Congrats to Bush! May he be the best ever.

*raises glass*

------------------
Intelligence, Integrity, Responsibility.
Vote Bush/Cheney 2000

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns
 

I'm gonna turn on the radio & expect t'hear the new cuts from "Use Your Illusion 1."

Pop Rocks will be the rage, the Berlin Wall will still be around, & those pesky Soviets will still be sailing about.

The memory of the USS Stark? Still fresh in the mind. Never MIND the Vincennes shootdown...

------------------
"Omigod. Singing meat. This is altogether too much."

 

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns
 

------------------
Intelligence, Integrity, Responsibility.
Vote Bush/Cheney 2000

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns
 

And isn't your sig a bit dated? *L*

------------------
"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000
 

*hyper from lack of sleep and writer's block*

------------------
love's function is to fabricate unknownnness
--
E. E. Cummings
****
Read chapter one of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! And party everyday.

 

Recount. There's a 2000-vote differential in the popular vote, enough so that a recount is being performed. Gore called Bush up & retracted his congratulations.

------------------
"Omigod. Singing meat. This is altogether too much."

 

Fascinating stuff really.

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns
 

He thought he could make a difference...
He thought he knew where he came from...
George W. Bush is..."THE PRESIDENT"!!!
-parental advisory-

------------------
So, how's that Survivor-contest coming along, Newt?
-Well not very well at the MOMENT, everyone seems to have died.
-Gee, that's bad. Those Aliens bugging you yet?
-Not really, they mostly come at night mostly...
 

AOL is running a realtime updatable ticker. The results thus far:

Gore (48%) 47,014,032
Bush (48%) 46,957,771
Nader (3%) 2,553,910
Buchanan (0%) 433,195

------------------
"Omigod. Singing meat. This is altogether too much."

 

------------------
"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000
 

Which is nice.

------------------
Remember December '59
The howling wind and the driving rain,
Remember the gallant men who drowned
On the lifeboat, Mona was her name.

------------------
No my signature is not dated.
 

Here's hoping the front of the WASHINGTON POST shows Al Gore holding up the New York Post (with its "Bush Wins!" headline), under a headline which reads: GORE WINS!

=)

Don't you also find it interesting that only 7% of the black voters who voted voted Republican? 93% voted Democratic ...

------------------
Gore/Lieberman 2000
***
"You still don't understand, do you MacLeod? I am the End of Time!" - Kronos

"You're history!" - MacLeod
***
"I think anybody who doesn't think I'm smart enough to handle the job is underestimating." - George "Dubya" Bush

------------------
"The distinction between past, present, and future is only a stubbornly persistent illusion."
--Albert Eistein

 

Not really... these ARE the same folks who made Tupac Shakur a cultural icon, after all...

And when you take into account the shady Democratic practice of busing people from the black churches to the polls, illegally campaigning from the pulpits of said churches (see Hillary in New York), the lock-step mentality of the NAACP, and the fact that a vote for a Democrat is a vote for continuing welfare and black-preferential social programs ad infinitum, it's not even barely suprising.

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

[This message has been edited by Ultra Magnus (edited November 08, 2000).]
 

You were correct, IMHO.

------------------
Gore/Lieberman 2000
***
"You still don't understand, do you MacLeod? I am the End of Time!" - Kronos

"You're history!" - MacLeod
***
"I think anybody who doesn't think I'm smart enough to handle the job is underestimating." - George "Dubya" Bush

------------------
Communism. The most socialist of all the 'ism's. It's in you to vote.

Please vote for the Communist Party of Canada This November 27th.
 

I do not, however, happen to have a chef, Swiss or otherwise, and am limited to microwaved popcorn when it comes to culinary skills. But I will pop the hell out of that popcorn for you.

------------------
love's function is to fabricate unknownnness
--
E. E. Cummings
****
Read chapter one of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! And party everyday.

 

Sol System is my watchword...
Sol System is my watchword...
Sol System is my watchword...

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns

[This message has been edited by Jay (edited November 09, 2000).]
 

BTW, you should see how much shite the USA is copping around the world for even considering GWB. I really wanna find that radio clip about religion & abortion being a big issue over there, extremely funny. Especially when they likened y'all to a bunch of mindless tv watching - religious fanatics. There was also a reference to GWB being about as smart as a dying camels arse.

Wait, maybe I said the last one.

------------------
Re: Russia in WWII

"Hey, we butchered Poles! Thats OK."
- DT.

------------------
Gore/Lieberman 2000
***
"You still don't understand, do you MacLeod? I am the End of Time!" - Kronos

"You're history!" - MacLeod
***
"I think anybody who doesn't think I'm smart enough to handle the job is underestimating." - George "Dubya" Bush

No, sorry, I couldn't keep it up.

Apparently, Al "you are hearing me talk" Gore is famous for being one of the most boring and uncharismatic people ever to appear on TV, and Bush is famous for being even lesscharismatic than him. We're talking Jeffry Sinclair levels of personality here...

