So, what do you think? Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
Very nice! I love seeing isometric drawings like this. Did you draw it all from scratch, or did you manipulate some Fact Files scans? Just from the clean look, I'd say from scratch, but it's nice to hear it from the horse's mouth.
Oh, and what program do you use again? (It's hard to keep track of what everyone uses!)
B.J.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
That's gotta be from scratch... the lights coming from the console podiums were never that defined in the Fact Files drawings, IIRC.
Very nice.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'm guessing it was also traced or interpolated from the sketch of the NF version seen in that comic book... Fantastic job, though!
Mark
Posted by machf (Member # 1233) on :
Nice! Any plans to do other views?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Bueatiful work, but it looks far too cramped to me.
I'd probably give it at least another three feet clearance (about a meter) tactical rail and the backs of the chairs at the aft of the bridge.
It's pretty cramped and Kebron is a biiig guy- currently, anyone working tactical would have to move aside whenever someone needed to sit at the aft stations.
While I'm sure you've captured the look of the NF bridge perfectly, I've always thought the idea of two chairs side-by-side was dumb: the ship's captain should be easily identifiable to anyone from the viewscreen, and the look of "co-captains" makes me ill.
Any idea what the far forward station is supposed to be for? It's pretty useless.
Again, it's a bueatiful illustration- as good as anything I've seen in Fact Files. Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Same thing the one on the Enterprise C was for Posted by Kazeite (Member # 970) on :
Yeah, it was done tracing NF sketch and using Enterprise C, D and E bridges as a coloring reference.
I drew that using CorelDraw, so, except for bitmap LCARS, I could make some extreme closeups if I wanted to
But yeah, Jason, you're probably right in everything you've said.
And... yes, I intend to make another bridge, this time from scratch. Which one? It's a secret Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
CorelDraw, huh? You must be using a later version than I am (version 8), because the antialiasing I get on thin lines is not very good. Other than that, I love the program!
But just for kicks, could you tell me what export options you use? That might make a difference.
B.J.
Posted by Kazeite (Member # 970) on :
Well, I simply export drawing twice the size I want, and then I shrink it in Photo-Paint to desired size
And yeah, I use later version: 12, to be exact Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
The forward console in the New Frontier comic is actually way smaller than that - in a frame where Soleta is briefing Calhoun and standing next to it, it's about knee high, and barely the size of the Ops or Conn pulpits. Also, the main viewer is significantly larger, covering the whole forward wall (the two smaller screens to port and starboard on the wall are omitted to provide the space).
All this certainly improves the ability of Ops, Conn, CO and XO to see the viewer even when somebody is toying with the forward console. If there's somebody there, he, she, s/he or it must be crouching pretty deep.
Admittedly, it looks a tad silly - but it's something quite unique to and characteristic of the refitted Excalibur, and as such might be featured in your design.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
Okay, you use the same cheat I do when exporting. Your lines still look better, though. I'm certain that's been one of the improvements over the years.
Planning on doing any other bridges or rooms?
B.J.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Kazeite, great bridge, as expected. I look forward to your surprise bridge.
Posted by Kazeite (Member # 970) on :
Timo, I know all that. As far as I can tell, comic bridge actually has different shape. Besides, it has different colors.
So, basically, I was keeping true to the sketch, not the comic.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Few Trek comics have any sort of consistency in visual design. "Double Time" (right?) is an anomaly in this respect, as most of the starship exteriors are generally accurate. The interiors certainly did not show the same sort of continuity.
Mark
Posted by Kazeite (Member # 970) on :
Anyway, here's my latest creation... Well, more like proof of a concept design - I wanted to see whether something like this could be done from scratch.
What do you think? Is the height sufficient for your tastes?
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
It looks likes it's based off the Brattain's bridge layout.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Hmmm..what's with the big window thing between that rear room and the raised part where the (presumably) the captain's chair is located?
It looks really small to me (based on the height of the steps leading to the raised portion and the height of that doorway). Smaller than the Defiant's bridge even- though it's tough to be certain without more visual references (like furniture).
I say it's either a battle-bridge or the ship's barber's shop (with shampoo sinks in that rear room and a barbar's chair centrally positioned).
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Well, in terms of furniture, you can see the outline on the floor of a sit-down console (like conn or ops on the E-D).
As for the window, I'm guessing it will have an MSD or something that can be viewed from both sides.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Kazeite,it does look like you are attempting the Brattain bridge, a very complex and complicated bridge. It looks like you are off to a good start. I am impressed that you are starting a complex bridge like that. I rank that one as complex as the Sutherland. Anyway, it looks like you are off to a good start.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Sutherland isn't complex as much as it is challenging, due to its pele-mele layout and the simple fact that there really aren't good shots of how it's arranged. Br!ttain, on the other hand, IS a genuinely complex bridge IMO with multiple levels, hidey holes and station sizes. Kudos to Kazeite for tackling this one!
Mark
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
I thought Kazeite would do an easier bridge, like Sisko's Saratoga or the Righteous, to name two. I stand corrected on the complexity of the Sutherland bridge. If Kazeite's Brattain is as good as his Excalibur, I will praise him now and avoid the Christmas rush.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Hmmm...I'm intrested to see how this looks completed but the overall layout seems... very ill concieved.
It does not seem to match the Miranda class at all either.
Posted by Kazeite (Member # 970) on :
Ok...
That "big window thing" is... well, big window thing. Yeah, I'm confused too. I don't know, maybe it was redress of Enterprise-A transporter room?
And, I have decided that it is kinda flat, so I've increased the height.
(And yes, it is Brattain bridge )
And, finally, here's some progress report: No, I am not going to make Saratoga bridge, because we already have it it two versions - as USS Prometheus bridge and Romulan Warbird Bridge. This looks like a job for photoshoppers Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Kazeite, perosonally, photoshopping the Saratoga bridge would look cheesy. I think it deserves the treatment as does all of the other bridges the Fact Files did not do. Yes it has been done in a couple of variations, but you can create the definitive version as you are the Brattain. I am still very impressed and blown away by your skills. I would rather see a quality bridge from you than some cheesy photoshop manip unless the guy is at your level or better. You, sir, have officially set the bar higher with your Excalibur bridges. This is not idle flattery, this is genuine appreciation of hard work and sweat. I am officially spoiled on your bridges.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Any chance you could mod the basic Amby bridge to be more militaristic to go with my Spartan (In that thread)? It's an Amby bridge after all, I just think that mission profile would determine the layout more than any stock configuration.
I also think your idea that the Brittain bridge was a transporter room set is right on the money.
Mabye that rear area is ued for stellar cartography charting (with the "window" serving as the holographic display- just not activated in the episode or illustration).
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
I also have a good list of bridges I would love to see done in the 3D isometric format that Kazeite is doing. Of course, I am patient. The Brattain bridge is off to a very good start and I can not rave enough about the Excalibur bridges. I figure if I do not get greedy and ask nicely and wait, wait, wait, my goals will be achieved anyway.
Posted by Kazeite (Member # 970) on :
Jason, I suppose I could mod Amby bridge for your Spartan. What changes specifically do you have in mind?
