quote:Posted by Marco Palmieri on Friday, March 04 2005 at 16:52:39 GMT
First, I wanted to let everyone know that Taking Wing is in da house! I just received my first advance copies, and it's quite the handsome book (not to mention a fun read). It should start appearing on bookstore shelves within the next week or so.
But mainly, I wanted to give everyone a quick update on the Starship Titan Design Contest.
- Unfortunately, despite my efforts to open the contest to fans worldwide, participation will be limited, like the Strange New Worlds contest, to residents of the United States and Canada, excluding Quebec, for the same reason: the differences in the laws governing contests that exist in different countries.
- The contest will officially commence at 12:00am Eastern Time on March 29, 2005. It will close at 11:59pm Eastern Time on August 15, 2005. A winner will be announced in October, 2005.
- The winning design will be printed in the pages of an upcoming Titan novel, and used as the basis for cover art on the same book. The winning designer will be credited on the book's copyright page.
- All submissions must be made electroncially, via email.
- The contest judges will include the Star Trek editorial staff at Pocket, together with Star Trek designers Doug Drexler, Michael Okuda, and Rick Sternbach; Associate Producer, Star Trek: Enterprise Dave Rossi; Senior Director of Licensed Publishing for Viacom Consumer Products Paula M. Block; and Manager of Licenced Publishing for Viacom Consumer Products John Van Citters.
As announced previously, the complete contest rules are printed in the back matter of Taking Wing, and they'll also be posted on the Simon and Schuster website on March 29, 2005.
Marco
Posted by Kobi (Member # 1360) on :
quote:Posted by Marco Palmieri on Friday, March 04 2005 at 16:52:39 GMT [...] - Unfortunately, despite my efforts to open the contest to fans worldwide, participation will be limited, like the Strange New Worlds contest, to residents of the United States and Canada, excluding Quebec, for the same reason: the differences in the laws governing contests that exist in different countries.
[...]
Damn some kind of unfair...
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
At least its not limited to JUST the US...
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
I'm excluded! Damn!
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Er...you could always have one of us submit it for you.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Are their any guidelines anywhere that designs have to work within (i.e. How old the ship should be, it's size relative to established vessels, etc.)
Posted by Krenim (Member # 22) on :
Like I said when word of this first got out, I would really like for somebody here at Flare to win this contest.
Yes, because I'm no good at ship design, I must emulate bad parenting by living through all of you. Now clean your rooms.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I think the idea is that contestants have to read the first book, or at least exerpts from it, and go nuts from there. So, we'll get to look at a lot of variations on a theme, or something like that.
Mark
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Since this is the novel realm, we probably stand a good chance that Titan as described avoids *some* of the pitfalls a movie-introduced Titan would dive into. Here's hoping the description will exclude at least the following:
I'd be happy with five out of six... Or even four out of six.
At the same time, I'm hoping the writers will include a hook specifically for the designers, something like "Riker marveled at the unprecedented design of the shuttlebay; his every muscle and nerve itched to take a shuttle for a spin from that curious thing" or "the ship's silhouette reminded Riker of that fantastic old Earth aircraft in one of the family scrapbooks Picard had been 'sharing' with him ever since hitting his (frankly rather annoying) midlife crisis".
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
If I designed Titan, she'd end up looking like something launched in 2230. Probably not what they're looking for.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Unless it IS what they're lookig for. Heck, pseudo-kinda-sorta retro is in these days...
Personally, all I really care for is that she be BIG. I'm not talking huger than E-D (though that wouldn't be hideous), but bigger than what we've been given these last few series. They've been trending smaller since TNG (E-E, Voyager, Defiant, Pre-E), and I think it's time to throw the notion into reverse. Give us something that's, well, titanic.
Mark
Posted by Marauth (Member # 1320) on :
quote:They've been trending smaller since TNG (E-E, Voyager, Defiant, Pre-E), and I think it's time to throw the notion into reverse. Give us something that's, well, titanic.
Mark [/QB]
1. Most important rule of technological advancement - make things smaller, to the point you just think 'does it really need to be that small?' Sadly it seems only the japanese have caught onto that rule.
2. The Titans were not themselves actually 'titanic' as you use the word, they were the same size as the Olympians IIRC, the meaning of titanic as something preposterously huge has only arisen since the Titanic that sunk. They were actually the original gods born of heaven and earth, the youngest and their leader - Chronos is the father of Zeus who eventually supplants him with the Olympian pantheon. Most of the myths seem to involve the son castrating the father as part of taking his place. Those crazy greeks.
3. Re: the exclusion, I have only one phrase - bum-clouds. Not that I'd win, but it's highly unjust that the majority of the worlds population can't enter.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
The possibility of an Al-Qaeda operative designing the Titan is one they can't afford to ignore.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: Er...you could always have one of us submit it for you.
Would that work? Would you do it? There is some FINE talent outside of North America, Masao, Rutger Warrink (RW) - to name just two.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Is it possible "Titan" was just used to reference the Saturnian moon, which in turn, was named after the Titans from Greek Mythology?
Do the other Saturnian moons follow any sort of pattern, a la the Uranian system (all females from Shakespeare).
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
What about submitting a version as a "Flare" entry? We can have our own mini competition, add/subtract points (using polls?). Then some of you cool artists can do 2d versions, 3d versions, line drawings, MSDs, Seanr could do a bridge! Michael could design Deanna's wardrobe... things like that !
We'd probably end up getting bogged down at what sort of M/AMR assembly should be used and how redundant the computer cores should be etc.
Then we get Mojo to pull some strings and it ends up in the Ships of the Line calendar (yes I know he hasn't been associated with it for a few years).
Maybe replace the UP3 forum!?!
Andrew
Posted by Austin Powers (Member # 250) on :
Actually, the combined Flare community should get together to produce the next Star Trek series!
Krenim would write the stories, with technical input by Bernd, Timo, etc.