------------------
"If every vampire who said he was at the Crucifixion was actually there it would've been like Woodstock. I was at Woodstock. I fed off a flower person and I spent six hours watching my hand move." - Spike, BtVS
 

------------------
"I do prefer the arse, but you can't dismiss the leg. They're joined at the hip, so to speak."

- Liam Kavanagh

 

Come on, Daryus. You don't see the irony in thinking we're "mindless tv watching - religious fanatics" based on a radio clip? Exactly how much do you KNOW about American culture that hasn't been fed to you, anyway?

------------------
Francesca: He was born on the tundra, that's where he belongs. You'll kill him if you take him to Toronto.
Thatcher: That's a bit drastic, don't you think?
Francesca: Look, I've been to Toronto. Trust me, nothing can survive there. - "due South"
 

I know. Have you ever heard "oirish" Americans pretending they know about the Northern Ireland/IRA situation?

"Come on, Daryus. You don't see the irony in thinking we're "mindless tv watching - religious fanatics" based on a radio clip? Exactly how much do you KNOW about American culture that hasn't been fed to you, anyway?"

I always thought that American culture WAS TV and media. It's not like you have a history, or anything.

And by and large, American culture is fed to us by...Americans. So it's your fault if it's presented wrongly.

(This is in contrast to British cultire in the US, which is represented by Dick van Dyke.)

------------------
"If every vampire who said he was at the Crucifixion was actually there it would've been like Woodstock. I was at Woodstock. I fed off a flower person and I spent six hours watching my hand move." - Spike, BtVS
 

------------------
Francesca: He was born on the tundra, that's where he belongs. You'll kill him if you take him to Toronto.
Thatcher: That's a bit drastic, don't you think?
Francesca: Look, I've been to Toronto. Trust me, nothing can survive there. - "due South"
 

IMDB.com:
Richard Wayne Van Dyke (Dick van Dyke)
Date of birth: 13 December 1925
Born in: West Plains, Missouri, USA

------------------
Buffy: "See, this is a school. And we have students and they check out books and then they learn things."
Giles: "I was beginning to suspect that was a myth."
- Buffy: The Vampire Slayer
 

As for the other thing... Yes, the vast majority of Americans are mindless TV-watchers. I won't go into the "religious fanatic" bit, since that pervades the entire world. After all, didn't someone just mention Ireland...? :-)

------------------
"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000

[This message has been edited by TSN (edited November 09, 2000).]
 

------------------
Gore/Lieberman 2000
***
"You still don't understand, do you MacLeod? I am the End of Time!" - Kronos

"You're history!" - MacLeod
***
"I think anybody who doesn't think I'm smart enough to handle the job is underestimating." - George "Dubya" Bush

------------------
Francesca: He was born on the tundra, that's where he belongs. You'll kill him if you take him to Toronto.
Thatcher: That's a bit drastic, don't you think?
Francesca: Look, I've been to Toronto. Trust me, nothing can survive there. - "due South"
 

(and Jim Carey is pissed)

------------------
All along the watchtower, princes kept the view
While all the women came and went, barefoot servants, too.

Outside in the distance a wildcat did growl,
Two riders were approaching, the wind began to howl.
Bob Dylan

[This message has been edited by USS Vanguard (edited November 09, 2000).]
 

------------------
No my signature is not dated.
 

------------------
Communism. The most socialist of all the 'ism's. It's in you to vote.

Please vote for the Communist Party of Canada This November 27th.
 

------------------
The wheel, it turneth. But the hamster, it hath demised.
When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is no longer our friend.
 

------------------
love's function is to fabricate unknownnness
--
E. E. Cummings
****
Read chapter one of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! And party everyday.

 

------------------
I see a red door and I want it painted black

------------------
"Life sucks, then you die"

quote:

---

It's refreshing to know that people all over the world claim to know so much about something they obviously know nothing about. It restores my faith in my country as being the last best hope of the world, in that at least we're not ALL morons.
Come on, Daryus. You don't see the irony in thinking we're "mindless tv watching - religious fanatics" based on a radio clip? Exactly how much do you KNOW about American culture that hasn't been fed to you, anyway?

---

Well, you're showing a total lack of brainpower there, old pal. Lets see, did I not point out it was a comedy show, and therefore amusing? Get with the program. There are good & bad, smart & dumb individuals everywhere. If you look in from the outside you can often see things with a certain clarity, and you my friend, are hardly clear. By the way, if you truly believe that 'last best hope for humanity' crap, you need a room with padded walls.

------------------
Re: Russia in WWII

"Hey, we butchered Poles! Thats OK."
- DT.

------------------
I am going to Japanese cars from now on, because the auto workers got the day off to vote and the state went to Gore.
From The Port Huron Times-Herald talk back section.

------------------
Francesca: He was born on the tundra, that's where he belongs. You'll kill him if you take him to Toronto.
Thatcher: That's a bit drastic, don't you think?
Francesca: Look, I've been to Toronto. Trust me, nothing can survive there. - "due South"

 

Personally, I'd say the UN is much more of the "last, best hope" for the world.

Fuck it. Let's nuke the whole planet and let God or Satan start all over again.

------------------
Can anyone say premature ejac ... er, election?

