Tonight we have Andorians and Tellarites and Romulans. Oh my! Looking for:
-More on the revelation that the Romulans are operating their ships by remote control, via some VR interface. A clever way of getting around the "never seen a Romulan" thing, but how are we stretching practicality here? How easy would it be to scramble or jam transmissions, when they figure it out?
-Plenty on Tellarite culture. Unto the present on this series, we've only really seen them once (though heard of them several times)... This time we should get a real look at who they are and how they'll figure into the founding of the Federation.
-What's ordering the Enterprise to ferry the two other species around in the first place. Are we to see some of Starfleet's new direction and goal in the local area?
-Perhaps not in this episode (certainly in the next), but Remans! The OTHER reason we didn't see Romulans around now - we see these guys instead, in anotehr stroke of cleverness. Will we see these guys developped as more than the rather dumbish aliens from "Nemesis"? What about their rare telepahtic abilities - which may come into play in this trilogy?
-And if not Remans, then the Romulans themselves - culture and especially tech, and look for tidbits that will echo their future TOS appearances. Look out for uniforms and costumes recycled from "Nemesis", as last seen in "Kir'Shara". Perhaps the Romulan style from this era comes back in vogue in two hundred years...
Mark
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
They're getting better at these three-parters. It's a solid opening act, and I hope this one follows through.
-Timestamp: November 12, 2154.
-Tellar Prime is where we begin proper. Tellarites enjoy mudbaths, trading insults, and view puppies as delicacies.
-Androrian hulls are composed of duranium. Shran's ship, the combat-tested Kumari, had a crew of 86 - 19 survived, including the sexy Lt. Talas. This places them, crew-wise, roughly on-par with Enterprise. Shran had been in command of the Kumari for twelve years... And she was the first of her class. Finally, an Andorian ship class name!
-Andorian ale has quite a kick.
-Andoian warship weakness: a direct hit to their shield generators should take them out. This one doesn't, though - it's strangely more powerful than normal, as was the Tellarite ship that took out the Kumari... Curiouser still, they have identical power signatures.
-The Tellarite ship is a re-use of the Xindi Arboral ship from last season, and IIRC it's been seen as something else before that as well.
-Yep, the Romulans are using the EXACT same uniforms from "Nemesis". The remote control setup seems to include a motorcycle helmet.
-Tracking the evil Andorian ship, we're led to a curious greenish, insectoid craft equipped with lots of subspace antennae as well as "multi-spectral emitters", which create the illusion of a different kind os ship. It's a maneuverable little bugger too, but is equipped only with very strong hull plating.
-In the ensuing battle, it becomes pretty apparent that the Romulan "chameleon" doesn't have any inertial damners, as the away team gets jostled around pretty strongly in the cramped confines.
-Enterprise has had an injector upgrade, allowing a new maximum (and stable!) top speed of warp 5.06 or more. The chameleon apparently can't keep up.
-Trapped on the chameleon, Trip and Malcolm weave their way through the ship, which seems to be little more than a collection of Jeffries tubes - not even a life support system is apparent. As an in-joke, Malcolm says that there's no rule that the bridge HAS to be on the top of the ship.
-The MACO guarding Shran and Talas actually puts up a good fight, knocking down Shran before Talas takes him out. Still, you'd think he'd call the bridge or something...
-The camera moves in the gun fight (and the space battle) are quite impressive. The quickness and sharpness is actually a quality of the digital camera process, I believe.
-Our cliffhanger happens when Trip and Malcolm finally find the bridge, revealing it to be a copy of the one the Romulans were seen in. There's a nice dramatic pullback that establishes the capital city... And it looks like IT doesn't change much in 200 years, either.
Mark
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Some interesting stuff. The remote control ship definatly helps the 'never seen a romulan' stuff. The chameleon ship also seems very sneaky Romulan.
As for the Nemisis uniforms... it looks like they may be using the Nemisis Romulan logo too...
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Couldn't they invent a new one!?!
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Can't add much to Mark's tech analysis, but I must say that this was one fucking great episode, and I can't wait for the next two chapters.