MinutiaeMan would be in charge of continuity of course, while Masao, IrishMan, Axeman, The Red Admiral et al could design the ships. Jason and Snay would be the ideal candidates to build the filming miniatures (a novelty - filming in 1:2500 scale - or Lego for that matter... )
Styrofoam could supply materials for set-contruction...
And so on and so forth.
We really seem to have talent from most of the trades around.
Let's get to it and show Berman & Braga how to do Star Trek!
Then again, what would we debate about if Star Trek was suddenly perfect? Posted by Manticore (Member # 1227) on :
Who would write?
Well, I guess I could shanghai the writing staff for my fanfic in... Posted by Krenim (Member # 22) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: What about submitting a version as a "Flare" entry? We can have our own mini competition, add/subtract points (using polls?). Then some of you cool artists can do 2d versions, 3d versions, line drawings, MSDs, Seanr could do a bridge! Michael could design Deanna's wardrobe... things like that !
You know, I was really considering proposing this sort of thing to the rest of the Admins and Mods: Opening up a new private forum for the contest, getting together a great design team from the regulars here, and having somebody eligible to submit the final product. If enough of you guys would be interested, let me know and I'll see what I can set in motion.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"Krenim would write the stories, with technical input by Bernd, Timo, etc."
"Who would write?"
Hm, I wonder...
Posted by Manticore (Member # 1227) on :
quote:Originally posted by TSN:
"Krenim would write the stories, with technical input by Bernd, Timo, etc."
"Who would write?"
Hm, I wonder...
Well, I still volunteer. Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Tagline for the secret Forum: "If a thousand monkeys typed on a thousand computers for a thousand years. . ."
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
"It was the best of times it was the BLURST of times!?!" Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'll design a bridge. Someone else'll have to do better than my usual pencil sketches, though...
Mark
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: I'll design a bridge. Someone else'll have to do better than my usual pencil sketches, though...
Mark
That's why you'd need Seanr back - but he chucked a spack awhile ago and never came back.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
"chucked a spack"?!?
You just made that up: admit it.
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: "It was the best of times it was the BLURST of times!?!"
"A Titanic Challenge?" No? I'll just go back to lurking then. Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
I could do a 3d version. It'd just look really REALLY bad Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jason Abbadon: "chucked a spack"?!?
You just made that up: admit it.
Nah! Never heard it? Must be Australian slang (school yard type).
Posted by Wes (Member # 212) on :
I was digging around some unfinished projects and found this. I might adapt it for a Titan design. Mabye not..
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
I think it's rather pointless to post any designs yet until the book comes out giving the description of the ship.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Besides, that design won't work. The starboard nacelle's off.
Rampant speculation isn't bad for SOME things, though. For the bridge, I look at it from a producer's perspective as well as a dramatic one. For example, Troi is aboard and is presumably still the counsellor and not first officer. Regardless, the bridge of the Titan will probbaly need a seat for a counsellor - so I'll be approaching it as having a tri-seat centre section. Likewise, as the Titan is likely to be a larger starship, the bridge will be on the order of the Sovereign class, but hopefully with a better arrangement of the same number of stations.
Mark
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
After catching the end of Nemesis the otherday, I am for them putting the Captain's Ready Room back on the "captain's left" - our right of screen.
So we have to wait for the book to come out? I thought that it was open slather at the moment?
What makes anyone suspect that it's a NEW ship? Maybe it's of the same vintage as the Sovereign/Intrepid/Prometheus classes - I would stick with in that region of classes.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'm going with that, and I suspect most people will be as well. From a production standpoint, we should stay within established Trek tech dogma. No wild innovations, no wierd and mysterious technologies. MAYBE something like a holocommunicator, or some of the other things that have cropped up over the years that would add a minor, but reasonable touch.
I guess one way of preparing would be to look at how some of the other book series have established starships. Palmieri and the other editors will be familiar with the processes that introduce readers to their starships, such as the Da Vinci, Gorkon, and Challenger; does anyone have those books, and would be willing to print the corresponding paragraphs that initially describe those ships?
Mark
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:What makes anyone suspect that it's a NEW ship?
Because Marco Palmieri et. al have stated that it will be a new ship. If they were going to use an established design, then why would they have a contest?
However, I'm guessing that you mean that the ship, while new, should come from the same "family" of newer designs (i.e. the Sovereign/Nova/Prometheus types). All I'm saying is that we don't know yet just how detailed the book's description will be until it comes out.
quote:I guess one way of preparing would be to look at how some of the other book series have established starships. Palmieri and the other editors will be familiar with the processes that introduce readers to their starships, such as the Da Vinci, Gorkon, and Challenger; does anyone have those books, and would be willing to print the corresponding paragraphs that initially describe those ships?
The DaVinci is a Saber class ship.
The Gorkon has never been described in the books, but someone drew a schematic based on Keith DeCandido's oral description, and it's shown at the end of one of the books. IMO, it's a pretty bad design for a brand new class. All it is is the Vor'cha with a fatter body, a more squared-off nose, and a few extra disruptor cannons. The side and front views of the ship are identical to the Vor'cha. (Note - the schematic is actually a bit different from the cover art of the ship: The cover art makes the ship look exactly like a Vor'cha only substituting the rear top pod with a spike that extends behind the ship).
On the subject of cover art, the Challenger only bears a miniscule resemblance to how it's described in the book. The artwork depicts a Constitution class saucer and secondary hull. The neck is fatter and more golden colored than a normal Connie neck. Ditto for the two nacelles. The nacelle pylons are black and look like a girl's hair clip.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
The Challenger design is awful.
..as is that "Gorkon" as well: a LOT of Trek's covers (aside from the DS9 stuff which is bueatiful) have slid in the quality department.
The current SCE book boasts both a Steamrunner and Sabre on it's cover and is honestly, the worst illustration I've ever seen on a nationally published book.
Even the old TNG book cover with the upside-down battlestar galactica photo is FAR better.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
The cover for the first Titan novel appears to rock. No ship though.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
VERY nice. This is what I was referring to. It's actually far worse in person where you can see the rough outlines on the ships and the crooked windows and lifeboats on the Sabre.
