in this thread at TrekBBS, Pocket Books poobah Margaret Clark confirms that a book reprinting artwork from the SotL calendars will be coming out this fall. Formal announcement next week.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Awwww yeah.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
I'd just like to say a really enjoyed typing "Pocket Books poobah." There, I just did it again.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Will there be anything new though? Seems a far cry from matt's "126 pages of CGI goodness", but if it's only limited to the SOTL calanders, it's gonna be a thin book!
Hopefully they wont split the images between two pages- that would seriously suck.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
I've got little interest in repurchasing copies of the stuff that I already bought a while back. I'd much rather be interested in new artwork and actual content (i.e. textual descriptions and information) to accompany the pretty pictures themselves.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I agree, I have the artwork in large format as calendars, why would I buy them again unless there was something different about the whole thing... maybe they corrected all the errors with ship naming and registries... Wasn't the Honshu named with like 4 different ship names/registries?
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
*cough* Unseen Frontiers *cough*
--Jonah
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Yeah- but only if the book contains anything as yet "unseen". Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Who keeps calendars, though? I mean, I guess if you've got them stored away somewhere than this isn't going to be a product you're interested in, but I can only imagine that's a tiny segment of the market. Coffee table art book > wall hanging intended to be disposable.
In any case, I haven't actually bought any of the calendars, so that is a plus, but then I haven't bought many of the previous art books either.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
I was never able to find them in the first place, hopefully Chapters will stock this, since its a book.
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
There have been 4 SotL Calendars(iirc), each with between 13 and 14 images. Most had a centrefold pic and a unique front cover pic. That's already about 50 images. Plus there are the ones from the other calendar centrefolds and front covers. Times that by two to account for the pages with text that details what the images are of and you already have nearly 126 pages. They might not even need any new pictures.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: Will there be anything new though? Seems a far cry from matt's "126 pages of CGI goodness", but if it's only limited to the SOTL calanders, it's gonna be a thin book!
Hopefully they wont split the images between two pages- that would seriously suck.
126 pages of cgi goodness, where?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I've kept all my calendars - why wouldn't you - I don't buy them to know the date. I've still got all my Tolkien Calendars back till 1992 - althought i didn't end up getting the 2004?? calendar with Tolkien's own artwork - I already have "pictures by j.r.r. tolkien".
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
I think I still have my Prince Caspian calendar from 1983 or so... Have all of the SotL calendars, too. Remember, not counting leap years, every seven years the calendars cycle. So I can use the '01 calendar again in '09 (I believe).
--Jonah
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mars Needs Women:
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: Will there be anything new though? Seems a far cry from matt's "126 pages of CGI goodness", but if it's only limited to the SOTL calanders, it's gonna be a thin book!
Hopefully they wont split the images between two pages- that would seriously suck.
126 pages of cgi goodness, where?
It's quoted my Masao (in the linked thread) as supposedly being quoted by MattC from here.
As Johnny pointed out, if you combine all the calanders, you almost get than many pages (and there'll likely be an original cover to the book).
The only calander I've kept was the '01 and this years (so far). The others I gave away, except for that awful "pop art" year- that got trashed.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
quote:Originally posted by Peregrinus: So I can use the '01 calendar again in '09 (I believe).
Do you also split your toilet paper sheets into plies and horde ketchup packets from restaurants?
I tend to write all over my calendars, so mine would unusable.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I don't buy calendars. I know what day it is & I know how to do simple math. The only one I have is on my WC door because Supper Buffet (a Chinese place) was giving them away for free right aroudn the time of my annual Chinese New Year party.
Fuckers.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
So, you're cheap?
CHEAP I SAY!
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
No, I just...y'know..have an excellent temporal sense. In any universe.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Well I have the calendar for this year and I like it. I think a better marketing idea would be to take some of the images and enlarge them to posters. Or they could just give the art book a provocative name like I dunno maybe "SEX".
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
VERY few people are likely to want a poster of anything STar Trek up in their home.
Seriously, I love the shows, but Trek as decor is just not something you want a woman to see right off when you bring her home....
(insert obvious cliche' about trekkies living in their mom's basement forver)
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Have I proved nothing to you yet?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Frankly, looking at your (track) record, NO. Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Look at the picture in my profile. Above them? Jeri Ryan poster. To their right, the Soveriegn-class cutaway. I will add that both those lasses slept in my bed with me that night.
I WIN. Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Does that say something good about you, or desperate about them. Sovvie cutaway: cool. Jeri Ryan poster: stalker-riffic.
