.
With that done ...
Wow. Awesome!
Well written, well acted (well, as well acted as Star Trek can be), great action sequences -- !
I didn't like the gel scene between T'Pol and Tucker. Certainly too fan-boyish. Anyone drooling over Jolene in this month's Maxim ("Well, I love when I sort of come to and I'm on the other side of the room, sweaty and breathing heavy, with bottles and ashtrays tipped over everywhere. I'm, like, 'What just happened? Oh, yeah, I got laid. Gotcha.'") won't be disapointed, but it seemed a bit risque for a Star Trek series. ::shrug::
I love the sets. They're so wonderfully detailed ... although I found myself wondering what Archer would say if he found himself standing on the bridge of the Enterprise-D. "Holy crap, this is big!"
The Rigellian mining station (or whatever it was) looks like something you'd see in TOS ... (except, obviously, better details and such).
I'd like to see more interaction between Sato and Mayweather. She hates spaceships, he loves 'em. I'd like to see something happen there.
I think we can probably add that mysterious room where the Suliban leaders confrences with his leader from the future as one of the standing sets of Enterprise. I think we'll be seeing it again.
I loved the opening credits ... I loved Zephram's speech. I thought the incorporation of some of the familiar opening speeches ("new life, and new civilization... to boldy go where no man has gone before") was done very well, didn't sound all that corny. I was hoping, at the end, Archer would sit down and say, "Space. The final frontier. These are the voyages of the Starship Enterprise, her new mission to seek out strange new life, and new civilizations. To boldly go where no man has gone before!"
Ah well.
I liked that we learn that there are sixty-or so dialects of the same Klingon language. I liked seeing the Klingon Hall, although I was kind of hoping to see a Klingon ship. I guess we'll get to see more of them later. The First Contact didn't seem to be so disasterous ... yet ... of course, the Klingons don't seem very open with what they're thinking, so I guess we'll find out more on that later.
Well, I think that about sums up what I thought of Enterprise. For the first time since Deep Space Nine went off the air, it seems there's finally a series worthy of carrying on the Star Trek legacy.
Aside from that, we had a good story and cast (John Billingsley, from those celluar phone commercials). He reminded me of Neelix. We had an exotic chef, now an exotic doctor!
One question: was that James Cromwell on that computer screen near the beginning? It sounded like him, and looked like him in a way. Probably they just took someone who sounded like him and put him on.
No doubt they'll be a future episode about Archer's father, and in another he'll be brought back to life (if he's dead) somehow.
Thos eare my thoughts .
I take back everything negative I may have said about Enterprise.
That was one of the most moving opening credits I have ever seen. I would watch this show every Wednesday just to see that again & again.
I'm with Jeff. The only negative aspect of the episode I found was the gel scene, for the same reasons. Even so, it was 100% better than every Chakotay/Seven scene in "Endgame."
There's so much more I want to say, but I think I'll rewatch my tape again first.
a little bit worried in seeing t'pual behave just like 7 of 9
but over all got a good night's worth of entertainment.
i also did think the infiltrate the sulliban base thing was pretty lazy though.
The capital of Afghanistan is "Kabul", and they mentioned something in the episode in reference to the Suliban heirarchy which sounded a lot like Kabul.
I agree fully with Jeff , the acting was good , no doubt as the cast begins to get closer the acting will get better as we go along.
The SFX were great , considering and I'm sure that once Paramount sees some returns from Enterprise ratings wise the SFX budget will grow.
The Enterprise looks great , you Akiraprisers , move on!
Dr. Phlox's smile was just werid , very creepy. I like that.
The Decon scene was a bit non trekish but atleast it wasent sexist , the Camera went both ways , Tucker and T'Pol , not to mention Archers Undies , I just hope they dont make that a running gag with Archer like Kirk and his tattered shirts.
Overall I'm very happy with this series premeire , and I will definatly be watching next week , I'm pretty sure by then the acting will be even better and it does look like the crew is starting to take to T'Pol , if they stay on track with this , I will be a very happy viewer.
:)
The only thing I don't like, off the top of my head, if the opening music. Visually it's great... but that music just doesn't fit. I wish they stuck with instrumental stuff.
PS: Think you have enough $s Jeffy? I still think anyone with common sense would relize that there would be spoilers for Enterprise in an Enterprise forum, not to mention the title in this case speaks for itself.
