This is topic PIC 3x09 "Vox" ($$$) in forum New Trek at Flare Sci-Fi Forums.


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Posted by Krenim (Member # 22) on :
 
So...

A while ago here at Flare we were discussing the Enterprise-F. My two cents were that the ship was a bad idea done well. The core concept (the way the saucer connects to the engineering section) was stupid, but given that, it's otherwise well-designed.

How fitting that I feel the same way about the episode that makes the Enterprise-F canon. [Big Grin]

So yeah, Deanna opens the red door and finds a Borg cube behind it. Everybody called it. Some of Picard's DNA was altered by the Borg and was passed down to Jack. Jack doesn't take the revelation well and is able to leave the ship in a shuttlecraft by taking control of the guards outside his quarters.

And here's where we get the baddies' master plan: The Changelings have used the scooped out parts of Picard's brain to secretly add the same altered DNA to anyone using a Starfleet transporter. That is what makes them susceptible to Jack's influence. The Changelings would deliver Jack to the Borg, where the Borg would use him to take control of Starfleet. Also, anyone over the age of 25 is immune to this, for reasons.

This is dumb. I don't buy the rogue Changelings were working for the Borg all along, and I hate that the Borg are suddenly Season 3's final boss.

Jack uses his abilities to track down the Borg. He makes note of an anomaly he guesses to be a wormhole, but the computer corrects him that it is a transwarp conduit. Is this supposed to be the same mysterious conduit from the end of Season 2? If so, where's Queen Jurati? Or did she get bored of watching the conduit and go back home?

Picard and co. travel to Earth to try to warn the fleet of the Changeling/Borg plot.

Jack confronts the Borg Queen. We don't see the Queen from the front, but the credits confirm she is voiced by the returning Alice Krige. To be honest, since I knew Seasons 2 & 3 filmed together, I got my hopes up for one last appearance by Annie Wersching, but it was not to be. [Frown]

Queenie plugs Jack into the Collective and sends out the signal to take over the assembled whole of Starfleet.

Hi, Shelby! *Shelby dies* Bye, Shelby!
[Roll Eyes]

Picard and co. have to flee the Titan after the assimilated "youngsters" turn on them (Why do they have the black Borg veins when they have no nanoprobes in their systems?)

Shaw is fatally injured just before getting on a shuttle, which completely sucks because he was the single best character in all three seasons of this show and I was REALLY hoping he'd get a spin-off. Seven stays with him for... reasons. Raffi stays with her for... reasons. Sidelining of non-TNG characters complete. [Roll Eyes]

Picard and co. arrive back at the ship museum where, yes, Geordi reveals that's he's restored the Enterprise-D. The ship is old enough that it'll be immune to the fleet protocols.

"Well, we can't use the Enterprise-E..." *Everyone looks at Worf* "It was not my fault!" What did you do, Worf? WHAT DID YOU DO?! [Big Grin]

I say this completely unironically: I'm with Picard. This reunion wasn't complete without the carpeting.

EDIT: I didn't think about this, but saw it mentioned elsewhere: The Excelsior tries to get away, but is destroyed by the rest of the fleet. So... RIP Elnor. Again.
 
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
 
That it was the Borg all along had already been spoiled by the Episode 4 subtitles.

I was fine with the resolution of the Borg story line in season 2. So it feels lame to bring them back as enemies in season 3. Personally, I think they lost their bite way back with VOY.

Another legacy character killed off. At least not a fan favourite this time. Like with Will Wheaton it was painfully obvious that Elizabeth Dennehy hadn't been acting for quite some time.

We all knew that Shaw wouldn't survive this, so no surprise there either.

So there were like what 200 ships? That can hardly be the entire fleet.

The re-introduction of the Enterprise-D was great but I don't know why they're going straight back to Earth with no plan.

And finally, we get some properly lit scenes.
 
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
 
As much as I dislike about this season ...

... that is my absolute favorite Enterprise. Always has been, always will be. And it was great seeing her again.
 
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
 
I didn't think this show could insult me any more. I was wrong.

Every single reveal here had me like Benoit Blanc: "NO!! It's just DUMB!"

I have seen shitty fanfic plotted better than this show, from day fucking one.
 
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
 
I think there’s some big reveal still to come about the Borg Queen. Krige was credited as her voice but we know that can change (some of the earlier dialogue was clearly McFadden speaking), and they took pains to not show her face. If she was going to play the role in full they’d either have shown her face or not credited her at all until next week when they do. And because it’s vital they have her appearing to be still the Queen, she gets a special title sequence credit (not something they did for Elizabeth Dennehy, one notes).

So I’m calling it right now. The new Queen will be played by… Kate Mulgrew. It’ll turn out that the only way the Queen could survive at the end of “Endgame” was to transfer into Old Admiral Janeway.