(And, no, upon seeing TUC transporter room screencaps I can see that I was wrong about that. The basic idea is the same, true, but execution is completely different)
Posted by PsyLiam (Member # 73) on :
I always thought that the TUC transporter room was just the Ent-D set with a big window stuck in it to make it look different.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Kazeite: Jason, I suppose I could mod Amby bridge for your Spartan. What changes specifically do you have in mind?
I was thinking of a tactically-oriented version: mabye with the upper level being all tactical displays and a raised captain's chair with the secondary seats habing prominant consoles.
Really, your work is so good that I'd like you to get creative with it: considering the overall side of the bridge complex, you could expand the size by eliminating the conference room or even the ready room.
I love the new version you made but I'd bring back the central captain's chair and the stairs to the tactical deck....and lose that forward console thingie.
Not that I'm getting pickey or anything. Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
quote:Originally posted by PsyLiam: I always thought that the TUC transporter room was just the Ent-D set with a big window stuck in it to make it look different.
It's been a while since I've watched The Undiscovered Country, but you're pretty much correct. They just took the TNG transporter set, swapped out the console graphics, and added an operator's booth. I can't remember if they repainted the room from the dark green color or not. I also think that they extended the set by creating a little hallway that goes from the isolinear control panels (the things that Data fiddled with in "Brothers", for example). Valeris emerges from there to tell Burke and Samno that they have business to attend to.
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
As far as I can remember, TUC used a shitload of TNG sets.
The transporter room. The set was (as we know) simply modified by putting a new pad on, a booth and that corridor. Also it was lit differntly.
Sickbay. I don't think we saw much of it, but the biobed was from TNG, with a differnt cover on it.
Enginering. JESUS! Where to begin? The warp core was slightly redressed (didn't it have bars around it?). That was it. Even the Okudagrams in the booth in at least one scene were the orange and purple ones from the E-D!
The corridors were from the E-D (altough the E-A probably had more claim to them, seeing as the E-D nicked that set from the E-nil as seen in TMP).
I think that the officers mess (where Scotty finds the suit in the air vent) was a redress of the obervation longe from the E-D (again lit more darkly) with a redress.
The turbolifts weren't TNG though. They used the old ones from TFF i think.
Thats what I remember - I'd be glad for additions/corretions in this case.
Posted by Mighty Blogger Snay (Member # 411) on :
TNG Sickbay, in addition to the TNG corridors, was I belive taken originally constructed for The Motion Picture. And the corridors recieved pretty heavy redressing, what with new sliding bulkhead doors, and overhead piping, plus new carpet and paint.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
Wasn't part of TNG's main engineering set also a holdover from The Motion Picture? And the battle bridge (like many of the bridges used in TNG) is a holdover from the movie bridge set. Quick sidenote, wasn't the bridge rebuilt between TMP and The Wrath of Khan? I have a vague recollection of David Gerrold in his book saying the original movie bridge set was a solid structure while the set from TWoK was rebuilt as wedges. Mark Nguyen is probably the answer-man for this topic.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
The presedent's office in TUC was ten forward.
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
The TMP bridge was built in sections, but Bob Wise wanted an kind of claustrophobic Das Boot feel to the set, so he had it all bolted together for filming.
In TWOK, the set had been redisgined slightly, mainly by moving parts of the bridge (most noticably Spocks station form behind Kirks seat to his right).
Also, in TMP all of the screens were projections from behind, whereas in TWOK all of the screens had been replaced by real monitiors.
This is why the bridge was so dark in TMP, but could be lit up in further pictures.
One final point, the Reliant bridge was also a rearrangment of the TMP bridge (though to a more TOS type bridge), but does anybody know if the Grissom's bridge was made the same way?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Yep. It was also basically left that way for the set's appearance as the Saratoga in the following film, then parts of it were restored to be all shiny for the Enterprise-A for its cameo appearance. Shortly thereafter, the set was cannibalized for the Enterprise-D battle bridge and further guest appearances on TNG.
Mark
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Then didn't it become Data's lab? And eventually the bridge to the Prometheus amongst other things?
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
Here we go - lots of bridge plans I found googling.
Not only does it hae the grissom, it also has the Excalibur in here too! Top marks.
The big question though? What's going on with the second officers console on the Hathaway? Was Worf just being lazy that eppisode, or was he fed up with standing for a 6 hour shift?
Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :
quote:Originally posted by The Ginger Beacon: Here we go - lots of bridge plans I found googling.
Good man! Same to whoever made the site!
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
That Yamato fantasy bridge is pretty cool. I like most of his arrangements for ready rooms, conference lounges, airlocks, and the surrounding corridors. Some of the Oberth bridges seems rather grand for such a small ship, though.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Small thoughts: Did the Hathaway really have the captain's chair in such an odd position? (I guess, since this is one of the few TNG seasons I've bought on DVD ((Ah, for the days of financial aid checks and few fiscal responsibilities.)) I could just go look for myself.)
I also like those consoles that are standing, for no apparent purpose, in the hallways.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
In the hallways of the Hathaway? Where?
I think we've studied the Hathaway's bridge before (as part of the TABASCO discussion, I believe) and as I recall, yes, the CO's station is in that odd position with an Ops-style console right next to it. I think the best shot of it is right when they beam aboard and Worf sits down. As I recall, he wipes off the console and starts punching buttons. Riker sits down next to him.
Crap... am I going to have to dig my tape out tonight? I think I am.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
There are hallways right and left. The one on the right has stairs leading down, while on the left there is a turbolift and a toilet. I guess the one on the left is more of an alcove. Foyer? Anyway, they both have boxes in them identical to the boxes representing consoles on the bridge. I guess one must be "stair control."
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
this folder has more up to date floorplans with accurite scaleing
Looks like the secret is out. The full thread with occasional updates and new floorplans is at TrekBBS.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Not only 2D overheads but some 3D isometric views ala Fact Files/STM as well. As far as the secret being out, it was going to happen eventually.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
What's that round thing in the Stargazer's ready room toilet? Captain's shower?
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Its his secret mini-turbolift Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Heheh down to the Sex-Deck. Yes, I'd say it's a Sonic Shower to fresh up the Captain before meeting with some sort of delegates or something.
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
I take it you mean this bridge, as opposed to this earlier version.
I reckon its both, so he can clean up after he gets back from the fiesta deck! Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Well, since only one of those has an extraneous round thing in the ready room head...
Though, I do wonder at the fact that the older one has a double sink in the one-toilet crew head.
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
That was one thing I mentioned to the designer earlier on. It seemed to be feature in several of the older versions, but not so much anymore.
B.J.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Oooooohhhh... I LIKE that Danube schematic. He's even got the swappable modules in there.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
cmdr_tw does really good work.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Cmdr tw uses 640x480 dvd caps to make his bridges. He needs the Voyager series to complete things. He needs the following: USS Equinox USS Relativity USS Prometheus USS Rhode Island I know we only saw Harry's head and an msd, but one can speculate and extract or diesgn something that looks logical for this ship.
