We all know it was better than The Lost World...because that movie had a dinosaur break out of a cargo hold on a tanker, shred everybody on board, and then lock itself BACK in the cargo hold, awaiting the heroes to find it.
Minority Report is also better than Screamers because Tom Cruise has never played Robocop, like Peter Weller.
Was it better than, say: Mission Impossible 2? Yeah. MI2, the only movie to ever get Metallica to contribute a song for the soundtrack, was also one of the most incoherent Hollywood movies in recent memory. During the mess of Napster, that was exactly what we all needed.
It wasn't as good as Roger Corman's Death Race 2000, though.
So. Where do we stand, then?
Posted by The Real Folk Blues (Member # 510) on :
it was great. better than almost equally as great Gattaca.
Posted by The Same Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Mission: Impossible - 2: Unknowable Hypenation - Colonization at least had the whole "dove" thing. John Woo is perhaps the single greatest action director of our time.
Posted by The Real Folk Blues (Member # 510) on :
he's not as good as Edward Gein.
Posted by The Same Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Of course, I didn't actually mean that John Woo is the single greatest action director of our time.
Posted by The Real Folk Blues (Member # 510) on :
and i didn't mean that John Woo was not as good of an action director as Edward Gein. as far as i know, Edward Gein directed no movies, action or otherwise.
Posted by The Same Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Perhaps, somehow, they made a child?
Posted by The Real Folk Blues (Member # 510) on :
i don't think that the Edward Gein i'm talking about is related to either of them. Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
John Woo would've been the greatest, if he hadn't made Hard Target. You can't be the greatest with Jean Claude in one of your movies, no matter what.
Posted by The Real Folk Blues (Member # 510) on :
well, you also can't be the greatest if you ever SAW Jean Claude, as the sight of him soils you. i guess there can't be a greatest, since everybody who see movies has seen Jean Claude at least once, and nobody who doesn't watch movies is going to make action movies. sad, sad world. Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
Minority Report was also better than Cutthroat Island. This, I have decided.
The chunky AOLish 3-D effects for the videos swayed me on that.
ET was better than Minority Report. So Was Jaws.
I could rank it against Speilberg's other movies. Or Cruise's...but it's unfair to rank it thusly. How could Minority Report POSSIBLY compare with Days of Thunder? Cruise has just made SO MANY GOOD MOVIES!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
Jean Claude doesn't soil you. Steven Seagal soils you. Each movie has become even worse than the one before. And they still hire him?
At least Van Damme made Time Cop. Which was decent, if only for the future of pornography.
Posted by The Real Folk Blues (Member # 510) on :
hey, Steven SeaGull has a pony tail, so back off. jackass . nah, you're right. Seagal hasn't made a good movie since Under Seige, despite having made a lot of movies since then.
edited to fix non-working smiley
[ June 23, 2002, 03:09: Message edited by: The Real Folk Blues ]
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
"Minority Report." RIGHT. Then how come there's not one brutha or vato in the whole dayum THANG, yo?
Jes' the MAN puttin' us DOWN again, tryin' t'keep us in our PLACE, G..!
Posted by The Real Folk Blues (Member # 510) on :
quote: tryin' t'keep us in our PLACE
hey, you're the one that said it was your place, not us Posted by The Same Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
The Large, Scary, Bearded, Pony-Tailed Half-Jewish Richard Marcinko look-alike Minority has a place now? I never knew you were oppressed bt the man.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
No, I'm part of The Scrawny, Scary, Bearded, Pony-Tailed Half-Jewish Richard Marcinko look-alike Minority. The Large, Scary, Bearded, Pony-Tailed Half-Jewish Richard Marcinko look-alike Minority is who's oppressing us.
Posted by The Same Ultra Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Why can't you just get along?
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
They have stars on their bellies & we don't.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"i don't think that the Edward Gein i'm talking about is related to either of them."
Actually, if you look at IMDb's biography of Gidget Gein, it says "His stage name is a combination of the names of Gidget (a 60's 'beach party' movie icon) and serial killer Ed Gein.". So, they're unrelated biologically, perhaps, but not topically...
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
Any relationship to Marilyn Manson?
Posted by Ultimate Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Wha? Yet another aspect of El Grande MM that is completely unoriginal? As per Meathead, without Mr. Reznor, Manson would be nothing more than "Brian Warner and his Drum Machine."