[ September 26, 2001: Message edited by: Soundwave ]
quote:
Originally posted by Soundwave:
The only thing I don't like, off the top of my head, if the opening music. Visually it's great... but that music just doesn't fit. I wish they stuck with instrumental stuff.
This is a criticism of Enterprise I can mostly agree with. I don't mind the fact that it's vocal so much that it's so "current." Even those who like the song will cringe at Enterprise reruns in thirty years. Maybe if they had made a legitimately "operatic" version, it would work, but the use of soft rock is questionable. I do like the muted, instrumental version used durng the commercial breaks and closing credits, though.
I've been very conservative in my use of spoiler warnings. But I guess you didn't notice the really big emphasis Charles has placed on making sure people don't spoil themselves (All new topics concerning the premiere episode require spoiler warnings. Do so by placing either the word 'Spoiler' in the subject line, or including the customary series of dollar signs.
Example: "Oh mah gawd, that was great $$$$poilers"), given that many Flare members won't see Enterprise for years, yet might still stop in to the forum for news on Enterprise.
Or, "PLEH!"
[ September 26, 2001: Message edited by: Malnurtured Snay ]
*glows brightly* 
I FREAKIN' LOVED IT!!!
This was the best acting i've seen come out of a pilot! Jolene was a great vulcan .. and Sato is a great character.
I'm gonna have to get use to Phlox.. but he's cool!
Bakula is a great fit as a captain.. takes no shit, that guy!!!! They play well with character interaction ...
The gel scene was a little much, but am I the only one that doesn't remember ANY of the true dialogue in that scene??? **Just pokin' fun**
Ok .. so..
Thing that some in other threads are picking on!!
The Enterprise takes a pounding ... without shields... WE have to remember that weapons in this century aren't the weapons they are in TOS .. I think as things move on .. we may see phaser on the ship becoming a little more advanced... HOw will they do upgrades without a Starbase ..
There will be no, "Set course to the nearest Starbase."
I think what they did was they took the Voyager premise (Take a lone ship out on its own) and made it a "Where no one has gone before" attitude with characters that aren't bound by a Eutopia mindset. The humans are not the superior morality of the universe here... they are inferior as the Vulcans are reminding them all the time.. (This aspect of the vulcan/human relationship, I think is great).
Also.. people are saying the T'Pol and her ilk were a little too emotional... Well.. they are 100 or so years before "Spock" .. they aren't as refined .. just as the humans aren't as refined... a few 'primitive' differences should be expected.. and IMHO, it makes it fresh.
That is what ENTERPRISE is ... FRESH
Two thumbs up!!
[ September 27, 2001: Message edited by: Alshrim Dax ]
I cant wait for next week!
I too, have taken back what I first said about Enterprise, about the Akira and other things.
quote:
Originally posted by Alshrim Dax:
The Enterprise takes a pounding ... without shields... WE have to remember that weapons in this century aren't the weapons they are in TOS ..
We also have to remember that every time the ship goes itno battle, Archer says "polarize the hull plating" for a reason. For all intents and purposes, Enterprise has shields, they're just integrated with the hull itself.
My friends who were much more casual viewers (remember that wider audience base we were always talking about?) thought it was okay.
The writing was somewhat wooden. Bakula's acting was great and his writing was above par with everybody else. I fear we may end up getting many many shows focusing on a single person to the exclusion of others again.
Blalock was good, definetely emotional, but I liked where Archer would catch her in the act. All the Vulcans seemed perpetually pissed off at humans. Not the kind of relationship that you think humans would tolerate for a hundred years. They were most likely just pissed off for that particular event, but we should've gotten some better scenes regarding the status quo relationship of human/Vulcans.
Other characters were excellent and would be outstanding if the writing was better. Billingsly did a fantastic job, but his makeup still irks me as being too human. They've done extensive regular character make up before (Worf, Data, Neelix, etc.) that would go a long way for him.
Sets were very nice. I like the entire of the Akiraprize. Though Trek AG shouldn't produce a sweet spot, I'll let that nitpick go for the time being. Special effects were incredible.
I like the ship out of context with the other series. I'm willing and able to watch this show and not get mad about the ship, but my feelings about it's creativity and lineage remain unchanged.