Posted by Mighty Blogger Snay (Member # 411) on :
Here is the bridge I made from the link Siggy provided. I tried to upload the image to Flare Upload, however I was told "I don't know how to handle MIME types ending with 'bmp'. Please ask the administration for help." So I'm just providing a link to my own hosting ...
So ... entering the bridge from the rear turbolift, you've got the command stations dead ahead. Moving counter-clockwise: Environmental MSD; Captain's Ready Room & Private Head; Communications; Turbolift #2; Engineering; Weapons & Security; Ladder #1; Main Viewscreen; Ladder #2; Ship's Operations; Science Station 2; Turbolift #3; Primary Sciences; Bridge Crew Head, 2 stalls; Damage Control MSD.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
I think of text files, JPGs, PNGs, and GIFs are allowed on the upload site. If you used Paint to save that image, you have the option of saving it as a GIF (which will considerably reduce the size of your picture there). When the save file dialog box comes up, just change the file type setting.
As for the bridge, apparently you don't want a genetically engineered superhuman to be able to easily cut off all exits from the bridge. That's interesting using damage control and environmental MSDs instead of the usual type.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I *love* this guy's work - even his creative liberties get a thumbs-up from me. Except for the often-confusing number of turbolifts he has going to some of them (some have one lift for a bridge of twenty crew, others have two for a bridge complement of five), the guy's got a real talent for placement. And speed. I'd love to see his take on the Lakota's bridge...
Mark
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Mark, the Lakota, Melbourne and Rhode Island are bridges he intends to create, as well as some originals I and others have designed. Very cool stuff/
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
As I can tell from screenshots that people have made, the Lakota actually used the Defiant bridge set, the Melbourne from the E-D battlebridge set later seen in the same episode, and the Rhode Island from probably the Equinox bridge set.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Yep, the Lakota was the Defiant wall in the distance, a couple of free-standing consoles, and some sort of column just to the right of where Benteen was. The "Melbourne" (it could've been any ship, including possibly another Galaxy) was just the E-D battle bridge, as was exhaustively researched on these forums. The RI was a piecemeal set, and IMO it didn't use any of the Equinox/Prommie/Excelsior set from Voyager - it was a one-wall set and really didn't need much work.
One wonders if hed be interested in having a go at some of the oldies-but-goldies I have on the sig-linked site..
Mark
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Yes, I remember the thread and participated in it to some degree. I believe he would tackle some if not all of the bridges on your bridge website. What he might do on the previously mentioned bridges is perhaps take suggestions on how they should look, like my take on the Yamato, true not canon, but different enough to be distinctive. All you have to do is ask. I have been in email contact with him on a couple of occasions on the bridges I designed so he will do them justice. All one needs is patience.
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
So do you suppose he's single-handedly picked up the TABASCO torch?
B.J.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
If he's going to try and extrapolate bridges for the Lakota, the Rhode Island and the Melbourne, he should most definately try the Odyssey as well... Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
He has already done the Odyssey, as well as the Yamato. He has also done 10 different Enterprise D's and both Saratogas. He is now doing runabouts. He churns out about 2-4 every 2-3 days. He uses 640x480 or better dvd screencaps to insure accuracy. He does not have the Voyager dvds so anyone who can cap and send him the Federation ships from it will not be dissapointed. As far as him taking over the TABASCO project, he may have done so unintentionally, but it only benefits the bridge geeks, like me, who is really loving not only his stuff from ST, but the originals he has done either for himself or for others. If Kazeite's quality of 3D isometric drawings of the various bridges contnues at the quality of the Excalibur and Brattain, TABASCO may yet have a second wind. One has to wait and see, I guess.
Posted by Capt_Frank_Hollister (Member # 1639) on :
Who (and how) could I contact if a wanted a custom modification of one of these Ambassador-class bridges? My personnal brain-child is the Ambassador-class USS Horizon. A physical model of which has been superbly created by SoundEffect and can be viewed here along with some background information created by me: USS Horizon Page
SoundEffect was also kind enough to write an article detailing its construction here: Building of the Horizon
At any rate, I have some ideas of what I want the bridge to look like and really liked what I saw here. I don't have the skills to create such quality graphics myself and so was wondering if someone here would be able to help me. Thanks.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
I hope we see the USS Hathaway bridge next after the Brattain is done. Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Hi, I'm new here, I've designed an Ambassador type bridge to physically fit into the ship's space (by the model).
I don't think there's enough space for the ramp to aft stations, so I left there the stairs.
What do U think about it?
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
I think you may need to get a new place to store that pic. I can't get it to load up.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
it's stored on European (CZ) freehosting, it should be acessed from all around the world. Can you access the main page? ST Projects I can load the img normally.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Works fine for me. So does the main site. Except, of course, that it's in Czech...
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I'm planning the translation. English version will work soon. I promise.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
I like it, omi. Based on the bridge layout, I'm guessing it's either the Excalibur from New Frontier or inspired by that design? I like how all the rooms fit together. It's interesting how you don't have the briefing room centered exactly at the back of the structure.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Very nice bridge layout. It does look like it is based on the USS Excalibur bridge from Double with some variations. I like the 3D as well as the overhead. Very Fact Files. Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Double Post, Sorry.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Nice execution but I have a couple of issues with it-
The rear conference lounge should be more toward the direct aft of the bridge to match the exterior windows.
The ready room is gigantic- mabye a perk of the Amby class, I suppose, but the room could be pared down some and the restroom should be expanded (one toilet for so many officers could be bad in a crisis situation). Or you could lose that third turbolift (unless it's a giant toilet for non-humanoid crewmembers).
I'd make the outer hull a lot thinner- it's 4-6 ft. thick at the scale shown. Not required by the TNG era.
The captain has a model of the Crystaline Entity in his office? Cool.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
That sounds good. I would be interesting to see it with those nits addressed.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Jason: You do realize that that toilet is accessible only through the ready room, right? I rather doubt it's used by the whole bridge crew.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
There must be a captain's rest room and the crew's, to make it a little more sensible.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I know the problems. But
I haven't seen any windows on the bridge of Ambassador model, so I haven't fitted the lounge to the middle (well I tried for the first time, but the person who I do it for, wanted a sofa in ready room )
I know the outer hull don't have to be so thick. It's because the bridge space is a half sphere and I don't wanna skewed walls.
Yeah, there is not enough space for crew's rest room. (But it hasn't been in TOS classes either) so it's located on Deck 2 just next to the ramp
Finally it's not the USS Excalibur bridge. It's made for my friend who's playing on-line Trek game (in Slovak ) and it should be the TNG era Ambassador refit (to fit TNG standards). It's name is Equilibrium (he doesn't care if the name is official )
Ok, here is the english versions of bridge engineering (combination of EF2 USS Dallas (Excalibur class) eng. and TNG era eng.) sickbay Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
OK, my pages are now available also in english (except the images for now ). So enjoy Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
oh, I'm sorry for the non functional link in one of my previous posts "first time". I don't know what happend. This one should work fine. I just learned to use the UBB code here and I can't edit anymore the previous post Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
The picture you linked is the USS Excalibur bridge. Nicely done though.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
That :first time" version does not work in that only the captain has access to the lone bathroom.
