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Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

In "Highlander: The Series", we see a whole society of Immortals (well, society of sort) ... you've got Duncan MacLeod, Amanda, Methos, Richie, their friends, etcetra ...

And you've still got a lot of badguys for Mac to whack!

Hey ... that rhymes ... Mac to whack ...

Actually, MacLeod rarely kills more than 11 or 13 Immortals per season, with 22 eps average per season ... but even a lot of the eps where he doesn't kill a K'Immie FEATURES a K'Immie!

So how many Immortals are there? Where do they like to live?

I'd put the number at about 3 - 5,000, most living in the colder climates (easier to hide a sword under a long coat)...

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"When they come, kill them. We're not here to make friends." -- Connor

"But you're my friend." -- Duncan

"Count yourself lucky." -- Connor

Highlander: The Element of Fire

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

Would be cool to see a list or number of all immortals ever shown in the movies and series. Shouldn't be impossible...

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And keep your foot off that blasted samoflanche!

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

I know there's a list somewhere ...

Oooooh! Here we go:
Http://www.highlander.org/FAQ/FAQ-4.html#4.3

Highlander I & III Immies:

Juan Sanchez Filla Loboz Ramirez (D)- Kurgan
Kurgan (D) - CM
Sundra Kastagir (D) - Kurgan
Iman Fasil (D) - CM
Wasilycz (D) - Kurgan
Connor MacLeod (D) - Duncan MacLeod (DM)
Kane (D) - CM
Kane Henchman I (D) - Kane
Kane Henchman II (D)- CM
Nakano (D) - Kane

Highlander II Immies: (listed seperately, TPTB have said Highlander II is not cannon)

Katana (D)- CM
Ugly Flying Dude 1 (D) - CM
Ugly Flying Dude 2 (D) - CM

Highlander: The Series & Highlander: The Raven Immies:

Pompeii Circa-79 ad Immortal (?)
Pompeii Circa-79 ad Immortal #2 (?)
Duncan MacLeod
Slan Quince (D) - DM
Lucas Desiree (D) - Howard Crowley
Howard Crowley (D) - DM
Kiem Sun
Felicia Martins
Devereux (D) - Felicia Martins
Caleb Cole (D) - DM
Carl The Hermit (D) - Caleb Cole
Walter Reinhardt (D) - DM
Alexei Voshin (D) - DM
Andrew Ballin (D) - DM
Marcus Korolus (D) - DM (FB)
Grayson (D)- DM
Darius (D)- James Horton (mortal renegade Watcher)
Kuyler (D)- DM
Xavier St. Cloud (D) - DM
Ursa
Grace Chandler
Carlo Sendaro (D) - DM
Amanda Montrose/Deverieux
Zachary Blaine (D) - Amanda
Alfred Cahill (D) - DM
Gabriel Piton (D) - DM
Col. Everett Ballian
Hugh Fitzcairn (D)- Kalas
Gregor Powers
Michael Moore/Quenten Barnes (D) - DM
James (D)- Renegade Watcher
Richie Ryan (D)- DM
Annie Devlin
Carl Robinson
Anthony Gallen (D) - DM
Thomas Sullivan (D)- DM
Mako (D)- RR
Anton LeGris (D)- Xavier St. Cloud
Jason Talbot (D)- Xavier St. Cloud
Michel De Bourgogne (D)- DM
Nicholas Ward (D)- DM
Arthur Drake/Drakov (D)- DM
Nefertiri (D)- DM
Marcus Constantine (yes, THAT Marcus Constantine!)
Luther (D)- DM
Rebecca Horne (D)- Luther
Martin Hyde (D)- DM
Segur (D) - Martin Hyde
Charles Browning of York (?)
Michael Kent (D)- DM
Kern (D)- DM
Paul Karros (D) - DM - this guy knew Spartacus!
John Durgan (D)- DM
Axel Whittaker (D)- DM
Sharon (D)- Axel Whittaker
Michelle Webster
Brion Cullen (D)- DM
Zoltan Laszlo
Kenny
Dallman Ross (D)- Kenny
Frank Brody (D)- Kenny FB
Sean The Drummer Boy (D) - Unknown
David Keogh
Garrick (D)- DM
Benny Carbassa
Lyman Kerlow (D)- DM
Peter Matlin (D)- DM
Michael Christian (D)- DM
May-Ling Shen (D) Michael Cristian
Trent (D) - Michael Christian
John Kirin/Cage
Bro. Paul (D) - Kalas
Bro. Timon (D) - Kalas FB
Kalas (D)- DM
Methos
Ceirdwyn
Kristov (D)- RR
Ernst Daimler (D) - DM
Lucas Kagan (D) - DM
Kagan's Teacher (D) - DM FB
Hamza El Kahir (D)- Xavier St. Cloud FB
Unknown Paris Immortal (D)- Kalas
Peter Hale (D) - Kalas FB