Seriously, whatever works for you- I've got my models on (tasteful) display, so I suppose there's some Trek to be had at a casual glance, though I'm more into greek philosiphy and rows of books at diffrent levels along the walls.
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
Trek-art only... TMP Enterprise refit cutaway, TOS Enterprise cutaway, ERTL's -A and -D utaways, DS( cutaway, Voyager gutaway, Romulan Warbird poster from the old TNG mag, whatever SotL calendar is current, and I know I'm almost certainly forgetting a couple. They've been in storage along with all my other art sincemid'02.
And no, Aban, I just like to reuse calendars I really like. I have a small day-planner to write stuff down on. Easier than writing on a vertical surface.
--Jonah
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
quote:Originally posted by Shik: Look at the picture in my profile. Above them? Jeri Ryan poster. To their right, the Soveriegn-class cutaway. I will add that both those lasses slept in my bed with me that night.
I WIN.
Seems like one of your lady friends has a inch she can't quite scratch.
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
My landlord doesn't let us have posters (he put it in the contract, along with traffic cones, pets, candles and foot spas).
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Not even framed ones? All my stuff is framed with shitty Walmrt ones.
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
No foot spas?!? WTF?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
And you signed this contract?
Does it just say you can't hang posters on the walls? Because, if I were in that situation, I'd set up some kind of easels or something to display posters, just for spite.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Peregrinus: I think I still have my Prince Caspian calendar from 1983 or so... Have all of the SotL calendars, too. Remember, not counting leap years, every seven years the calendars cycle. So I can use the '01 calendar again in '09 (I believe).
--Jonah
Prince Caspian calendar!?! Who is the artwork by? Have you got any scans? Unless it's the Pauline Baynes artwork.
I don't even USE the calendars - they are more like 12-14 pages glossy books. Geek porn, I oogle at the beautiful pictures in a large format.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I think you mean traffic cones!?! WTF?
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
It's a student letting, so there are some funny clauses. On the otherhand, it's quite cheep for a student house, and maintainence free.
We just used the frames in the living room and kitchen, turned the landlords print saround and put our own stuff in. But we aren't supposed to put stuff on the walls (probably because it's only cheap paint), and there ain't no frames in the other rooms.
As for the other stuff, apparantly most student lets here have traffic cone clauses, pets - well thats not very unusual, candles are (alegedly) a fire hazzard and foot spas could electrocute you. Or something, I can't be bothered to dig out the copy.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
If I were a landlord, I sure as hell wouldn't rent to students without a lot of prohibitions spelled out. Back in my student days, we hung a coach and Xmas tree rom our ceiling and built a water-filled sensory deprivation tank in our living room (this was about when "Altered States" came out). Also used various illegal substances.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Some places here forbid having a trafficlight in your apartment (as they're common souvineers from whatever hurricane just rolled through).
I think it was South Miami (a city all it's own, believe it or not) that started that.
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
Masao, I really hope you meant you hung a couch from your ceiling. Unless it was a really lousy coach.
B.J.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
He meant a stagecoach.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Well I said for them to be made posters because it be really weird if you hung them up like they were famous works of art. I dunno I think this book going to be such a hot idea. I remeber one book called Starship Spotter that people said was crap and a Ships of the Line artbook reminds me of this idea.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I suppose they are NOT going to call it "Unseen Frontier" because all this stuff has been seen before?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
"The Already Seen Frontier"
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
The Familiar Frontier Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
The Discovered Country. The More-Travelled Road. Once More, With Ennui.
And Starship Spotter WAS crap. The descriptions were amateurish, and the ships being portrayed were portrayed as wireframes. Simple silhouettes a la WWII would have been better -- and easier on the eyes. That was just a mess...
--Jonah
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
And the big CGI pics were too dark and most of the ship was in the crease between the pages.
Other than that it was great.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I wasn't a great fan of the Starship Spotter text, The guy they got to write the text is decidedly TOS-era biased, which shows in the final product. Doesn't really help that the book is biased to the TNG-era.
Also, SS was a sort of stopgap project while Unseen Frontier was being worked on. At least they managed to ge that out before UF got the plug pulled.
Mark
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I wasn't a great fan of the Starship Spotter text, The guy they got to write the text is decidedly TOS-era biased, which shows in the final product. Doesn't really help that the book is biased to the TNG-era.
Also, SS was a sort of stopgap project while Unseen Frontier was being worked on. At least they managed to get that out before UF got the plug pulled. Also, UF is Mojo's title. Whatever the name of the book, it won't be that.
Mark
Posted by bX (Member # 419) on :
Could it be called (cunningly enough) 'Ships Of The Line'?