I've finally written a letter to Les Moonves showing my support for the show, and all I can say is that I hope plenty of others are doing the same. Here's to a fifth season!
-MMoM Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Who do we write letters to? I actually might just do that for Enterprise. I feel Enterprise is going to be a DS9 like show - I remember when everyone thought it was the worst show especially the worst Trek! (I loved it from Emissary - so I was dismayed at that reaction). Now everyone considers DS9 to be the mature/classy Trek. I feel Enterprise will eventually be a series the most come to enjoy - even if it might be after the series has finished.
I say go for season 8 for Enterprise - seriously.
So who is this Les Moonves and who and where do I write to (somewhere that will make a difference).
At the same time I'd also write a letter asking for Rick Berman and Brannon Braga (well at least Brannon Braga to be removed from the paramount lot!) Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
All you need to know is here: www.saveenterprise.com Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Thanks, do you think it's worth writing? Anyone else plan to?
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Pretty good episode, but I'm not so sure about the way Romulans are portrayed here. First of all, that organic zippy chameleon ship did not even look remotely Romulan (it didn't resemble anything, really). And what's with the reuse of EVERYTHING from Nemesis? The city, the uniforms, the emblems.
The Romulan villains in this ep were not particularly interesting. They might as well have not shown them AT ALL. Can anyone remember even ONE LINE from the villains in this episode?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
"They've entered the bridge".
But in three-act tradition, the bad guys are typically glossed over here. They'll doubtless have more substance starting next epsiode.
Mark
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Harry: The ship was obviously an advanced prototype designed for a specific purpose, not something from their general design lineage. Also, I like the way they're being kept mysterious and not overly-exposed (both to the audience and the characters) at this point. Mark makes a good point about this only being the introductory act, also. It's like saying the Dominion was "not particularly interesting" in DS9 seasons two & three.
Legitimate gripe about the Nemesis stuff, I guess, but for some reason it doesn't seem to bother me. Three reasons, really. (1) The story was great and the directing was tight, and I never had the chance to be distracted by it. (2) This has always happened on all the Trek shows; it has to do with the time and budget constrictions of a weekly TV series, and perhaps in this case one that is already in jeopardy. Something's gotta give, and I for one am glad it's something a inconsequential as what the Romulans are wearing as opposed to a more integral element. (3) In re Romulus, how much different could it be anyway? I mean, how much did San Francisco change between the 22nd and 24th centuries? (4) Not that I generally approve of such excuses, but Nemesis was a shit movie and, like, NOBODY saw it anyway.
Andrew: By all means. That site's been up for at least a year or two, and one has to assume that some people are doing this on their own. The reason I never bothered before now is that I never really considered cancellation as a serious threat before this season. But better late than never. But remember, time grows short!
-MMoM Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
I thought of a couple of points on re-viewing:
-- Tellar and Andoria are 5 days apart at whatever speed the NX-01 is traveling.
-- Tellarites use "particle cannons" as ship-mounted weapons.
-- The Andorians and Tellarites have been feuding for over a century.
-- The clue that the Romulan ship is Romulan is the beridium matrix in its power cells, somewhat similar to those on the mines from back in "Minefield."
-- Romulan maneuvering thrusters utilize liquid hydrogen and oxygen as fuel.
-- I think this is the first time reference has been made to Malcolm's attraction to T'Pol as established in "Shuttlepod One."
-- The Romulan vessel's camoflauge system works with a series of holographic projectors along its hull. Kind of advanced for the era, eh? It uses tri-phasic emitters to simulate various kinds of weaponry.
-- While it no doubt is the same CGI environment, are we sure that some of the buildings in the Romulan capital haven't been altered/added/deleted when compared with Nemesis? For some reason it looked subtly different to me...
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim: Mark makes a good point about this only being the introductory act, also. It's like saying the Dominion was "not particularly interesting" in DS9 seasons two & three.
Ahhh but season three DS9 was FULL ON Dominion!!