Okay, now I'm continuing on the liner notes for my "Highlander" video collection, so I might miss one or two ... I've got Seas. IV and V, and Raven ... but not Seas. VI (blech!)

Kanwulf (D)- DM
Andrew Cord (D)- DM
Mikey (D)- RR
Tyler King (D)- DM
Unamed Immortal (D)- Tyler King
Peter Kanis (D)- DM
Kamir (D)- DM
Kristin (D)- Methos
Walter Graham
Claudia Jardin
Kit O'Brady
Terence Kincaid (D)- DM
Col. Simon Killian (D) - DM
Paul Kinman (D)- DM
Bryce Korland (D)- Jim Coltec
Unamed Immortal (D)- Jim Coltec
Jim Coltec (D)- DM
Sean Burns (D)- DM
Jakob Galati (D)- Watchers (DM recieves Quickening)
Irena Galati (D)- Renegade Watcher James Horton,
Kassim
Danny Cimoli (D)- Unamed Vegas Immortal
Unamed Vegas Immortal
Damon Case (D)- DM
FB Student of MacLeod's (D)- Damon Case
Warren Cochrane
Andrew Donnelly (D) - Warren Cochrane
Morgan D'Estaing (D)- DM
Robert de Valicourt
Gina de Valicourt
Cassandra, Witch of the Donan Woods
Roland Kantos (D)- DM
Grahame Ashe (D) - Haresh Clay - Ramirez's teacher!
Carter Wellan (D)- RR
Haresh Clay (D)- DM
Mathew McCormick
Johnny K (D)- DM
Terence Coventry
Cory Raines
Alec Hill (D) - RR
Gerard Kragen (D)- DM
Derek
Ancient South American Immortal (D) - Gavriel Lorca
Gavriel Lorca (D)- DM
New Immie #1 (D)- Gavriel Lorca
New Immie #2
The Messenger/Methos Imposter (D)- William Culbraith
William Culbraith (D)- RR
Ingrid Henning (D)- DM
Koren/Kronos (D)- DM
Silas (D)- Methos
Caspian/Caspari (D) - DM
Otavio Consone (D)- DM
Steven Keane
Lord Byron (D) - DM - yes, *that* Lord Byron
Hans Kershner (D)- Lord Byron FB
Basil Morgan
Mario Cardoza (D)- Amanda
William Kenworthy (D)- killed by pre-Immie Nick Wolfe
Stefan Collier (D)- Amanda
Simon Clark (D)- Amanda
Talia Bauer (D)- Amanda
Jade
Derrik Markham (D)- Amanda
Liam Riley
Jeremy Dexter
Vladimir Raenkov (D)- Amanda
Dr. Julian Heller (D)- Amanda
Sean
Sean's Female Friend
Sean's Male Friend
Even Peyton (D)- Amanda
John Ray Fielding
Wilson Geary (D)- Amanda
Marco (D)- Wilson Geary
Victor Hansen
Korda (D)- Amanda
Korda's Female Ally (D)- Amanda
Frank Brennan (D) - Amanda
Nick Wolfe
Kell (D)- DM
Faith (D)- Kell
Jin (D) - Kell
Ancient #1 - # 11(D) - Kell, Kell, Kell, etc.
Cracker Bob (D) - Kell - anyone else know of any of the other "Endgame" Immies? These were all I could find out ...

I also have *no* info for Immies from Seas. VI ... so ... here's what I've got!

