In short, there are a number of "factions" involved in time travel as part of their regular operations. The plot of this episode revolves around Silik, our nutty Suliban buddy from the pilot show, and crewman Daniels, who claims to be from the 31st century. The beauty of this episode is that it really deosn't establish a good or bad guy side, as Daniels' sole motive was to capture Silik, and Silik's job was apparently to *save* the Enterprise, and possibly to capture some technological doohickey of Daniels'.
But Daniels' story is thus: he works for a group that enforces the "Temporal Accords" governing time travel. Silik's pals are from a time before his, and can only project themselves into the past - they can't interact with it. Anyway, Daniels brought with him a variety of technological doohickies including a "temporal observatory" which apparently kept track of various peoples traveling in time, such as some people observing the construction of the Giza Pyramids - but at least they were "following the rules". He also had some sort of phase-shifting gadget which lets him walk through walls and stuff.
FutureGuy makes an appearance here, and supervises the *removal* of some of Silik's genetic enhancements as punishment for not getting the Klingons to go to war. FutureGuy does promise to restore them however should Silik succeed in his mission. Oddly, Silik's mission was to save Enterprise from an antimatter cascade, and does so. However Archer prohibits him from sneaking off with the observatory gadget, but he does escape.
But where does this leave us? Or rather, when? If Daniels really is from the 31st Century, this is a couple centuries after Braxton's adventures on the Relativity and Aeon. Daniels comes from Illinois, but on an Earth that's allegedly not the Earth that the Pre-E crew is familiar with. Also, what about FurtureGuy? By the 23rd Century people knew enough to slingshot around the sun in order to travel through time. Couldn't he just do that? Or possibly, he was sitting in the future at some point, and could only communicate in real time in the temporal chamber thing. So, it's possible he came from a point in the futre sooner than the 29th Century, when Timefleet could easily transport people through time, and probably later than the 22nd. Point being, that Daniels' organization apparently could not track FutreGuy and stop him at his origin time. Strange, that.
So, as you can see this episode raised a bunch more questions than it answered, and at this point I think that's a good thing. We have here a time travel episode that doesn't distinctly involve time travel, but does. Cool.
Mark
[ November 28, 2001: Message edited by: Mark Nguyen ]
Mark, when this thread is on the main board, the ["Cold Front" $$$] is ommitted, and someone clicking into the thread might not realize you're talking of the episode in particular, but the Temporal Cold War in general.
Just a thought
Mark
Really, I don't mind. I'm looking out for others. Shouldn't you be doing that too?
Going to Enterprise technology for a moment, it looks like the enlisted crew really gets screwed on their cabins. Those things are smaller than most dorm rooms I've lived in! I guess that hold to the "submarine" feel of the sets, though. Quite nice, I thought. Also, the massive lock that Reed puts on Daniels' former quarters is an interesting device. Could be a similar alarm mechanism to the device on Spock's quarters in The Search for Spock? And on a final note, I was right. Enterprise's launch bays do have to depressurize and repressurize which each use.
The lock WAS damn cool.
One last thing: it looks like Main Engineering is in the saucer. When pointed out the malfunctioning relay to Daniels, he indicated its location on a schematic overlay. So the reactor is in the saucer, and it really doesn't look like it can be ejected in an emergency.
I'm also left with this question. Was the Enterprise suppose to be a ball of reckage and fire by now? If Silik was lying about the fact that the Enterprise was not supposed to be destroyed at that time then it's open season on continuety for Berman. He can do what ever the hell he wants at this point.
In Archer's room there was a wall with sketches of all the previous Enterprises. There was a sketch of another space craft right next to the one of the space shuttle Enterprise. I don't think it was the ring ship Enterprise, but I cannot be certian.
*catches breath*
Only thing of some redeeming quality the guy said, or at least didn't say: there was apparently no more Starfleet. Either that, or Starfleet was no longer involved in time policing.
Good thing they locked his quarters up before the end, I bet Daniels was the type to leave dirty socks laying around. "God knows what else is in there"? Yeah C'ptain, check in there in a couple seasons. You'll be pleasantly surprised. 
If I had to guess, I'd say that Daniels (in the interest of explaining things quickly) wasn't entirely honest with Archer about the capabilities of the future. I mean, did you honestly expect a detailed history of time-travel? "Yeah, in a hundred years, you'll be able to sling-shot around the sun."
Also, I would imagine that "Time-Fleet" can somehow protect itself from ripples in time. This might also hamper their knowledge of how their Time-Cops' missions end up.
quote:
there was apparently no more Starfleet
Can I ask why that is redeeming?
quote:
Originally posted by Siegfried:
Wait a second, the Suliban's FutureGuy is operating from the 30th Century? I must have missed that part, when was it said?
Naw, his puppet master is from the 30th Century.