...and that's cause for mutiny! (thus the true story of the destruction of the USS Pegasus is revealed)
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Well, it's the same way on the final version, as I mentioned earlier. As he said, the bathroom for the rest of the crew is on the next level.
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
Got a good close-up of the bridge superstructure of the Yamaguchi -- as well as a ton of other wonderful model shots -- at the IDIC Page.
And have you seen the perspective shot of the Enterprise-C's bridge published in the Fact Files/Star Trek Magazine?
--Jonah
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
A great site for references.
Omi, you are right- there is no rear windows on the Amby (looks lie it was a liberty of the aftermarket decalers that I used on my model!).
There are those off front-facing windows though. A cool circular hallway around the bridge's front half with framed photos and windows would be cool and would hatch the studio model- kind of a cross betwen the model display on the "E" and the officer's lounge full of memoribilia in STV)
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Do you have any picture? I don't see them (those off front-facing windows - I don't know where to look for them) I see only those on deck 2.
Wow, if there should be the hallway in front of the bridge, there would be not enough space for the conference lounge, and it will have to be also on deck 2...
And I'm sorry, in Czech republic there is no possibility to have any access to Fact files/ST Magazine. I can use only what I find on internet. (if that was meant to me)
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Here ya go. See the horizontal windows on the fron of the bridge in the second pic? Mabye the conference lounge is on deck two?
Nothing says it has to be behind the bridge after all...
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
well, i think there is a mistake. if you look carefully to this picture, you'll find out, that if there should be two decks in the top halfsphere (there are windows for 2 decks) there wouldn't be enough space in the top one, but only for the bridge and 2 turbolifts (like in Ent-C) no ready room, no hallway. I think there shouldn't be any windows in the top sphere!
Well I found (somewhere), that Ambassador class ships has 38 decks (many different sources on internet, but this is logicall - due to heigth of the ship and deck), if the top halfsphere contains 2 decks, there will be then 39 decks (not 38) in whole ship - as you can see on cutaway I'm working on
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Hmmm.... The idea that only the upper half of that hemisphere is the main bridge does not work well- particularly when you consider the height of the Enterprise C's bridge.
Better to think that the entire hemisphere is the main bridge and the excess top portion contains the sensor dome and assorted snacks for long missions.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
yes, i know, but there are two rows of windows on the hemisphere. that is obviously a mistake. but i think there shouldn't be any windows at all... or the conference lounge is in front of the bridge, not behind Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
One set of "windows" could be part of the self-illumination system -- none of these pictures show the miniatures with the lighting turned on.
And here's the Enterprise-C's bridge for reference.
Since I'm not home, does anyone have the drawing of the Excalibur's bridge from the New Frontier graphic novel?
--Jonah
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
If the dome is all one deck, it's pretty tall. There may simply be two rows of windows. If, as Jason suggested, there were some sort of gallery there, it may have a very high ceiling, with a row of windows at normal height, and a row of windows higher up.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Here is the original sketch from 'Double Time' from which Kazeite's drawing was done from.
I hope it helps.
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
Do a link instead.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Sorry, I thought this would be easier.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Never liked bridge designs that featured huge empty spaces at the front while squishing many stations into the rear. Obstensibly this is so that the cameras on the set will have more possible angles to shoot with less extras and reset time, but it's hardly practical.
On this design, the guy at Tactical would be bumping into the shoulders of the people at the rear stations. Also, the Captain would be shouting most of his orders to people behind him. Meanwhile, he could install a pool table or mini-grand piano at the front and still have room left over for a fridge. A bachelor must have designed this bridge.
Mark
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I know this bridge isn't idal, but USS Pasteur has a simillar type of bridge. All stations except the flight control behind the captain. Well, Galaxy class bridge has also most of the stations behind captain's chair. The new (modern) bridges are moving captain behind the others.
Well, i have taken all your comments, this photo and I create a design, where are all the windows. It combines few styles of the other ship's 'deck 1 layout'. First I made a side view, because I wanted to know how many space there is. If I wanted to use all the windows, the conference lounge has to be in front of the bridge and little lowered. So there are stairs to ready room and hallway, but that is necessary evil. The lengths (in meters) are based on the length of the whole ship (526 m). Here it is.
What do you think about this room layout? (It's not the original Ambassador class ship, but the refit.) Thanx for all comments.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
Yeah, that's the sort of thing I meant, about the two rows of windows on a single deck.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Interesting. The location of the conference room also works with SeanR's Ambassador bridge.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
What's SeanR's Ambassador bridge?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Looks great- though I despise the Voyager-ish "co-captain" chairs.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I konw, I don't like it either. I'm thinking how to change it, to some sort of TNG order (or whatever). Where First officer and Counsellor have their own seats on the bridge. But I think there is not so much space in the center as on Galaxy, and if they seat elsewere, they will be too far away from the captain to advise him...
image with three central chairs, but the two will see just the operators of fly control and OPS. So I think the version with 2 chairs is better. Only thing I don't know, where should seat the counsellor... any idea?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Screw the councilor's seat- unless they offer some strategic advantage (as Troi did) they have no place on the bridge.
I'd just have the captain's chair slightly raised with the XO's seat to the right of it (possibly with a small system's display like Riker sometimes used).
While we almost never saw it this way, most of the time, the XO and captain would not seve at the same time so dual seating is not a huge concern.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I know. But both chairs don't have to be occupated in the same time. Only in emergency situations.
As I said earlier, I develop this for my friend for a game and he wanted two command chairs (like on Excalibur). Later he told me, his counsellor asked him, where he would seat on the bridge. I answered there is no place for a counsellor on the bridge and he can just stand there like Bones did in TOS Well, if they solve some problems, they will do so in some lounge or another diplomatic apartment.
I just wanted someone other's opinion
Does anyone have some opinion for the other rooms? Or it's OT here | bridge | engineering | sickbay |
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
1) I love the bridge general layout! The twin turbolift stations are a bit odd, though: I understand that one of them is atop the vertical shaft, while the other is a sort of a "side track", like in the E-D bridge - but the exit to the lobby from the bowmost one is a bit awkward, with the narrow foyer and stairs and all.
Could the bowmost lift station be rotated clockwise or something, to provide a more direct access to the lobby? Perhaps the whole starboard lobby needs a better raison d'etre anyway. This is the room through which visiting dignitaries and whatnot march from the turbolift to the briefing room. A bridge crew galley and head isn't the first thing I'd place there. (I'm at loss with other ideas, though. An office of some sort, with a check-in desk for thpse VIPs?)
Dunno. The rest of the layout makes excellent use of the existing windows. But in this little lobby, the turbolift is so close to the windows that obvious problems arise.
2) Engineering looks fine. I trust an isolation door goes into that gap in the circular screen around the warp core in times of emergency?
Perhaps it would be nice to show the necessary workshops and spares stowage facilities around the engineering area this once?