Because, yes. Even though the big D reveal was widely predicted, it still brought a tear to my eye and you know I’m not a D fan. Geordi back at the helm where he began! Would love to have been a fly on the wall in the budget meeting where they said they wanted to rebuild (even partially, I’m sure some of it was virtual) one of the most iconic sets in the whole franchise…

I thought Shaw’s death would be a lot more heroic. He suffered from massive survivor’s guilt to begin with, and then he had to watch helplessly as his crew were either transferred unwittingly to an enemy ship, massacred by Changelings or assimilated by the Borg. Surely choosing to stay to let others escape (as he once was himself) is better than just forgetting to duck one time?

And it was always going to be the Borg. Nobody else it could have been.
 
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
 
I'm still dumbstruck that they used the Borg very prominently for three seasons.
 
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
 
Because no one has any fucking imagination.
 
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
 
So there’s a lot to get done in the last episode. There’s the small matter of “all of” Starfleet having been assimilated by the Borg, and the crew’s kids too, and presumably all the people replaced by Changelings to rescue, AND the small matter of crafting a suitably moving proper farewell to this cast who we all love and have had as part of our lives in one way or another for the past thirty-five years…

Ah, yes, the Changelings. Questions remain.

1. How DID they align with the Borg? Who made the first move?
2. Are they still a going concern at this point? After all, the Borg have form when it comes to ditching alliances as soon as they’ve got what they want from them.
3. Are we to assume that they replaced everyone with any decision-making authority in Starfleet, given that…
a) The powers that be were dead set on the Frontier Day mass celebration - when there were plenty of people saying it was a bad idea?
b) TPTB also thought that networking all the ships was a good idea, when anyone could tell them it wasn’t l, even if they hadn’t watched Battlestar Galactica?
4. If so, why wasn’t Shelby replaced? Or maybe she was, and that was a Changeling learning the hard way that when you Fuck Around with the Borg you soon Find Out?
5. So is Talky Hand Guy the Changelings’ Borg liaison or a Borg interface? And really, the whole “cut part of yourself off to use as a long-range communicator” thing isn’t getting any less stupid…
 
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
 
So Matalas has answered that last one on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/terrymatalas/status/1646891357167054850

quote:
The device Vadic cut her hand off on sent a subspace signal to the Collective so they could communicate. You saw the back of the HandBoss’s head this episode.

 
Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :
 
quote:
b) TPTB also thought that networking all the ships was a good idea, when anyone could tell them it wasn’t l, even if they hadn’t watched Battlestar Galactica?
Doesn't Prodigy take place before Picard S3? Shouldn't what happened at the end of S1 been an idea that networking starships was a bad idea?
 
Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :
 
Yeah right, as if they cared about interseries continuity.

It also seems the LaForges are the only inhabitants of the Museum. How else could Geordi have kept it a secret that he‘d been restoring the E-D for 20 years. Also no Borg Starfleet officers trying to stop them.
 
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
 
Well, it’s Frontier Day, maybe everyone has the day off? Plus drones are mentioned, and I think now it’s just been retconned that there are always those maintenance bots around doing stuff, we just never see them.

Good news, Elnor fans! He wasn’t on the Excelsior. As if it matters, it’s not like we’re ever going to see him again either way.
 
Posted by Zipacna (Member # 1881) on :
 
Well that was the biggest load of fanwank I've ever sat through.
There's no way that a Changeling, even a genetically tortured one, would co-operate with a solid unless they had a plan to betray them afterwards.
There's also no way The Borg would co-operate with anyone unless they also had a plan to betray them afterwards.
There's also no way that Picard wouldn't have at least suggested taking Jack to Juraqueen.
There's also no way that Shelby would ever consider Borgifying the fleet...and if she's a Changeling, then she's clearly one that also had their brain removed by Section 31.

All that said, I did tear up a bit at the appearance of NCC-1701-D...even though that was also fanwank of the highest degree.
 
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
 
"Somehow, the Enterprise-D returned."
 
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 138) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
So there were like what 200 ships? That can hardly be the entire fleet.

Well the US Navy has approx 485 ships. If I had to guess, I'd say that's how many ships were nearby that could attend. There's probably plenty of deep space science ships, or ships on critical missions like defense patrols that they couldn't just up and leave for a holiday. So no doubt maybe the majority of the fleet, but not all of it. Maybe ships not hooked up to the Cylon... I mean Borg network... weren't invited. At least at age 41 glad I can't be auto-assimilated. Who knew getting old had a benefit.
 
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Shik:
"Somehow, the Enterprise-D returned."

They apparently use a much better model in the next episode, if that helps.

Pics: https://twitter.com/STvSW/status/1647359133287346182
 
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
 
No. No, it doesn't help at fucking all. The nature of a CGI model isn't the fucking issue.
 
Posted by Zipacna (Member # 1881) on :
 
Frankly they can dig out the physical model for all I care. It doesn't address the problem of NCC-1701-D reappearing 30-years after it crashed being some of the worst fan service that's ever existed, and is a frankly stupid plot device...especially considering you've literally got a museum full of ships that could serve the exact same purpose sitting there minding their own business.
 


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