From another, this time rather negative review of that Star Trek Adventure thing the Brits have stolen from this continent, there's a surprising little gem:
"There were various LCARS displays on the walls (my favourite being the Wolf 359 tactical deployment)"
Th'hell? PICTURES!
Mark
Posted by Fleet-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
What the... is this something that Mike Okuda made back in 1990 or something made for this exhibit?
Posted by Starship Millennium (Member # 822) on :
Hmm... something tells me that this person is talking about a DS9 Dominion War display. It seems pretty odd we wouldn't have heard about it from Okuda or anyone by now...
But then again, didn't Mojo say that he was working on Wolf 359 stuff for Unseen Frontier? Maybe it's more salvaged material.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Nope. We didn't get around to any maps before the book was shelved.
Mark
Posted by Starship Millennium (Member # 822) on :
*Sigh...* What could've been... Posted by Proteus (Member # 212) on :
So, the guy is a total cheapskate and gives it a bad review because the desplays were dull... riiight.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Are any Flare operatives planning to go?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"So, the guy is a total cheapskate and gives it a bad review because the desplays were dull... riiight."
Or maybe it really does suck like he says.
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
NO! BUT IT CANT SUCK! IT'S STAR TREK, AND ANYTHING STAR TREK RULES THE ROOST! HOT STUFF! YES YES YES YES!
Nemesis was an excellent film.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Is it possible at all that he might be referring to this list from a plaque (?) or something that Spike talked about waaaay back when he first joined the board? That was before my time, but I remember reading about it at some point...
-MMoM Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
He mentioned Wolf 359, and I doubt he would have remembered that name if there wasn't a small sign next to the Okudagram saying "Wolf 359 display" or something. This excludes any Dominion War or Tachyon Grid Display (assuming the guys who are responsible for the exhibition didn't mess things up).
Posted by Identity Crisis (Member # 67) on :
The guy must have been blind to have missed the rather large Enterprise section.
Yes, there was a large Okudagram with a Wolf 359 display. Yes, I think it was the one that had been seen at the earlier exhibitions which is why I didn't mention it in my earlier round up of what was there. It was a sort of memorial to lost Starfleet vessels. Down the left hand side were ships like the Yamato and Stargazer with dates and details of how they were lost. Top right was a tactical display that was just some lines and arrows swooping around - totally uniformative. Bottom right was a three column list of ships lost at Wolf 359, the first column was mainly the ships we know about and the second and third columns were those made up for this display and as far as I can remember they were accuratly listed in the old thread already referenced.
Posted by newark (Member # 888) on :
Are these ships 'official', or do they fall into the same category assigned to ships mentioned in computer games, card games, and the like?
Posted by Dr. Phlox (Member # 878) on :
^ Well this hasn't been seen in an actual episode, so it probably does fall into the semi-canon encyclopedia footnote type area.
quote:Originally posted by Proteus: So, the guy is a total cheapskate and gives it a bad review because the desplays were dull... riiight.
That's what I thought when I read it. The guy spends a paragraph complaining about some credit card charge and then moans about seeing props and costumes in an exhibit of props and costumes. Clueless.
I'm certainly still looking forward to visiting.
Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
quote:Originally posted by Masao: Are any Flare operatives planning to go?
Don't look at me, I hate London...it smells funny.
Posted by Fleet-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
No, that's Paris.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"Are these ships 'official', or do they fall into the same category assigned to ships mentioned in computer games, card games, and the like?"
I'd say it falls in the same territory as fan fiction, but, then, that's where I'd put computer/card games and such, too.
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
quote:Originally posted by Reverend: Don't look at me, I hate London...it smells funny.
*chuckle* Animaniacs flashback: "The answer, my friends, is blowin' in the wind -- except in New Jersey, where what's blowing in the wind smells funny."
--Jonah
Posted by Identity Crisis (Member # 67) on :
These ship names fall into the same category as the U.S.S. Trinculo - material created for an exhibtion that has never, and almost certainly will never be seen on screen.
(As far as I could see the Trinculo isn't in the London exhibition, but the Leeds and Valkyrie are.)
The names show a lack of imagination and as there's no class, registry or design associated with any of them they don't really have much appeal.
Posted by Fleet-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
Ah, the imfamous Trinculo from the Planet Hollywood... too bad the hard drive where the pic was at became damaged in an earthquake.
Posted by newark (Member # 888) on :
Which Planet Hollywood is this? There are, or rather were, many Planet Hollywoods.
Many names in the canon Star Trek are, by their own merits, unimaginative. We have ships named after old naval vessels, heroic figures in history, obscure scientists, soldiers, geographical locations on Earth, and so on. These names on the Wolf 359 display adhere very closely to this tradition.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
quote:Originally posted by Identity Crisis: These ship names fall into the same category as the U.S.S. Trinculo - material created for an exhibtion that has never, and almost certainly will never be seen on screen.
