You know the game. Comments and corrections welcome.
 

For whatever reason, the Visual Effects Department scaled up the station to 1609m (5280') as early as the pilot, and used this figure until the end. It seems Rick and Mike tried a compromise in "The Making of DS9" by giving a 1350m number, which turns out to be the exact average of these two sizes (I averaged them and got 1353m). I'd go with Rick's design size because it really is a good compromise between the structure and VFX shots.

2) IIRC, the Magazine has a "Designing the.." article about Dukat's freighter explaining how every little trapezoidal box is actually a cargo bay. Knowing the rough size of the cargo bay set, and the fact that the ship has at least five decks according to the dialogue, we might be able to calculate a range for its size.

3) You could explain how you got the 98m number for the Hideki, or say "approx. 98m". This is my reasoning: we know that at least two sources set the Hideki equal in length to the Jem'Hadar attack ship: the DS9TM (70m/68m) and Stipes (152m/152m). We know the Jem'Hadar attack ship must be about 100m long because it's buried 90m into the rock according to the dialogue in "The Ship", while the visible portion is not that big. Hence, the Hideki should be about 100m long as well. The way I got the 98m figure is by setting the Defiant equal to 110m, while adopting Stipes' 152m/171m ratio of sizes.

However, the Stipes numbers obviously showed up onscreen a few times -- I believe some of those fleet shots show the Hideki at about half the size of a Galor, supporting the 152m/366m ratio espoused by Stipes. We've also seen the Jem'Hadar fighter at 152m, though the earliest shots have it at around 100m. In the interest of overall accuracy, these numbers should probably be discarded.

[ December 04, 2001: Message edited by: Phelps ]

Also in "Accesion" there was a different type of Bajoran sailing ship.

[ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: AndrewR ]

Also, there is a detachable shuttle that emerges from the base of the Marauders.
 

In the episode "The Nagus", the Nagus traveled to DS9 aboard the transport ship Sepulo. This ship is identified as Ferengi by the command personnel.

Sepulo is seen docking at DS9.
 

Good point about the winged ship being of two distinct interior designs. Then again, most of the interior remains unseen in both variants. We could very easily claim that the ship has *both* bridges. The small cockpit would be for flying the ship, while the larger set would be a place from where Colonel Kira could command a fleet. IIRC, we never saw any windows on the larger set...

But did we really see the interior of this design in "Preemptive Strike"? There were multiple Maquis types there, and we saw two interiors - that of Ro's ship ("Alien shuttle" set reworked) and of a second Maquis ship ("Starfleet shuttle" set heavily reworked, or custom set?). But did we truly get a clear association between the latter set and the winged Bajoran exterior?

Note that we should probably disregard all data from the mirror universe, where this ship also made an appearance. Also note that the Maquis ship most probably had warp drive, while the Bajoran ship may or may not have had one. Despite DS9 TM claims, there's nothing in the episodes to suggest that the Bajoran ships lacked warp capability.

About the Wadi ship... Every time it made an appearance in seemingly Bajoran hands, it was hauling VIP passengers. Why not say it was the same ship every time? Perhaps Wadi vessels are eminently suited for VIP transport, at least in the price range Bajor could afford?

Then again, the Xepolites fly that design, too (although in a vastly larger scale - see "The Maquis"). But fortunately for us, that vessel was filmed from such interesting angles that the similarity is not all that obvious.

Timo Saloniemi

[ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: Timo ]

What was the class/size of the shuttle/ship seen docked at an upper pylon in "Profit and Loss" season 2.

What about the ground base seen in "Once more unto the breach" - it was dominion? But it was distinctively cardassian - the three pronged towers etc.
 

The ship that premiered as the rather puny Pakled vessel was seen in Cardassian hands in "The Wounded". There, it was a far larger freighter, perhaps 300-400m long. The model also made an appearance in that size range in DS9, as a Rigelian freighter in "Vortex".

Since the model was a regular "guest ship" throughout TNG, the Cardassians could have purchased it from the wide interstellar market. However, it's IMHO good to note that the triangular shape is VERY remniscent of the other two triangle ships seen in Cardassian hands, and in that same tan coloration. Perhaps the triangular design motif is native to Cardassians?

Bajorans would probably have access to the two triangle-ship types only because the Cardassians left some behind after the occupation, and the Bajoran design style would be closer to the graceful winged interceptors...

As for the cargo holds in the "spiny" freighter being separable pods, they sure didn't look like that from inside in "Return to Grace". I'd love to see a "container ship" fly with an empty container berth or two even once, or with differently colored containers or something... (The DY-100 does seem to lack the top two or three containers, but then again, that ship is never seen with a full set!)

And re: the shuttle/ship in "Profit and Loss". I seem to remember it docked on the ring, not on the pylons. It was the Hideki model, in its first appearance ever, and the scale vs. DS9 suggested there was roughly commensurate with the big military Hidekis that later were seen attacking the station.

One shouldn't forget a reference to a "Cardassian frigate" in VOY (I think "Dreadnought" was the episode, but I'll check). Is that the Hideki, or an unseen type?