3) Sickbay also could use "logistics spaces". The storage room is fine, but the wardroom might benefit from one of its own. And it would be difficult to navigate those coffins out of the morgue if the need ever arose. A slightly wider doorway? Rearranged internal orientation so that the coffin long axis matches the doorway to begin with? Reoriented/broadened corridor outside? An integrated corpse disposal chute?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
1) I'll try to rotate the turbolift a bit, to make it more "symetric" to the opposite doors to bridge. The lobby has to be lowered (because the shape of the outer hull) and I don't see more practical way than use stairs. I know that head and crew galley is not very nice on the way to lounge, but even on Ent-D there is the crew's head directly on the bridge. I think it should be somewere near the bridge. And the galley is use for changing crew. (Never wonder from were come the crew to change posts with those who just decided to go to away mission? Well, it's from this lobby.) I think it's usefull to place it there.
I've never seen any check-in desk for people entering the conference lounge.
2) Yes, there are isolation door for emergency situations (sliding down like on Ent-D).
I designed just the engineering, not whole deck with necessary rooms around it. It will come by the time as a simple schema of whole deck.
3) I think the ward should be a bit isolated (not like on Ent-D, but like Ent-A) and there are all needed supplies in that room already. If there is need for sthg else, it will be brought from the storage through the lab.
I know there is not enough space in the morgue. The idea was, that it's just "storage". (Like on Voy) Corpses are transported there. But you're right the doors should be wider. (At least to the lab.)
I'll make the adjustments... Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
I like it alot, thougha couple of things bug me. I don't think the side view is quite accurate. The tactical console is curved on the top view but doesn't really show any sign of curvature on your side view.
I really dig the ready room with the Janeway style lounge seating, though I'm wondering how many times brand new bridge officers accidentally walk into the Ready Room trying to get to the conference lounge.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
The sideview is just the cutaway. So it's cut in the middle of that tactical console. I did it just to have an idea of free space there.
There is label on every door. So I don't think the'll make such a mistake to enter door with label "ready room" when they wanna go to the conference lounge. I don't think they are so stupid If they didn't look to the plans before, they can just ask
[ August 10, 2005, 07:11 AM: Message edited by: omi ]
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
OK, I rotated the turbolift, so there is a bit more space in the entrance, I also made wider doors to the morgue in sickbay layout. Oh, I also deleted the lab table in morgue, to do there a bit more space.
| bridge | engineering | sickbay |
Posted by Vice-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
Nice Omi... although two Ready Rooms though seems a lot. Perhaps it should be a weapons locker or just a lounge for the bridge officers. Or move the conference area to one of the ready rooms and make an officers lounge like the refit Enterprise.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Nice work and I agree, one ready room is enough, unless the XO has power as well. I like the 3 chair variant, I am sure a one chair variant would also be easy to do. Also, you can do more than the Excalibur bridge variants, since you have the basic elements like the captain's chair, one can do a first officer and maybe even a counselor or variants thereof. The tactical station can be more than just the horseshoe from TNG, as I said, mixing and matching to create an original bridge can be fun and perhaps a bit daunting. Keep up the good work.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
There is just ONE ready room! On the right (starboard) side is "crew galley" or I don't know how to name it - "bridge crew's lounge" with head. (I wouldn't place 4 toilets into ready room ) It's just a place through you go from bridge to conference lounge. Not second ready room!
Well I think about delete the front console, move the flight_control/OPS console a bit front and make so a bigger place for three chairs.
The tacitcal console is not horshoe from TNG, it's bended console on the railing.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
You don't need FOUR toilets on the bridge. For no more than 7-8 people on the bridge at one time, there's no chance that half of them would be in the can at the same time. In the office building where I work, on my entire floor there are five toilets plus two urinals total for over forty people.
I'd recommend shrinking the head to two seats plus one or two sinks, bringing it even with the Galaxy class. Then, you can swap the locations of the head and lounge, giving the latter more room and tucking the head into the corner. The upper deck alcove can then be expanded a little more to give the people up there a little more room when exiting the bridge, so they won't bump into people waiting for the lift. The downside of this is that the head would then have a more spectacular view than the lounge.
Good work though! I'm really liking how you're scaling everything.
Mark
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Thanx Mark, I was surprised when I found your bridge designs year or so ago, so I knew, I'm not alone in designing, but I was looking forward to see some new ones and none comes
I'd like to swap the head and the lounge, as you suggest, but there are windows! I don't place two windows into head and none to lounge... The windows possition is taken from the model.
Well you suggested to reduce 4 toilets to 2 and add 2 urinals. Feminists wouldn't be happy from you Anyway, there are toilets for whole deck 1, it means people on the bridge, in lounge and conference lounge. I don't think it's too much
I have now another Idea. Separate the turbolifts. And the one move opposite (next to ready room).
And thanx a lot.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
There should probably be a stool or something for the tactical officer. There is no reason to deny the person a seat for such a long shift.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Tell that to owners of fast food joints. Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"For no more than 7-8 people on the bridge at one time, there's no chance that half of them would be in the can at the same time."
Well, that depends upon what the ship's kitchen served up for lunch that day...
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Turbolift separation would indeed solve a lot of problems. You'll just have to make sure, then, to connect the two vertical shafts on Deck 2 to ensure the availability of spare cabs behind the bridge doors 60/60/24/7.
It then becomes a question of whether you want to stay true to the "Double Time" conference room layout, or perhaps provide direct turbolift access to that room. (It would be a bit inconvenient to replace either of the conference room doors with a lift station, since Calhoun wouldn't want people traipsing through his sanctuary on the way to meetings, yet he'd probably want direct access himself...) A third doorway directly from the lift into the conference room would be more sensible than the idea of first disembarking the lift, THEN going through another set of doors to get to the conference room. If you wanted to do that, you could just as well use the "bridge lift" and ditch this separate "conference lift"!
There's always the chance that the "Double Time" lounge wasn't anywhere near the bridge, of course, leaving you free to configure this one as you please. Wasn't the NF Team Room described as being somewhere on the saucer rim or something?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Once again. This is an Ambassador-refit class bridge, but it's not the USS Excalibur's one. If you look carefully on the picture, you'll see USS Equilibrium label on the top left
I thinked about add an extra turbolift with access directly to conference room, but I didn't like the concept. There is not enough free space than. Anyway, I havn't seen any conference room with direct turbolift access.
I take some of the proposals you posted here and redesign a bit interior on the bridge to create more space for aft/tactical stations (with the stool for tactical station - well, service on the bridge is not a fast food job). I think this concept make different places on deck 1 more accessible (well, ready room).
I'm really interested in your reactions. >> new layout <<
Posted by Vice-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
I like the new lounge layout with the couches instead of that table with four chairs. Although I think the lounge needs more of the table plus two seats like Ten-Foward...
Looks damn good though.
I'm guessing that the Turbolift that leads to the lounge would be a way to have guests on the bridge and not interfere with normal operations and the other one for Starfleet personnel to use. Imagine if Picard had the option of sending Troi's mother into a Turbolift that gave him a buffer zone to escape!
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
This one looks great! (Hmm... Didn't I say so already?)
The remodeled furniture is nice, the layout for off-bridge spaces is nice... Now the original, rather angular bridge itself sticks out as the least thought out part of the whole. I wonder why that is...