Like I said before, we need to appreciate that we're the best SPECIES in the solar system. When we break it down more we get nazis, commies and lovely commie-hunters.

Of course, if we ever get our hands on a real swell guy that has many good answers then he's probably the antichrist, huh? Kill him and back to square one. There, everyone hates everyone again.

BTW, I haven't been keeping up. Has the election been settled yet, or if not, when?

[This message has been edited by Nimrod (edited November 13, 2000).]
 

Ah yes, those damn reds...

I trust you mean the totalitarian "communism" that was in place in the USSR during the cold war, and not the actual idealogical communism.

------------------
Communism. Who wouldn't like their neighbour thrown into a goulag?

Please vote for the Communist Party of Canada This November 27th.

 

------------------
"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000
 

------------------
Francesca: He was born on the tundra, that's where he belongs. You'll kill him if you take him to Toronto.
Thatcher: That's a bit drastic, don't you think?
Francesca: Look, I've been to Toronto. Trust me, nothing can survive there. - "due South"

 

Ultra Magnus: I said 'commies' because at the time (60's-70's) nationalists and right-wingers didn't see a difference between the groups. Any supporter whatso had to be 'processed'.

------------------
And keep your foot off that blasted samoflanche!
 

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

------------------
Frank's Home Page
"Gardening for Dummies is too intense." - Rick
 

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

------------------
Frank's Home Page
"Gardening for Dummies is too intense." - Rick
 

PEOPLE are flexible, HUMANITY isn't.

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

------------------
Communism. Who wouldn't like their neighbour thrown into a goulag?

Please vote for the Communist Party of Canada This November 27th.

 

Yay. I'm ALL for regressing ourselves back to the dark ages. Now I know that all Republicans aren't as silly as this, But I actually used to lurk on a list where the men there told the women that "the country was all set until the women got the right to vote", and that "if those n****** would stop screwing things up, we'd get the right man in office".

Weell. That's just great. I say we take people like that and give them thier own country to live in, 'cause they certainly need to be far away from me, and obviously have different interpretations of our Constitution and equal rights. Feh.

Does this sound incoherent? Well if it does, too bad. I'm not fixing it.

[edited because I obviously can't spell]

------------------
The wheel, it turneth. But the hamster, it hath demised.
When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is no longer our friend.

[This message has been edited by Jubilee McGann (edited November 15, 2000).]
 

In any case, I do so love being labeled as an idiot male that too so long to understand that women were equal. Come now, I understand women are equal and deserve every right that every other human being has. However, I shouldn't be blamed for something some guys did long before I was considered to be born. Just because they were idiots doesn't mean I'm an idiot by association.

And that forum you were lurking on...those men usually aren't getting any so they vent their anger on that which they cannot have.

------------------
"I'm not like George Bush. If Bush loses, his life goes on. I will do anything to get elected." - Al Gore, 1999
 

"And how long did it take us women to get you idiot males to understand that we were equal...?"

Well, w/ comments like that, what do you expect? ;-)

------------------
"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000
 

------------------
love's function is to fabricate unknownnness
--
E. E. Cummings
****
Read chapter one of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! And party everyday.

 

------------------
***...***...***

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

and

and

I have no clue who sent these to me......

------------------
***...***...***

------------------
love's function is to fabricate unknownnness
--
E. E. Cummings
****
Read chapter one of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! And party everyday.

 

It was around the time that you showed us you could open a pickle jar without help. Pity you've never been able to repeat that feat.

------------------
"If every vampire who said he was at the Crucifixion was actually there it would've been like Woodstock. I was at Woodstock. I fed off a flower person and I spent six hours watching my hand move." - Spike, BtVS
 

It took far too long for us idiot whites to realize women should be allowed to vote.

Course, it also took us idiot whites WAAAAY too long to learn slavery was a bad thing.

Or that people of color were actually (say it ain't so!) human!

The U.S. still has a long way to go in terms of social equality. I figure we'll be caught up ... oh, in about a hundred years or so.

Jeff

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

------------------
"If every vampire who said he was at the Crucifixion was actually there it would've been like Woodstock. I was at Woodstock. I fed off a flower person and I spent six hours watching my hand move." - Spike, BtVS
 

Like, in Northern Ireland?

"...letting British people be the good guys for once?"

Alec Guinness, Sean Connery, Liam Neeson.

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

"...marriage, which I see as a purely religious ceremony."

Er... No. There is such a thing as religoous marriage, wherein a couple has the leaders of their particular theology acknowledge their relationship, usually involving fancy clothes and a lot of pre-written words. There's also legal marriage, wherein the couple has the government of their particular nation acknowledge their relationship, usually involving a piece of paper w/ their names on it, and often tossing in the fancy clothes and ritual drivel, just for good measure.

Then there's the only definition of marriage that really matters, wherein the couple decides for themselves that they're going to devote their lives to each other.

But, if you need a priest or a judge or whoever to tell you "okay, you're married" before you'll believe it, that's your prerogative.

------------------
"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000
 

When I say we still have a long way to go, yes, I am referring to the gay right's movement. I'm also referring to how three white men in Texas decided to drag a black man to death with their pickup truck.