Posted by Griffworks (Member # 1014) on :
quote:Originally posted by Marauth: 3. Re: the exclusion, I have only one phrase - bum-clouds. Not that I'd win, but it's highly unjust that the majority of the worlds population can't enter.
quote:the differences in the laws governing contests that exist in different countries.
Sounds like ya'll need to talk to your local law makers.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
*shudder* That cover is horrid. I love it when I can tell which photos the artst used as photo reference.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Hey, has a character list been released for Titan? It'd be nice if we knew of any special character positions, so better to build a bridge for.
Mark
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Aban Rune: *shudder* That cover is horrid. I love it when I can tell which photos the artst used as photo reference.
FAR better than using the same stills and painting a really sloppy illustration of the same scene (as on that awful SCE book- really, so look at it in the bookstore: you'll wretch in the asile).
Though I cant imagine wht the former Preator is on tyhe cover- it's not as though a sizable portion of the novel will focus on his ashes (hopefully, anyway).
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Maybe the book is about the Preator's unstable clone and how he attempts to take control of the Romulan government.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
The Titan's description is posted online now:
quote:Here are the main parts of the concept notes from the back of the titan novel...(not exactly word for word)
Titan Concept notes
USS Titan, NCC 80102, Luna-Class
The Titan is a mid-size starfleet vessel, approx. 450m in length, with a crew complement of 350, Titans hull configuration is comparable to other SF vessels.
Luna class is SF newest-gen long-range explorer, a starship but not built specifically for combat, but like the connie, a vessel designed for a long term multipurpose mission into uncharted space. Equipped with conventional Tactical systems (deflector shields, phasers, quantum torps) Titan also boasts state-of-the-art propulsion and cutting-edge scientific equipment as well as being a testbed for experimental scienc tech not yet available on other classes.
The Titan is manned by the most varied multispecies crew in SF history, with humans comprising less than 15% of the 350 member crewthe diversity of the crew is intended to facilitate stories that will explore the ways that beings of different cultures, biologies, psychologies and physical appearances learn how to work together, or fail to, depending on the circumstances they encounter.
The Luna-class development project was initiated in 2369 in response to the discovery of the Bajoran wormhole. Field testing of the USS Luna began in 2372, but the projected was shelved due to the dominion war, then resumed in 2375.
LUNA-Class Fleet:
all ships named for moons in the Sol System (Terran Solar System)
Amalthea Callisto Charon Europa Galatea Ganymede Io Luna Oberon Rhea Titan Triton
Intresting- a crew of only 350! This means the Titan is either mostly automated (unlikely) or much smaller than the Sovvie! It's only as long as an Excelsior, at any rate.
Makes sense as the ships in the class are all named after moons (as opposed to the notion of "Titan" refering to mythology or referring to size.
I dont know if I'd want to serve aboard the USS Charon: imagine what the UT broadcasts to a new species- "Ferryman into the afterlife".
Real good for First Contact situations. Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
No USS The Moon?
(Also, why would names be translated like that?)
Posted by HerbShrump (Member # 1230) on :
Humans make up only 15% of the crew yet the ships and class names all come from the Sol system.
Still an Earth-centric mindset in Starfleet.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I agree, naming all the ships in the class after moons in the Sol System is a it Earth-centric for a vast interstelllar Federation (IMHO).
The other founding Federation worlds probably make insecurity jokes about humans always naming everything after themselves...
Still with 85% of the crew being non-human, that still means that 90% of the total crew will be humanoid with only the most minor facial additions or skin color variances.
I'd love to see an Andorian bridge officer: the way the Andorian character in the new DS9 books was handled was really well done. A lot of cultural background was etablished for the Andorians and I hope it's not just discarded.
Some trills would be nice as well: mabye that babe from the Enterprise will transfer over with Riker.
quote:Originally posted by Sol System: No USS The Moon?
(Also, why would names be translated like that?)
We dont know exactly how the UT translates cultural proper names: usually ship names dont translate at all but if someone asks what your ship's name means, that might be a problem.
I mentioned the same thing whan (on the JOAT forums) someone came up with the "Mephistopheles class". It's just a baaad idea: like naming your ship the USS Electra. Even the USS Phobos would take some explaining..."God of Fear" and all that. Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Soo. . . Luna-class, and NCC-80102. Question is, do we regard that as canon, canon-until-it's contradicted-onscreen-which is-unlikely-given-it'll-be-years-before-we-see-more-Trek-even-without-Riker-and-Troi, or non-canon?
I'm always suspicious of these themed naming schemes. Sisko called his Danubes after rivers because he felt like it. But having all Cheyennes names after Native American tribes. . . meh. One would hope they'd include non-Solar System moons right from the start. USS Praxis? USS Rura Penthe?
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
Just how many non-Solar System moon names do we have anyway? And isn't Andoria a moon itself?
B.J.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Well, time to start speculating...
I'd wager most people in this contest are going to be thinking about an Intrepid-Sovereign cross. 450m and 350 crew is just fine, considering that Voyager was 344m long and had a crew of 150.
As such, I'm thinking SPACIOUS will be the key visual motif inside and out, in order to accomodate all the species they'll run into. Independent and redundant systems will also be a major factor, to highlight the endurance and reliability of the ship on super-extended missions. So, we're going to see considerations like:
- quad nacelles, OR notably advanced nacelles that can operate independently.
- expanded fuel and deuterium supply - Sternbach has written 3 years for Intrepid, five for Galaxy; we'd likely be talking 8-10 for Titan, no?
- if there's a separation capacity, each part would also be capable of significant warp AND sufficient capacity to house the entire crew for extended periods of time in each section, if one part were lost.
- bridge and all major facilities would be designed with significant ergonomics in mind
- Onboard manufacturing and repair facilities outstripping even the Intrepid class.
...And so forth.
So, if we're going to try to come up with a design from Flare, I'd suggest we start with a defined mission profile document (like at the start of the TNG:TM) and solicit design proposals that way.