Posted by Makotokat (Member # 1041) on :
Where everyone has gone before
Still nice to see things all in one place...
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
Has anyone else seen this page from Simon&Schuster about their 40th anniversary books? Scroll down to the (not suprisingly named) Ships of the Line entry and click on the picture for a slightly bigger view of the cover. I like how they show the various ships there (including the Botany Bay), but notice that we can see the underside of the Enterprise-J! It's obviously not fully canon, but it's about as close as they come. Interesting that they seem to have given it two deflectors, a circular one in the usual spot, plus the oblong one that we've seen before at the saucer front.
B.J.
Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :
I have to say that the NCC 1701-J looked a whole lot better topwise.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I say we wait until a better picture.
And get out your rulers! Perspective aside, it looks like everything is to scale in this picture. We haven't seen anything like this before, have we?
And what would be new models for this book? The Ambassador and Constellation are new, I think. The Botany Bay is a little odd to be in that lineup.. And what's that under the Chaffee?
Mark
PS - Hey, the Akira is right next to the NX-01! AND LOOK, THEY'RE COMPLETELY DISTINGISHABLE!!! Sorry, old pet peeve. Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Yeah, but perspective's a bitch, as usual. Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
The Ambassador and Constellation have both been in the Ships of the Line calendars before. Snazzy cover, but the blurb definitely gives the impression that there won't be anything new. Poop. Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: And what's that under the Chaffee?
It looks like it might be TNG's Type 15 Shuttlepod or the Type 6 Shuttlecraft.
B.J.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I'd guess that thing under the Chaffe is an NX-01 shuttlepod...no idea what that thing is to the left of the defiant.
Enterprise E seems to be pregnant- her secondary hull is just not that droopy.
Enterprise J looks pretty strange, but less so than the shock of seeing the D for the first time, I'll tell ya.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
The thing to the left of the Defiant ithe Botany Bay / DY-500 model we've seen before. The Chaffee must have nine lives... I don't think there's anything special about that model, and yet it's been in nearly every calendar!
Here's the image on Flareupload to simplify things...
Mark
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Jesus H. FUCK. Why can Shatner just not let Kirk DIE??
On the nice side, I'm squeeing at the reissue of some of the OLD books. I really liked the old runs & have picked up naught one of the so-called "relaunch" titles. These authors they get...no sense of story. Too wrapped up in injokes & asides & details.
The Fiction Companion intrigues me.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Woah the Ent-J looks really thin.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Well, it has been dieting. How nice of you to notice.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
My my my, look at my little Ambassador (galaxy and excelsior too)
M.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by Johnny: The Ambassador and Constellation have both been in the Ships of the Line calendars before. Snazzy cover, but the blurb definitely gives the impression that there won't be anything new. Poop.
The Ambassador is a completely new model. I know, I made it with my pal Simon
M
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
That's a bloody awful lot of ships!
Posted by bX (Member # 419) on :
That does look pretty cool. I think I only ever bought one of the calendars, so the book is looking pretty good to me.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN: Well, it has been dieting. How nice of you to notice.
Well I was just saying because you know, it could be anorexia nervosa.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Mabye the Enterprise E has bee stealing it's food: that beergut might also explain the extra decks from Nemesis.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Err....no.
That's just how the model is, I'm afraid. That particular one is the old Digital Muse one.
M.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Not how the physical model is though....I have a ton of reference pics of that and (to my eye at least) that one on the cover looks ...off.
Could just the tiny image posted is not great too.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: Mabye the Enterprise E has bee stealing it's food: that beergut might also explain the extra decks from Nemesis.
Simple the E-E is a TARDIS. In First Contact itself - the number of decks changed. In Nemesis - the 'Viceroy' was knocked off by Riker on - I think - the bottom deck where he proceeded to fall at least another 10-20 decks. Ohhh! Maybe we can put Nemesis in the "The Final Frontier" basket... "life is but a dream". Nah TFF was better than Nem.
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC:
quote:Originally posted by Johnny: The Ambassador and Constellation have both been in the Ships of the Line calendars before. Snazzy cover, but the blurb definitely gives the impression that there won't be anything new. Poop.
The Ambassador is a completely new model. I know, I made it with my pal Simon
M
Well an Ambassador has been in the Calendar before, it was in the shot of all the Enterprises docked at a station.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Well an Ambassador has been in the Calendar before, it was in the shot of all the Enterprises docked at a station. [/QB]
No shit, sherlock. Sean did that one, but it's total crap. It was just a redress of a public domain one he found apparently.