And the Romulan uniforms in Nemesis were a continuation of the uniforms brought in for the Romulans in Deep Space Nine - I think it was in "Improbable Cause"/The Die Is Cast" two-parter.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Well I'm through disc 5 of the 7 in the third season set now, and all I've seen of the Dominion thus far is "The Search" two parter, one Jem'Hadar in "The Abandoned," and one Founder in "Heart of Stone." All the rest is just them saying "The Dominion may be about to come through the wormhole any time!"
So far. Don't give anything away. Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
OK, but really The Dominion in those seasons is more of a psychological enemy at the same time. They after all didn't declare war until the end of season 5!
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Right, I know that. And I'm saying that it's like the Romulans in this season of ENT. Which is a good thing. Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
How did I find this pic so fast? Because the ship is just a re-use of the "Flea" ship from some half-rate Voyager episode. The only two differences are that the Romulan version has holo-emitters on the hull, and the color is green (although, strangely, it's the olive-green color of Klingon ships rather than the lime-green color of the Romulan ships in "Minefield" and the D'Deridexes). So that explains why this ship doesn't even look vaguely Romulan.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Which means that this episode really features no new designs at all. >.<;;
"The Fight"? That's the Chakotay Boxing episode. Wierd, I don't even remember there being another ship in that episode. Given its placement in Voyager though, at the time it was probably a lower-res ship seen in the background or something. Give it new textures, a few new roundish emmitters, and voila! No one will notice.
Mark
Posted by Neutrino 123 (Member # 1327) on :
I find it strange that Enterprise did reasonably well fighting the Romulan Fleaship, which had no problem destroying two Imperial Guard ships...
The photon torpedoes seem to give Enterprise parity with the supposedly more advanced races.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Hey, I just downloaded the preview for "United" seen at the end of the UPN broadcast of this episode. It's not exactly a spoiler, but it gives us something to look forward to. Towards the beginning of the preview, there's a shot of Enterprise surrounded by Vulcan, Andorian, and Tellarite ships. There's a familiar and long-missed design in the lower left.
About FREAKING time, man.
Mark
Posted by MarianLH (Member # 1102) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: There's a familiar and long-missed design in the lower left.
An Ambassador?
Marian
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
Now that's funny.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Okay! Woo! I just finished watching "Babel One" - OMG It was FANTASTIC! WOO!
Yes, yes - everything everyone has said above. Loved it all.
References to T'Pol's marriage. Reed liking her bum. Romulans, Tellarites, Vulcans, Humans, Denobulans, Andorians! WOO!
That pull back was FANTASTIC. For a moment there I thought they may have stumbled into either an alternate bridge or one that was some-how out of phase with the real one that Trip and Reed stumbled into.
BOTH Romulan Logos were seen!! The TNG Blue and Green (superior one I might add) was seen on bulk-heads etc. The Nemesis design was etched into the bulkhead. Maybe it's more of a Emperial Seal sort of thing?
When they mentioned why the Romulans cared about disrupting talks between Andorians and Tellarites - I thought "future guy!" for a split second!
Tellarites - they were great - they have REALLY fleshed out this species in just one episode. GREAT!
Anyone catch the reference by Shran to "spouses"? Remember Andorians have a weddings that involve 4 people! The creators have done their homework people!
Enterprise is GREAT!
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Well, I'm not so sure it was meant to refer to the Andorian foursome wedding so much as he meant that more than one of his 86 crew was married, and he knew their spouses.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Well it's nice to believe that that is what they were referring to.
Posted by SoundEffect (Member # 926) on :
I think it was in the StarTrek.com's synopsis and cast list, although not revealed yet, that the Romulan commander played by Brian Thompson, will be named 'Valdore', yet another of the many Nemesis references in this episode arc. ...so that's who they name their newest Warbird's after...
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Or at least another person with the name Valdore.
Brian Thompson makes another appearance on a sci-fi show.
OK I remember him being on Trek as a Klingon, Crusade as that genetically altered guy, The X-Files as the Alien Bounty hunter.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
I'm sure we've previously had the discussion of just how many science fiction appearances Brian Thompson has made.