Mark
Posted by Krenim (Member # 22) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: So, if we're going to try to come up with a design from Flare, I'd suggest we start with a defined mission profile document (like at the start of the TNG:TM) and solicit design proposals that way.
Actually, the first thing I think we need to do is find out if we can actually legally submit a joint effort with people outside the US/Canada to the contest. It seems like most of you are better at finding out such things than I, how about you guys look into that, hmm?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'm no lawyer, but I'm willing to believe that an entry made on behalf of a group or entity is perfectly allowed. That's the bare minimum we'd get away with, though something on behalf of "The Flare Sci-Fi Forums" or somesuch could be allowed, as long as all participants agreed in principle that it is a group effort and will not seek individual credit or rights to the final design.
Then again, we could also make up an identity and submit it under that name - I've been looking for an excuse to use "Max E. Mumwahp" for a while now. But if you ask me, I think this would be a neat project for the gang to put together, even if we don't submit it.
Mark
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
I strongly suspect that you can't have a group design like that, and that creating a fake person would be even worse.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
With 85% nonhumans, this ship is going to need a lot of toilets of various configurations.
Posted by Wes (Member # 212) on :
quote:Originally posted by Sol System: I strongly suspect that you can't have a group design like that, and that creating a fake person would be even worse.
Agreed. We need to pick a represenitive, living in the US, and who is at least semi-active here.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
So, who will be Flare's stooge?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I live in Canada. TECHNICALLY I'd qualify, but you know how this Americentric contests tend to work.
Mark
Posted by Wes (Member # 212) on :
I'd say Mark or Masao, they seem to be pretty active and have a good working knowledge of starship design and such...
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: Well, time to start speculating...
I'd wager most people in this contest are going to be thinking about an Intrepid-Sovereign cross. 450m and 350 crew is just fine, considering that Voyager was 344m long and had a crew of 150.
As such, I'm thinking SPACIOUS will be the key visual motif inside and out, in order to accomodate all the species they'll run into. Independent and redundant systems will also be a major factor, to highlight the endurance and reliability of the ship on super-extended missions.Mark
Well, seeing as Troi will be there, I'm expecting a mission status similar to the E-D - or other long-term missions. Voyager was never going to have a Counsellor.
I don't think it should be too advanced.
Is Riker more of a 'local affairs' type Captain - or an exploring type Captain?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Masao: With 85% nonhumans, this ship is going to need a lot of toilets of various configurations.
Why? We've never even seen a toilet on Trek before. Mabye they just beam it out into space (the real reason starships have deflectors- right there).
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Is Riker more of a 'local affairs' type Captain - or an exploring type Captain?
The storyline is supposed to wrap up some Nemesis loose ends and then be all exploration.
A good thing too: there's only so much we need to see a starship endlessly patroling Federation space- far too much TNG became that and the Sovvie does no exploring at all from what we've seen.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I think they just pack it all into those torpedo casings and fire it at enemy ships! Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Riker's no diplomat. He was far more a man of exploration and action - and at that, SHIPBOARD action - than Picard ever was. Not that he'd be the one to shoot first and get the Doctor to autopsy later, but he'd not resort to the diplomatic pussyfooting some people think TNG is characterised by. I think his character would be far more matched to exploration than Picard ended up being, and that the Titan will be a good vehicle for his zest.
Riker is finally going on the very mission type he was tapped to do fifteen years before, because finally the ship and the mission were right. I'll conjecture that he turned down the low-and-slow Drake so he could come aboard the high-tech and new Enterprise-D, to open his career to better opportunities; he turned down Aries because it wasn't his kind of ship (Constellation, old and patchwork), and Melbourne because it wasn't his kind of mission (while larger, we've conjectured often that neither Excelsior nor Nebula classes were serious explorer starships, but rather utility ships in TNG, which covers both Melbournes). Now, when offered the Titan on a mission of exploration, he's finally got a brand new ship on his kind of mission - so off he goes. Anyone see where I'm going with this?
Voyager didn't have a counsellor because Janeway didn't figure they'd need one for their short term mission - this is established in dialogue somewhere in the first season or two. Voyager, while a ship certainly capable of long-term exploration, probably reflected Starfleet's need to fill the gap of needing a small ship that could do all the stuff the big explorers needed to do - though not necessarily all at once.
I envision this Luna class to be at the opposite end of this spectrum from the Intrepid, with the "Jack of all Trades" ships like the Galaxy and Sovereign occupying a comfortable middle. Quick and smart, but built for the long haul and with the resources to stay in shape for a long time without visiting a major starbase.
Remember those REALLY deep space explorers that Admiral what's-his-noodle was talking about in Voyager's final season, being merely 5-6 years away from Voyager (and by extension, about 30,000 ly from Earth)? I see the Luna class being the kind of ship that could be sent on this sort of mission. Not that Riker and company would ever find themselves on that deep a mission of exploration, but Titan should be the kind of ship that Starfleet would send way, WAY out there.
Mark
Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
Here's my only problem with that description; Riker said the Titan would lead the task force to the Neutral Zone. If the ship is supposed to be a medium-sized explorer and it's his first mission as a captain, why would they send him? We know that at least one Galaxy was also available, and there are probably many other, more experienced captains out there for such a difficult task. So either he was taking it literally (as in "We'll lead the way and the Admiral will follow us with his Galaxy") or the whole mission is not as important as it may seem (maybe Starfleet just sends in a few ships to help clean up the Bassen rift and transport the federation ambassador back to Romulus, something like that).
Besides that, I was always under the impression that Riker was waiting for the Enterprise or a similar ship. If he now settles for such a relatively small and unimportant ship (at least compared to a Galaxy or Sovereign), he could have taken the Melbourne 11 years ago and could be Admiral already (if the Borg hadn't assimilated him, of course).
Other than that, I'd like to see a return to oval hulls instead of that ugly Nova/Intrepid/Prometheus-triangular crap. I have a design going that uses the Galaxy-saucer turned 90� to make it look more Sovereignish. What about that idea?
