What would a movie-era version of the Mirror Universe's ISS Enterprise look like?
A straight copy of "our" Enterprise doesn't seem right, and it'd be the easy way out.
More heavily armed would be pretty much a given. Photorps at the base of the neck, or below the bridge ala TOS. Armored bridge? Dare I say it, hull plating like the NX-01? More macho secondary hull and warp nacelles? Definately loose the botanical section.
Those are the ideas I've been playing with (but I'm hopeless at artwork so don't even ask for a sketch ).
Anyone think of something different to add to the mix that I may've overlooked?
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
If she's a tool of oppression and cruelty, perhaps you could add weapons and other external devices that are not part of the regular Trek universe at all.
Instead of the arboretum windows, you could have bomb bay doors, pointing menacingly down towards the planet the Empire is displeased with. Bombs may not be tactically superior to phasers, but they look and sound so much more evil...
Instead of a shuttlebay, you could have assault barges berthed semi-recessed on the exterior. Again, perhaps no more effective than transporters, but far more menacing.
And be sure to display the colors of the Empire very prominently. Huge swastikas on the forecastle and red-black-blue flying on every mast is what makes for menacing alt-history seagoing ships - the actual design or armament is quite secondary! Do the same here. The sword-piercing-poor-Earth could be painted on the sides of the secondary hull in the same size as the main deflector dish. And red and black and perhaps gold paint should be lavishly applied on the possibly otherwise Starfleet-white ship.
(Oh, and the warp engines should glow orange, of course.)
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Cartmaniac (Member # 256) on :
Something along the lines of the warship Voyager, except, well, TOSsified. She's gotta be a lean, mean, death-dealin' machine, so let her form follow her function. 8)
Posted by First of Two (Member # 16) on :
Since somebody brought this up, I've been wondering...
Has anybody ever actually done designs for Mirror Universe ships? Like, say, the "Dark Mirror" E-D, or their own designs? (And I don't mean just canon designs with a lot of guns photoshopped onto the hull)
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
Er, hold up. How would there be a Mirror-Universe Enterprise in any case? The Empire collapsed.
Of course, I suppose we could be talking about an alternate reality where Spock failed and the Empire triumphed over its enemies.
Posted by First of Two (Member # 16) on :
quote:Originally posted by Malnurtured Snay: Er, hold up. How would there be a Mirror-Universe Enterprise in any case? The Empire collapsed.
Of course, I suppose we could be talking about an alternate reality where Spock failed and the Empire triumphed over its enemies.
Dingdingding! Give the man a cee-gar!
"Dark Mirror" was written before the DS9 crossover episodes, and had the Terran Empire surviving into the TNG-Era.
Given that some people aren't too fond of the path the canon Mirror universe took (even the Shatner Mirrorverse and "Dark Passions" Mirrorverse extensions), it's not unreasonable that some folks might set their sights on a Mirrorverse where the Terran Empire never fell.
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
"Dark Empire" was also total crap.
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
That was the novel with Cmdr. Flipper, wasn't it?
Posted by CaptainMike (Member # 709) on :
since the mirror universe depends on the concept of alternate universes, i have no trouble believing there are a couple of causal permutations of that universe.. also there's the 'Mirror Universe Saga' comics where the movie era 1701-mirror was commandeered by Admiral Kirk from our universe and destroyed, only to have a standoff of mirror Excelsiors (alternate epoch in both dimensions, since in both universes the events dont fit into any canon)
i made a quick pic for some dudes website, only to have him not use it. he didnt like how i pointed out his ICC registry scheme was not in keeping with the original episode.. (BTW, in "mirror, mirror" the 1701 had identical marknigs to the Enterprise, but the raised WNMHGB bridge dome for some reason.. wierd, huh?) Posted by Griffworks (Member # 1014) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jim NCC1701A: What would a movie-era version of the Mirror Universe's ISS Enterprise look like?
A straight copy of "our" Enterprise doesn't seem right, and it'd be the easy way out.
More heavily armed would be pretty much a given. Photorps at the base of the neck, or below the bridge ala TOS. Armored bridge? Dare I say it, hull plating like the NX-01? More macho secondary hull and warp nacelles? Definately loose the botanical section.
Those are the ideas I've been playing with (but I'm hopeless at artwork so don't even ask for a sketch ).
Anyone think of something different to add to the mix that I may've overlooked?
Heh... I've chatted about this very subject fairly recently w/my friend Barry Yoner. We had sort of envisioned a timeline for the Mirror Universe based off the DC Comics, in which Spock never attempted to subvert or destroy Kirk, seeing that he would need to find a network of people to help him. A Fifth Column, if you will.
Anyhow, here are the armaments as I envision them. Basically, I went FanBoy with my thinking: 2 each fore and aft firing photorp tubes as seen below:
(Image courtesy of Barry Yoner and is of his stripped for refurbishment U.S.S. Bonaventure model he built for his Star Trek club up in Edomonton, Alberta, Canada.)
Possible additional photorp tubes mounted on the rim of the primary hull, tho more of "emergency" tubes of a one- or two-shot nature.
I also picture pairs of phasers in a number of locations on the ship. I was going for a look on the primary hull (saucer) not unlike the Excelsior class placement. I was thinking that the two single-mount phasers above the shuttlebay would be dual mounts, as well as those on the bottom of the secondary hull. Add a "launch bay" in the fantail for some sort of small fighter meant to enhance the offensive capabilities of the Imperial Edict (?) class heavy cruisers. Something that was fairly maneuverable and could pack a bit of a punch against other capital ships. Maybe a slightly more advanced version of the "Killer Bee"? Maybe turn the botanical garden section into a launch/recovery bay for same. Or turn that same area into a ground troop (Imperial Marines, anyone?) barracks or training area for same.