Posted by DeadCujo (Member # 13) on :
I watched a Minority Report screening and I'd like to declare myself an expert on the subject of how bad Tom Cruise acts these days. Mission Impossible 2, Vanilla Sky, and Minority Report are three of the worst movies ever made. Tom Cruise can't seem to make his characters very believable anymore. The special effects in MR didn't impress me and neither did any of the stunts. The kids in the row behind me who wouldn't shut up were more entertaining.
Posted by Snay (Member # 411) on :
I agree about M:I:2. Haven't seen Minority Report.
But ... you didn't like Vanilla Sky? Why not?
Posted by DeadCujo (Member # 13) on :
The story and acting in the movie were both bad. And not just on Tom Cruise's part...Penelope Cruz shouldn't even act. Even Jason Lee wasn't very good, and I loved him in Kevin Smith's movies.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Gidget Gein was apparently Marilyn Manson's original bassist.
I discovered that while figuring out whether that quote UM mentioned was true or not. Suddenly, I have less respect for Trent Reznor...
Posted by Ultimate Magnus (Member # 239) on :
quote: I discovered that while figuring out whether that quote UM mentioned was true or not
I AM NOT ONE TO LIE YOUNG TIM.
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
And yet, MM has an autobiography, and Reznor doesn't. And in his autobiography, he hardly mentions Trent except to say that they're friends.
Strange, when you consider that he devotes an entire chapter to seeing his grandfather masturbating.
Posted by Ultimate Magnus (Member # 239) on :
Because Manson's a Starfucker. Which, could also be exactly why Reznor's only a "friend."
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
They were feeling each other up nicely in that video.
Courtney Love has fucked both of them. And Twiggy. The song was about her, if you ask me.
Posted by Ultimate Magnus (Member # 239) on :
I suppose.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
I wasn't suggesting that you lied about the quote. I was just wondering if the information contained within the quote was true.
Posted by Ultra Magnus Pym (Member # 239) on :
In other news...
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
Ladies and gentleman...The God of Fuck.
Hold your applause, please.
Posted by Ultra Magnus Pym (Member # 239) on :
Thank you, thank you.
Oh, you don't mean me. Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
There's some guy in Ohio that changed his name to "Cardinal Fuck", but I don't think that's related to Marilyn.
Meanwhile, I never realized just how crooked his nose is, until now. Previously I had only noted it's size.
Posted by Ultra Magnus Pym (Member # 239) on :
Brian Hugh Warner. His name is Brian Hugh Warner. Will someone simply say Brian Hugh Warner.
Bad. Assss.
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
I oftentimes mistype Brian as Brain. I only mistype Marilyn as Maryland.
Posted by Woodside Kid (Member # 699) on :
AAAANYWAY.....
I have a major quibble with a plot point in the film (Spoiler ahead)
Just how do they expect to take Precrime nationwide? According to the wacko doctor in the greenhouse, the three precogs in Washington are the only ones to survive. So, here's the dilemma: do they have the range to go nationwide? If they don't, where are they going to get more precogs for the rest of the country? And if they do, how have they been able to filter out predictions for the thousands of murders nationwide and only focus on D.C.?
Posted by Brown_supahero (Member # 83) on :
Does anybody know what song Cruise's character play when he goes on the computer
Posted by Balaam Xumucane (Member # 419) on :
No idea on the song. As to the nationalization of pre-crime, if I remember correctly in addition to a visual signal the precogs also delivered a time and location stream. I imagine that such reports would be thus filtered.
I really enjoyed this film. I thought it was fairly well thought out, looked fantastic and was even pretty well acted. I loved how spooky the precogs' visions were. The two wooden balls was a bit much, but I liked most everything else. Maybe Spielberg got spooked at the reviews of AI and EpII.
Scene I liked the best: "I don't hear a red ball, John." alarm sounds.
Posted by Veers (Member # 661) on :
I liked the film a lot. Spielberg just keeps surprising. I don't now how to rate this to A.I., which a lot of the world hated, but they were both excellent films.
Posted by Elna (Member # 837) on :
I have to agree with Veers. AI was a very good film as was Minority Report. AI could easily have been shorter though and still been good.
Oh and is it me or was there a continuity problem?The guy who changed Cruise's eyes said he'd go blind if he took the bandages off before 12 hours were up, and the spiders came to scan him before the twelve hours were gone. Surely he should have gone blind in one eye?? :S
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Just been to see it! Rather good, I thought. Haven't seen AI so I can't really comment, but Minority Report was one of the better films I've seen recently; just one thing, the wooden balls thing was too like the National Lottery (or Lotto as they now insist on calling it). Actually thinking about it, that may have been intentional...