If you don't think this country has a long way to go, then you need to go out of your home and take a look around.

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

What could the government have done to stop his death ... hmmm, well, I don't know. Maybe educated those rednecks a bit better? And why so defensive?

And the government has done very little with the advancement of gay rights (don't ask, don't tell ... oh, please)

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited November 16, 2000).]
 

What is needed is a fundemental change in society, and that will not happen by the government.

------------------
"I'm not like George Bush. If he wins or loses, life goes on. I will do anything to win." - Al Gore, Newsweek, 1999

 

So, the question is, how do we accomplish said change?

And why do we let parents teach their children hatred in the first place?

And why does Rush believe himself to be on a "hit list"? =)

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited November 16, 2000).]
 

It's one of those things liberals do, called character assasination. Ken Starr, all the women that Clinton tried to destroy, the SecState of Florida. You know, the politics of personal destruction that we're supposed to stop? How can you in good consience support such hypocrits, anyway?

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

Hm. Now I may write a song about that...

White robes turn red...
Morons are dead...
(something something)
(something) in the head...

RE: The Hit List: Don't you remember the Larry Flynt "Money-for-dirty-laundry" episode during the Lewinsky thing when they ofered rewards for accusations (substantiation was irrelevant) against Republican leaders?

---------------
Stupidity deserves no mercy.

[This message has been edited by First of Two (edited November 16, 2000).]
 

I don't agree with character assassination on the sides of either parties ... (look at Bush's pre-primary attacks on McCain as an example).

I especially don't like whats going on down in Florida. Frankly, I'm all for Gore conceeding, b/c the longer he and Daley drag this out, the more it hurts his chances or re-election ...

As for hipocritical, you might want to take a look into your own ranks and not throw the proverbial first stone there, buddy. Republicans don't have the high moral ground on this issue any more than Dems do.

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

And I realized why I hate Rush so much.

He's an incredible spin doctor ... no matter what happens, he spins it in favor of the Republicans. I'm not NOT accusing Democrats of doing the same thing, mind you, but Rush seems so bent on the Repulican Way Of Life (so to speak), that he seems blind to any other arguments.

Does anyone here know who Ron Smith is? Maybe he's just a local Maryland guy, I dunno.

Died-in-the-wool conservative, but, as one Dem put it on his show tonight, "that guy on before you? He's a liar. I don't agree with your political outlook, but you at least tell the truth."

And it is true. Ron Smith'll swear up and down by the Republican So Called Way of Life, but he *is* able to see the other side of the argument, and will even argue with other Conservative callers on his show in *support* of the other position.

Is he a liberal?

Yeah, right. Was Hitler a nice guy? Noooo ...

Is he fair?

Very.

Is Rush fair?

Nope.

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Example, please.

"Is Rush fair?

Nope."

Evidence, please.

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

On the few occasions I've listened to Rush, everytime someone has tried to bring up an argument on the other side's perspective, Rush goes, "No, no, no -- those liberals are..." and so on and so on. He does not give the caller time to present his argument, and does not listen to said argument. Hardly fair of him.

Sorry. Rush Limbaugh is a spokesman of the Republican Party. I doubt one word of what he speaketh is an orginal thought ...

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

I've never seen a debate where one side interupts another often, whether it's heated or not.

And I can Proudly say, I have not listened to Rush since I took over from my platoon SGT. Late 1992.

------------------
**...****...**

IIRC, that was not Bush.

"On the few occasions I've listened to Rush, everytime someone has tried to bring up an argument on the other side's perspective, Rush goes, "No, no, no -- those liberals are..." and so on and so on."

I don't know who you're listening to, but that ain't Rush. Maybe two liberals have called him in the past year that I've heard, and he always just gets out of their way and lets them rant (as liberals are wont to do). He may interrupt someone (anyone) while they're speaking, but only because he IS on a limited time frame, and needs them to get to their point ASAP.

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

Sorry fellas -- John McCain knows more about honor and integrity than George W. Bush *ever* will.

As for Rush ... sorry, Omega. He doesn't let anyone speak anything that he doesn't want to hear.

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Interesting article, though it isn't really about McCain except in passing, and I'm not too sure I agree with the ultimate conclusion. Still, food for thought.

------------------
What did it mean to you
An early chat with death
To pull your body for a moment from your soul
--
Camper Van Beethoven
****
Read chapter one of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! Gonna donate half my money to the city.

Rush Limbaugh - The master communicator.

The New World Order is coming! Are you ready? Once you understand what this New World Order really is, and how it is being gradually implemented, you will be able to see it progressing in your daily news!!

Learn how to protect yourself, your loved ones!

Stand by for insights so startling you will never look at the news the same way again.

------------------
Communism. Who wouldn't like their neighbour thrown into a goulag?

Please vote for the Communist Party of Canada This November 27th.

[This message has been edited by Ultra Magnus (edited November 16, 2000).]
 

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

------------------
**...****...**

I gotta say, that's the saddest, yet funniest pile of utter shit I've ever read.

There IS no 19th Degree ritual.

Lucifer isn't mentioned in any Masonic ritual.