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
That idea has been done many times over and is not "new" thinking.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'm in favor of a blended-notched design. Divots and such in the saucer, but which does not break an overal sleek shape. reduced numbers of greeblies as on Voyager or Pre-E, but perhaps subtler versions of the same. I'd also prefer an ovoid hull - Voyager's just too old for that.
As for Riker and his mission, I'm thinking that it's basically a stop off on the way "Out There", as NX-01 did in its premiere. One of the Federation's oldest enemies had just suffered a major political and military upheaval; if I were Starfleet, I'd temporarily assign my ships to take care of that before getting back to exploartory priorities.
***
And here's the first visual innovation I'm going to propose in a collective Flare design - not variable-geometry nacelles as on Voyager, but variable PROFILE nacelles. That's right, nacelles that will actually change shape for a high-speed cruise mode - useful for getting from point A to point B efficiently if not super-fast, as on Voyager.
Say, for example, to have shorter nacelles with the warp coils bunched up together for lower FTL maneuvering or high speed bursts where raw warp power is used to create an appropriate field; and then an extended coil profile that would in turn create a warp field suitable for long-term, high speed cruise. Hell, if the saucer were to be equipped with small nacelles of its own, this could be incorporated into the scheme, as would subtle changes to the rest of the superstructure.
Visually, this has the potential of looking pretty cool, without really breaking the established dogma of starship design - or, as on Voyager, seriously overpowering the story. What I'm talking about is a REAL two-mode starship without really having one; think a not-so-obtuse version of the changes in the Jupiter 2 in the "Lost In Space" remake, the Super Pursuit Mode KITT in "Knight Rider", or even that goofy-cool alien space ship in "Flight of the Navigator".
Mark
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Or the Viper in the show of that name? Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
Speaking of Knight Rider... KITT already had the ability to up to 300mph before SPM of the 4th season. Besides, I find it very difficult that Michael would be able to control KITT at SPM speed anyway... unless that mode switches KITT to Auto Drive.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Even more difficult to survive if KITT were to make a sudden course correction at 350+ MPH.
Really, I've been thinking of modifying the Nova designs from the back of the TNG tech manual.
The one with the oval saucer and the nacelle pylons (aparantly) protuding through the nacelles.
I figure those protrusions might be the "sandwitched" sensor palates like the (southerland configuration) Nebula sports but blended into the hull (as opposed to on a pod).
That or I'll put most of it's weapons on those protrusions: it would give the ship total coverage and I could have the first starship without phasers on the saucer.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Not a bad direction to go, but anything remotely resembling the cooler potential designs published over the years by Sternbach or Eaves or whoever has already been done at least once.
Mark
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Yeah, I've seen that one but I'm not real thrilled by it.
The seriously deep sectional "trenches" in the saucer bother me and they changed the saucer's overall shape from extreme oval to a more circular aspect.
The drawing is only a rough starting point for me at any rate....I had considered making the saucer "egg shaped" in that, while still a flattened disk, the saucer's widest point would be far to the front of the ship and it's smallest at the rear (where I'd probably go back to one central impulse drive).
Posted by Cpt. Kyle Amasov (Member # 742) on :
quote:Originally posted by Dat: That idea has been done many times over and is not "new" thinking.
Never said it was, but it looks cool.
That Insignia class reminds me of one of the Nova-concepts from the TNG TM. So if you want moveable nacelles, how about nacelles that move up and down the pylon instead of fixed nacelles on foldable pylons?
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"That Insignia class reminds me of one of the Nova-concepts from the TNG TM."
Gee, you think?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
quote: So if you want moveable nacelles, how about nacelles that move up and down the pylon instead of fixed nacelles on foldable pylons?
Nope... From my view, if we do moving nacelles of basically any sort, they'll compare it to Voyager. If we do CHANGING nacelles, it'll be like nothing done in starship design (Norway conjecture aside), without straying too much.
I'm proposing we do a sleek starship, and the kicker is that at warp, it changes into a SLEEKER starship - and not just the nacelles. Sternbach was on the right track with his Voyager concepts, but he decided to make his nacelles "explode" open when at high warp to expose the warp coils in a bid to make the ship go faster; they eventually settled on the VG pylon assembly which has been forever lampooned as water wings. So, I'd recommend against VG pylons.
I wish I could articulate this in sketch form... In addition to the above examples, how about the Incredibile from "The Incredibles", or even Inspector Gadget's Gadgetmobile? Or, remember how the Enterprise-D looked so much sleeker at that exact moment it slingshots into warp? What if we had a ship that could do exactly that, except STAY that way when at warp?
Mark
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
If nacelles changed in any way, it might be an internal change, such as the warp coils moving farther apart or becoming thinner. Wouldn't be seem much from the outside, though, other than some telescoping sections.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Yup, which could result in several visual changes. In addition to becoming longer, sliding lengthwise, the bussard colelctors could become bigger (sliding panels reveal more of it), additional greeblies would become visible (imagine an Excelsior-esque dorsal grille being revealed as a Galaxy nacelle extends), and for embelishments, a small fin or two.
As for the coils, I've been thinking about that too. There could be the simple idea of one set of coils that move further apart when activated. Or, you can have two sets of embedded coils: think of one set of coils with a smaller set in it, which are aligned in a staggered configuration. In "expanded" mode, the smaller set of coils would extend aftwards and the nacelle superstructure would alter to accomodate. This could figure into the endurace factor of the ship, too - with essentially two warp engines in a single nacelle, losing one set wouldn't be a critical failure.
Then there's the deflector assembly - what if that telescoped forward to be able to better protect the ship at higher warp? Imagine a basic starship with the basic TNG neckless saucer-secondary-two nacelles config. Then it goes to high warp - the nacelles elongate, the deflector assembly moves forward (think of it changing from an Intrepid to a sleeker Sovereign type), and a couple pointless fins pop up somewhere on the saucer. Or, if the saucer has independent Prometheus-type recessed nacelles on top, deploy them too. FA-SHAOWW!!