M.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: Not how the physical model is though....I have a ton of reference pics of that and (to my eye at least) that one on the cover looks ...off.
Could just the tiny image posted is not great too.
I know that ship like the back of my hand
That particular set of geometry was done by ILM for Insurrection. Muse took it, ported it to LW, reduced the texture resolution for TV use.
M.
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC:
quote:Well an Ambassador has been in the Calendar before, it was in the shot of all the Enterprises docked at a station.
No shit, sherlock. Sean did that one, but it's total crap. It was just a redress of a public domain one he found apparently.
M. [/QB]
Right, and that's all I said. That the Ambassador class had been in the Calendars before. You seem to have taken it to mean I thought it was your model in that calendar, when it was really the "total crap" one. Doesn't really matter to me whose model it was, since I was only describing the type of ship.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I think "Johnny Sherlock" has a nice ring to it though.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
true enough
and no, I haven't forgotten about the warp delta either...just been a bit busy with work to open LW lately.
M
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
That's alright, we know the results will be worth the wait, the bribes, and that thing where Johnny was in a lace negligee on a street corner. Really, what was THAT part all about..?
My previous post had been about looking for new CG models, even of existing ships. So, if the Ambassador is new, then hopefully the Constellation or others would get a similar sprucing up. And label changes - yes, we notice every single one.
Say, is the cover image representative of the proportions of the book? If so, I suppose this means that the various ships that had been "creased" in previous calendars will be visible in full glory this time out...
Mark
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Well, I created the Ambassador on my own (with Simon). Doug just asked if he could use it. It weighs in around 650000 polygons. About 60 lights, window boxes behind every window, all markings are modelled, detailed primary and secondary shuttle bays, ribbed phaser strips, etc.
Not too bad...but we've decided to do another one
M
Posted by The Vorlon (Member # 52) on :
Could you share some pictures of your Ambassador, Matt? Or any other ships, for that matter.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Sure, if I get near the house in the next few days.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC: Sure, if I get near the house in the next few days.
I'll be home tonight, so I'll put up an image or two of the Ambassador and a couple of other things.
M
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
If you have any official Steamrunner images, I'd kill for those!
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
I have no idea why the heck you'd want to see any images of that thing. I don't have any, but sheesh, the textures were culled from the sovereign model.
M
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Really? Well, it's still a beautiful design.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Oh, that's nice. Hello wallpaper. Thanks, MattC.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
I did those about 6 months ago. Geometry got cleaned up some more, a few more details here and there.
M
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Awesome stuff, Matt. I think this is the first time I've seen someone separate the Amby saucer witht he requisite details.
Mark
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Awesome new desktop backgrounds for my collection!
And though I never thought about it, it makes perfect sense for the Ambassador to have saucer-sep capability... except that the saucer doesn't have any impulse engines! Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Yeah, I did think about that. Oh well, roll on V3.0 Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
I hope it's okay, I took the liberty of using one of those awesome high-res images and created a shiny background scene for it. (I just love the Flaming Pear Photoshop plugins... I may not know much about Photoshop [Elements], but their three space-theme plugins�LunarCell, SolarCell, and Glitterato�are friggin' awesome!)
I'm not sure I got quite the right angle for the lens flare, though... should it be a bit further to the right? I used the shadows on the engineering hull as my reference, but I don't have a whole lot of experience with this kind of artwork.
This is just a lower-res reproduction to show off, but if Matt's okay with it, I can post the full 1900x1200 version for large-screen monitors!
Posted by WizArtist II (Member # 1425) on :
SWEET....I'm going to have to nab those plugins.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
I'd rather you didn't. Sorry, just had bad experiences with stuff like that.
If you want, I'll render something up on Sunday with a background. I've probably got something on the HD somewhere.
M.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Sure Matt, no problem. Do you want me to take that small version down, too? Or shrink it down even smaller?
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
I reckon Matt finds any use of his pics slightly objectionable as it induces flashbacks to numerous RPGs that nicked them, after removing any credits.
I think I remember these pics from the thread that was on SFM before the meltdown. Good to see them again.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
Super pics, thanks Matt!
P.S. Don't forget about the Emmette... Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Wow - beautiful!!
One nitpick - ain't I a stinker - the E-C had a blue impulse engine glow.
One might also assume that the Ambassador - an earlier ship to the E-C had a blue glow too, whereas the later versions like the Yamaguchi had the red glow.
I *LOVE* the saucer separation! I just beamed when I saw that (as in grinned you dirty people).
Hmmm I don't think I've used glitterato!! I have the other lunar/solar cels.