The Capitol was NOT laid out by Freemasons.. doesn't this guy know about Benjamin Bannecker? The guy who pretty much designed the place after the plans were lost? He was BLACK! (At that time, there weren't any black Masons... there are now, though.)

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

Either way, if Rush Limbaugh *really* was as bad as you say, JK, he wouldn't even take calls from liberals.

And you're totally wrong on the "Spokeman for Republican Way of Life." He is the spokesman for the conservative way of life, something I tend to agree with.

------------------
"I'm not like George Bush. If he wins or loses, life goes on. I will do anything to win." - Al Gore, Newsweek, 1999

 

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

He was also one of those D&D slammers. I bought a book, Tome of Magic, and asked him to look it over and point out to me where in that book I could find a spell to say to make anyhting happen. He looked at every page in the book, and found nothing. I changed his mind on D&D, it wasn't satanic, but a game.

------------------
**...****...**

quote:

---

I don't know who you were listening to, JK, but it wasn't Rush Limbaugh. Assuming you were listening to anyone at all.

---

Yes JK, please turn the station in your head to some easy listening.

Or even better, plain static will give you better information than El Rusho.

You dern tree-hugging, diversity-seeking, gay-loving, anti-gun, tofu-eating, believer in the ozone hole, feminazi JK! You take that, you...you...you progressive!

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns

[This message has been edited by Jay (edited November 17, 2000).]
 

Ah, yes. He ad-homeniumed himself.

"I'm larger than most of them!"

Paraphrased, of course. Very amusing.

JeffR, do you know who Ron Smith is?

#1 reason I don't care for Rush: he's against gay rights. Sorry guys, he's an idiot (and buy his own admission, he's a fat one)

------------------
Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Specifying "gay rights" seems wrong, specifying individual right seems better. I have customers at Colortyme that cover the entire spectrum, do I give any special treatment to anybody..... Yes, those that pay their bills on time will get better service. Based on their individual actions.

I once had a guy at a bar tell me I had to like him, because he was gay. Until he made that statement I thought he was a pretty good joe, but demanding special treatment from me because of his sexual orientation was wrong.

------------------
**...****...**

----

Ritten,

Very good point ... individual rights are of extreme importance ... the Gay rights movement is frankly what seems to be the only one left as still a work in progress (what the hell is wrong with two men or two women getting married?).

-----

Oh, right. Omega, ::Smack You!:: for being so close minded that you refuse to look at anyone else's beliefs, instead calling them names and being a child.

Why am I surprised? You *are* a child.

JeffRaven and First of Two have formed their opinions ... First more definitly than JeffR, I'd venture, going from a staunch Democrat to a staunch Republican. I'm sure JeffR has had some of his beliefs changed, and if not, I'm sure they're challenged every day.

But you, Omega. What do you do? Listen to Rush all day and night? You accuse others of being spoon-fed information, yet refuse to see that you *are* spoon-fed.

I see two reasons why you would be Republican:

Your parents are Republicans, so you're one too, of course, because thats what they've taught you.

Your parents are Democrats, so you're a Republican as a way to rebel against your folks.

Both are perfectly understandeable, but neither makes your position correct. Quite frankly, your position will never be correct.

Now, let me explain that. 1of2 is a great example of this. He went from a Clinton-voter to a Bush-voter. Why? His belief system was challenged. He formed opinions for himself (which he can defend very well, while all you do is go around demanding people "proove it" and calling those who disagree "stupid liberals").

I don't know if JeffR has had his beliefs challenged in quite the same way, I don't know if he's ever been anything but a Republican, but I can tell you he's probably been made to actually *think* about his stand on the issues and defend those stands.

As for myself, as I mentioned earlier, I was once a supporter of the death penalty and guns ... but again, I was challenged, and found the pros of those issues lacking against the cons.

And I am capable of independent thought Omega, unlike yourself. You see, I, the staunch liberal ... voted for a Republican, Rob Ehrlich, as my councilman. Why did I vote for him? Well, because he was the best man for the job ... and NOT because of party lines.

You stereotype Dems as "liberals", yet pull imaginary numbers out of your ass apparently to defend the KKK presance in the Republican Party. You accuse others of "ad-homenim" attacks when you routinely do the same.

So, Omega, to sum up ... wash my car!

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited November 17, 2000).]
 

Let's see...

1) You say I'm spoon-fed my ideas because... what? Because I beat you in arguments? You spout one party line, I spout another. The thing is: I can back mine up with logic. I win. Get over it.

2) You state my position will never be correct. Fine, well, then, proove it. First and I have beaten you in every argument so far. We have evidence and logic. You have rhetoric. Seems like I'm the correct one.

3) I never said anything about Democrats and liberals being synonymous. Gore voters and liberals, yes. Ignorance and liberals, yes. But you're the one who seems to intimately associate party affiliation and philosophical views.

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

You completely missed over what I said about "correct." First's arguments are correct, because he's had them challenged and in some cases, changed. Go read over what I said again.

If you want to tell me to shove it, be my guest. And please learn how to spell prove.

Um ... you never said Democrats = Liberals? What about that "98% of Democrats are Liberals, but only .000000001% of Republicans are in the KKK" ... crap? Short memory, eh?