If we're lucky, the Romulan holoship's origin will be left obscure, and we can assume they stole it from somewhere, thus explaining its appearance.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Brian Thompson was also the alien wanting Kira in a holonovel in "Rules of Acquisition" and a Jem'Hadar in "To The Death". He's also been on Charmed and Birds of Prey.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:If we're lucky, the Romulan holoship's origin will be left obscure, and we can assume they stole it from somewhere, thus explaining its appearance.
Unfortunately, the second Romulan stated that the ship was a prototype, implying that it is, in fact, a Romulan vessel.
Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
Unfortunate that the Romulan know a little thing called "function over form"? From the sounds of it this thing is highly specialised, so its uniqueness is quite appropriate.
Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
Since I guess this one will not see the end of the current trilogy, the Romulans will probably build more of these ships. They will become a part of the fleet and, at some point in the future, one of these ships will encounter the badlands, where a strange energy beam transports it to the Delta Quadrant. They begin their journey home but are intercepted by a yet unknown species. They kill the Romulans and copy their - from the aliens' point of view - advanced technology. Years later, the Starfleet ship Voyager encounters the same species but fails to recognize the ships, either because of the heavy modifications or because the data gathered 200 years earlier is still classified (or was lost).
And tomorrow I'll tell you why the Lysian commad station and the Edo god look the same. Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
That's easy: the Lyssian's ARE the Edo gods: the Lyssians are an incredibly advanced race the occasionally assumes physical form to re-enact famous moments from their history: kind of like Ciil War enthusaiasts.
Or the Edo were themselves an incredibly advanced race that enjoy sex with lesser species and act dumb to attract them.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
And both the Xindi and the Tellarites have bought cruisers from the Arkonians?
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
No, the Xindi and the Arkonians bought them from the Tellarites Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Topher: Brian Thompson was also the alien wanting Kira in a holonovel in "Rules of Acquisition" and a Jem'Hadar in "To The Death". He's also been on Charmed and Birds of Prey.
Birds of Prey - hehe nice connection.
No no, he was that red-guy who Quark was trying to make a deal with - the Dosi I think the species was.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov: And tomorrow I'll tell you why the Lysian commad station and the Edo god look the same.
Can you also explain why the Vidiians and the species from "Transfigurations" have a variant of the Tellerite plague ship? (without the large ball). Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
The Terelians were said to be hunted down wherever they popped up in the Galaxy, so it would make sense that the Vidiians and the other guys both encountered the Terellians and integrated their ships into their fleets. The Sphere in the middle is an escape pod. If they have to give up their ship, they use the sphere to disappear into subspace, a technology they got from the think tank. Terellian spheres were also assimilated by the Borg, who adapted the technology and equipped their cubes with these ships. And the borgified ex-terellian-plague-escape-pod-sphere that was used by the Borg to go back to the 21st century and was shot down over Antarctica was probably used by Starfleet as a blueprint for the Daedalus-class when they noticed that spheres look much cooler than dishes. Another Borg sphere that was used to travel back in time was captured by the "Sphere Builders" (until then they were only known as the "Dudes Who Look Like The Suliban") who decided th adapt the technology, too. One of the Sphere builders however went insane and wanted to build the biggest Sphere of them all. He was exiled but finished his work. Thousands of years later the chief engineer of the Enterprise crashed with his transport vessel on that sphere's surface.
I hope this answers the question. BTW, tomorrow I'll post my 250-pages essay on the origins of the Hammerhead freighter. Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Funny shit, that.
Really, there's no real reason why all of these races living in close proximity to each other (I'm talking about the Tellerites, Arkonians, Xindi, etc., the races that live within the sphere of space in the Alpha Quadrant accessible to Enterprise) can't have been trading technology (or stealing it from each other) for quite some time.
The way I see it, there's two ways you can look at this kind of thing. You can rationalize it "in-universe" like I just did above, or you can just say "eh, they reused the models, it's a TV show and they need to be economic." Either way, I'd say that the percentage of viewers whom this really bothers or distracts from the story is extremely small. I might even venture to say that most viewers recognize the NX-01 and that's about all.
Not to say that I don't enjoy it when they put a lot of effort into small details, but as long as the story is good that's really all I'm concerned with. Look at TOS. They had a total of what, maybe SIX models during the entire run of the show? And it never mattered, because the VFX weren't the focus, it was the plot and the characters.
