Heh, that's not a bad looking ship, all things considered. It'd have a lot more interior volume in the primary hull, too.
It could lose the checkerboard flux chillers, though.
[shields] Maybe we could get Ron Moore to do a "re-imagining" of TOS with this ship. Ira could produce. [/shields]
Marian
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
Wow . . . she's beautiful. I'd thought of some tweaks on the 1701 to bring her more in line with the continuity between the pre-E and the A . . . a little bit of blue nacelle glow on the inboard sides, some blue glow behind the old dish . . . but damn . . . I never would've gone this far, and it was clearly my mistake to not do so.
That said, though, the side view needs some buildup aft of the bridge . . . the top view seems to show a superstructure which is not visible in the side view, and which (in my aesthetic opinion (ha!)) is needed to make the saucer flow better down to the impulse deck.
There's also a bit of an optical illusion in regards to the saucer, I think. The ventral side has the pre-E's little jag on the way down to the sensor array bubble . . . that sharp angle that cuts in before the round bottom section. In the pic, it looks like the part that should be horizontal isn't horizontal . . . I can't tell in looking at the pic if that's because it isn't horizontal, or whether it's because the connecting dorsal and the front of the secondary hull seem to make it all one big curve.
Anyway, if I were actually thinking this could be the 2260's Enterprise, I might've tweaked the engines a bit more to bring them further from the 2150's nacelle design.
But don't get me wrong. Even though I've mentioned all those little tweaks, I love this ship.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Bleurgh!
It's a travesty! The original 1701 is a beatiful ship. This thing is an abomination Posted by Futurama Guy (Member # 968) on :
OOOOOOOOohh...
it's shiny! Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
I agree that this design could possibly serve in some sort of "reimagining" of TOS, were such a thing to occur. However, it would still be nothing but a pale shadow of the original, as are all ships that came after her.
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
Reimagining of TOS? I'd like to burn the memos, if any, that mention such ideas Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
Not bad as an intermediate concept, although it could certainly do with having the details toned down somewhat, at the moment it's far too much of a literal re-jiggling of the NX-01.
Posted by jesus X (Member # 1201) on :
That's really a beautiful design, when viewed in line of the Star Trek: Enterprise style. It's quite realistic. Frankly, I can see that as a ship design circa 2200, a step between the NX class and the Constitution. Maybe halfway between in size too. That's really nice.
Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
Yeah, you're right, 225 meters versus 289. Maybe this bad boy is 260 meters. Posted by blssdwlf (Member # 1024) on :
Hmm, its a nice design for an alternate trek reality series like Enterprise
However, if this were an outgrowth of the NX-01, I would expect it to be catamaran style, NOT 1701 style with its distinctive primary/secondary/nacelles layout. From an evolutionary standpoint, there really isn't a connection from NX-01 to 1701. This design could work as an intermediary ship, perhaps 50 years before the 1701.
But, the original 1701 will always to me look better than any "re-imagined" version. (And the refit-1701 will just be as untouchable ) They got them right the first time.
Posted by MrNeutron (Member # 524) on :
Maybe it's what the ISS Enterprise should have looked like.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by MrNeutron: Maybe it's what the ISS Enterprise should have looked like.
Not a bad idea, really: a oppressive government would likely have kept to the "unpainted" look of the NX-01 and gone more for function than form in it's starships.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon:
quote:Originally posted by MrNeutron: Maybe it's what the ISS Enterprise should have looked like.
Not a bad idea, really: a oppressive government would likely have kept to the "unpainted" look of the NX-01 and gone more for function than form in it's starships.
Maybe the series "Enterprise" ends up being the Mirror Mirror universe!?!