What arguments have *you* beat me in? And careful: don't confuse my conceding points to 1of2 or JeffR with you beating me. My, you are an arrogant little twit, aren't you? If I have to go over that whole issue again, I'd be quite perturbed.

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

Bad Omega.

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

I was in Phoenix a few months ago (as I always am, lurking during the day)... For once, the little kids, the Saiya-jin, the Jedi, and the idiots that I have to protect from each other left, and a few people who I could dare call intelligent came in. A conversation started, and as with all decent conversations, it eventually went to the big three: sex, religion, and politics.

Yes, this is relevant to the digression in progress.

Along came a guy named Jon. (Tim, you remember this night, surely...)

Jon is one of those unfortunately not so rare specimens of Christians who are so closed minded and stubborn about his beliefs that we could simply not help but probe his limits. He reminded me of Jim... Those of you who know him, know what I speak of. Those of you who do not know him, feel very lucky.

Anyway.

I asked him a question... went something like this.

Me: "Uh, so Jon... The Masons are devil worshipers, right?"
Jon: "Yes."
Me: "So, because I graduated at a catering place that used to be a Masonic temple, have I worshiped the devil?"
Jon: "Yes, I believe you have."

(The exact context of the questions and answers is currently somewhere in the back of my mind, but this is close enough...)

It went on.

Me: "Say, my girlfriend is Wiccan. Is she going to hell too?"
Jon: "What is Wiccan?"
Me: "Wicca. Witchcraft."
Jon: "Oh. Yes, she is."

- Blind, unquestioning faith is stupid
- People who have blind, unquestioning faith in their religion are of questionable sanity
- People who have blind, unquestioning faith in their religion who make a futile attempt to preach to others are of questionable sanity
- People who willingly stay and get beat up on by a bunch of others are of questionable intelligence
- People who insult or otherwise ridicule others for their beliefs are of questionable intelligence

I realized near the end of the conversation with Jon that I was doing to him what I so hated being done to me by Jim. I was preaching to him. I was trying to make him see that he was a fool for thinking what he did.

Tell me, how much better than him does that make me? We're both bloody idiots.

Before you continue with your arguments, please take a few minutes and consider this.

Thanks.

------------------
"Uh, Cody, what has the Mullah of Cappistan been smoking?"
"MILKSHAKES. I HAVE BEEN SMOKING MILKSHAKES!"
 

1of2 said himself that he used to be a Democrat. His opinions have changed ... but why? Because of where he lived? Who he hung out with? Of course. As people move on with their lives, opinions and beliefs get challenged. 1of2, an eloquent "typer" and I'm sure also a speaker, defends his beliefs and does so very well. His beliefs are "correct" because they are "correct" for him, as my beliefs are "correct" for me. Are they same belief? In some cases, yes, in some no.

Omega, your beliefs are not "correct" for you. Maybe they are, there is that possibility. But until you've moved away from home, and lived in THE REAL WORLD you won't know.

Get it? Did anyone else have any trouble understanding that?

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

------------------
**...****...**

"You completely missed over what I said about "correct." First's arguments are correct, because he's had them challenged and in some cases, changed."

You might want to look up the definition of "correct", 'cause it seems like you're saying that First is correct, I agree with First, and yet I'm not correct. Is english not your first language, by any chance?

JK2:

"And isn't telling me to shove it an ad-homenium?"

No, it's only ad hominem (and why don't you learn how to spell THAT, hmm?) if I intend to convince someone of something by insulting you. I just insulted you because I felt like it.

Charles:

I'd have to agree with those points. Of course, I'd add a caviat to the last one, saying that it's OK to ridicule others for their beliefs, if their beliefs fall into one of the first three categories.

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

You're an idiot. Kindly re-read my post. If you *still* don't understand, I'll spell it out much more simply ... like, in pig latin.

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

We tried, Rob.

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

------------------
"Omigod. Singing meat. This is altogether too much."

 

Let me try this again:

Rob has a political alignment that is "correct" for him. That is, he's tried other alignments, they ain't worked, he found one that he likes. Therefore, it is "correct."

You have (apparently) only had one sort of political alignment (Republican), and until its challenged in the "Real World" you will not know if it is "correct" for you.

Do you understand?

I'm not attacking your views b/c they're not the ones I agree with (well, sometimes I do, but not in this instance), I'm attacking them because you've never had them challenged.

You've never had a friends whose been shot by a man legally entitled to own a gun.

You've never had a friends who is trying to pull themselves out of drug abuse, only to be dragged back down by too-stiff and unwavering laws.

You've never been working your tail off to pay your bills and your taxes, realizing that you're barely making ends meet (such as 1of2, which is why I respect his views on the subject, b/c he hasn't simply decided to pick one side or the other).

Do you understand? Don't take it as an attack. Take it as an observation.

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant

Continuing to boldly go ...

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited November 18, 2000).]
 

"- People who willingly stay and get beat up on by a bunch of others are of questionable intelligence"

Not necessarily. Sometimes, throwing yourself to the wolves is the best way to make your point effectively, if not to the wolves, then to the witnesses.