I would just like to emphasize that even while there's no hard evidence of the Trinculo being in an episode, neither is there any that it was made up for an exhibition.
quote:Originally posted by TSN:
"Are these ships 'official', or do they fall into the same category assigned to ships mentioned in computer games, card games, and the like?"
I'd say it falls in the same territory as fan fiction, but, then, that's where I'd put computer/card games and such, too.
How can anything that's officially licensed be fan fiction? That's a contradiction in terms.
Posted by Identity Crisis (Member # 67) on :
quote:Originally posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim: [QUOTE]I would just like to emphasize that even while there's no hard evidence of the Trinculo being in an episode, neither is there any that it was made up for an exhibition.
Agree that it was never in an episode. But, what was it created for, if not an exhibition? Or does Planet Hollywood not count as an exhibition? Exhibitions don't need to charge huge entrance fees...
quote:How can anything that's officially licensed be fan fiction? That's a contradiction in terms.
If a fan writes an officially licensed novel then that's officially licensed fiction written by a fan. Sounds like officially licensed fan fiction to me. And gosh, what about fans who write episodes? The line is so thin it might as well not exist! Posted by Fleet-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
The picture was taken back in October 21, 1995. I went to the Planet Hollywood in Beverly Hills, CA for my mom's birthday. The funny thing is, someone else went there and posted their own pictures online. I found it in a website but unfortunately both my pics and my that person's were lost in an earthquate when the hard drive was crushed. I am still looking for the 35mm copies of mine. But it has been at least 7 years since I've seen them.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Well, don't keep us in suspense: wat kind of ship was it? Canon or kit-bash? Dammit: I'm a modeler, not a psychic!
Posted by Identity Crisis (Member # 67) on :
The Trinculo? It's a Galaxy class, NCC-71867. Sorry, I thought everyone had heard of it. Posted by Fleet-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
It was one of the 4 foot models. Just think of it as a redress of the Enterprise-D after Preemetive Strike.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Crap. I was hoping for something new.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
I'm still not convinced that it wasn't in a DS9 ep.
And about the whole "fan fiction" thing, I would say that that label along with "Fandom" denotes stuff that isn't officially licensed or condoned, as opposed to "Non-canon," which is stuff that's not necessarily a part of the continuity of the shows and films, but nevertheless was officially sanctioned in some way.
Posted by Fleet-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
I know at least four fully built 4 foot models of the Enterprise-D were built. One model was used as the USS Odessey and the other one was the TNG All Good Things model labeled USS Venture. Someone I met has an unbuilt Enterprise-D in his house since he was a freelance model maker for TNG, DS9, and Voyager before CGI came in.
Posted by Proteus (Member # 212) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN:
"So, the guy is a total cheapskate and gives it a bad review because the desplays were dull... riiight."
Or maybe it really does suck like he says.
Well he was complaining because it cost $28 to get it, i dunno, thats just sort of silly to me. He has obviously never been to a theme park or Las Vegas attraction or even the Experience. In fact the first friggen paragraph is all about how much he spent and how it was SO HORRIBLE AND AWFUL. Just takes away from his credibility
Additionally: check this out: cool huh?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
What's cool? That you know how to place inline images in your post? Whoopee...
And, personally, I wouldn't want to pay almost $30 for something like that, either. Maybe you should fly to London and see it for yourself before uninformedly, unilaterally declaring that the reviewer can't possibly know what he's talking about.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
Definitely not the rifle they actually use on the show. So did they tear through the archives redecorating old props and then picking the one they liked the best, I wonder? Leaving aside the whole "phaser pistol" issue.
I presume from the cards with numbers and a picture of a headphone on them that the exhibit hands out keen MP3 players with all the descriptions on them? (A museum development I wholeheartedly approve of, by the way.) I don't suppose anyone happened to remember what it said for this particular case?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
That looks cool as all hell! The sets are worth the price of admission alone. I wish I could go to see it....or that it would come to the US.
....the only silly thing: the Neg'Var is hung upside down!
Posted by Identity Crisis (Member # 67) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: I wish I could go to see it....or that it would come to the US.
It's in the US all the time. This is the travelling version of the permanent exhibition in Las Vegas. There will be differences but it's largely similar.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
I think the exhibition at ST Adventure is bigger and has more props than the one in Las Vegas. I've been there 1.5 years ago and I don't think the exhibition area was bigger than 70 m�.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Where would I find it's schedule? I DO want to see the Vegas version too....but that Bajoran Orb and case has to come home with me!
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
...Not to mention the fact that not everyone in the US lives near Las Vegas... Posted by Akira (Member # 850) on :
dont know if this was posted yet
Posted by Identity Crisis (Member # 67) on :
Hey, a couple of years ago I flew to Las Vegas for the weekend, from London. So no one in the US as any exscuse.