Posted by Veers (Member # 661) on :
Elna-- I think the doctor meant that, if he took the banadages off and kept them off altogether, he would go blind. But since his eye was exposed for at most a few seconds, I don't think it would cause him any problem.
Posted by Thoughtchopper (Member # 480) on :
Yeah, but he's got a point. That part was tense specifically because we as an audience were expecting him to go blind if the spiders found him. It was something of a letdown when he didn't. Whatever tension the scene had seemed like a cheat later on.
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Also that was a fairly bright light the spider shone in his eye...
Posted by Elna (Member # 837) on :
I thought it built up the tension for no point aswell. I mean, after all that, nothing happened to him concerning the spiders. Still, the film was top notch and i'm not gonna go on about the bad parts too much... Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
Gee, I waited weeks to see the film before I could finally read this thread. . . and only about 5 posts have anything to do with it. And as for that scene, I wondered from the start why they picked that building to do a sweep in at all. Coincidence = sloppy plotting, and if they had other information should have gone further than "Oh, just a drunk. Lunchtime!"
Posted by Red ThoughtPym (Member # 480) on :
In addition, as far as I remember, there were no spider scanners in the story. Nor were there any half ass chase scenes that did nothing for the story.
Posted by Red Magnus Pymster (Member # 239) on :
There wasn't a big red fancy Lexus either. A direct translatory piece would've been as dull as I am. The spiders weren't as cool as they could have been, though.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
And, as far as the idea of a national Precrime department goes, I just assumed that those three kids weren't the only surviving drug babies out there, and that maybe other facilities would be set up for other precogs; maybe not as good as the original three, but close.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
quote:Originally posted by Vogon Poet: And, as far as the idea of a national Precrime department goes, I just assumed that those three kids weren't the only surviving drug babies out there, and that maybe other facilities would be set up for other precogs; maybe not as good as the original three, but close.
Which is a possibility, but then why would the villain go to the trouble of staging an elaborate crime just to keep Agatha, when he could just get nearly as good precogs elsewhere? Then you also have the commercials stating that these three precogs are a "gift to society" and even minor religions being built around them. The existence of more procogs would tend to undermine that, especially since you would need three or more for every city to go national. (which admittedly seems to be a contradiction, if you need more for other cities to go national, then the original three aren't that valuable, then why commit a crime to keep them in order to make pre-crime a success, in order to go national? Wow, thats near circular)
Wasn't it also mentioned that the designer drugs that created them were eventually cleaned up so they wouldn't have this side effect, so there wouldn't be any possible new sources of precogs either?
Then again, PKD books usually aren't too coherent when it comes to drugs, so that could just be an influence from the book (which I have not read) , and not a fault of the movie.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
I had these same exact thoughts, about the cyclical nature of the plothole. But I couldn't articulate them without getting a headache. 8)
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
Well there's a similar problem with the shooting of Leo Crow:
In the vision Anderton shoots Leo Crow after discovering that Leo Crow seemed to be his son's killer, with Agatha in tow. Then after seeing the report Anderton goes on to kidnap Agatha, and replay the scene almost exactly, with the only difference being Leo Crow shoots himself.
The thing is though, how would Anderton have gotten there in the first place without seeing the vision? Did the vision cause the crime in the first place? But if that were the case, how would Anderton's boss know that just by hiring Leo Crow to act like Anderton's sons killer, that the pre-cogs would have the vision that leads Anderton there? My brain hurts.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
I seem to recall that was the original point of the short story, shorn of all the extras put in to pad it out to feature length - that Anderton only ended up killing someone because he had to go on the run. . . for going to kill someone. A self-fulfilling prophecy, in effect.
Posted by Fedaykin Supastar (Member # 704) on :
spoiler perhaps: $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $
when Anderton told the layd in the greenhouse he had no idea who Leo Crowe was, didnt the doctor reply that [something to this extent, i dont remember the exact wordage] whoever he was, u'l end up on a path to kill him...
a self-fulfiling prophecy, since all Agatha knew would be that John would seemingly kill Crowe, she didnt (or rather the ppl back at pre-crime HQ didnt) know the events which lead up to the Leo Crowe murder. As the mall chase scene would imply that Agatha knows what to expect (duh..she's a precog).
and about the pre-cogs in a nationwide program, couldnt they just clone the original 3 and then put the clones through the same process that the 3 precogs went thru? i assume that by then the genetic manipulation technology would be available to them [from what i gather by that lady Doctor in the greenhouse's explanation - what's her character's name again?].
neways thats just my thawts
Posted by Mr. Pink (Member # 621) on :
These thoughts about the plot holes bothered my friend and I as well, who saw it the other night. But it was very hard to articulate them during the movie.