Okay, perhaps it is a little bit inconvenient that a dignitary being led to the conference room along that aft ramp would still have to walk through the bridge. Imagine Lwaxana Troi with a dress that doesn't fit in a turbolift... The remaining option would be to abandon the ramp altogether, put the starboard turbolift where its pal used to be, and give it two exits, one to the bridge, one to the lounge. But that would be silly.
The rails on the stairs make a world of difference in terms of "organizing" the spaces. And Calh... Sorry, the CO's curved table is a nice touch. But as said, the bridge now yells for curved shapes, too.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
For the chairs in the lounge. There is not space for them... sorry. That's why I changed the table with couches.
If someone needs to go just to the conference lounge, he/she can exit the turbolift in lounge, and go through one door to conference room (not through the bridge).
If someone cannot fit into turbolift, he/she would hardly go through the ramp. There are surely many other rooms on board, to arrange meetings. If it is really an extreme, she can be transported on the place with her huge dress. (I don't think Lwaxana will ever visit this ship) And about the elevator. I don't like elevators with more than one exit. (may be just when there are 2 opposite. but it's not this case)
I know the bridge is a bit angular, but it's how it was designed (and I think it's not so terrible) I could arrange the aft stations curved, but it won't be than the Ambassador bridge. The off-bridge spaces has to be rounded, because shape of outer hull is that way. You think that I shoul made all stairs straight?
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Sickbay looks a bit small for suck a huge starship. Particularly if the ship were damaged in combat or providing emergency medical assistance to some colony or what have you.
Nice engineering layout- I'd go with a holographic "pool table" design though: it always irked me that we never saw more holographics in use on TNG after season two. That lil' "pool table" just cant convey a couple of dozen decks worth of systems effectivly.
A small nit: "USS Equalibrium"?!? What were they smokin' when they decided on that name? Mabye the ship is destined to be destroyed by the rogue IKS Inner Ear Infection....
Posted by Vice-Admiral Michael T. Colorge (Member # 144) on :
I'm sure Omi can add onto Sickbay... just after he expands around the Main Engineering first.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Wow, wow, wow, guys...
Of course. The sickbay is not very large. In fact, in main sickbay on Galaxy class ships, there are 4 beds. Here, there are 6. I think, this is the MAIN sickbay, so there are more wards and few more surgery rooms throughout the ship.
Jason, how have you came to HOLOGRAPHIC pool table? It's old class ship. I just use a table we can seen in ST4:TVH in SF HQ. And was used in EF2 in egineering of USS Dallas (Excelsior class) and advanced in Ent-D. The ships there are just schemas on the display, I think
USS Equilibrium - as I said, it's for the game, and the "crew" of this ship has agreed on this name. I think it's name of some movie, or sthg like that, and I think they come with this in the pub (and trust me, you don't have any idea about czech pub!), so don't ask
expand? what? look guys, the plan is this. I make the important rooms of this ship and then just general layout of ALL decks (that's why I do everythig with 3D model) I don't wanna do it so deatiled as is my Oberon project, cause it's so much work... (anyway my english is obviously not so good, to understand you what you want to expand around engineering...)
does anyone know this page? or Ent-D blueprints book, which is my dream to own, but not accessible for me. (they told me it's sold out)
[ August 11, 2005, 04:36 PM: Message edited by: omi ]
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
If you need a good shot of the Enterprise NX-01 dedication plaque, here it is. Enterprise NX-01 dedication plaque This was made by the same guy who has done lots of bridge oveheads as well as alot of oriignals. I hope it helps.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Omi rocks my world. No, I haven't gotten back to bridges (one member here is STILL waiting for my help on one - sorry, guy!), but that doesn't mean I'm out of ideas. What I'm seeing here though is a really cool new thing - making brdges fit into the model's exterior that don't relly make sense in the first place. I challenge someone to make the far-too-wide Sovereign bridge into its skinny cowling.
The refit Equilibrium is fantastic. It also looks far better to lead people through the lounge to get to the conference room... While both Enterprise-D and Voyager routinely led visitors through the bridge to get to their lounges, both sets featured two entrances to get them there. Enterprise-E had an awkward bridge-only lounge, but that may have been intentional to have it specifically for th bridge crew (when it was seen in "Nemesis", it was not the same lounge or in the same space as the doors didn't match up).
Mark
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
thanx for the dedication plaque, I'm planning to make one for Equilibrium too. As soon as the crew tell me the sentence they like to have there written.
Yeah, Sovereign is really the challenge but I think someone will find a way to fit it (somehow) Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Omi, the holographic technology is nothing new- it obviously predates TNG by some time (as no one is "Ohhh" and "Ahhh" when it appeared in season one. Besides, this is a Refit: if the 80 year old Excelsior refit can kick ass, an Ambassador can have a holographic engineering display.
Wanna build up a nice bridge for one of my designs? I'll give you lots of design freedom.....
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I know holotechnology can be added, but really, there is not holographic table in engineering
In fact, captain of Equilibrium said, Ambassador class ships (mean Equilibrium) doesn't have any holodecks, but it has theatre, cinema, and some recteational decks
Well, I may be really interested, but I have to see the designs first.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Here- I have several to choose from. Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
I have many more dedication plaques and I have a Photoshop template not only from movie TOS through TNG/Nemesis, I also have a TOS template as well. I would love a ENT Photoshop plaque template as well as a Relatvity 29th century plaque template but I am not going to hold my breath.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Send me a copy of your TNG template!
PLEEEZZ.
I know someone that cuts plexiglass and I think a nice model base coud be made from a dedication plaque.
Unfortunately, the ones I've seen posted around the Web have been somewhat....lacking.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Jason, it is the one I got from the "A Call To Duty" site, You could go there and download it yourself. I just modified it to reflect my people within my organization. Let me know and I can send it, no problem,
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Cool and thanks.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Jason: wow. I can just envy you. The fleet pics. Wonderfull. It's really like dream. Anyway, which of theese are your designs? I can't recognize them so well. Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Some are my own design, others are from model companies like ravenstar Studion nad, of course, some are canon designs.
If you see anything in particular that intrets you, I can elaborate on the ship in question's origins.
The Los Angeles class is a favorite of mine though.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
OK, if I'll have time, I'll try sthg. First I have to finish the Equilibrium PS: LA is nice class
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Thanks and cool.
If you cant get to it, Aban's Steamrunner bridge works nicely as well.
Hmmm...have you considered making the Equilibrium's shuttlebay(s)? We've never seen anyone attempt those before.
Mabye reverend (our wayward son) could whip up some Amby-era shuttles or something unique to your ship.
Like a boxy shuttle with a dune buggy in the back. Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Yop, I'll be doing all decks (in general) so the shuttlebay too. I think it'will use some modern shuttles and if unique ones, I'll design them too have you seen my Sol shuttle?
Oh no, I don't like the idea of buggies on starships. And if so, not such as in Nemesis. I just can't understand it's purpose. The SW's landspeeder is much more greater idea. Unfortunately not in ST.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
The shuttle itself would have served far better than the buggy -by simply lowering that aft door it would have become a flying pickup truck.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I think so Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Hmmm...how are you going to address the upside-down Excelsior shuttlebay slapped on as part of the "refit"?