Oh and why the 'Emmette' again - isn't that the name of one of the characters of "Queer as Folk"?
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
The blue glow could have been the result of combat damage, though.
Does this model have aft torpedo tubes? I really dig the teeny weeny twin fwd assembly.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Did the Excelsior have a blue impulse engine? (Ignore the E-B which wasn't around when the E-C was built and filmed).
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
In ST6, the Excelsior impulse engines were definitely red. Contrary data would have to come from ST3, then, since the ship wasn't powered up in ST4 and ST5. But IIRC we don't see the Excelsior from the rear in that movie, except again in depowered state.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
Matt's Ambassador does have aft torpedo launchers. There's a small indentation in the upper secondary hull between the neck and the aft shuttlebay. And Matt's separated saucer could only be propelled by thrusters for an escape from the secondary hull, though it looks like reconnection is possible without station aid.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
In regards to the blue glow, my lighting setup for the Ent-C markings does have it. I prefer the red though, so I rigged up the Ambassador for it to be like that.
Doug used the blue impulse rig in the book, so it should have the blue impulse engines.
The impulse engines for the saucer section (we did think about this) are 'likely' to be hidden behind some blow off panels or some such (I'll think about this for the next revision). I'l discuss it with Simon.
There should be an image of that sucker in the 2007 SOTL calendar as well (along with the D and a few BoPs).
As for the Emmette, well, is it that important to know what the heck it was called.....
M
PS: And yes, RPG's do indeed suck rat's rectums.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
*BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP* Holy Excuses, Batman! It's the Dog-Ate-My-Homework alarm! Is this your way of saying you're not able to provide proof of what the USS Mana-Mana Do-Dooo-Dee-Doo-Doo was actually called? 8)
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lee: *BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP* Holy Excuses, Batman! It's the Dog-Ate-My-Homework alarm! Is this your way of saying you're not able to provide proof of what the USS Mana-Mana Do-Dooo-Dee-Doo-Doo was actually called? 8)
How about "I just don't care enough to make it a priority right now".
M
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Hey Matt, want something REALLY obscure to model... how about the Excelsior study model (a Ralph Maquarrie version) that is seen in a back area of Spacedock in STIII!! Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Ooh, somebody's snippy today. . .
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Easy, lad. He's posting this stuff solely at his discretion, and antagonizing him is probably not going to loosen him up any.
Matt, it's true, those of us who are fixating on this must be a little funny in some way...but it comes with the territory. I am most interested in seeing pictures of the model primarily because compiling shiplists is one of my favorite Trek-related activities, and also because I'd like to see how it compares to the Warp Delta, which Rob Bonchune told us was based on it.
-MMoM Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Hey Matt, want something REALLY obscure to model... how about the Excelsior study model (a Ralph Maquarrie version) that is seen in a back area of Spacedock in STIII!!
Nah. And that was the Enterprise Refit study model that Maquarrie did.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Oh, and I'm teasing, not antagonising.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Umm...What about the battle of Wolf 359?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC:
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Hey Matt, want something REALLY obscure to model... how about the Excelsior study model (a Ralph Maquarrie version) that is seen in a back area of Spacedock in STIII!!
Nah. And that was the Enterprise Refit study model that Maquarrie did.
Oh yeah, that's right.
Anyone want to try making it and giving it a "true-to-trek" feel - i.e. the hull plating/colour etc?
Andrew
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
I don't know, what about the Battle of Wolf 359? Unless you're asking me there on a date, in which case the answer's "I'm washing my hair."
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:Anyone want to try making it and giving it a "true-to-trek" feel - i.e. the hull plating/colour etc?
Just take a Star Destroyer, add nacelles and a saucer, and there you go.
As for origins of ship names, some people here just like to know obscure info like that. Me, I could care less. I just want to see the ship Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
Don't you just love double posting?
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC:
PS: And yes, RPG's do indeed suck rat's rectums.
Wow, generalise much?
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by Captain Boh:
quote:Originally posted by MattC:
PS: And yes, RPG's do indeed suck rat's rectums.
Wow, generalise much?
Only when those theiving dorks are involved.
M
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Is it possible to ask what piece of artwork they stole? Those RPGs looked craptacular anyway.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Oh, they steal everything. I've found whole pages of my site lovingly recreated on more than one Trek RPG site. . .
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC:
quote:Originally posted by Captain Boh:
quote:Originally posted by MattC:
PS: And yes, RPG's do indeed suck rat's rectums.
Wow, generalise much?
Only when those theiving dorks are involved.
M
Hell, if we're generalising, they're all Star Trek fans, I guess all Star Trek fans are theives too.