I also figured for larger sensor arrays. Basically, take out the inserts for the windows on the ERTL Refit model sort of like was done on that one model in TNG, tho don't put the nacelles on sideways. In place of all those lounges you'd have long-range or at least short range pin-point accurate sensors. The better to pull off assassinations from orbit using the ships phasers, right?
I plan to build a model version of this ship one day, and have plans for the expanded photorp bay from Barry Yoner. However, I won't put the Earth Empire pennant as large as the deflector array. It will be very large-sized, tho. Posted by Jim NCC1701A (Member # 1021) on :
quote:(but I'm hopeless at artwork so don't even ask for a sketch )
But I've been known to do the occasional nasty cut-n-paste...
Put this thing together 3-4 years ago. Would change a few things if I was to start over but I'd probably keep the sec hull (lifted from another fellow's schematics....)
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Yep. John does great work. The DataSheets he makes for four of his ship designs is just awesome. You can find them at Federation Models, check in the Products section.
However, in keeping with it being James Kirk's Enterprise, I'd keep it as a "Constitution" refit design, just slightly modified.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
There were a bunch of mirror universe designs up at shipschematics.net, back when that place still existed. Or does it persist? Anyway.
Posted by Griffworks (Member # 1014) on :
Jim has a bunch of Alternate Universe designs in his Other Races section, to include Jim Leary's version previously seen in this thread.
[ June 06, 2003, 05:12 PM: Message edited by: Griffworks ]
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I was part of the Terran Empire Sim Association for many years over on AOL. I built the specs for several ships & even built models of 1 or 2.
The ISS Tempest was on Starship Modeler for a while in an old, old Gallery probably since converted to CD by John Lester. It was a Sovereign painted in dark, dark metallics & greys & was fairly bristling with weaponry. I used battleship turrets (both tri-barreled main guns & smaller secondaries) with where cut into the hull & could rotate. I also used various gunship weapons & tank cannons. I also upped the torpedo tubes & the like. I also wrote the specs for Wraith & Omen.
No, I did not name the ships. But I DID choose the info for Wraith's dedication plaque, including the quote.
Posted by Jim NCC1701A (Member # 1021) on :
quote:to include Jim Leary's version previously seen in this thread
Famous at last Thanx Griff.
quote:However, in keeping with it being James Kirk's Enterprise, I'd keep it as a "Constitution" refit design, just slightly modified.
I agree, although to be honest I'd thought of John's C de L too. It's the ultimate for when you absolutely, positively have to destroy every last ship in the sector. Accept no substitutes. You could even argue that it's derived from a Connie with it's sec. hull - but that might be a bit of a stretch. Found some (sanctioned by John) artwork here http://www.scifi-meshes.com/gallery/data/501/4836_final_coeur_de_lion.jpg It's a bit too large to display here though.
IIRC, didn't Scotty make some comment in Mirror Mirror about the technology being not as advanced as the Federations? Or am I getting mixed up with one of the novels?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Take of the roll-bars and you have yourself an proto-Excelsior-study-model-four-naceller!
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jim NCC1701A: What would a movie-era version of the Mirror Universe's ISS Enterprise look like?
Definately loose the botanical section.
The botanical section could be a prisoner/convict/slave hold?
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Just reading the rest of the thread... I don't think there should be too much difference between the external appearance of the ships of the different universes... because The Enterprise was basically still the Enterprise... the internal structure/room usage might have been different but the ships were essentially the same.
I like that Couer De Leon SP? I reckon it would be perfect for a normal universe kitbash ship... It's a great idea. maybe loose one of the two roll bars... ALTHOUGH I like that idea of the roll-bar being underneath - something you can't do with the Normal Miranda because of the nacelles... opens a whole new idea for roll-bars! Posted by Jim NCC1701A (Member # 1021) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Take of the roll-bars and you have yourself an proto-Excelsior-study-model-four-naceller!
Or a stretched one of these... (blatantly patting myself on the back ) Another of my cut-n-pastes - Enterprise saucer with a Starfury body. I did the top view, and Jim Stevenson did the front and sides (I didn't have those views of the Starfury). Personally I woulda made the nacelle pylons thinner and kept all 4 nacelles "right way up", but that's just me.
quote:I don't think there should be too much difference between the external appearance of the ships of the different universes
Just change some of the details, ya reckon? Enough to show they're from different cultures / mindsets.
Posted by darkwing_duck1 (Member # 790) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jim NCC1701A: IIRC, didn't Scotty make some comment in Mirror Mirror about the technology being not as advanced as the Federations? Or am I getting mixed up with one of the novels? [/QB]
Must've come from a novel. In the episode "Mirror, Mirror", he said about the tech "mostly changes in instrumentation, nothing I can't handle".
Anyways, as for the possibilities offered in other posts, if you lost that third nacelle off of the Belisarius, then I think she'd make a creditable Connie Refit for the MU.
Posted by Captain39 (Member # 1001) on :
http://www.shipschematics.net/ I love the Oberth being converted to a light destroyer. It's like looking at a really nice dressed middle school kid try to be a bully to high schoolers. I dunno maybe it's just the medication... Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
That's a nice ship... but that ship with the two roll-bars has put the secondary hull sorta behind the primary hull - and made it in line - allowing the nacelles to start further back. Sorta like that study-model.
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