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Excelsior? Equilibria is Ambassador class. I think I use some ideas from Ent-A shuttlebay.
Jason, The templates are on thier way. You need Photoshop 6 or later to open the files. Nice work, omi.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by omi: Excelsior? Equilibria is Ambassador class. I think I use some ideas from Ent-A shuttlebay.
I was actually referring to the Excelsior part they added to the bottom of the aft shuttlebay on the studio model as part of the refit. Here is a good rundown of the changes between the Enterprise C and the Refit version Ambassador.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
OK, I understand now. I'm working on the cutaway. You can see the shuttle bay, lower are stored shuttles and underneath can be repair bay and spare parts.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
oh....Groovy.
What are the two ope squares in the saucer and secondary hull? Too small for the computer cores...claustrophobic's quarters? Zero-G dodgeball?
Stellar Cartography mabye (though too big).
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
That should be computer cores. But as I said, I've just begin with this. Do you think it's too small? 3 decks tall? Ambassador is smaller than Galaxy, needs smaller cores Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Not that much smaller! I'd have the core at least six decks tall- this is the refit after all- computer capacity is what most starship refits would be all about after all.
Hell- the Sovvie and Galaxy's computers are the core of the ship.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
OK, OK. But what about nanotechology? Everything is getting smaller and smaller Refit has the same size core, but with more capacity
OK, I made it bigger Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Good.
Besides, Voyager spoiled any chance of the word "nanotechnology" ever being cool on trek.
I've got an idea! we'll make that large chamber a V.R. room where the ship's pilot will use kung fu and boxing to activate the ship's weapons!
Wait, that's the single dumbest idea ever. only a moron would like that. Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Yeah, I was thinking about full holographic bridge. It may change, when you enters combat - tactical officer will just point a finger to holographic target and ship will fire But have no idea, what would they do, when they loose power Posted by Cartman (Member # 256) on :
"...we'll make that large chamber a V.R. room where the ship's pilot will use kung fu and boxing to activate the ship's weapons!"
You're just never going to get over that gripe, are you?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
He's not alone. God, that idea was stupid.
Computer cores are huge on most starships. Even though they keep getting smaller these days, a huge core conveys the sense that whatever computing needs teh ship has are way, way beyond whatever we've got now. Today, they've got ten story building-sized computers used for weather modelling that STILL aren't good enough.
Mark
Posted by machf (Member # 1233) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mark Nguyen: He's not alone. God, that idea was stupid.
Why did you have to remind me of that? I thought I had finally erased it succesfully from my memories...
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cartman: "...we'll make that large chamber a V.R. room where the ship's pilot will use kung fu and boxing to activate the ship's weapons!"
You're just never going to get over that gripe, are you?
No. It's the worst idea in al of sci-fi, IMHO. Also, JMS was going on and on about how great the movie was both before and after it aired. It killed the last shred of admiration I had for him. But it's far off topic, so I'll stop ranting (for now).
A holographic bridge would not work real well because we're always seeing power failures on Trek, but of it had a physical backup, stuff like future Jadzia's "holographic controls" might be nice- particularly if you could access the controls from anywhere on the ship in an emergency.
Besides, if they had a holographic bridge, we'd never get to see Unnamed Crewman get caught in a control panel explosion. And that makes an episode for me. Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Um.... What are you guys talking about? I think I missed something...
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I had run a slight tangent rant on the stupidity of the TV movie Legend of The Rangers, wherein the pilot used a V.R. interface to fire the ship's weapons by using some cheesy tae-bo nonsense moves.
It was baaaad. So bad, I could not even laugh at it in a MST3K way. I was in shock that it ever got produced- or even made it past the storyboard stage.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Yikes.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
I agree, I prefer the real birdge with blinking and flashing and blinking and flashing Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Toggle switches are high tech! Just ask the Son'A- their bridge was intentionally designed by Eaves to be retro, and yet they slapped around the Enterprise easily enough.
..until Riker got serious and took out the Radio Shack joystick: dont mess with the Radio Shack joystick.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
Yes, I just rewatched 'Insurrection' recently. If you notice on the Enterprise E Bridge, the counselor and first officer stations are just chairs.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Well, the XO should be up and monitoring the other stations (or wresteling with nosforatu in the Jeffries Tubes) and I cant imagine any other captain but Picard has his ship's councilor on the bridge....ever.
That third seat is probably intended as the "visiting dignatary/admiral" seat- as it was in The Pegasus.
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Pulaski sat in it from time to time too, so I don't think it was set as Councilor's station really.
On the bridge, Troi was more of an advisor than a councilor anyway.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Troi was more eye-candy than anything else. Eye-candy with feelings.
I'm convinced that she just faked half of her "empathy" nonsense- how could she "sense" anything from an image on aviewscreen depicting a person billions of kilometers away?
Bad writing, not withstanding.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
Maybe there's a psychic realm that Betazoids can tap into to sense the emotional and mental state of anyone in the universe. Think of it like a massive network that everyone plugs into, but the Betazoids are 1337 #4XX0rs that can zoom to anyone on that network instantly. All they need is to see what the person looks like. We can call this realm the Midichloriverse.
As to the bridge topic, I've always labeled the third chair as a "mission specialist's seat". If a mission is large and important enough to warrant a mission commander or something, then that person sits in the seat to also advise the captain on mission-related matters. For example, Admiral Pressman sitting there in "The Pegasus" or Lt. Cmdr. Shelby before Picard was kidnapped in "The Best of Both Worlds". I also want to say that we saw a few (very few) others also sit there (and I want to say that K'Ehleyr sat there on first appearance, as well). We only saw Troi there most of the time because the Federation's flagship tended to get dinky missions like shuttling Lwaxanna Troi around or dealing with the crews' family issues.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Yeah...those "family issues" made for some real (yawn) intresting eisodes.
If Betazoids had such incredible powers, they'd be superior to guys like the Metrons. ...and that whole "Dominion suprise invasion" proably would not have worked real well. Instead of "Midichloriverse" we'll call it Plot-devicive-space". It's like subspace, but "sub-inteligent" space".
The same realm most of Voyager's aliens sprang from.
Posted by Siegfried (Member # 29) on :
All right, Abbadon, you're making me think too much about an idea I put out there on a lark. Of course, the Dominion surprise invasion remained a surprise. You didn't see any Betazoids on the Defiant, did you? Also, I said the Betazoids had to see the person's face to locate them. We've never seen the real face of a Founder; I imagine it looks a lot like slime. Thus, the Betazoids couldn't probe 'em.
Or the Dominion has a kick-ass firewall.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Or Betazoids dont like "slimy thoughts", which rules most of mine right out.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
I am sure many people's thoughts would be considered slimey. I like the idea of a mission specialist chair rather than a counselor chair, either way it works.
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
My thoughts are fluffy.
By the way, where's the joystick on all the other starships?
Unless that ships wheel in TFF wasn't just for show.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
As far as the joystick on other bridges of starships, I think the captain has an opt-in for the bridge. Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
All movie events after First Contact are just a side effect from Data's time with the Borg Queen - we are witnessing events that data pondered in the "eternity" that he was contemplating joining the Borg Queen.