For instance, I've been in one or two conversations/confrontations like the kind you mentioned above, that turned ugly after a while. Now, my beliefs didn't change, the beliefs of the guys who attacked me never changed... but the attitudes of the people who were watching, sitting on the fence? Oh, baby! I showed them just how hypocritical the people I was arguing against were. And that was enough.

I would have had a LOT of fun with your 'friend,' CC. I bet I coulda gotten him to take a swing at me.

I don't know what that anti-masonic rot is about. The Masonic symbol is a compass over a square, with a big letter "G" (for "God") in the middle of it.

Yeah, the Eastern Star women's organization's symbol is an upside-down star, but anybody who thinks that that's a purely witch or satanic symbol is a person of colossal ignorance about history and culture, including their own. (The AMISH paint those symbols on their barns, for chrissakes!!)

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

The Masons are Satanic.

End of story. If you disagree with me you are doomed for eternity.

All the evidence points to Satan.

------------------
Communism. Who wouldn't like their neighbour thrown into a goulag?

Please vote for the Communist Party of Canada This November 27th.

 

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"What he did to that walrus gentle-man was inexcusable."
-T. Herman Zweibel on "Mr. Woodrow Wood-pecker", The Onion, 7-Nov-2000
 

Congrats, George W!

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"I'm not like George Bush. If he wins or loses, life goes on. I will do anything to win." - Al Gore, Newsweek, 1999

 

Now stop aiming those missiles at Toronto!!!

------------------
"My Name is Elmer Fudd, Millionaire. I own a Mansion and a Yacht."
Psychiatrist: "Again."

 

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

*meow*

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"I am in one of those rare periods of life where I am convinced I am a sexy devil."- Simon "Sol System" Sizer
 

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

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"Life end when you die. But imagination share with others, live forever."
--Quan, Final Fantasy IX
 

*thinks*

Um...

Wait, wait, ok.

At least if they leave the country, Bush won't be able to find them! Ha ha ha ha ha ha...damn.

At least...if they...take...money...

(Quick Simon, it's time for your secret neverfailing punchline.)

Tits!

------------------
I have been floated to this spot this hour
On a series of events
I cannot explain
--
Olivia Tremor Control
****
Read chapters one and two of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! Read, read, read, read, read me now.

------------------
"Life end when you die. But imagination share with others, live forever."
--Quan, Final Fantasy IX
 

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------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

?????

So they are the evil that has been underscoring the 'American Way' for all these years???

------------------

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"Life end when you die. But imagination share with others, live forever."
--Quan, Final Fantasy IX
 

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Quatre.

------------------
"Omae o korusu..." - Heero Yuy

Facism is fine, so long as it discriminates everyone equally.

------------------
"Karate is a form of martial arts in which people who have had years and years of training can, using only their hands and feet, make some of the worst movies in the history of the world." - Dave Barry
 

------------------
"I'm not like George Bush. If he wins or loses, life goes on. I will do anything to win." - Al Gore, Newsweek, 1999

 

Jordan:

You can be a complete moron at times, you know?

And if anyone cares, I'm likely going to David Lipscomb.

Ziyal:

Most PEOPLE in CA are liberals, not just teachers. The ratio'd probably end up near the same.

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"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"

[This message has been edited by Omega (edited December 15, 2000).]
 

"Gore is Clinton II or worse." -- Dad
"Gore is a hypocrite trying to make himself look like the working man's man. Look at that ridiculous 'farmer' outfit!" -- Mom, during a Gore campaign stop in PA

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"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

*SIGH @ all of you*

Can't we all just...get along?

------------------
"I'm not like George Bush. If he wins or loses, life goes on. I will do anything to win." - Al Gore, Newsweek, 1999

 

------------------
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Moreover, I don't really know anyone else on these boards who has inserted himself in so many arguments in such a know-it-all manner. That really bugs me. But what the hell, diversity makes the world go 'round...at least for some. Omega is quite vociferous in his opinions and I feel that I can be just as vocal in my opposition to them.

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Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns
 

I for one rather appreciate that at times. It saves me from boredom sometimes, but he angers me at others.

Wrong as he is, he's generally interesting.

Oh my, that's far too nice...deflate your damn ego Omega!

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns

[This message has been edited by Jay (edited December 15, 2000).]
 

Extraordinarily rarely do I even get involved in one of his issues, and if I do, I generally try to avoid any slanderous remarks. They may seep through, but are in jest.

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"Karate is a form of martial arts in which people who have had years and years of training can, using only their hands and feet, make some of the worst movies in the history of the world." - Dave Barry
 

------------------
Re: Russia in WWII

"Hey, we butchered Poles! Thats OK."
- DT.

(Well, not right now, obviously. Later.)

------------------
I have been floated to this spot this hour
On a series of events
I cannot explain
--
Olivia Tremor Control
****
Read chapters one and two of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! Read, read, read, read, read me now.

Y'know, my calling you a fascist insults fascist. You're a fascist wanna-be. You claim that all your so called opinions are the God's honest truth and that everyone else is WRONG and you are totally right.

Well, guess what - YOU ARE WRONG.