They write stuff, so I guess all writers are theves.
They're on the internet, I guess everyone on the whole internet is a huge thief.
Guess I'd better start stealing your work then.
A bad experience isn't a free ticket to be a dick.
Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :
Oh please, there�s a huge difference in using other peoples material and crediting them and asking permission as opposed to rpg:s stealing entire pages or hotlinking to my images which happens all the time. I�ve contacted at least 4 pages this month alone. So captain Boh, never done anything creative yourself since you can�t recognise the feeling when people use the material you�ve been sweating over for days or weeks without permission?
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Is it possible to ask what piece of artwork they stole? Those RPGs looked craptacular anyway.
There were about a dozen over the last 12 months from either me or my compadres. In the end, we got sick of policing it.
m.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
I've had work stolen from me. That doesn't mean I condem an entire group for the actions of some of its members.
Play by Email RPGs are what got me into 3d modeling and 3d modeling is what got me into forums. I'm not stealing other peoples images and I never have.
I've met quite a lot of great people through RPGs, people who have been great friends and helped me get through some really terrible times, people who have inspired me to better myself and do something with my life. I've also met some terrible people, but I don't let them sour me on those who aren't.
The fact of the matter is, only about 1 in 10 people involved in RPGs even have a say it what turns up on the internet, so most of the stealing is done by a very small part of their community. Most of the members probably don't even know the work on the sites is stolen. I didn't until I got into 3d.
So yes, some RPGers are most definately huge, image stealing dicks. But so are members of a ton of other groups.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Boh,
It's ok. SFM managed to sour me completely on showing anything publically anyway.
M.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
SFM?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Ahhhhhh I thought you meant those RPG books that came out a few years ago!!
How do you track hot-linkers?
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lee: SFM?
SciFi-Meshes.com.
I'm surprised anything untoward happened there, pretty much everyone is paranoid about image theft, so I would've thought it'd be quite a safe place to post stuff. I've had my work stolen when it was posted on TrekBBS(once a guy actually reposted it within a couple of days and claimed it was his work), but never SFM.
It's a shame that people feel they can't post their work because of a tiny minority of thieving twits.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Nah, I just can't stand the geeks.....
Meanwhile, hope you like my Enterprise-C in the SOTL 2007 calendar
Big kudos to my pal Alain for doing the image
M
Posted by bX (Member # 419) on :
Something tells me... yes.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Will the E-C be doing something interesting? It's always tricky I guess trying to think up new and interesting positions for starships in the calendars?
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Some Yesterday's Enterprise thing apparently.
M
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Matt, can you do us ONE big favour... before the book comes out or the calendar - go through and check that the starships don't have 5 different registries or names over them.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
Yeah, like he's really going to do that. And, anyway, what would be the point?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Yeah. If we were assured that all these little glitches were taken care of, then what's the point of buying the product if not to scrutinize every pixel?
In any case, most of the artwork will be simple re-prints of existing calendar pictures, and not re-renders. For the new stuff though, we ARE due fewer mistakes, which Matt and the other artists are indeed improving at doing.
Mark
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
I just grabbed this from startrek.com's article about the soon to be released book:
quote:The mystery of the missing Columbia NX-02 lasted for two centuries, until it was discovered in the early days of the Dominion War. Image by Pierre Drolet From "Ships of the Line" by Pocket Books
Looks like there's going to be a few suprises afterall!
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
WOW!!
FUCKING WOW!!
I'm gonna guess that means Hernandez didn't get to stay with Archer after all...unless Columbia had a different captain. Also, that's...remarkably intact for "abrupt planetfall."
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
Fantastic!
Is the craft closest to the camera one of the workbees from Nemesis, or an extended version of the Argo buggy?
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Cool, it seems that Ships of the Line may end being made in the same style as the Terran Trade Authority books.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
...I think I peed a little when I saw this. I'm at my work desk. Excuse me for a second.
This does not mean that Columbia was missing right after we last saw her. Two centuries before the start of the Dominion War still leaves us a couple decades for her to get lost. She's got the proper deflector and everything - I'm impressed!
That IS an Argo up front, probably taken from the CG version done for its leap into the shuttle at the end of the scene. That's a Type-9 and a Danube in the background, too. The only out-of-place thing here is that the Starfleet crewers are wearing VOY/DS9 colorfuls. Not irreconcilable, but they really shouda been wearing grey by then.
Mark
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
"She's got the proper deflector and everything - I'm impressed!"