Overall, there was nothing special about the plot. No great premise was set up really. Klingon first contact didn't turn out as horribly as we were lead to believe. We only get the vaguest of notions about the EFG. And at least I got the impression that they weren't interested in Archer/Akiraprize at all. "We don't want to involve the humans. Not yet anyway." The sentence and its tone make it abundantly clear that they are after somebody else. And story wise, where is the fun in that?
I laughed:
At the gel scene. Just because it was completely ludicrous.
At Phlox's line where he sounded exactly like those guys from Galaxy Quest.
The worst thing besides the gel scene:
The couple of flashback scenes with Archer as a kid w/ his father and the model spaceplane. Once again: Star Trek + children = crap. Thankfully, there were very few of such scenes.
Conclusion:
The writing needs to get better, but there is a lot of potential. If the writing were to get on par with TNG or (dare I even suggest it as a possibility) DS9, then we would have one outstanding show.
quote:
Though Trek AG shouldn't produce a sweet spot...
Why?
Though Archer's toy certainly seemed to be using antigravity. But maybe the sons of very important engineers get perks (perhaps Vulcan in origin?) that the poor children of doctors and lawyers and meat vendors don't.
Only towards the end of the scene did the dialogue start to synchronize with the action, like T'Pol's parting shots being while she was rubbing him down. That was actually effective to portraying their interaction, having her take the dominant role in the discussion while she took the dominant role in the act of violating his personal space.
But this was after her rubdown was complete. I'd be interested to know whos decision it was to cut the the closeups of her body.. editor? director? producer? studio? network? whoever did it screwed up someone elses well done scene
[ September 28, 2001: Message edited by: Stingray ]
Did anyone notice how they reshot 3 days of Jolene's scenes with the new wig.. the ready room scene seemed to cut back and forth like crazy.
I liked:
Everything, I liked the beginning, the opening shots in the farm, and opening credits. That was different from the rest, in terms of no ship wooshing by, or beauty shots of the ship, just flash back scenes from 'real' life and First Contact.
I hated:
The Gel scene, there was no reason why there had to be a gel scene. That made an almost perfect episode (for once) into a almost Voyager/Shit episode. The writers could definitely rewrote that differently. I guess next episode wil have her taking a bubble bath right?
Characters:
Archer: He obviously is a natural Trek captain. I think the writers will wirte alot of episodes between Archer and T'Pol. (sounds familiar?)
T'Pol: To me she's just there for a new 7 of 9 but this time she will be through the entire series. I think she needs to be more Vulcan because she seems to be alittle 'human'.
Dr. Phlox: He seems to be a mix of the Doctor from Voyager, the people from Galaxy Quest and Neelix. I think he is the comedy relief.
Mayweather: I have no clue what the future for this guy will be.
Tucker: I have no clue, I think he gets pregnant later in the series right?
Sato: I think she's a bit afraid of ships.
Reed: For some reason I think he and the Doctor will be the ones battling each other like Quark and Odo.
If each episode is like the one last night, then we got a winner and a replacement for the TNG crew for the movies.
I was a little sketched by the way Phlox went into that Galaxy Quest riff.. i wonder if it was on purpose? Still at least he isnt Neelix.
The Good,
Scott Bakula’s performance. Definitely the best part of the show. I was happy when I heard Bakula was on board as captain and I am even happier now after seeing Archer on-screen.
Homages to TOS. Communicators and their sounds. The bridge “scanner” used by T’Pol. Ship wide intercoms.
The shuttlecraft design. One of few designs in Enterprise that actually has some visual believability as far as existing before the TOS era.
The “uneasiness” the crew has with the transporters. I rather like this aspect of the show.
Archer’s Dog. My wife and I are “dog people,” as we call ourselves, so I liked the dog! The pooch can stay!
The Bad,
The Story. While I found the plot itself “average,” the episode as a whole “felt” (at least to me) as if it had been thrown together somewhat haphazardly, with little regard to detail or continuity. It didn’t seem to “flow” very well.
“Technobabble.” Too much gibberish for my tastes.
The “Temporal Cold War” plot device. Pretty pathetic. It would have been much better to simply focus on the “disastrous first contact with the Klingon(s).”
The disastrous first contact with the Klingon(s). While I agree that “first contact” did not go so well, it seemed to fall short of being the “disastrous” event that I had envisioned.
The Music: I am a musician by trade, so this is a big deal to me. I certainly do not care for the “pop-song” theme, but I do not necessary find it that offensive. No offense to composer Dennis McCarthy, but I really wish that B&B would have considered some new talent so we could get out of that “Voyager/DS9 feeling” that continued to lurk in the background of Enterprise.