As for opressive governments... Earthforce in B5 feels like an oppressive government (well we know it was with Clark etc) but even the feel of it before hand. Like, to make their mark in the Galaxy, it had to be through military conflict... Something that seems more like what the Narn were like. I suppose the Earth-Minbari war 10 years previous would still be very fresh in Earth's mind and thus the government and the people would still be militaristic and have darker overtones.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
The Earth Alliance was pretty easy-going up until the Minbari War, actually. Just the fact that they had GONE through such a massive conflict and nearly went extinct in it made them more susceptible to totalitarian overtures, like the US was to McCarthy-ism in the fifties. And, of course, EA warships are all business and no pleasure because the Alliance's level of technology doesn't permit form to precede function, so that has little to do with the tone of its government.
Posted by Commander Dan (Member # 558) on :
quote:Originally posted by blssdwlf: But, the original 1701 will always to me look better than any "re-imagined" version. (And the refit-1701 will just be as untouchable ) They got them right the first time.
Amen.
Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
I wonder how this ship would look, with the pearlescent colors of the refit.
Posted by MarianLH (Member # 1102) on :
Speaking of which, the movie refit would be a lot more plausible if this were the original.
Marian
Posted by jesus X (Member # 1201) on :
Agreed that the original was very near-perfect. Truly a think of beauty, a work of art. But we can have fun with the design, since it doesn't detract. Recently I played with the design to make the pylons slightly more TMP like, moving the base conenction forward, and the nacelle connection back, with a slant and widening it. I didn't taper the pylons though. Maybe I'll post a pic. Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
IS the Polar Lights model of the NX-01 out yet?
Posted by MarianLH (Member # 1102) on :
Be interesting to see the same treatment applied to Reliant.
Marian
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
quote:Originally posted by blssdwlf: But, the original 1701 will always to me look better than any "re-imagined" version. (And the refit-1701 will just be as untouchable ) They got them right the first time.
So the Enterprise-A looks just as good as the original, even though a "re-imagined" version (which is pretty much what the Ent-A is) would never look as good as the original?
Buh?
Posted by Capt.Blair245 (Member # 1113) on :
Sorry for changing the subject but when reading that site it said an error was that Spock had 3 ears. Anyone got a pic?
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
Uh, I think that picture (and the whole site) was just a joke...
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
The design makes it look like little has changed in 100 years. Especially when compaired to how much changes in the next 100
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Like how the Miranda, KBOP, Excelsior and Oberth didint really change in 100 years?
Mabye that's what the E-Nil looks like before they added the white panels....it could be a pic of a Connie that's 90% completed. Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Well, obviously the ships that already existed didn't change much (on the outside, anytime they beam over to an old ship, the insides look new) but the designs have progressed alot compaired to the NX and this ship.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
You mean like the ships introduced in First Contact over the BOBW fleet?
Radical design departures spring up during times of war and conflict: the Connie after the Romulan War and the FC ships after Wolf 359.
Mabye the Daedalus after the conflict with the Xindi and the Federation's formation.
Just a thought.
Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
I wonder what movies, in another 40 years, will make it look like?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
A big CGI chrome blob like the Queen's ships in Episode I.
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
The SR-71 is not a 'blob'.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Connies after the Romulan War!?!
The Romulan war was at the FOUNDING of the Federation. (Found another reference to this - from "Homefront", i think it was when Sisko was telling Jaresh Inyo how dire the Dominion situation was. That Earth will not have seen a war like it since the FOUNDING of the FEDERATION.)
Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
ENTERPRISE third season is 2153, the Earth Romulan war is set at about 2156, ending with the treaty of Algernon, in 2160. The founding of the Federation is firmly established as being in 2161.
Actually, currently we're in early 2154. Probably around mid-February, possibly early March.
Posted by MarianLH (Member # 1102) on :
I said "Be interesting to see the same treatment applied to Reliant." Can't any of you incredibly gifted graphic artist types take a hint?
I wish I knew how to do stuff like that. So many ideas, and no way to express them...
Marian
Posted by TheWoozle (Member # 929) on :
The NX-01 could easily BE a fore runner to the Reliant.. or the Akira, heh heh.
Posted by MarianLH (Member # 1102) on :
quote:Originally posted by TheWoozle: The NX-01 could easily BE a fore runner to the Reliant.. or the Akira, heh heh.
Translation: "I don't know how to use Photoshop either."