The temporal observatory appears to have been fried, but we got to see enough of it that I can make a few observations. It seems very similar to the interface onboard Annorax's temporal weapon/ship, except 3D. But I wouldn't care to speculate if the Krenim have any role in the Temporal Cold War. 
I've also kind of got a funky theory that solves this whole time travel thing... Future Guy and Daniels don't actually time travel. Think about it. We've seen 29th Century time travel technology. If good old Braxton is any indication, actually physically travelling back in time strains the body and warps the mind. Instead, I think Future Guy and Daniels are (for lack of better term) temporal isomorphic projections. Future Guy's is just less advanced. Regular isomorphic projections were seen in "Think Tank," where Jason Alexander's character, while not actually there, could drink and taste coffee. Daniels, while for all intents and purposes could interact with the 22nd Century as though he was actually there, was not. Silik's beam didn't actually kill Daniels, it just shattered the projection.
Am I making any sense with this?
The time-traveling red-shirt (Note: He was wearing red and he died. ) said he was "more or less" Human. Is it possible that Daniel's was genetically modifed to handle extended time-travel without developing temoral psychosis? Myabe that was what he meant by being "more or less" Human. As for genetic modifications being illegal within the Federation, they may have made an exception by the time the 31st century rolled around.
Sorry to say this Krenim, but if Daniels was a projection I think Phlox would have noticed this when he gave him a physical. On the other hand a genetic modification could be hidden from Phlox's instruments if need be.....
I need to review the episode again, but I also have a theory about the theory I just told you about. hehe.
[ November 28, 2001: Message edited by: MIB ]
[ November 28, 2001: Message edited by: MIB ]
And I like the notion that Daniels wasn't really there, but was merely a more advanced version of the temporal projection that FutureGuy was apparently using. After all, when Silik killed him, he didn't jsut vapourize - he seemed to destabilize or something first, laugh a bit (per the closed captioning), and then he *exploded* with some blue energy pyrotechnics. Now, granted we don't know what kind of weapon Silik had, but it certainly didn't seem to kill with the familiar vapourization thing we know in Trek, and not like the drilling/burning effect we've seen those weapons have on Archer's leg and the Suliban babe.
So, assuming TPTB are actually keeping track of these things, whatever Silik killed wasn't just human. And if Daniels was actually *in* this time frame, then when he was shot he'd look like Archer's leg or that Suliban babe. In other words, he may very well be some sort of projection like it has been posited here. Cool, no?
Mind you, the key thing is that we don't really know if what Daniels was saying was the actual truth. If he was Timefleet or something like that, then even if they'd been killed I'd assume someone would be sent back to cleam up the mess. This of course depends on what the mess *was*. According to the supposed original timeline, the Pre-E was *destroyed* in the episode. Of course, this may be some alternate limeline hijinks caused by FutureGuy or whoever Daniels was with. In any case, we're probably going to assume that Archer, T'Pol and Trip remember what this is all about for future episodes - no one at least erased their memories, like they supposedly do as standard procedure with Timefleet. Hmm...
Time travel. Tricky Business. Unpredictable.
Mark
Mark
We know from Star Trek the progression of the use of time travel.
2151
Vulcans are disputing the validity and, more importantly, the existence of time travel.
2266
Time travel is proven to exist as a freak side effect of an engineering process. ("The Naked Time")
2267
Guardian of Forever is discovered. This ancient bio-mechanicoid structure is a time portal. ("The City on the Edge of Forever")
2268
The first tentative steps toward examining past cultures is taken by Starfleet. There are no set protocols on how to work in a past period. ("Assignment: Earth")
2286
Using the sling shot method, the crew of the HMS Bounty retrieve two humpback whales from 1986 Earth and return them to current Earth.
2373
Earliest known existence of the Temporal Board. This board investigates explorations into the past by Starfleet personnel. Their mission-determine the damage, if any, to the timeline and the level of culpability by the personnel.
2769
Anthropologists are studying the building of the Great Pyramids of Giza.
~2870
Timeships are in operational. Operated by the Temporal Board, they are assigned to monitor timelines.
People can be transported by powerful energy waves to a distant past. These people can interact with people of the past. ("Future's End", "Relativity")
~3050
A Temporal Court is in existence. This court works in conjunction with time travelers of the past, present, and future (?) on the setting of protocols and regulations for space traveleing. Anthropological study is permitted.
Possibly-instead of sending people into the past, the temporal authorities send highly focused projections that exhibit the properties of a real person into the past. This could be in response to medical effects associated with persons who did physically travel to the past.
quote:
The time-traveling red-shirt (Note: He was wearing red and he died. ) said he was "more or less" Human. Is it possible that Daniel's was genetically modifed to handle extended time-travel without developing temoral psychosis? Myabe that was what he meant by being "more or less" Human. As for genetic modifications being illegal within the Federation, they may have made an exception by the time the 31st century rolled around.