-MMoM Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
quote:Originally posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim: The way I see it, there's two ways you can look at this kind of thing. You can rationalize it "in-universe" like I just did above, or you can just say "eh, they reused the models, it's a TV show and they need to be economic." Either way, I'd say that the percentage of viewers whom this really bothers or distracts from the story is extremely small.
But you forget that an overwhelmingly big percentace of this small percentage frequents this forum.
I don't have a problem with technology "sharing" (one way or the other), either. Since the appearance of Romulan D7s this has never been an issue. Look at today's navies. If you're not smart enough to invent it just copy it. Or buy it. Or both.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Oh, BTW, I can't believe I didn't think of this before, but I just realized that this episode puts the final nail in the coffin on the DEAD DEAD DEAD issue of whether Romulans have warp drive in this era or not. Irrefutably explicitly DEAD.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
If people have managed to argue that the Romulans never had warp drive in TOS for over 30 years, I'm sure they'll manage to ignore this evidence too.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Reuses are bad when it's REALLY obvious. I thought i had seen the flea before - but that was probably only because of the fact files schematic.
I didn't notice the Tellarite/Xindi Arboreal (although lets hope we see a definate 'Tellarite' design style.)
The main annoying model problem in Entperprise is when they used the Movie Klingon Cruiser. Even that wasn't so bad, and can be somehow explained away.
Posted by J (Member # 608) on :
I'd like to say, that it is stupid beyond any stretch of the imagination to say Romulans could travel interstellar distances in short amount of time [which they did in Balance of Terror]. However, it is not stupid to say that the Romulans are limited to Impulse Power, which is synonomous with Fusion power in Star Trek--- especially TOS. AND if you aren't intelligent enough to figure it out, warp drive can run on fusion power.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Yes, but that's not what the argument was. In Trek, FTL pretty much = warp drive, and impulse pretty much = slower than the speed of light. So, yes, the logical theory is saying that they were impulse powered in TOS. The stupid theory is to say that they couldn't travel at the speed of light or faster.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Saying the Romulans couldn't have had FTL drive in the war is a joke. Remember how the Klingons outgunned the Enterprise was when it didn't have warp drive?
Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
Heck, DS-9 only had thrusters and it managed to go FTL, a quarter of a light-year.. why couldn't a Romulan ship that had 'simple impulse power'?
The warp field is the key... look at the Warbirds in TNG.. they didn't have a M/MA warp core, they had some sort of artificial singularity... implying totally different ways to make a warp field.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Whafook? Whachoo talkin' about, Willis?
DS9 used its thrusters for propulsion maybe TWICE in the whole series, and it's hardly any fraction of a light year to get to the Denorios Belt.
Mark
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Well, a few light hours, maybe.
Posted by HerbShrump (Member # 1230) on :
The Romulans had to have FTL before the War. They should have had FTL when they left Vulcan. It would have been cool if they'd have given the Romulans an alternate sourse of FTL like soliton wave riding or jumpgates or one of those "slingshot arrays" like was seen in Voyager.
That way the Romulans could have had FTL without their ships necessarially being FTL equipped.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
*ahem*
Hence why I said DEAD DEAD DEAD issue.
Posted by J (Member # 608) on :
quote:Originally posted by TheWoozle: Heck, DS-9 only had thrusters and it managed to go FTL, a quarter of a light-year.. why couldn't a Romulan ship that had 'simple impulse power'?
The warp field is the key... look at the Warbirds in TNG.. they didn't have a M/MA warp core, they had some sort of artificial singularity... implying totally different ways to make a warp field.
On both of these I'm going to have to mention a little detail. I don't remember DS9 going FTL, I remember it getting up to impulse speeds by creating a subspace bubble and pushing the thrusters to max.
On the Warbirds, they make a warp field the exact same way that the E-D does except for the power source. The process before plasma interacts with the warp field coils can be different, but the process afterwards is a straight forward process. How they create the plasma is of no concern to the process, only that more higher energy plamsa = more speed.
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