And that's where I'd stop, lest I spooge so much as to make walking around too difficult.
Mark
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I seriously think we need a sketch Mark - sounds intruiging.
I too want to eliminate the annoying 'stepped' saucer seen on the Sovereign.
A larger dish too - the Sovereign dish looked silly - I think it was changed in pre-production somehow for story purposes - I don't think the crew would have been able to magnetically make their way across the grill on the E-D's dish or something like it.!
I like your Riker: Explorer or Diplomat mini article there, Mark!
Just expanding that - I've always felt that the E-D was destined to deep space exploration and that starting from Farpoint it was making it's way slowly out from core-Federation worlds. The problem was - by the end of the season - with "Conspiracy" they were back to Earth again - and as Picard said in his long that that was something unusual for a ship like the Enterprise.
I think that after the events of "The Neutral Zone" they were on their way back out again - then along came "Q-Who" and the contact with the Borg. After this I believe that Starfleet would have ordered the Enterprise to stay relatively close to Federation borders. This is seen then throughout the rest of the series where we have more interaction with border worlds than we do with 'strange new worlds' - and there was no problem with that. People think that the Federation border is quite crowded - the problem is they think of it as a solid line in 2 dimensions. Anyway that is besides the point.
P.S. What is the "Luna Class" you speak of? Sounds Fandomesque. And what ships were those that were supposedly not far away from Voyager!?! Is this when they got the message from Admiral Hayes?
Should we have a separate Forum for this project? Like the old UP3 forum?
Andrew
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Perhaps you should actually read previous posts rather than skimming them.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Maybe you should shut your yap?
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
No no no, its "shut yer fan-hole".
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
No no no, it's "for fuck's sake, that wasn't even funny the first thirty times".
I'm curious how all this articulation on the ship would be presented in a static image on the cover of a book?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
The "changing ship" seems far in advance of Federation technology (though by all rights, such re-arrangment should have been available back in early TNG as an offshoot of replicator tech- just as physical walls should be instantly erected to seal hull breaches instead of force fields).
A good idea for Enterprise J though (not as though we'll ever see it now though).
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
"just as physical walls should be instantly erected to seal hull breaches instead of force fields"
Why, when force fields seem to work perfectly well?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Not really- it sure took a while for the field to pop up in Nemesis.
Physical barriers would be better- in case the power goes (and it's likely if your ship is chock full of hull-breaches).
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
And why would the various conduits that provide raw matter have resisted getting blown up like the various conduits that provide shimmery force fields?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
They wouldn't, but physical barriers would remain after the power fails at least.
I always thought a lifeboat should only be a hatch with a specialty replicator in it: if the ship's lost, the replicator could just manufacture whatever sized lifeboat is required.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I would reiterate that the ship I'm talking about does't morph - it simply rearranges. It's Beast Wars, not Beast Machines, natch.
Mark
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Still, moving parts on gaint spacecraft really bug me.
Do the parts move on magnetic rails? I cant fathom they have huge internal servos and gears and traditional joints.
What happens in case of total power loss?
Better to have a variable geometry warp field.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
How about nacelles that 'hide' behind the saucer section when at warp - but are above (or below it, or even to the sides - for bussard collection) when at sub-light speeds?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Might as well make the saucer move instead. Mabye it can flap it's nacelles while at warp...
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
That sort of thing was also proposed by Eaves in the early Sovereign concepts. Not a bad idea, unless the design turns out to look like a chicken as well.
If VP nacelles move, it'd peobably be along the same lines as Voyager, the Scimitar, etc. The Norway's VG nacelles supposedly move on rails - but I'm not proposing the entire nacelle moves like that.
Try this - imagine the Sovereign class, with nacelles that are about 2/3 the current length. It goes to warp, and the whole pylon moves the nacelle down somewhat to clear the bussard collectors. At the same time, the nacelle opens up and extends to full length, moving the second set of warp coils into "extended cruise" position. Two very small nacelles deploy from the dorsal aft saucer on angled pylons. And finally, the deflector moves from a near perpendicular position to something more angled.
I'll try to demonstrate this on a profile view of a Sovereign, when I get back home after Sunday...
Mark
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I just dont see the advantage of ever having them retracted: Even Voyager never explained why the nacelles were not just kept in the "up" position. (the reason is, of course, that the moving nacelles was a gimmick to make the ship somehow unique).
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
In this case, retracting and possibly moving the nacelles behind the saucer at impulse would help protect them in combat by reducing their profile, adding additional layers of hull to shoot through (if the grilles are covered, and since the collapsed hull plating would be doubled up in places.
In the case of power loss? well, if we go along the lines of two sets of coils, power loss in either set would not be catastrophic. Power loss in mid-change would not be hideous either, as one set would not be powered up regardless.
As for a VG warp envelope, I think it's accepted that all fields are known to do this ANYWAY - to the limitations of the hull shape. Sternbach has also said that an Intrepid can probably go to warp with its nacelles down, just not nearly as fast or efficiently. We're taking this to the next stage with this proposal. And the Nova proposals suggest that warp fields are tied closely with hull shape AND nacelle positioning.
I propose that using Voyager as a stepping stone, the next stage will be to change the shape of the nacelles themselves - and that by this point Starfleet will be able to do so without it looking way too high tech.
And no water wings. God, please no water wings.
Mark
Posted by kiltedbear (Member # 1138) on :
I like the idea of the Luna class. While there are only 12 in service so far, more of these ships would be a great replacement for the few Excelsior and Ambassador class ships that survived the Dominion war.
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
How do you explain there were few Ambassadors that survived?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Fanboy speculation.
quote:And no water wings. God, please no water wings.
You mean those goofy pylon-mounted impulse engines on Voyager? Those did indeed suck.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Well I finally found the Luna Class description. They could also include USS Selene in that list - as it's another name for our Moon.
The start-work date would put it around Intrepid/Sovereign/possibly Norway vintage.