Not enough Homages. While I applaud the homages that do exist, I still think that more are warranted. I would have liked to have seen TOS style rank stripes, the “tracer” below the main view screen, rectangular windows, and/or more TOS-like panels and readouts (similar, not exact), just to name a few.
The ship interior. Not too bad, really; but a little bit too “busy” (I thought) for pre-TOS.
The Ugly,
I was immediately disenfranchised when the first images of the “Akiraprise” were released. Still, I originally thought it was a fairly “neat” design, though quite unoriginal and certainly not believable as a ship that predates the TOS Enterprise. After watching Enterprise, I can honestly say that I now like the Akiraprise even LESS.
Klingon Warbirds? Is no one at Paramount doing their homework?
A space-age shotgun? How hokey is that?
Warp Travel. I found myself immediately questioning how and why they were able to travel so quickly from Earth to the Klingon Homeworld. Not to mention their little excursion to Rigel.
The “gel” scene.
I still have issues with continuity…
Overall Thoughts,
I really feel that this show is walking on thin ice, and I just can’t seem to get around that feeling.
Isn’t Spock supposed to be the first Vulcan in Starfleet? Yeah, yeah, I know… This isn’t the FEDERATION Starfleet, it’s EARTH’s Starfleet. And T’Pol isn’t really even a member of Earth’s Starfleet, she is just “tagging along” for tickles and grins.
And what about the “Akiraprise” itself? Obviously this is a pretty big deal with humans just beginning to venture out into the great unknown of space, yet we have only now learned of the NX-01? There has never been ANY previous mention of this “Starship Enterprise,” and in fact, the NCC-1701 has always been referred to as the “first” Starship Enterprise.
Right, right… I got it, EARTH Starfleet versus the FEDERATION Starfleet. Sure… Like I said, Thin ice…
B&B could have avoided SOME of this controversy simply by naming the ship something OTHER than Enterprise (Akiraprise, perhaps?). It just seems that the more Trek that B&B produces, that many more “rationalizations” must be conceived amongst the fans in order to “preserve” continuity.
Is Enterprise just a TV show? Sure… But the problem is, it is based on something that has become MORE than “just a TV show. How many books and articles have been written on the mythos and fandom of Star Trek, not to mention how Star Trek has embedded itself into our 20th Century (and 21st) culture.
TPTB have a certain responsibility to make the show somewhat “believable,” even in Sci-Fi. Because this is a PREQUEL, this should occur on TWO fronts. First, the stories, characters, and events should be believable within the context of Enterprise. Second, the stories, characters, and events should be believable in the context that they occurred BEFORE The Original Series.
This is where I have a MAJOR problem with the Akiraprise. I see it, yet I do not really believe that this is a ship that could have existed before the TOS Enterprise. Even Wednesday night, I had to kick myself a couple of times through the course of the episode to remind myself that this is supposed to be happening BEFORE The Original Series.
I will continue to watch and see how the show turns out. To be fair, I will have to see at least a season (maybe more) in order to really judge the show appropriately. I can say this, however: I never got that “tingly feeling” (sometimes referred to as the “chill factor”) while watching the premiere of Enterprise. In actuality, it has been a long, long time since I last had that feeling while watching Star Trek…
Dan
[ September 27, 2001: Message edited by: Commander Dan ]
quote:
Isn’t Spock supposed to be the first Vulcan in Starfleet?
No, not really.
quote:
Originally posted by Vogon Poet:
Wait a minute, you absolutely sure about that?! I mean, it's one of the biggest contradictions in original-series Trek, that how can Spock be the first Vulcan in Starfleet when the Intrepid has an all-Vulcan crew. Now you're telling us that one half of that contradiction is actually non-canon?
Is this news? Spock was never stated to be the first Vulcan in Starfleet in any filmed Star Trek episode or movie. Go ahead, watch them all, it's nowhere to be found. I though everyone knew that by this point...
quote:
Because the young Vulcan chose to join Starfleet, he and Sarek opened an 18-year rift over Sarek's hope his son would attend the Vulcan Science Academy. Spock was the first Vulcan to enlist in the Federation Starfleet, serving aboard the U.S.S. Enterprise under Captain Christopher Pike as a lieutenant, and later for James T. Kirk
http://www.startrek.com/library/individ.asp?ID=112508
Read it an weap boys and girls!!