Okay, I added who killed whom ... DM is Duncan MacLeod, CM is Connor MacLeod, RR is Richie Ryan ... FB means it happened in a flashback.

Top Immortal Warriors:

kills only from TV episodes or movies where we actually *see* the Quickening, or hear direct reference to another Immortal killed

Duncan MacLeod: 61 kills (not including Seas. VI kills and novel !!canon!! kills)

Jacob Kell: 14 kills

Amanda (Amanda?!): 13 kills

Connor MacLeod: 7 kills (well, we didn't see him much...)

Richie Ryan: 6 kills

Kalas: 5 kills

Xavier St. Cloud: 3 kills

Kurgan: 3 kills

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited November 15, 2000).]

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

Then there's General Katana and his two ratfaced boys in the future. And Van Peebles and his mongol-pals. And all those guys from the last movie, the new one.
There's some polish guy you only saw a picture of in the first movie when Connor was interrogated, is he up there?

Everyone should be listed, simply because they are immortal. Squabbles about canonity is irrelevant in that regard.

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And keep your foot off that blasted samoflanche!

[This message has been edited by Nimrod (edited November 15, 2000).]

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Damn! I completely skipped over Highlander III ...

Highlander II was just ... well, lets not even go there!

Wasilycz is up there, near the top. Hold on, let me go amend the list to add H3 to it ...

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

The "Endgame" Immies are at the bottom, starting with Kell. There were a LOT!

You've got Kell, Fain, Jin ... 11 Ancient Immortals who were with Connor at Sanctuary ... Cracker Bob is the only one of Kell's other henchman I got the name for, but there at least two or three others ...

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

Am I the only one who finds it slightly ironic that there's an immortal named "Kenny"? :-)

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"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000

Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :

Dude, you need to get on the phone with your lawyer. "There can be only one"? That's the most blatent case of false advertising since Uncle Heinrich's Non-Flammable Zeppelin Gas.

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What did it mean to you
An early chat with death
To pull your body for a moment from your soul
--
Camper Van Beethoven
****
Read chapter one of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! Gonna donate half my money to the city.

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Actually, Highlander II is non-canon, per Davis and Panzer.

Um ... I just remembered the novels ARE canon too ... Damn, let me go find them ...

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

You know whats even funnier?

Kenny "died" when he was 10 or so, so he's been a little boy for the past 850 years ... (imagine the built up sexual tension...)

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :

Yeah, he wanted to throw the fuck into Amanda. Can y'blame him, though?

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"Omigod. Singing meat. This is altogether too much."

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

::drooling::

Amanda ...

Course, she looks a lot better w/ shoulder-length black hair then with that crew-cut platinum blonde look -- yech!

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

Ok, now I'm gonna go deeper.
Most of the baddies we've seen have been forced to cope with their immortality by themselves.
Connor is an exception. I never saw the Duncan-pilot so I don't know if he had a mentor. Don't know about Amanda either.

But Ramirez, samaritan as he was, how could he know that he looked for Connor particulary? ("-Vat do you want? -You!") Did he always go around and teach newbies the rules and ways, like some Kenobi??
And the Kurgan! How could he have known about Connor AND pointed him out to the Frasiers before Connor's gift even had manifested?? It's all so organized, I don't get it.

And who's Davis and Panzer?

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And keep your foot off that blasted samoflanche!

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Connor *was* Duncan's mentor. He found Duncan two years after Duncan became Immortal (poor Mac -- he thought he was the devil)

There are Immortals, like Ramirez (and Connor), who teach other Immies how to fight and survive. They do this because they do not care if they themselves survive, as long as a Good Immortal wins the Prize and not an evil one.

A good example is Rebecca Horne, whose whole existance (well, at least from the 9th century and on) was based on teaching new Immortals how to survive and fight. She taught one of them (Luther) too well, because he came back and killed her.

Older Immortals can "sense" a pre-Immortal. This is why MacLeod "adopted" Richie in a sense ... he knew that Richie would become an Immortal.