It was for a stag 'night' and it did wipe out most of my savings, but hey it was Vegas, in a weekend, from London....
Posted by SoundEffect (Member # 926) on :
That's a very cool pic!
I can see on the left-hand side there's a listing of 17 starships. Each 3 line entry has the starship name, NCC number, and another line of information (probably not class name as some entries are long and more than two words.)
There's a sector number at the top...wish I could read that!
Posted by Styrofoaman (Member # 706) on :
Nice. No chance of getting a "better" shot?
I'd love to see this in person... Prehaps it's time to take the wife back to Ireland for a week... While she's there, I can skip over to London for a bit. Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Is that the ship list next to the graphic at the left?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
The 39-count ship list is at the lower right. "Starship Losses at Wolf 359".
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Holy poo, this is great! Someone should ask Okuda if he knows anything about it.
Any speculation as to what the orange and yellow lines represent? Perhaps the courses of the cub and or fleets? If so, and if the white dots are starships, then it confirms the notion that the attack came in waves...
Mark
Posted by CaptainMike (Member # 709) on :
well, the graphic has the "starfleet command" logo on it, and i dont believe that was devised anywhere before the DS9 war arcs.. so this is an after the fact graphic.. add to that that its done in movie-era okudagrams, not accurate to the period. it does look nice though.
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
I think that graphic debuted in "Homefront"
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
I assume you mean the SF Command logo, and not the full Okudagram?
Posted by Fleet-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
SC Logo did appear from DS9's Homefront. Along with Erika Benteen and Admiral "I can run things better than the Federation Council" Leyton.
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
Erm, silly me. I meant that SC logo.
Posted by Proteus (Member # 212) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN: What's cool? That you know how to place inline images in your post? Whoopee...
And, personally, I wouldn't want to pay almost $30 for something like that, either. Maybe you should fly to London and see it for yourself before uninformedly, unilaterally declaring that the reviewer can't possibly know what he's talking about.
Meh, I guess your right, I just have a thing against people who make such a big deal about spending money. And before you say OMG LEARN TEH VALUE OF DOLLAR, I know.
I heard that "the ST Adventure is bigger and has more props than the one in Las Vegas", if thats the case, its certainly worth a mere $30 to get in.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
If you're lucky I will actually go and see this exhibition thing, in which case I'll try my hardest to get a photo of the list. I just hope you'll realise what a sacrifice it'll be on my part, given the negative reviews and all.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
quote:I heard that "the ST Adventure is bigger and has more props than the one in Las Vegas", if thats the case, its certainly worth a mere $30 to get in.
Well, Las Vegas wasn't worth the $25.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
Upon looking at this photo & other concept drawings of the NX-01 by John Eaves, I have to wonder if he has ever actually seen an episode of TOS. Especially in the second concept, he seems to think that a vessel, which came 100 years before Kirk's Enterprise, should for some reason look almost exactly like Picard's Enterprise-E 200 years later, the only difference being the Cochrane-Phoenix nacelles. No wonder Drexler ended up using the Akira as a template - Eaves gave him the idea! Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
Looks more like the Ambassador-class IMO. Especially the front view.
Posted by Bernd (Member # 6) on :
This is a list of starships from the display at the exhibition, sent to me by Adrian Jones:
quote:Starships are: Klondike, Estaban, Watley, Volga, Tokyo, Everest, Maxwell, Gauss, Neptune, Vega, Pioneer, Nepal, Popovich, Falcon, Gemini, Vandenberg, Pueblo, Zetar, Peking, Beagle, Brahms, Rixx, Solaris, Khumbu, Shimoda, Marco Polo, Gage, Kyushu, Liberator, Melbourne, Saratoga, Tolstoy, Roosevelt, Ahwahnee, Bellerophon, Bonestell, Buran, Chekov and Princeton. Lalo is incorrectly listed instead of Liberator [taken from a shuttle from the scene]. And of course Endeavour was the only survivor.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Okay, so extracting the new names from that list:
Klondike Estaban - For Captan J.T. Eseban of the Grissom? Watley - For an Enterprise medical tech? Volga - For the river. Later a runabout. Tokyo Everest Maxwell - Probably NOT for Benjamin Maxwell of the Phoenix Gauss - For the magnetic dude Neptune Vega - Star about 26 ly away. Subject of Isaac Asimov's novel "Contact" Pioneer Nepal Popovich Falcon Gemini - For the constellation or spacecraft series Vandenberg - USAF space launch facility in CA Pueblo Zetar - The lights of, and the only "alien" name in this list Peking Beagle - Darwin's ship. Also in a TOS episode. Brahms - Likely NOT for Leah Brahms Rixx - For the captain of the Thomas Paine? Solaris Khumbu Shimoda Marco Polo
quote: Maxwell - Probably NOT for Benjamin Maxwell of the Phoenix
Maybe after the makers of a certain hot beverage?
quote: Zetar - The lights of, and the only "alien" name in this list
Other than the Rixx, don't you mean?
quote: Rixx - For the captain of the Thomas Paine?