Timo Saloniemi

[ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: Timo ]

There is one unknown Ferengi design - the ship that Bok's son used in order to attack Picard and the Stargazer. It can't have been a D'Kora, since Picard did not recognize the design after "The Last Outpost". I doubt it was one of the shuttles, either - but all we know about it is that the faked logs of Picard mentioned a "subspace antenna cluster" that Picard would have mistaken for a weapons array.

Perhaps this ship was not of Ferengi manufacture, so that possible surviving witnesses could not prove a Ferengi connection after a pirate raid. But it's at least potentially an unseen Ferengi vessel.

Timo Saloniemi
 

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I'd love to see a "container ship" fly with an empty container berth or two even once, or with differently colored containers or something...

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You'll get your wish when you get to see Enterprise, Timo. More or less.
 

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I'd love to see a "container ship" fly with an empty container berth

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Here are a couple of screenshots of the ECS Fortunate.

[ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: Spike ]

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Question, Bernd: Are you going to make larger versions of the small ships in the database that we can link to, such as the Surak class, Klingon ship type from "Unexpected", the Conestoga, etc.?

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The quality of the screen caps (at least of my copy) doesn't allow to see more details than there are in the small pics, and in the case of the "Unexpected" ship I just don't want to know how exactly it looks.

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The first bajoran ship has been seen in at least two sizes... one the size of a runabout->Maquis Raider - i.e. the cock-pit was for 2-4 people... the second size was where it was big enough to house a proper bridge - the first episode of season 7 - had Kira on a Bajoran bridge.

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You're right. Now I remember the smaller version too.

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For the Ferengi - if you include DS9 as a Bajoran station then the Klingon ship that the Ferengi had in "Rascals" would also be a Ferengi ship.

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Well, I would have to include Gul Dukat's BoP too (on the Cardassian page). I will think about that.

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About the Wadi ship... Every time it made an appearance in seemingly Bajoran hands, it was hauling VIP passengers. Why not say it was the same ship every time? Perhaps Wadi vessels are eminently suited for VIP transport, at least in the price range Bajor could afford?

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Maybe yes. I would have to check the episodes (most of which I don't seem to have on tape).

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In the episode "The Nagus", the Nagus traveled to DS9 aboard the transport ship Sepulo. This ship is identified as Ferengi by the command personnel.

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That's interesting. What did the ship look like?

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Here are a couple of screenshots of the ECS Fortunate.

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Thanks. These are a lot better than mine. Should be sufficient for a rough schematic.
 

I mean, it IS distinct from the Cardassian version. New "nacelles", new stuff at the bow. And it's big enough to carry two or three of the Cardie versions in pieces in its holds!

Timo Saloniemi
 

If you have the episode "The Nagus", the Sepulo will be the ship seen docking with the station at the beginning of the episode.

In reference to those images of the ECS Fortunate, I find it strange that there are no markings. No name, no registry, nothing. In our merchant marines, ships have names painted on their sides (port, starboard) and aft. In the navy, ships don't have their names painted on. They have numbers painted on to tell a friendly who they are. This spaceship has neither system. What could be the reason for that, I wonder?
 

The Fortunate might be left undecorated in a brief and rare burst of logic. In space, visual identification probably doesn't play that much of a role - when you are at visual range, it's usually too late. Too late to turn away if this is a foe or an uninteresting neutral. Too late to turn towards the ship if this is your target - you had to do all the required turning in order to get to visual range already.

As for why Starfleet would later being painting names and numbers on its ships, well, the candle of logic must have burned out. At least alien races usually don't do anything that stupid.

Timo Saloniemi
 

This is what I have been missing, screenshots of the new ships from the new show posted here
 

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No name

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Look at fortunate9.jpg. There you can see the name. And I made another screenshot where you can see the "TE" of "FORTUNATE".
 

Timo Saloniemi
 

These are the head illustrators for the respective seasons, however, Jim Martin did some stuff in season 1 as well (besides bringing coffee). He helped Rick Sternbach designed the runabouts, and also visualize station interiors with Delgado. Doug Drexler became more and more involved in the illustrating business as well in later seasons, designing things like the Chaffee and Defiant's interiors.

[ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: Phelps ]

Illustrators have been credited in an odd way on Enterprise. Most episodes, Drexler is credited as "Senior Illustrator," but in certain shows that credit's been removed and instead either John Eaves or David E. Duncan has been credited as the "production illustrator," implying as best I can make out that for that particular episode Drexler took time off and the new stuff was drawn by someone else on staff. According the earlier reports on startrek.com, Eaves was the senior illustrator and Drexler the junior, but that's apparently not the case now that the show's in production. Jim Martin was also meant to be on-staff, though we have yet to see any of his work.

Anyway, getting back to the question, Fortunate Son's credits (available at Psi Phi) say Eaves worked as that ep's production illustrator. I guess we can assume that the Fortunate and the very cool Nausicaan raiderships were his work.

[ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: The_Tom ]

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I mean, it IS distinct from the Cardassian version. New "nacelles", new stuff at the bow. And it's big enough to carry two or three of the Cardie versions in pieces in its holds!

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You're right. It should be a different,, larger class.
 

[ December 06, 2001: Message edited by: Phelps ]

[ December 07, 2001: Message edited by: targetemployee ]