Now, how Kurgan knew who Connor was before they met, I don't know ... but older Immies have been known to have strange powers, and maybe Kurgan was psychic (for example, Roland Kantos had the *voice* and Cassandra had *prophecy*). A more reasonable explanation is that Kurgan either passed through the Glenfinnen a few years earlier and "sensed" pre-Immie Connor (a sense of honor perhaps kept Kurgan from killing Connor then), or another Immortal (a student, a friend) of Kurgan's sensed Connor and told Kurgan about him.

Or, an Immie told Ramirez about a Scottish pre-Immie named Connor MacLeod, and somehow Kurgan found out and went to Scotland to take MacLeod's Quickening and find Ramirez (the two have a LONG past with each other, in case you hadn't noticed).

This isn't all that unexpected: Duncan encounters an Immortal hermit who was waited in a cave for six hundred years to meet Duncan, for the sole purpose of giving Duncan his head to help in the "upcoming battle" against Ahriman (a Persian demon).

Also, Cassandra was in the Donan Woods near Glenfinnen for a century or two, waiting for the Immortal child born on the winter solstace, who would in time, kill the Immortal Roland Kantos.

Panzer/Davis are the the Executive Producers of Highlander and The Series. They are in fact, what Gene Roddenberry and Michael Piller and Rick Berman etc. are to Star Trek.

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited November 17, 2000).]

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Er ... there's also a popular (but unofficial) theory that an old Immortal can use the Quickening to sense another Immortal's name ...

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Posted by Free ThoughtCrime America (Member # 480) on :

so... we keep hearing about how bad ass certain immortals are because they have so many kills, or "charges". But it's never made clear why they are considered so unbeatable. I assume it's because they have so much experience (having killed six hundred odd immortals in duels must mean you are good with a sword, eh?) Is there another reason? Do they heal up faster with the higher charges of quickening inside them? Perhaps they possess the knowledge and skill of the other warriors? Even the stamina? Which of course would explain how Duncan gets laid so often.

Fuck, I hate him. None of the evil immortals seem to get much ass. This would tend to make you evil, if nothing else would.

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Between the idea and the reality, comes the Shadow

Posted by Teelie (Member # 280) on :

*lmao*

I hate the HL4 reasoning, the more heads you are the better you are by default. Some Immortals (Methos for instance) can be literally millinea old and not have many heads but be highly skilled and not have the desire to kill.
Kalas was killing them for centuries in that monastary before Duncan find him out, and then there's That other, who knew Darius before he took that other ancient's head 1000's of years ago. Duncan killed him. You'd think he would have taken more heads than Duncan, and going by head count automatically will reduce the amount of new immortals out there if anyone with like 3 kills found a new one.

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Grayson was the Immortal stalking Darius. Darius was Grayson's teacher, but Darius challenged and defeated "the oldest living Immortal at the time" outside the gates of Paris fifteen hundred years before the ep and became a "good guy" ...

There's a popular theory that the older an Immortal gets, the more they tire of eternal life -- always fighting other Immortals, losing their loved ones -- and eventually, that wariness manifests itself in a fight and they lose.

I agree that the HL-4 reasoning blows. Unless Dawson is showing it to say, "hey, this guys really good 'cuz he's got the talent to kill six hundred plus Immortals! He knows how to use a sword!"

Look at Richie ... his first kill was SEVERAL HUNDRED years old, and the first Immortal he defeated (although he didn't kill her), was at least a hundred and fifty years old ... oh, yeah, he defeated her the first day he learned how to fight with a sword ... so, IMHO, the "more heads you take..." theory is BS ...

Although, in "The Immortal Cimoli", Danny Cimoli, who is a new Immortal, is told by Amanda that once he's "taken a few heads" he'll be better able to resist other, more experienced Immortals coming for him ...

Anyway ...

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant
Average Rated 6.83 out of 10 Smileys by Fabrux
***
"Oh, yes, screw logic, let's go for a theory with no evidence!"
-Forum Member Who Shall Be Nameless. 11:48am, Jan. 19th, 2001

Posted by Teelie (Member # 280) on :

The only thing that I can think of that would make sense from what Amanda said is he'd learn how to better defend himself or maybe the Quickening gives them some kind of skill level which is too RPG-ish to me.

