Minutiae Man's amazing simulation of my drawing style in the TOS/NX-01 post ( http://lobotomy.pleh.net/~flareupload/uploads/444/USS_Investigator.gif ) prompted me to post my new similar ship. I've been thinking that both the Miranda and Oberth classes might have arisen from a common ancestor having a usual primary with a engineering "back porch" I'm thinking this is a 2240s time frame. The registry and name are provisional. This is a very early WIP with lots of details undecided, so no nitpicking about drawing errors! General comments are, of course, welcome. I actually like MM's ship quite a bit, it's very sleek.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I dunno...the lines don't match up. The profile suggests a thinner (in width) "deck" than is shown on the plan. This isn't a bad thing, as I think the thinner deck works better.
It's the rather abruptness of its ending & the "plain jane-ness" that doesn't endear it to me. It's not that it looks utilitarian; utilitarian I can & usually do like. This just looks like they said, "Eh...I'm bored. Let's build a ship."
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Well, me likes!
There's something to this that reminds me of those Jeffries sketches of work pods and other small craft. A flat chassis onto which a top bubble and two nacelles are added... This thing doesn't look as if she should float in space. Rather, she should hover just above a surface of some sort.
Which is only a positive thing. I like a ship that looks like she would be doing something else than the Enterprise, when she's *supposed* to do something else.
FASA and/or SFB came up with very similar designs back in the mists of time, with fat saucers and dorsal nacelles and terraced upper surfaces. A silly ventral mount for a round deflector dish ruined the lines, though. Light cruisers, they called them. This could be the ultimate incarnation of that idea.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Bernd (Member # 6) on :
I like it. It thas a nice TAS touch to it.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
I think the basic concept works pretty well. The aft section doesn't seem to match up (as Shik pointed out), but I think that it's still interesting.
I'm not sure if this ship looks right for the Valley Forge era, or might work better as a follow-on to the Lancaster (say, around 2210 or so). I'm reminded a bit of the style you used for the aft saucer structure on your Swordfish carrier, there.
As it stands, this structure looks like an early 2220's design -- are those nacelles supposed to be proto-Valley Forge types? Also, the current registry number (which I know you said is provisional) precedes the Kestel, so the early 2220's makes sense.
If you're looking for backstory suggestions, you could possibly combine Shik's impression of a relatively "boring" design with the story about Starfleet developing new light cruiser-type ships to fill out the fleet and extend its capabilities. This one could be one of those projects, a "quick and dirty" solution that gave rise to the Miranda a while later.
Overall, looks like a good start!
(Oh, and my kitbash of your design in the other thread was nothing more than a bitmap patch job, not a mimicking by any means.)
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Looks promising. Again the back section, but nothing too serious.
Another possible backstory; as you mentioned the Oberth class, perhaps a more scientifically focussed ship to supplement the Asia class. Smaller and less capeable and with a slightly higher weapons/science ratio but another victory for the science lobby. Perhaps with some sort of 'plug-in' lab/sensor module under the aft hull?
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Thanks for the comments, fellow engineers! I will try to address them. 1) "The lines don't match up": The catamaranish thingies are just half cyliners at the edge of the back porch. The make the profile look taller but are just at the edge. I'm working on the rear and front views that will clear that up. I am thinking of decreasing the height of the main slab (which runs through the entire ship) to less than the current 2 decks. 2) "It looks plain": Yeah, it sort of does, but not all ships should look flashy. But I'll work on it. 3) "It has a TAS touch": Good eye! This was intended. Those beads on a string on the primary hull were stolen from USS Huron. The shuttle deck will also be inspired by Huron's 4) Time frame and role: This is now a very small ship, with a main body, with nacelles, of about 90 m. The main factor in the ship not being even small is the length of the back porch, which is determined by how small the power train components can be. The basic layout could easily be adapted towards Miranda (when enlarged) or Oberth. I don't have a small ship in the museum for the 2240s, so that's what I'm shooting for. The nacelles will probably be tapering tubes very similar to the units on Connies. The bridge, with a small base beneath it, is also similar to that on Connies.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I figured it out. The profile looks unbalanced--there's nothing ventral to offset the nacelles. And I still think the porch could be made not as wide. But that's me.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
To address the "unbalanced" look, perhaps some miniature pod containing the navigational deflector (like on Reverend's Antares) would be in order? That would be like the upper roll bar on the classic Miranda...
