC situation. Another starship, I think, just means another ship has come to help out in the battle, for which they were already losing. By that time, they'd be grateful for any additional ships that could help out, and not just the big "starships" to come.<P>------------------<BR>7 alarm clock: "Do not touch me."<BR>Dilbert: "Then how do I turn you off?"<BR>7: "Believe me, I am plenty turned off." <br /> </font> </td></tr> <tr bgcolor="#E5EAEF"> <td valign="top" width="18%"> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <b>TSN</b> <br /><small>Member # 31</small> </font></td> <td width="82%"> <font size="2" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> <img src="https://flare.solareclipse.net/posticon.gif" border="0" alt=" - " /> posted <script language="JavaScript1.3" type="text/javascript"> document.write(timestamp(new Date(2000,4,23,17,17,0), dfrm, tfrm, 0, 0, 0, 0)); </script><noscript><span class="dateformat-0">May 23, 2000</span> <span class="timeformat-0">05:17 PM</span></noscript><hr /> </font> <font size="3" face="Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> I don't even recall anything about the word "starship" in FC, so I don't know what the exact line was, but I agree it probably wasn't of any special importance. Perhaps saying it was a starship meant the difference between a good ship and another Borg ship.<P>As for the Ferengi, perhaps, in their language, they still have a classification that translates out as "starship", and it's separate from cruisers and frigates, and marauders, &c.<P>------------------<BR>"Numerous painful experiences can be caused by having (and especially using) a large penis."<BR>-J. Ralf Lenz, president, Large Penis Support Group <br /> </font> </td></tr> </table></td></tr></table> <br /> <br />
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