Posted by Free ThoughtCrime America (Member # 480) on :

at least this shows I'm not the only one confused about that...

Anyway, what is the "official" timeline of the shows? Ignoring highlander 2, we still have a rather disjointed chronology to look at.

Hopefully you guys have seen all the movies:
but if not
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connor kills the Kurgan before the tv show starts. But in HL4: Endgame he's shown to have been in that coma chamber (or whatever the hell it was) for at least a decade. He was there for the first show of the series, and it's my guess that HL3, where he killed Kain and his butt monkeys(heh...what do you think they did in that cave for four hundred years?) came immediately after that. Did conner go into sanctuary after that, or did the third movie not happen? I mean, didn't he have an adopted son in the movie? Where the hell did he go? I haven't seen all the episodes, but still...

And, one last question. How long does the Gathering last? If it started in the first movie (ignoring the obvious fact that the immies in the movie believed they were the last, and that connor has won the prize at least three times now) and it's still going down three movies and a tv show later...That's at least a decade of subjective tv show time. Ritchie sure picked a bad time to become an immortal, right at the end of it. The only way it could work is if the Gathering is going to go on for awhile, say a few decades.

But they'll never explain that, will they? Gads, I despise reverse histronics. It would have been more convincing to simply say the movies didn't happen, and that the series was all on it's own. ... now that I think about it, that would have actually been preferable, because all the big screwups are from the movies.

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Between the idea and the reality, comes the Shadow

[This message has been edited by thoughtcriminal84 (edited January 21, 2001).]

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Highlander II and III never happened. (This is canon, by the way -- those two movies never happened)...

The events of 1985 New York can best be described as a "mini-Quickening", nature's way of keeping the numbers of Immortals low. It follows then that Connor, Kurgan, Kastagir and the other Immortals actually THOUGHT that it was the Gathering -- and in a way, it was -- just, not the final Gathering, but a mini- let's get rid of all the Immortals in New York ... (this is just a theory, mind you, but it seems the best one) ...

Connor hunts Slan Quince in the TV show's "The Gathering."

Shortly thereafter, the prologue of "Endgame" where Kell blows Rachel up occurs. Duncan MacLeod is in New York City ... one first season episode explains away Duncan's absense in the first act or two by having Richie mention Duncan being in "New York" ... this, therefore, makes the most sense as where to place the "Endgame" scene ... Connor enters the "sanctuary" shortly thereafter.

There is a year space between Seasons V and VI of Highlander: The Series.

"Endgame" probably takes place 3 years after the conclusion of "Highlander: The Series" and two years after the last episode of "Highlander: The Raven."

As for "The Gathering" (the event, not the episode), no one knows how long it will last. During the First Season of "Highlander: The Series", constant reference was made that the Gathering was, in fact, happening right then and there -- if that were true, many years would pass before the Gathering concluded. TPTB ignored references to the Gathering beginning with the second season (I guess they didn't expect the show to last that long), so it's anyone's guess as to how long the Gathering will actually be ...

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited January 21, 2001).]

Posted by Teelie (Member # 280) on :

I think they just keep changing their minds and muddling the movies up.
They should do some clarifying and changing of what happened in all 3 "current time" movies, ignoring 2 being in the future, obviously, but this still leaves 3 as being a bit of a quirk with the adopted son.

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

If they'd done III in "Series" continuity, maybe ... you know, just a quick drop off line about not winning the prize and Duncan running around somewhere ...

BUT those stupid bastards ...

Posted by Free ThoughtCrime America (Member # 480) on :

"heeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeee we are...the princes of the UN-EEEEEE-VERSE!"

cue wah wah pedal, thunderous drums.

Would this show have been half as cool without Queen? Nah.

Did Duncan ever kill Horton? I've always wondered.

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Between the idea and the reality, comes the Shadow

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Yeah, in "Counterfeit pt. II" ... Horton was running away, and Duncan yelled: "I thought you said you were the man I couldn't kill!" so Horton came at Mac with a switchblade and (with more than a little help from Mac) got it slammed into his chest.

And died.

Didn't stop him from coming back as a guest star in a flashback in one episode, and as the demon "Ahriman" in three more ... (although that arc sucked majorly)