Only 90 meters? You're right, that *is* tiny. The scaled shuttle didn't quite register, because we never really get a good sense of how big shuttles are w/rt the bigger ships in the televison (or movie) SFX. I can see how that fits better as an Oberth predecessor than a Miranda, now.
You certainly don't have to take this into account since it's your own timeline, but I've really come to like Harry's idea of renumbering the Surya to NCC-1650 to make it a Connie-era ship. If you want to use some idea like that, Masao, you might want to make this one a little earlier -- maybe 10 years or so?
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
I had a version of this ship that had an abbreviated secondary hull with a foward dish and rear shuttle bay. The trouble is unless the ventral primary hull is very flat, you need to have the dish come down fairly far for adequate clearance. I was thinking of having a dish somewhere, but neither Oberth nor Miranda have one. If there is a dish, it would be on a fairly thin ventral pylon (not as thin as on FJ ships) near the stern.
The actual intro date isn't set. I just want to have a few years before both Mirandas and Oberths (or their immediate predecessors, if it is not my ship).
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
I finished front and back views and added variants with elevated nacelles and flat nacelles (at center of disc). I also had a version with nacelles mounted below the disc, but it looked too much Miranda. I also added a silhouette of my Valley Forge class for size comparison.
Which nacelle arrangement do you prefer? I sort of like the flat version, since it's midway between Miranda and Oberth.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
Hey ... Masao ... could you humor me a bit?
To the version with the mid-level nacelles ... could you beef up the rear a bit, and add a raised torpedo launcher, similar to the one on the Miranda (if not in configuration)?
See this thread for why.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Snay: I couldn't quite figure out from the linked thread what you're planning, but, sure, I can do a revision for you.
In what way do you want the rear bulked up? We have three dimensions, so it could be longer, taller, thicker, or a combination thereof.
How do you want the torp laucher attached? It could be on a single pylon or on a rollbar. Do you want a dual launcher or a single tube?
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
Masao:
quote:I couldn't quite figure out from the linked thread what you're planning
In short, I'm looking for a design of a TOS- or movie-era starship which I can re-create in mini-fig scale in Lego. "I actually want to, within the limits of Lego, attempt to build as realistic a replica of a Starfleet Starship." See my March 7th post of that thread for elaboration.
quote:In what way do you want the rear bulked up? We have three dimensions, so it could be longer, taller, thicker, or a combination thereof.
Hmmmm. I'm not sure, honestly. Perhaps a bit longer and taller?
quote:How do you want the torp laucher attached?
I'd like a single pylon, with two foreward launchers, and a single aft one.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Oo! Flat version, please! Perhaps with ever-so-slightly angled nacelles, either upwards or downwards. Not a HUGE degree of arc...but a leetle small one.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
So, Masao, check your PMs!
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
I don't think I like the perfectly flat version, but Shik's suggestion of *slightly* angled nacelles sounds like it would work well. I'd prefer an upper placement compared to lower... although if you take a progression from Paris to Kestrel to Capella to Miranda, then perhaps slightly-lower orientation would make more sense. (Of course, the designs don't have to be so arbitrary. )
I also think that the latest edition of the registry number is a little high. Considering the differing size, I think that the Capella would fit in better as a contemporary of the Kestrel/Aryabhatta. Considering that the Capella with its small size can hardly perform the same mission profile as the Aryabhatta, I think it'd work better to have the Capella built in the mid-2220's. (Shortly after the new Command directive for lots of small ships.)
Looking good! Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Masao, for pylon angle, what I was thinking of was much like the bow elevation of the Detroyat design...if you find it on SSDB. Not in vertical direction necessarily, but degree of angle.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Here's the revision Snay requested. I made the back engineering deck a bit longer, but wasn't able to make it much taller, since the two deck slab runs the length of the ship. I did make the half-cylinders slightly larger though. I added a crappy torp pod on a single stalk. Because the midline is filled with engineering equipment, I had to put the stalk fairly far forward. But, feel free to modify it in any way. I put the nacelles up on these schematics, but that was just to get them out of the way to show the hull.
The registry number is still up in the air. I won't settle on one until I come up with a suitable history for this ship. Still playing around with the nacelles. But maybe slightly raised might be ok. I'll take a look at Detroyat.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
Okazaki has a design!
The nacelles will be flat on the baseline of the saucer (supporting their weight isn't going to happen). Looks like we're still talking about four decks: A-, B-, C- and D-Decks. Altho, some stuff COULD go in the torpedo room and the stalk.
Masao: you even put the port & starboard airlocks where I was going to! You = kick'in ass.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
)