Maybe a sprinkle of the Danube design?
I'd say it's moved on from the "Galaxy family" of ships like the Galaxy, Nebula, New Orleans etc.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Guys, as interesting as this is, you might wanna consider moving it to a more private venue. All sorts of people drop in here and lurk, all it takes is for the wrong sort of person to drop in and read some of the ideas - or even for word of such ideas to get passed on to such a person - and they could quite easily use the best ideas in their own submission, with no way to prove they plagiarised.
(as it is, I suspect they're shooting themselves in the foot with this competition, it would be very easy for some little toerag to come along and claim that the winning entrant had stolen his ideas...)
And I wouldn't get to bogged-down in unusual modes of propulsion or ship configuration - chances are they'll never get passed on to the writers of these books. The same goes for bridge layouts and so forth; I'm willing to bet that that lengthy entries, which read more like actual proposals for developing Starfleet classes, will get rejected out of hand in favour of nice simple presentations which feature an interesting yet plausible design depicted in a pleasing manner.
That's if you want to win, of course. If you're just after a pleasing diversion to while away the summer months, be my guest!
Posted by Wes (Member # 212) on :
Lee said exactly what I was going to post. The design has to look good first, then be functional second. No one is going to care how the warp field looks.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
So how about changing the old UP3 forum into a new Titan design forum?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I agree - let's set up a private forum about this... Can we?
Mark
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Until then, may some proud owner of "Taking Wing" post the relevant passages on what we are supposed to be designing?
Luna class we already know. But is she called a cruiser or an explorer or something like that? Are figures given on ship size, performance, crew size, armament, primary mission profile? Any neato tech tidbits? Comments on the paint job? Anecdotes on what the designers were smoking?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Bumping up - here's all we know so far. What's the source on this, Jason?
quote:Here are the main parts of the concept notes from the back of the titan novel...(not exactly word for word)
Titan Concept notes
USS Titan, NCC 80102, Luna-Class
The Titan is a mid-size starfleet vessel, approx. 450m in length, with a crew complement of 350, Titans hull configuration is comparable to other SF vessels.
Luna class is SF newest-gen long-range explorer, a starship but not built specifically for combat, but like the connie, a vessel designed for a long term multipurpose mission into uncharted space. Equipped with conventional Tactical systems (deflector shields, phasers, quantum torps) Titan also boasts state-of-the-art propulsion and cutting-edge scientific equipment as well as being a testbed for experimental scienc tech not yet available on other classes.
The Titan is manned by the most varied multispecies crew in SF history, with humans comprising less than 15% of the 350 member crewthe diversity of the crew is intended to facilitate stories that will explore the ways that beings of different cultures, biologies, psychologies and physical appearances learn how to work together, or fail to, depending on the circumstances they encounter.
The Luna-class development project was initiated in 2369 in response to the discovery of the Bajoran wormhole. Field testing of the USS Luna began in 2372, but the projected was shelved due to the dominion war, then resumed in 2375.
LUNA-Class Fleet:
all ships named for moons in the Sol System (Terran Solar System)
Amalthea Callisto Charon Europa Galatea Ganymede Io Luna Oberon Rhea Titan Triton
Submissions must be in the form of general plans (i.e., technical illustrations), and must include the following five external views:
side front back top bottom
All files submitted must include the designer's name, address, telephone number, and email address.
Designs must be submitted via email to [email protected] in the following electronic format:
jpeg CMYK color 14" x 9" at 300dpi
All submissions must be received by 11:59 p.m., Eastern Standard Time, August 15, 2005.
Nothing we can't handle. Also, here's the book's opening blurb, which provides some of the mission context:
After almost a decade of strife against foes such as the Borg, the Cardassians, the Klingons, and the Dominion, the United Federation of Planets is at the dawn of a new era. Starfleet is renewing its mission of peaceful exploration, diplomacy, and the expansion of knowledge. Among the starships spearheading that endeavor is the U.S.S. Titan, commanded by Captain William T. Riker and manned by the most biologically varied and culturally diverse crew in Starfleet history.
But their mission does not begin according to plan.
In the wake of Star Trek � Nemesis, Praetor Shinzon, slayer of the Romulan Senate, is dead. The power vacuum created by his demise has put the Romulan Star Empire, longtime adversary of the Federation, at the brink of civil war. Competing factions now vie for control of their fragmenting civilization, and if the empire should fall, that entire area of the galaxy may destabilize.
To restore order to the region, Titan 's long-anticipated mission of exploration is delayed as Starfleet assigns Riker to set up power-sharing talks among the Romulan factions. But even as the first tentative steps are taken toward building a new Romulus, the remnants of the Tal Shiar, the dreaded Romulan intelligence service, are regrouping behind the scenes for a power play of their own. With no other help available, Riker and the Titan crew become the last hope to prevent the quadrant from falling into chaos.
Mark
Posted by machf (Member # 1233) on :
Sounds like it wouldn't be too different from the Nova-class, maybe something in the middle between Nova and Sovereign, with a touch of Prometheus...
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
There are several directions to take it - since it's a "next generation" (no pun intended) design, it could be a logical outgrowth of the Galaxy, Intrepid, Defiant, or Sovereign class "looks", a blend of two or more, or something completely different. I'm willing to wager that the completely different mindset will capture their attention more than a cut and paste design - and I'm sure that Pocket will get lots of them.
The only problem here is that there isn't likely to be a very iterative design process in this contest. Maybe Masao can enlighten us here, but I'm guessing that they'll take all the submissions, choose the best one, and then send it over to Doug (or their resident art guys) to make it into a CGI. We get credit for the initial design, they make it gold with only minor changes. We'll have to have a proper iterative process in place before we proceed too far.
Mark
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Why do they bandy around the word "quadrant" so much!?! 1/4 of the galaxy destablised by a fragmented Romulan Star Empire? Hmm.
Long-range explorer? 4 nacelles anyone? Wasn't the bit on the Pathfinder having four nacelles about long distance - or was that rather for short distances faster/maintaining a higher warp longer?