Ehmm... Gary Seven, anyone?
quote:
Originally posted by MIB:
I'm also left with this question. Was the Enterprise suppose to be a ball of reckage and fire by now? If Silik was lying about the fact that the Enterprise was not supposed to be destroyed at that time then it's open season on continuety for Berman. He can do what ever the hell he wants at this point.
Assuming that Daniels was telling the approximate truth about the Temporal Accords and so on, no, Enterprise was not supposed to be destroyed. After all, Daniels didn't seem shocked to still be alive after Silik saved them; in fact, his mission demanded it. Given that all interviews with Berman and Braga mention them bending over backward to ensure that Enterprise doesn't significantly--and obviously your opinion of significantly may differ from theirs--violate continuity, it seems clear that these time-travel incidents will be handled in the "predestination" manner.
quote:
Daniels is from the 31st Century while Braxton was from 29th Century.
However, Daniels clearly states that those from the 30th Century does
not have the technology to send people back. So where does that leave
Braxton and (quoting someone else) "Timefleet"?
Alternate timeline, perhaps? After all, the various possible futures are equally valid until we reach the decision points necessary to choose between them.
Of course, this leaves us with the question of which future is supposed to be the correct one: Daniels'? Or Braxton's? Or maybe neither?
quote:
Originally posted by Woodside Kid:
Alternate timeline, perhaps? After all, the various possible futures are equally valid until we reach the decision points necessary to choose between them.Of course, this leaves us with the question of which future is supposed to be the correct one: Daniels'? Or Braxton's? Or maybe neither?
Guys, guys, guys. Nobody ever said the Humanoid Figure is from the thirtieth century! They said he was from "an earlier century" relative to Daniels's thirty-first, not "a century ealier." He could be from later in the twenty-second century for all we know.
Sorry.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Nguyen:
Now, granted we don't know what kind of weapon Silik had, but it certainly didn't seem to kill with the familiar vapourization thing we know in Trek, and not like the drilling/burning effect we've seen those weapons have on Archer's leg and the Suliban babe.
It was a particle beam weapon, T'Pol mentioned the thing Archer was shot with after he woke up. It was the same weapon that fried Daniels.
What's this, the 8th episode of the new series, and temperoral paradoxes are already manifesting themselves.
Mark
As for the funky disruptor effect, I have a theory for that as well. That disruption effect that started to surround Daniels may not have been a hologram breaking down, but it might have been a transporter trying to beam him back into the future. It could be some kind of auto-retrieve program at work. Maybe if a time-traveler is severely injured, he/she atuomatically gets pulled back into the future for fear that his/her cover would be blown if a hospital checks who the time-traveler is and finds out that he/she doesn't 'offically' exsist.
-MMoM
On the other hand, I don't think Enterprise was supposed to be in a position to be destroyed in the first place. If we assume the Shadowy FutureGuy has temporal technology on par with Annorax from "The Year of Hell," he can predict which actions by Silik could cause Enterprise to be struck by that particular plasma flare. Thus, he could arrange for himself to be their to save the ship. Of course, this then leads to the possibility that Shadowy FutureGuy already knew that Silik was going to fail. That is, of course, unless Shadowy Future Guy is interfering in things all at once. That is, he's in his temporal chamber giving orders for about twenty minutes in his time frame. But he's jumping to points all over the seven-year time frame of Enterprise.
Great googly moogly, my head hurts now.
Or did you mean another pointy-eared alien?
quote:
Originally posted by MIB:
I have narrowed down the century from which Shadow Guy comes from to either the 25th, 26th, or 27th centuries.
How? Evidence?
This means that they must have developed the tech to at least partially transport people back into the past in either the 25th, 26th, or 27th centuries.
No watch me get totally embarrased when it is revealed that the Shadow Guy actually comes from the 16th century or somewhere around there.
quote:
Originally posted by MIB:
Daniels said that the Shadow Guys could only partially materialize in the past to give orders. However, he said that they eventually perfected the process. We know that by the 29th century they have the process perfected because of Braxton's temporal tranporter.
However, we don't know that Daniels came from the same possible future as Braxton. If he didn't, then this tells us nothing.
quote:
Originally posted by MIB:
We also know that they were capable of completely materializing in the past in the 28th century because Daniels mentioned a group of scientists from the year 27-something were at Giza, witnessing the pyramids construction.
Daniels never said that the scientists were "at Giza," merely that they were observing. They may have been there, but they may have not. As such, it isn't appropriate to use this as a data point.
quote:
Originally posted by MIB:
No one had the tech to even partially transport themselves in the past by the 24th century.
This is true. The only things we know for sure are that the humanoid figure comes from after 2377 and before the thirty-first century.
Thus, FutureGuy could still be post-Braxton.
quote:
However, we don't know that Daniels came from the same possible future
as Braxton. If he didn't, then this tells us nothing.
Hmmm....different possible futures. Now where did I hear that before?