It felt as if there were something wrong, even as I was watching it, but just couldn't pin it down.
Did anybody else have these problems, or am I just stupid?
I have to say, if it did nothing else, it did for the most part provide an interesting view of the future. and something which seemed fairly reasonable on most accounts. Not for 2054 (?), but perhaps farther off.
I loved those aircraft thingies. Is there anything out there on what they are, the concepts they're based off of, etc.?
Posted by ThoughtPyminal (Member # 480) on :
Doesn't "Precog" sound like what you should call the extra pieces of plastic that are left over after you finish building a baby's crib?
Or at least, like a cog you're supposed to insert before the other cog?
Perhaps a kind of Tylenol, or Prozac. Some kind of brain-candy, at any rate.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
quote: Then again, PKD books usually aren't too coherent when it comes to drugs
Er, are we thinking of the same author?
Minority Report = better Dick film than Blade Runner (Though not, necessarily, better film.) Why? Because it wasn't about a minority report.
That is to say, a good Dick story isn't about what you think it is. Or at least not about what you think it is in the way you think it will be. The supposed central gimmick of Minority Report is the minority report. But it turns out that there isn't one regarding Cruise, and then the main bad guy is brought down by an entirely different phenomenon.
In contrast, there weren't any twists like that (and by "like that" I mean of a minor and subtle degree, as opposed to "And it turns out that the villain is a robot communist!" stripe) in Blade Runner. (Also, no Mercerism, which seems to me the heart of the story, though it does not stop the film from being very good.) Total Recall has none, despite what Verhoeven may say, and let us remember that Verhoeven's sole goal is the destruction of all we hold dear. In Screamers the robot girl falls in love with him. Case rested.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 24) on :
Well, to be perfectly honest I haven't read Electric Sheep in quite a while, although I have read "A Man in a High Castle" about four months ago.
As for the drug culture reference, when a friend of mine recommended High Castle to me, the story went something along the lines of, he was on drugs while writing many of his books, and he also consulted an I Ching device for that particular book, which seemed to ring true at the time since both books seemed particularly random and at times incoherent, while still enjoyable.
Perhaps I may develop a different opinion soon, "A Scanner Darkly" is high on my reading list after my genetics and CS exams this week.
As for Minority Report as compared to Blade Runner, I already noted that I find it difficult to evaluate the merits of Minority Report without having read the book.
However, based on what I do know, I do agree with you. Minority Report may be a better PFD film, wheras Blade Runner was more enjoyable, and definitely more stylish taking into account how much older it is
Here's the thing, what about the whole Deckard is or isn't a replicant deal. That could be considered a twist, but while its definitely in the sequels, I can't seem to recall if its in the actual book. (And the sequels were written by another author which further clouds the issue) Admittedly, it isn't a "getting hit by a truck" revelation, there are hints....the unicorn/origami and the five replicants deal.
Mercerism on the other hand, is definitely something that I could live without.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
But Mercerism, and more importantly the idea of empathy which it embodies, is the whole point of the story, I think.
As for The Man In The High Castle, the book within it, The Grasshopper Lies Heavy, was written entirely by the I Ching. The Man... on the other hand, was only partially written by the I Ching. Dick consulted it on occasion. He later said that it was a rather insidious book and shouldn't be trusted.
Dick, of course, was on amphetamines, I believe, for a good portion of his writing career, a double-edged sword in that it allowed him to complete entire novels in one sitting, over a weekend, while also nearly killing him (and maybe getting him in the end anyway) and making some of those novels not so good because they were written so quickly.
But to say that when Dick wrote _about_ drugs he was somehow incoherent doesn't ring true to me. Whatever else he knew, he understood drugs, as A Scanner Darkly displays in frightening detail.
Posted by ThoughtPyminal (Member # 480) on :
Dick believed that he killed his cat with a telepathic blast on accident.
Posted by Ryan McReynolds (Member # 28) on :
He also wrote the quote in my sig, which I think is one of the most brilliantly simple statements about the nature of existence ever written.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
I've always like that quote.
Posted by Hunter (Member # 611) on :
Personly I've always perfered his "Gods Dead, They found the body orbiting Alpha Centarui" myself, now if only I could find out where it is from.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Waitaminute... In comic books, Cybertron was in the Alpha Centauri system. God == Unicron?
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
If it makes you happy to think that, then by all means do so. 8)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
. nah, you're right. Seagal hasn't made a good movie since Under Seige, despite having made a lot of movies since then.![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)