Just as all of ST5 was a collective dream of Spock/McCoy/Kirk's brought on by McCoy's Bourbon Beans.
Oh and how the finale of Enterprise didn't exist and how the Entire run of Voyager was Harry Kim stuck in one of Quark's holosuites.
At the end of the series/when Harry was freed - he promptly left Starfleet.
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
LOL, nice take on the events of the various ST shows/movies.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
Well, everything after "ST:VII-Generations" is juste Picard's experience (dream) in Nexus Posted by machf (Member # 1233) on :
Picard's most secret desires coming true, that is...
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Not much of an imagination of 'ol Jean-Luc, it seems.
Insurrection shoud have been set during the Dominon war- the need for the planet to heal would have seemed more justified then and it would have explained the Enterprise's absence from all the major battles.
...though nothing excuses that joystick, ST:INN is still far superior to Generations.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
"Insurrection shoud have been set during the Dominon war- the need for the planet to heal would have seemed more justified then and it would have explained the Enterprise's absence from all the major battles."
Have you, perhaps, not seen it?
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Yah Jason... Insurrection was set during the Dominion War.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Nooo....it's after. Riker says "During the war with the Dominion, the Son'A supplied the drug..." not "They are supplying our enemies with the drug..." They're definitely talking about events in the past tense- it saved them from having to explain the war at all to the non-DS9 crowd.
It's about a year after the war ends chronologicly, from what I can tell. Picard mentions how the federation was looking to make new pals after their losses in the war. Not making new pals beacuse it's wartime- there is none of the urgentcy that wartime would envoke.
Anyone got a script? I'll gladly be proven wrong, but it's not likely. Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
quote:RIKER (reacts) Look at this...
She stands, leaning over Riker's shoulder to see his computer, putting one arm on the desk...
RIKER (CONT'D) 'The Son'a have been suspected of producing mass quantities of the narcotic ketracel-white... their ships are rumored to be equipped with isolytic subspace weapons outlawed by the Second Khitomer Accord...'
Posted by Captain Serek (Member # 1038) on :
In the beginning of the film, where the reception is taking place, Picard is mentioning something of the short aliens being inducted into the Federation because of the war.
Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
But OK, every reference to the Dominion might just be ambiguous enough to allow your interpretation, Jason, but it hardly seems like the obvious conclusion; that being, to my and as far as I know most minds is that it all takes place roughly where the DS9 and Voyager were when the film came out, which was 2375 as far as, for instance, the folks at Memory Alpha are concerned.
It's just that I've never seen someone take your position.
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
One simple fact everyone has forgotten was that all indications were that Worf was still stationed at DS9 when the movie takes place. Both Picard and Worf mentioned that they were going to swing back to DS9 to return Worf. Because of that, the movie has to take place during the war because as soon as the war ended Worf packed up and went with Martok to be an ambassador.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Hmmm....you all have valid points. My thinking is mainly because the utter lack of urgentcy (or any real sense that it's wartime at all- much less a war the Federation was losing most of the time and suffering weekly casualties- often in the thousands).
Why would Worf have been there during wartime at all? It sure does not match any point in DS9 continuity for him to have been away like that (unless it was some sort of leave following Jadzia's death- we sure never heard mention of it though).
Riker says "During the war with the Dominion, the Son'A supplied the drug..." not "They are supplying our enemies with the drug..." They're definitely talking about events in the past tense- it saved them from having to explain the war at all to the non-DS9 crowd.
Riker mentions "the Diplomatic Corps is busy with Dominion negotiations" (that could go either way, really- either just after the war's conclusion or the "peace feelers" that Vreenak mentioned to Sisko in season six).
Picard: "In view of our losses to the Borg and Dominion, the council feels we need all the allies we can get." That (to me) implies long-term losses (the Borg attack was three(?) years prior- giving audiences a tie-in with the last movie). Besides, why would the federation bring in a low-tech race during the war? They'd be putting that entire culture's lives at risk of Dominion attack for nothing. There is also no reason for a race to join up during a horiffic war they cant really contribute to.
Later, Admiral Daugherty is convinced to aid Ruafo because "the federation is Old- it's been challenged by the Borg, the Dominion, The Girl Scouts..." he never mentions any ongoing war, nor does the Admiral say anything about it to Picard. If he had made a case for saving thoudands of federation lives wounded in battle, it might have swayed Picard, instead, his pleas are for some "fountain of youth"- not to win a war or save the quadrant from destruction.
Crap- the lines about the Son'A supplying White are not consistant with the script (hell- in the script there's a prune-faced libraian on the Enterprise!?! Paper notepads?!?) . Too bad- the script gives much better background on the Son'A than the movie did.
Mabye someone can watch the movie and jot down the exact dialogue for us?
Posted by Peregrinus (Member # 504) on :
First of all, those aliens aren't being made members, they're being made a "protectorate" -- under the Federation's protection, and with space set aside for their future expansion and exploitation, but still allowed to develop in their own way and their own time until such time as they petition for membership. Might be weeks, might be years -- or never.
Notice also in that very script that you linked to, Picard asks Worf how his wife is. If Jadzia's still alive, the war is definitely not over.
--Jonah
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Doesn't Picard also pretty specifically say to Anij that his people are at war right now? It could be something a little more vague like "these are dangerous times for my people", but he definitely hints at an ongoing conflict that he feels he needs to be a part of.
There's an edited scene in Nemesis where Worf says something about diplomatic life not agreeing with him, explaining why he's back in Starfleet. Now... if Insurrection takes place a year after the war, Worf would have had to already gotten fed up with being an ambassador and returned to Starfleet. Why then would anyone still be surprised about it during Nemesis?
In the absence of any dates, we have to go with the intent of the writers. I don't see anything to suggest that they meant to set it anywhere other than in the then-current time frame during the war.
Yes, the script avoids mentioning the war in any great detail to avoid confusing the little people who didn't watch the series... but still.
Posted by omi (Member # 1695) on :
I thnik this discussion deserves it's own forum... it's a bit OT here, what do U think?
Posted by Dat (Member # 302) on :
One thing you should know is that topics easily and very quickly get off-topic here.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
quote:Originally posted by Peregrinus: Notice also in that very script that you linked to, Picard asks Worf how his wife is. If Jadzia's still alive, the war is definitely not over.
--Jonah
That's in the script only, I'm afraid.
As I mentioned, the movie would have been a hell of a lot better if they used more of the script (or did not edit out what they used).
I understand the writer's intent, but it's certainly not clear -or i'm dense as Neutronium.
Fuck you all in advance for the obvious retort that follows that last sentence. Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
I want to say there's a penis joke here somewhere... The rebel Jem'Hadar's captured Iconian Ziggurat(sp?) was made out of Neutronium... and that was slightly phalic... Is that funny?
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
) and it should be the TNG era Ambassador refit (to fit TNG standards). It's name is Equilibrium (he doesn't care if the name is official ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
)![[Frown]](frown.gif)
). So enjoy ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
and I can't edit anymore the previous post 
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)