You're nothing more that something that's pathetically sad. In fact, you're so sad that it boggles the imagination. I'll make a compromise with you: NEVER and I mean EVER talk to me on these here forums ever again or so help me i'll call kanaly on you and that is something you'll never escape.

And those of you know what kanaly is, you know what I meant. The forms must be obeyed.

But I do digress.

Bugger off, twerp.

Quatre. (And that's ALL I have to say about this topic or anything political to this out-freyen.)

------------------
"Omae o korusu..." - Heero Yuy

Omega's only wrong when he disagrees with ME.

When he agrees with me, he's right, merely tactless.

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

Now, the next question I have.....

How long till we can start flaming Bush and the Republicans for ruining the country?????

------------------

[This message has been edited by Ritten (edited December 16, 2000).]
 

But for Bush in specific, we should probably wait until he's at least been inaguarated.

------------------
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Omega, at the very least, discusses his arguments, and opinions, and if he disagrees with you, he'll question you, or make an attempt to.

Guys like Quatre really irk me, in the fact that they'll post shit like he just did, attacking NONE of Omega's positions, calling Omega a Twerp, and saying he's wrong.

Do we really need that garbage cluttering up these forums?

He did nothing to further an argument, provide a defense, or anything valid to any discussion whatsoever. He just said 'You're wrong'. Yeah, he's swayed me, and I'm sure Omega.

Y'know, stop bitching and whining like a goddamn little 3 year old girl, stop personally attacking someone for NO reason, or don't post at all.

------------------
"Karate is a form of martial arts in which people who have had years and years of training can, using only their hands and feet, make some of the worst movies in the history of the world." - Dave Barry
 

------------------
"I'm not like George Bush. If he wins or loses, life goes on. I will do anything to win." - Al Gore, Newsweek, 1999

 

Disagreement, though, even when venomous, can provide hours of amusement to break the monotony of an otherwise frequently tedious existence.

Plus it gives me something unproductive to do during the slow times at work.

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

------------------
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------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master

Fo2:

"When he agrees with me, he's right, merely tactless."

Tact is highly overrated, in my rarely humble opinion.

Ritten:

"although for being religious he seems not not bother with pride being a sin."

How do you read pride into what I say? I simply state facts. Yeah, I strongly believe I'm right, and I know I'm pretty darned intelligent, but I hardly think these are my own, unique accomplishments.

I'm proud in the "reasonable self-respect" sense, not the "inordinate self-esteem" sense.

I'm beginning to think my adversaries are divided into two groups here. You've got UM, Daryus, maybe Rob on certain things, et al. who are generally reasonable people. They may disagree with me (which, of course, means they're wrong ), but they're logical about it. Then you've got Jordan and JK, who don't seem to see anything wrong with flaming me personally, instead of making a real argument.

How 'bout we have two flameboards? One for legitimate arguments, and the other for irrationality.

------------------
"You know, you--you let a wolf save your life, they make you pay and pay and pay..."
- Fraser, "due South"
 

------------------
"I am in one of those rare periods of life where I am convinced I am a sexy devil."- Simon "Sol System" Sizer
 

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Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns

[This message has been edited by Jay (edited December 16, 2000).]
 

*Swats at a few folks with an old broom*

To be blunt, how much is there left to say about this presidential mess, anyway? I think we're all finished here. By all means, keep on talking, but if you guys keep fanning the flames I'll crack out the padlock (haven't used it in a while, so it'll be extra-fun)

-T_T

------------------
"...I was just up in Canada, Toronto actually. You know, they really hate you guys [Americans] up there? The funny thing is, they think you hate them back, when in fact, you just couldn't be bothered to care. Now in Ireland, it's a different story. At least we had the common decency to wait until the English invaded before we started hating them. I guess the Canadians are hating you in advance..."
-Irish Comic Ed Byrne on Canada-US relations

And its not like you ever accept an argument that isn't precisely the same as your own.

------------------
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[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited December 17, 2000).]
 

And in Omega's...no i'll call him smega from here on now out, case is nothing but yet another lil' pitiful fascist case whom I have to go out of m way to knock the living hell out of general principle.

And I do so love listning to k.d. lang too.

Quatre.

------------------
"Omae o korusu..." - Heero Yuy

------------------
Re: Russia in WWII

"Hey, we butchered Poles! Thats OK."
- DT.

[This message has been edited by Daryus Aden (edited December 17, 2000).]
 

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[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited December 18, 2000).]
 

------------------
Oh, yes, sitting. The great leveler. From the mightiest Pharaoh to the lowliest peasant, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?
~C. Montgomery Burns
 

------------------
Re: Russia in WWII

"Hey, we butchered Poles! Thats OK."
- DT.

------------------
EOH

 

What's REALLY got the lib.s pissed is that Bush is nominating minorities, SUCCESSFUL CONSERVATIVE minorities, to cabinet posts, which puts the lie to most of they've said about him.

That, and that he's also shown every intention of sticking to his guns on his campaign promises, especially the large tax cut, in the face of opposition.

------------------
"Ed Gruberman, you fail to grasp Ty Kwan Leap. Approach me, that you might see." -- The Master