OK, after watching "The Ultimate Computer" I was struck by the similarities between the two computers... which came first HAL or M5?
Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :
"The Ultimate Computer" debuts: 8 March, 1968
2001: A Space Odyssey debuts: 3 April, 1968
Interesting.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
Yeah, but 2001 had been in development for about 4 years, and HAL had been a planned character for at least half that time. I doubt Kubrick nicked the idea, somehow.
Posted by David Templar (Member # 580) on :
So what? Both SkyNet and the Matrix's A.I. came considerably after those two. And they were just as crazy. Maybe they were the clones-descendents of M-5 and HAL.
Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
There's really not a lot of doubt about that.
SkyNet and the Matrix were obviously based upon that basic premise... "self-aware-and-sentient-computer-with-a-personality-complex goes ballistic" has been rehashed a little too often.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Trek marathons are a good way to introduce someone to TOS, or to get you out of the modern trek frame of mind - with the nice film and the great effects. I was watching The Ultimate Computer during this marathon - and had totally immersed myself in TOS... and well this episode was soooo good. That scene where Scotty's Engineer was so fucking "out of the blue"/"startling"! I couldn't believe it I was a little shocked! I was just going WTF! What a way to die - he just got disintigrated! GOOD episode. I noticed that prop that that Engineer was using - was used in "Trials and Tribblations" - well a replica I guess.
Andrew
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
I don't know if I'd call that shocking. Everybody got disintegrated back then.
Posted by Grokca (Member # 722) on :
Ya , if you disintegrated them before they said anything, then they cost less.
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
I've always been curious why disintegration went out of vogue in Trek, whether it was goodie or baddie having their molecules scattered. I suspect Mrs. Berman runs a class in "Elementary Playing Dead" which all actors and extras are required to take. I get so sick of people gasping and lurching backwards as a phaser beam hits them, what I would have given to see, for example, some of the Klingons invading DS9 in "WotW" getting properly zapped. . .
Posted by Austin Powers (Member # 250) on :
Vogon, did you see the Voyager blooper tape where Tuvok makes fun of the scene in which he is shot - in "The Voyager Conspiracy"? That was great.
Posted by The Red Admiral (Member # 602) on :
Vogon, BTW, Arthur C Clarke was responsible for Hal, not Kubrick
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote: I don't know if I'd call that shocking. Everybody got disintegrated back then.
Yes, but usually it was 'freeze' phaser fires disappear. PLUS I was watching a Trek Marathon so I was totally immersed in the TOSishness of it all. The difference of this 'disintegration' was that I don't know it didn't look as fake... he was innocently walking over to turn down the power or something and then boom! He's disintegrated - and it wasn't the 'glow-y phaser' type it - they added a pyrotechnique effect, which made it look more realistic I reckon - a 'firework' where the poor guy had just been standing. I don't know EXACTLY what made that bit work - but it was pretty good - and sorta not what you were expecting - maybe it was that the Engineering officer got a name. I was watching an episode last night - where that woman appears and disrupts all the cells in the victim's body by touching them - can't remember the name - but Scotty also sent another Engineering tech to his death ;o) And what was that funky new Jeffries tube? AND Why was Spock so fucking anally retentive in that episode - it was the WORST I've seen him. I'd love the quote where Scotty says he'll get the engines to work even if he has to get on top of them and nurse them, then Spock holds up his finger ads says:
can't remember EXACTLY what he says but it was bloody funny.
Andrew
Posted by Vogon Poet (Member # 393) on :
Right now I get one ep a day on E4, and it's a great pleasure rediscovering how good Star Trek actually was. And I actually got to see the one you're on about, "That Which Survives." Spock was a little weird in this one; howeever, it seems recently I've seen every occasion when Spock has had command, and I'll say this: at least he and Scott were able to have a good working relationship! Most of the other times, he seemed to have McCoy there, openly questioning his authority and decisions in front of everyone, and all because he didn't agree with them or disapproved of Spock's style. I know the ship's CMO is outside the chain of command, but, hello? Gross insubordination?
Posted by Kosh (Member # 167) on :
I always wondered why Spock never used TFVNP on McCoy.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I gather you mean the "The Fucking Vulcan Neck Pinch"!?!
I liked the line(s) in "The Apple" where Kirk says to Spock, I wish you'd taught me that Neck Pinch now! and Spock replies "I have tried many times"! ;o)
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Famous.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Oops ;o)
Posted by Chris StarShade (Member # 786) on :
With regard to the "AI with personality complex goes ballistic" routine, a favorite thing to really throw that off, is like in the beginning of an episode or movie, the thing just starts going ballistic...
"I don't like you, Dave, so I'm going to crush you're poor body into a dehydrated pulp and jettison it out the airlock..."
"You think so? Well, take this!" (pushes manual override)
"Artificial Intelligence deactivated. Ready for command."
"Open a communique to the engineers back on earth, tell 'em I need a new AI program, the last one went berserk..."
Yep, that's my idea of what will happen when AI tries to take over the world.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
That, of course, assumes that the AI doesn't know how to bypass the override, and hasn't already done so before revealing what it intends to do to Mr. Dave.
Posted by Nim Pim (Member # 205) on :
None of the computers mentioned did anything wrong; only according to us.
They were trying to cope with the new information available to them, and it was our fault for not programming them more thoroughly. Again, as Einstein said. "A problem cannot be solved at the same level of thinking that created it". We must transcend, and that's hard when one mistake in your preparations will send a hundred nukes up your butti.
Like the first rotating doors who didn't stop if an arm or leg got stuck, "Oops, didn't think of that!".
Actually, as seen in 2010, HAL was being very creative and responsible when faced with conflicting orders (I don't know if the explanation was an after-construction, but it made sense. Hopefully by Clarke). He could've just gone in sleep mode and killed everyone instead.
Oh, and after seeing 2010 three months ago, first time in 12 years, I was totally surprised to see the design of the russian spaceship.
I will never have the same respect for the shipdesigners of Babylon 5 and their "Omega Class", although one of them was named "EAS Nimrod" (awww).
I just thought of something. That bastard president in Bab5 who looked like Peter Boyle and didn't dare to speak, he spelled his name "Clarke", didn't he? What a bad pun, if I ever heard one! :-) He was probably suffering from studdering, so that when he presented himself on those rare occasions, he said "C-Clarke!".
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