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
The latter: the modified Pathfinder was supposed to be two twin-nacelled ships merged into one, and running their engines alternately...
Somehow I think that what the jury will be looking for is a standard vanilla starship that lacks any and all tech gimmicks but has a distinct "look". That is, a new shape for the primary hull, a new design for the nacelles, and perhaps a new way to merge the primary and secondary hulls, but nothing fancy beyond that.
Venturing down the "strange sharp-angled cutouts in a slightly distorted saucer" path of late is one possibility. Another would be go for something super-smooth for a change. I'd love to do something very utilitarian, to reflect the postwar depression (multiple pylons supporting blocky nacelles, primary hull hanging down below the level of the engineering section; a really mean "18-wheeler" look), but that would mean deliberate uncoolness, which doesn't win any points.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Krenim (Member # 22) on :
Alright, folks, here's the deal. Our illustrious leader Mr. Capps has graciously provided a private forum for the Titan contest, and I have been once again temporarily promoted to Admin to grant people access to it.
Those who want in, please post here, as my PM is still rather full at the moment. Only members who have been here at Flare for some time will be given permission to enter to prevent perfect strangers from ripping off designs.
From what I've read in this thread, it doesn't look as though collaborative entries will be allowed (But somebody should outright ask the appropriate person or persons just to be sure). Although I don't think anybody here would be so boldly evil as to rip off someone else's design, post designs at your own risk.
The purpose of the private forum is to give those who can't/won't enter this contest a chance to critique the designs of those who are, and to ensure a wide variety of entries are submitted to increase the probability that one of us Flareites will hit upon what the judges are looking for and win.
That is all.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
*raises hand*
Thanks, man.
Mark
Posted by Krenim (Member # 22) on :
Access granted.
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
While I may not say much, I would like access if just to critique the various designs and to make the occasional suggestion.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Access granted.
Posted by Wraith (Member # 779) on :
Again, I may not be able to contribute much in terms of actual artwork, but I would like access to critique and look at the pretty pictures! Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I would also like o contribute ideas and possibly art or a model.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
For the record, I'm an idea man as well. I can sketch stuff well enough, but have no real skill at finalized art.
Mark
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Done and done.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Mark: Designing Vanguard station was a bit different, since it was a commission job, not a contest. I got some instructions before starting from Marco Palmieiri (sort of like the contest guidelines), but then got feedback and suggestions every time I sent in some new drawings. So, yes, the process was iterative.
Since I'm currently a resident of Japan, I won't be entering (and don't know shit about modern starships), but I'd like access to the forum anyway!
Posted by Wes (Member # 212) on :
I am a professional graphic artist and have been here for about six years.
Please let me in? )
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Permissions accomplished.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Could I get in? I'm working on my own design and I'd like to bounce ideas off of people without everyone and they're dog seeing it (and I don't mind if some of my ideas go into the group project)
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Oh, what the heck, you might as well give me access, I'm feeling nosy. 8)
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Access please - as it was sorta my suggestion for a separate forum for this
So has anyone asked whether we can have a collaborative entry - or why not just have - as I think it was mentioned earlier in the thread - one person enter a final design that we all work on here. The person can call themselves joe "Flare" bloggs or something.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Since the prize is just credit in the book anyway, if contributers don't care if one person takes the 'credit' I don't see a problem with a collaberation
As long as the one person isn't a total ass about being the one who gets credit
Posted by Wes (Member # 212) on :
Why not just the "Flare Sci Fi Fourms"?
I dont see a problem with that.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
On a logical level, I don't either, but their legal advisors might.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
You're all in.
Posted by Austin Powers (Member # 250) on :
Before anyone decides to close the door on possible applications: I would like to have access too please. Not that I am a US resident, but I would like to be the first to build a Lego model of the finalized Flare design Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
What about Charles being the 'person'? Then we'd all know it'd be connected with Flare? Unless the bearded one is an absolute megalomaniac!?! Posted by jesus X (Member # 1201) on :
Can I get access? As a regular lurker and occasional contributor... I love the stuff that comes up here. This is the only Trek forum I bother to read. The signal to noise ratio is incredible.
As for the Flare entry, I have some ideas... Posted by machf (Member # 1233) on :
Hmmm... with so many people wanting to take part, hopefully this won't end like the proverbial committee-designed duck...
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I think we're going to split the overal project up into at least two parts, to minimize the committee dilution inherent in a group project. There will probably be at least two project leads, and two parallel designs to go with it.
Mark
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
In like Flynn.
Posted by Doctor Jonas (Member # 481) on :
I really shouldn't be in: I can't do anything to actively collaborate in a starship design (I merely can do book and webpage layouts).
But as critics for the designs are admitted, and I've been a member for four years, I humbly request access for the forum.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
quote:Originally posted by Captain Boh: Could I get in? I'm working on my own design and I'd like to bounce ideas off of people without everyone and they're dog seeing it (and I don't mind if some of my ideas go into the group project)
I'm not questioning your integrity, but do you think this is wise? Both for your own design and that of any group Flare effort, it might be best to limit any possibility of future accusations of idea theft.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
The committee recognizes the delegation from South America and grants his request.
Posted by machf (Member # 1233) on :
When I first saw this post, I thought "but I didn't request anything...", then I checked the preceding page and saw Doctor Jonas' post, and then things made sense... funny enough, at first I had thought of something similar (along the lines of "not being able to do much to actively take part in a design, unless you want someone to bring you back to reality before things turn into a three-ring circus"), but then decided there were already too many people getting involved...
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
Could I get access? I'm still debating whether I'll enter (based on if I can come up with something decent), but I'd love to bounce some ideas around.
B.J.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
You're in. Through there, line on the left, one cross each.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Same here. I don't really have any CADD ability, but I could do some sketches and scan them, or just to a technical/historical write-up on the class...
Pretty please?
-MMoM Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
When the paddle hits your ass you will say "Thank you sir, may I have another?"
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Those crazy greeks.![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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