Marian
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by TheWoozle: ENTERPRISE third season is 2153, the Earth Romulan war is set at about 2156, ending with the treaty of Algernon, in 2160. The founding of the Federation is firmly established as being in 2161.
Sisko definately said "since the founding of the Federation" - and since no ENTERPRISE - that would point to the Earth-Romulan war.
There's a set date for founding of the Federation - but not of the E-R war is there?
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
Well, he didn't say "Romulan war". He could have been referring to anything. If the Xindi attack somehow leads to the founding of the Federation, even that might count. (I'd say the amount of destruction caused to Earth even by that one weapon would qualify as pretty servere.)
And the Naboo ships in Episode 1 and 2 were plainly very, very pretty. Foolish Jason.
Posted by Nim the Fanciful (Member # 205) on :
Hmm, a theoretical "War Arc" with the romulans might be just the kind of transfusion Enterprise needs...
Posted by Nim the Fanciful (Member # 205) on :
Just noticed, if you add a "2" to that link in the beginning of the thread, you get a nice front view too.
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: And the Naboo ships in Episode 1 and 2 were plainly very, very pretty. Foolish Jason.
If completely lacking in imagination.
Posted by blssdwlf (Member # 1024) on :
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam:
quote:Originally posted by blssdwlf: But, the original 1701 will always to me look better than any "re-imagined" version. (And the refit-1701 will just be as untouchable ) They got them right the first time.
So the Enterprise-A looks just as good as the original, even though a "re-imagined" version (which is pretty much what the Ent-A is) would never look as good as the original?
Buh?
Buh?
The E-A isn't "re-imagined" unless you are smokin crack
Read it again. Both the original connie and the refit were done right.
If you're ruffled and think the Ent-style is how everything should look, thats your opinion like I have mine.
[rant] The next thing you'll know, we'll see "re-imagined" Defiants, Excelsiors, Reliants, E-Cs,E-Ds and Constellation classes.
And then "re-imagined" X-Wings, Y-Wings, A-Wings, Star Destroyers, Babylon stations, Starfuries, Vipers (oh wait, too late, someone already did that ) [/rant]
Oh where was I, that's right, the refit isn't "re-imagined" because its a new ship. Not someone coming along and saying, hey, this is the exact same ship that was in TOS (wink wink).
Posted by aneurysm (Member # 906) on :
Either way, it is still a shit design...
Posted by Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Do better.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
You say that the original is the best design. No attept at "re-imagining" it would make it better, since it was perfect the first time. It didn't need changing.
The refit Enterprise was, to all intents and purposes, a "re-imagining". They took the original design, and modified it, to make it look better.
You say that the original is perfect. You say that any reinterpretation of the design would be rubbish. You say that the refit Enterprise is also perfect.
See?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"Oh where was I, that's right, the refit isn't 're-imagined' because its a new ship. Not someone coming along and saying, hey, this is the exact same ship that was in TOS (wink wink)."
Eh? It was the same ship. It just had different outsides stuck on it. And some different insides. But it was the same ship. That's why it's called a "refit".
But, really, it was a sort of reimagining. They were saying "here's how we should have done the ship in the first place, if we could have". Just like the Klingons.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN: It was the same ship. It just had different outsides stuck on it. And some different insides. But it was the same ship. That's why it's called a "refit".
Bullshit: a refit is a upgrade of an existing system to accomidate new tech or fic design flaws: not replacing every single part, inside and out. That's just building a whole new ship....slowly.
Posted by MarianLH (Member # 1102) on :
Originally posted by Jason Abbadon:
quote:Bullshit: a refit is a upgrade of an existing system to accomidate new tech or fic design flaws: not replacing every single part, inside and out. That's just building a whole new ship....slowly.
Officially, it's a refit. In any universe based on physics and engineering, it's a new ship. Which do you choose? Ah, the joys of being a Treknolophile...