The Columbia is probably stored as a seperate file from the Enterprise, since it has different colouring, deflector and textures. I did look for that right away myself though.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Weird.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
After a few seconds looking at that picture, I had to stop and remember to breathe. That looks quite enticing!
quote:Originally posted by Shik: Also, that's...remarkably intact for "abrupt planetfall."
Well, the Enterprise-D was "remarkably intact" after its "abrupt planetfall" as well. I expect that most of the bottom decks are left in pieces trailing a few kilometers to the left of the picture. Also, sand is probably (relatively) cushioning, compared to rock and compressed clay/dirt.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Yeah, but...nacelles still standing? No major breaches? No burnination or anything like that?
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
Semi-controlled planetfall, crew's attempted survival a la Ceti Alpha V (ST2 version)?
Whatever the story, it just looks spooky-good.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Johnny: Fantastic!
Is the craft closest to the camera one of the workbees from Nemesis, or an extended version of the Argo buggy?
Argo buggy. The background ships seem to be the nose of a Runabout and (facing) a "speedboat shuttle" from Voyager.
Posted by Lurker Emeritus (Member # 1888) on :
One can technobabble ones way out of questions like why the nacelles are still standing. Star Trek has always given out the message that Starfleet understands physical laws differently. The notion that the Constitution class is considered a robust engineering solution exemplifies that.
What bothers me about that picture is the antimatter. Where is it? There was no suggestion, to my knowledge, that the NX class were capable of ejecting the core. I think this limitation even formed the basis of several plot devices! Presumably all this antimatter is still contained in it's magnetic bottle or the whole back end of the saucer and the catamaran nacelle struts should be either missing or spread very thinly over the desert. And that's a conservative guess. The entire ship should have been disassembled! And there should probably be evidence of some sort of relatively new cratering - probably appearing to the visual observer as a very large shallow bowel full of sand, but which to a physical archaelogist would show up as a bloody big hole full of sand on his subsurface topography charts. Unless of course the antimatter containment failed whilst airbourne, in which case the ship should be tiny pieces scattered over most of one hemisphere!
But that is not the case, according to the picture. According to the picture, containment must still be active, although were the power for this is coming from, who knows. So how come all those little people are so calmly wandering around all over it? If you took one of the old decommissioned Soviet nuclear subs from Murmansk, raised it into orbit, dropped it in the Sahara and then came back two hundred years later, would you want to go anywhere near that thing? Even if it looked like the reactor hadn't breached and scattered it's radioactive guts all over the crash site, it will still be quite banged up. Would you want to go near it? Not if you want to breed one day, or even die of old age.
Sorry if I've burst any bubbles Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Well, it's entirely plausible that the antimatter containment bottles are removable/ejectable, while the reactor is not. Remember that episode where Archer was going to remove all the ship's antimatter and leave it on an Insectoid ship?
Therefore, one could justify a scenario where, whatever happened to the ship, there was enough time to shut down the reactor and remove/eject the antimatter before they lost containment. Restricted to impulse power, they wouldn't have been able to go very far, and probably some other circumstances related to the emergency forced them to make an emergency but (semi-)controlled landing.
Posted by Lurker Emeritus (Member # 1888) on :
Good point, but I thought that Trip complained both at losing so much antimatter and also about how long it would take. Hours were mentioned. Doesn't sound like something you'd attempt in an emergency, like imminent realisation that if you don't get rid of it before you crash, you'll blow up.
If it's as easy to drain the stuff as that, why do later generations eject the entire core instead?
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Because even if you dump the fuel tank, there's still a little bit of fuel left over in the engine itself. Plus, the nature of the warp core is that it's a regulated reaction. If there's a failure in the core, that results in an unregulated reaction �i.e. an explosion. And in those kinds of emergency situations, there's no time to do a careful shutdown of the system to purge out the antimatter and prevent a chain reaction.
Also, remember "Disaster"? That time, the problem wasn't with the core itself, it was with the antimatter containment system. So we've seen both kinds of emergencies on the ship.
Finally, in the 22nd century, it's entirely possible that Columbia had been sent on a long-range exploration mission to a point where no one had any idea exactly where it was, there was no hope of immediate communications, and no hope of rescue. Think of the Archon and the Essex, for example. I think this pictured situation could be quite similar. If the NX-02 were out of comm range, they lost their warp drive, and had limited fuel or life support, then landing in the desperate hope of saving the crew might have been their only option.
(And then once the crew got away from the ship, something else disastrous happened to them, thus preventing anyone from surviving to tell the story several hundred years later. Talk about bad luck!)