I wouldn't have thought so, not unless he died in the few years between "Conspiracy" and BoBW. For all we know Rixx could be a fairly common Bolian family name or the good captain might have a famous ancestor.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
The Sacred Chalice of Rixx? From Betazed?
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
quote:Maxwell - Probably NOT for Benjamin Maxwell of the Phoenix
Well, Wolf 359 took place before Captain Maxwell went off the deep end...
quote:Vega - Star about 26 ly away. Subject of Isaac Asimov's novel "Contact"
Um, "Contact" was written by Carl Sagan! Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
quote:Originally posted by Shik: The Sacred Chalice of Rixx? From Betazed?
Good point! Perhaps Rixx is a city on Betazed, maybe a temple or even an ancient religious figure or deity (ancient Bolian contact perhaps? ). On the other hand Rixx could just as easily be the name of a 21st century Tellarite philosipher or the Klingon word for a kind of green putty that can be found in one's armpit one mid-summer morning.
Posted by TheF0rce (Member # 533) on :
Upon looking at this photo & other concept drawings of the NX-01 by John Eaves, I have to wonder if he has ever actually seen an episode of TOS. Especially in the second concept, he seems to think that a vessel, which came 100 years before Kirk's Enterprise, should for some reason look almost exactly like Picard's Enterprise-E 200 years later, the only difference being the Cochrane-Phoenix nacelles. No wonder Drexler ended up using the Akira as a template - Eaves gave him the idea!
Good lord my neck hurts now...
Anyway wow, I don't really see a single original concept up there. The very first thing on top [err to the left] looks like the sovi's captain's yacht.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Looks like my brain is working wackbards this morning. I seem to be celebrating this new year's a bit too hard.
Sagan. Rixx. Zetar. Got it.
Mark
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Wouldn't it make the most sense if the Maxwell were named for James Clerk Maxwell, the physicist?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: Okay, so extracting the new names from that list: Gauss - For the magnetic dude
Err, I think you mean the Mathematics dude.
Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
Klondike - Didn't Uhura mention that guy in ST3? The inventor of the transwarp-drive? Brahms - probably the musician Solaris - Stanislaw Lem's novel (and a bad Clooney-movie)? Shimoda - wasn't that the name of the chief engineer of the E-D in one of the early episodes? Khumbu - according to google a region near the Everest in Nepal (sounds reasonable since Everest and Nepal are on that list, too) Popovich - early Cosmonaut Pavel Popovich?
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
quote:Klondike - Didn't Uhura mention that guy in ST3? The inventor of the transwarp-drive?
That was Thorndyke. And Uhura only mentions him in the German dubbing.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Is that something that was cut from the original!?! Why would they just add extra dialogue in there like that?
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
English:
UHURA Would you look at that!
German:
UHURA Nicht zu fassen. Thorndykes Idee. (Unbelievable. Thorndyke's idea.)
quote:Why would they just add extra dialogue in there like that?
You'd be surprised, if you knew what they did with TOS and TAS. The dubbing is horrible.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
So mabye TAS does'nt suck in another language? It sure sucks in english.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
quote:So mabye TAS does'nt suck in another language?
The original version is brillant compared to the German dubbing. Spock tells jokes in every episode.
Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
quote:Originally posted by Spike:
quote:So mabye TAS does'nt suck in another language?
The original version is brillant compared to the German dubbing. Spock tells jokes in every episode.
And every episode's just about 15 minutes long. They cut more than 10 minutes for whatever reason, sometimes deleting whole subplots or creating a totally new story out of the remains. None of the figures has the same voice actor as his/her counterpart in TOS, Arex sounds like he's suffering from lung cancer and M'Ress like a girl from a sex hotline. I haven't seen the original TAS (in fact, I haven't even seen many of the german version either), but how bad it may ever be in the original version, the german version is worse.
And where the hell did they get the name Thorndyke anyway? That's not just changing the dialogue a little bit, that a concrete information they give a way for a reason.
Oh, and did anyone ask someone with more information on the list yet?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
It's the germans retaliating for that whole "nazi episode" thing. Posted by Akira (Member # 850) on :
Any new info yet????
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
quote:Originally posted by Akira: Any new info yet????
Not sure what you mean. I doubt there's really any "new info" to get. It boils down to the same thing it always has: It was a display created for the exhibition, by the exhibition. No canonical value whatsoever.
For the most part (on this board, anyway): non-canon = not important
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Clueless.![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
cool huh?
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