Marian
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I think they started refitting the old Enterprise, kinda got on a roll and eventually replaced everything. Realising that they could've built two new ships in the same amount of time, they officially called it an "extensive refit" to cover their own asses with Admiral Nagura.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Irrespective of the "in-universe" events, the Enterprise as redesigned for TMP was, from a production standpoint, a definite re-imagining of the ship from the original series. They took the basic layout of the ship and updated it to suit the bigger budget and better production values that a film project provided over a TV project.
By the way, I do not wish this to be misconstrued as a bashing of either the original or updated designs. (They're both good, though personally I do like the original better.) But to say objectively that the refit wasn't intended as a "re-imagining" is ridiculous. It most certainly was.
Now, with that out of the way, the "ENT-style" version. It looks terrible. Very ungainly and lacking in grace, and the drab coloration only amplifies its ugliness. 'Nuff said. (And this is coming from someone who is largely fine with the appearance of the NX-01, even though I *do* wish it was made to look more retro.)
-MMoM Posted by blssdwlf (Member # 1024) on :
Its probably because "re-imagining" equates for me to "out-universe" events of writers/producers/powersthatbe coming along and writing off what existed before (the original "in-universe" and replacing it with "re-imagined" material as done in BSG re-imagined). The refit isn't "re-imagined" to me because it did not attempt to erase the existence of the original.
I do get what psyliam is trying to get at, but I don't agree with the interpretation.
quote:Originally posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim:
Irrespective of the "in-universe" events, the Enterprise as redesigned for TMP was, from a production standpoint, a definite re-imagining of the ship from the original series. They took the basic layout of the ship and updated it to suit the bigger budget and better production values that a film project provided over a TV project.
By the way, I do not wish this to be misconstrued as a bashing of either the original or updated designs. (They're both good, though personally I do like the original better.) But to say objectively that the refit wasn't intended as a "re-imagining" is ridiculous. It most certainly was.
Now, with that out of the way, the "ENT-style" version. It looks terrible. Very ungainly and lacking in grace, and the drab coloration only amplifies its ugliness. 'Nuff said. (And this is coming from someone who is largely fine with the appearance of the NX-01, even though I *do* wish it was made to look more retro.)
-MMoM
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Well, the in-universe refitting was simply an excuse to re-imagine the ship from the creative/production staff's standpoint. But I understand your point, and I recognize the distinction. I think we can agree that it is a good thing that there are no plans to do a BSG-type remake of Star Trek.
-MMoM Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
The problem with reimaging things is that some people will like the new stuff more and pretend that it retroactively wipes the old stuff from existence, and some people will like the old stuff more and pretend that it proactively wipes the new stuff from existence. And then they will beat each other senseless over it.
Posted by Nim the Fanciful (Member # 205) on :
And the Naboo fighters being dull will have to stand for Jason. I feel they are a great addition to the otherwise boxy and grey SW-ships, inspired by the same sleekness and aesthetic excellence that the P-51 Mustang has.
The only drawbacks I see with the Refit Enterprise is that they made the nacelle-pylons widen towards the nacelle instead of towards the main hull, making the pylons look like bell-bottom pants to me. Same with the "neck", should've had a broad base that thinned towards the saucer. All this from a profile POV, natch. Also, launchers firing backwards out of the neck, like with that last version of the Constitution class.
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
"Last version of the Constitution class"?
And surely the nacelles would have looked more like bell-bottom pants if they were wider at the bottom than at the top, since, er, that's what bell-bottom pants look like?
Still, at least we can agree that the "reimagined" Red Dwarf looked shit.
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
I think he means the America (sub)class or whatever it was called. Enterprise II class I think it was really called. The USS America NCC-1847? was a member. Basically a refit Connie with modified impulse housing, widened nacelle pylons and an aft torpedo launcher.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Nim the Fanciful: And the Naboo fighters being dull will have to stand for Jason.
I said the Naboo royal ships were dull blobs o' chrome: I sorta like the fighters (though they're too small}. I've seen many really nice model build-ups of naboo fighters made to be old weathered and rusted ships (as they'd appear in A New Hope's era).
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