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Just because the NX-01 was missing a particular feature does not mean the NX-02 was missing it. Also, just because the NX-01 was missing a feature at one point in time certainly does not mean the NX-02 was missing it at a much later point in time.
"...a very large shallow bowel full of sand..."
Ew.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Besides, barring some accompanying text, anything could have happened to get the ship there. Random demigod encounter, a magic subspace whosit. . .
Posted by Zefram (Member # 1568) on :
quote:Just because the NX-01 was missing a particular feature does not mean the NX-02 was missing it.
Exactly. Once again, using the standard Starfleet/Earth naval fleets comparison, the first example of a class is usually somewhat prototypical. Lessons learned during its operation are incorporated into later ships of the class. As soon as it became an issue, Enterprise probably includeded in its logs "needs method for quickly eliminating antimatter". For all we know, the Enterprise itself could have been retrofitted with such a feature.
And that explanation doesn't even require technobabble.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Perhaps any hazardous material could have been beamed away before the away teams landed?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Maybe the ship was stolen from the Starfleet Museum and disapeared soon after... Prahaps it was stolen by that Fanboy Alien from Futurama.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Welshy!
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
quote:Maybe the ship was stolen from the Starfleet Museum and disapeared soon after...
No, you're thinking of the Excelsior. Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Well I was able to skim the book today at Barnes and Noble. I wouldn't recommend it for purchase. For one thing the scenes are considerably scaled down (the book is fairly small) and some scenes even have sections cut off. For example, the scene with the Ent-D and the "Stingray ship" has a portion of the picture with Stingray's left nacelle cut out. The only interesting thing I found in the book is that the "Stinray" is called the Altair and it's not from the far future but a prototype commissioned by Starfleet to create a starship chasis that can achieve higher warp velocities.
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
Wank.
--Jonah
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Dude, there's no Trek on the screens right now. Wank is all's we gots!
Mark
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
There's a photo that's SO appropriate.. but so naughty..
Oh well.
How are the pages set out? Are the pictures on double page spreads with explanations on other pages, or overlayed on the image? Are there any new images aside from the front cover?
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Well its set up like this:
On the Left page a small one sentence discription or quote with the picture on the Right page.
I never had all the Calenders, so I couldn't tell you what images were new or old but I did see one pic which had a Miranda plummeting into a planet with its life boats landing on the surface of the planet.
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
Oh. Sounds like they waste a lot of space. Especially considering it's basically a picture book.
The Miranda image was in a calendar a few years ago, iirc.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
None of the pictures from the vertical-format "National Geographic" edition (as described by Mojo, from the second year, I think) are included.
Posted by Mikey T (Member # 144) on :
Which is sad since I wanted to see how it would look like... you think Mojo will release them?
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mars Needs Women: The only interesting thing I found in the book is that the "Stinray" is called the Altair and it's not from the far future but a prototype commissioned by Starfleet to create a starship chasis that can achieve higher warp velocities.
So.... did anyone notice the similarities between the "modified" Enterprise-J and the Altair? It's the same bloody ship, only without the saucer! Now that's lazy...
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Because they've never done that before.
Ever.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
Not only that, but the crack-smoking person who wrote that inane caption (and who is most certainly NOT Doug Drexler), should be shot. The ship is obviously not a 24th century prototype, but a ship from the 26th century. Apparently the caption-writer never saw ENT's third season.
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
Yes, like I said over on SFM, it looks like they just removed the saucer of the Ent-J and "tada!", they had a new, slightly cooler ship. The very forward bridge module type section is probably the only difference.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'm willing to bet money that someone thought no one wound notice. The E-J underside has NEVER been seen, so th eartist probably took their Altair model, popped the E-J saucer out of its housing and flipped it upside-down, and just pasted it on.
However, I'm still willing to bet that the model as depicted is simply another Enterprise...
Mark
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
quote:Originally posted by B.J.:
quote:Originally posted by Mars Needs Women: The only interesting thing I found in the book is that the "Stinray" is called the Altair and it's not from the far future but a prototype commissioned by Starfleet to create a starship chasis that can achieve higher warp velocities.
So.... did anyone notice the similarities between the "modified" Enterprise-J and the Altair? It's the same bloody ship, only without the saucer! Now that's lazy...
Wank.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
One wonders whether the Altair came first, or the alternate E-J. The "bridge dome" on the former seems like an ill-fitting add-on...
In any case, I find the Altair an interesting design, the alt-E-J not so. It seems the best starships are often born when a studio bigwig turns the sketch upside down, or bow aft, or takes just half the ship, or decides to use a sidearm or sensor design as a ship design...
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
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