But it clearly states FEDERATION STARFLEET!....
quote:
Originally posted by Alshrim Dax:
Read it an weap boys and girls!!
What relevance does a quote from a Web site have with regards to the fact that, canonically, there was no mention of Spock being the first Vulcan to join Starfleet. Did I miss some ceremony in which the writers of the official Star Trek Web site gained the power to have their statements carry even the slightest authority?
It's also in the encyclopedia if I'm not mistaken... I'll go home and check it for sure!
Of course the first vulcan in Starfleet line didn't seem to make much sense at the time it was said and I wouldn't really mind if it was ignored.
quote:
No offense to composer Dennis McCarthy, but I really wish that B&B would have considered some new talent so we could get out of that “Voyager/DS9 feeling” that continued to lurk in the background of Enterprise.
I couldn't agree with you more. I didn't like the score at all. It really gave the show a DS9/Voyager feeling that it otherwise wouldn't have had (and that detracted from the mood they were trying to create).
quote:
Umm. Ya!! The site is run by Paramount!! Who owns the rights to Star Trek!!! I'd say they have an authority on Star Trek. Just reporting what's there man ... nothing more..
It's also in the encyclopedia if I'm not mistaken... I'll go home and check it for sure!
Said or shown onscreen = canon.
Stated in script or series bible, written by the Okuda's, posted on the official website, stated by Braga, Berman, Pillar, Roddenberry, and God but not said or shown onscreen = noncanon
[ September 28, 2001: Message edited by: Obi Juan ]
quote:
Originally posted by Obi Juan:
I am going to have to dig out the videos, because I swear it was said.
By all means. I assure you the search will be futile, but it's always fun to rewatch original series episodes.
For what it's worth, I think the myth originated with "Journey to Babel." Because Sarek disapproved of Spock's decision to join Starfleet, fans may have misinterpreted that to mean that Vulcans don't usually join Starfleet in general. In fact, it actually referred to Sarek's preference that Spock attend the Science Academy. But it's easy to see how pre-VCR fans might think otherwise... and that could grow very quickly through word of mouth.
For the record, i think that two of the older novels that could be considered canon are The Motion Picture novelization by Roddenberry and Vulcan's Glory by D.C.Fontana (the TOS staffer who crafted the Vulcans as a race in writing 'Journey to Babel' and 'Amok Time'), Since the two of them are much more important to Trek's history than those jokers B&B. Fontana's book is set during Spocks first mission on the Enterprise under Captain Pike and features a half-dozen Vulcan crewmembers of varying degrees of seniority. But its a book not filmed canon, so i cant force it down anyones throat.
[ September 28, 2001: Message edited by: CaptainMike ]
But enough Felderkarb about Vulcan primacy, back to the episode;
First the good: Liked the technology/sets/props a lot. The acting was pretty darned good and certainly above and beyond, say, "Encounter at Farpoint". The Suliban are going to be fun bad guys, and I loved that Tony "Tiny" Lister was playing a Klingon. The crew shows a lot promise both in terms of characters and actors. I like Scott Bakula a lot, but I am still having a hard time buying his character as a kind of a hard-ass. He just seems like such a nice guy. I don't know if the gel scene really needed to be in there, but I'm glad there was dialog happening (funny, but I do seem to be having trouble remembering exactly what that dialogue was...). The scene did seem a little too much. Maybe I'll like her better when the show gets its legs, but so far T'Pol is no 7of9 in my book.
And I'm sorry if you like it, but that title song really must go. It is sub-wretched. Cheapens the whole thing. "Dawson's Nebula" and all that...
Me: "There is something missing."
I'm still upset over the opening theme. It doesn't sound Star Trek! Reminds me more of those music videos they put together at Trek conventions. Give me a full orchestra any day.
The plot was okay, though I should probably watch it again since I got distracted several times during the show. I thought the females and Phlox had pretty strong characters, but the other guys are rather bland, though that's probably temporary. And that thing with Archer about not being afraid of the wind was kind of forced.
quote:
Originally posted by Tora Ziyal:
And that thing with Archer about not being afraid of the wind was kind of forced.
"Captain's Log, supplemental. Henceforth, baked beans, burritos, & curry are forbidden from being served aboard ship. Most esPECially all together."
Afraid of the wind? No. Afraid of ion storms? Yes.