The only ones I've seen is the one from the RPG (seen at Memory Beta: http://startrek.wikia.com/wiki/Tellar ). I'd like this for my map project. Also, are there any Vulcan emblems other than that IDIC thing.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Didn't Enterprise establish some new emblems??
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Didn't watch Enterprise much, so that's why I'm asking. I know that Enterprise established an Andorian emblem.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
There's always the old Franz Joseph tech manual where the Federation is suggested to consist of (or at least to have been founded by) folks from Earth, Alpha Centauri, 40 Eridani, 61 Cygni and Epsilon Indi. That is, Earthlings, Centaurians, Vulcans, Tellarites and Andorians, even though FJ doesn't say that much.
The 61 Cygni sign is a very Earth-centric design featuring, you guessed it, a swan, its wings raised to cradle some symbology. The Epsilon Indi one is a boring regular stars-and-stripes style flag with a white seven-armed Maltese cross in place of the stars, and just seven stripes in rainbow colors, red up and violet down.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Kobi (Member # 1360) on :
quote:Originally posted by Timo: There's always the old Franz Joseph tech manual where the Federation is suggested to consist of (or at least to have been founded by) folks from Earth, Alpha Centauri, 40 Eridani, 61 Cygni and Epsilon Indi. That is, Earthlings, Centaurians, Vulcans, Tellarites and Andorians, even though FJ doesn't say that much.
My theory on this is that all were supposed to be Earth colonies, and only later they were connected with being the homes of alien races.
I had a look in the FASA manuals, the Star Trek IV supplemental indeed gives logos for the Federation races: Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
The Tellarite logo is a pig? Who came up with that?
To answer Andrew's question, no, there was no apparent Tellarite logo used on Enterprise. There are a few candidates from other souces, though the only one I can recall is an unidentified banner from the Khitomer scenes in ST:VI. As I recall it was a red triangle pointing down with what looked like yellow leaves wrapped around it and a black upwards pointing triangle as a background. It was on my to-do list, but I never got around to it.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Thanks, Kobi, but that FASA emblem's...not useful! It's as if the Earth emblem had an angry gorilla on it.
Also, Timo, I know about those FJ emblems, but I'm trying to forget about them. However, some were used in the movies, but weren't really identified (ignorable).
I think Bernd might have come up with a banner or something. I'll have to rummage around my hard disc a bit.
Anyone know of any other Vulcan emblems (hopefully without hammers, anvils, or volcanoes)?
Edit: Found some Fed flags Bernd sent me:
Tellar:
Andor: Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
quote:Originally posted by Masao: Anyone know of any other Vulcan emblems (hopefully without hammers, anvils, or volcanoes)?
Only ones with rubber tires, bombers, & motorcycles.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Yeah, those are ok.
Posted by Kobi (Member # 1360) on :
quote:Originally posted by Masao: Thanks, Kobi, but that FASA emblem's...not useful! It's as if the Earth emblem had an angry gorilla on it.
I think it is just important to show that the flags or coat-of-arms are alien enough. Just look how different the present day coat-of-arms from European/American states are to those from Arabian world and Asia.
Edit: Just had a look at LUG's Planets of the UFP, in an image depicting first contact between Tellarites and off-worlders the Tellarites carry standards with big discs on top. The discs are framed ... fits very good with Bernd's red disc and the yellow frame.
Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :
well, there was this emblem shown in one of the movies which correspond with Franz� sketches: my tellarite ships page Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I don't know about Masao, but that helps ME out a lot.
Posted by HerbShrump (Member # 1230) on :
I created these two from the Franz Joseph Designs.
61 Cygni (Tellar)
40 Eridani (Vulcan)
40 Eridani looks sufficiently Vulcan.
Posted by aridas (Member # 1051) on :
I combined the FJ logo with some Tellarite graphics from ENT to get a modified logo I used on this early Tellarite ship:
I figured if their planet had people that looked like pigs, they might also have birds that look like cyclops swans.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Ark ship? Is it for evacuation of Tellar, colonization, or both?
Either way it's a nice design that's really alien.
Posted by aridas (Member # 1051) on :
Thanks. It was a meant to be sublight, multi-generational explorer with an end goal of establishing a settlement. Other images of the ship, along with a 3D model are here.
I never liked the use of Roman numerals on a design that had been assigned to the Tellarites, so I tried to subtly blend the majority of the swan logo with an interpretation of the interesting Tellarite lettering Mike Okuda (or maybe Geoff Mandel?) made up for ENT.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
"W-w-w-w-w-w-elcome t-t-to T-t-t-telar!" Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
quote:Originally posted by Starship Freak: well, there was this emblem shown in one of the movies which correspond with Franz� sketches: my tellarite ships page
That was used for Enterprise? Well, as has been mentioned, it's unlkely that an alien race would use an emblem that incorporates the Earth/Western name for the homeworld star. I suppose the use of a swan might be an amazing set of coincidences, but I don't buy it. If 61 Cygni were the home of a human colony, then I could see it.
Perhaps, in a spirit of galactic harmony, Earth's new emblem incorporates a gleep, a small amphibious rat-like creature native to Tellar, whose name has been given to the Tellar constellation including Sol.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
quote:Originally posted by Masao: Perhaps, in a spirit of galactic harmony, Earth's new emblem incorporates a gleep, a small amphibious rat-like creature native to Tellar, whose name has been given to the Tellar constellation including Sol.
Posted by aridas (Member # 1051) on :
Didn't the gleep star in "The Immunity Syndrome"?
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Hmm. On those Roman numerals, is |X|I supposed to be the same as 61 somehow? I mean, is this |X| thing a standard alternative to LX outside the Porcine Star Empire?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by HerbShrump (Member # 1230) on :
It could be LXI That would be 61. With the lines at the top and bottom, it all blended together.
Posted by aridas (Member # 1051) on :
Interestingly, to the ancient Etruscans, from whom the Romans learned their numbering system, the IXI would have been 100.
It's hard to believe Franz Joseph intended these crests and flags as being applicable to Tellar or Andor. He believed the "Plato's Stepchildren" / "Who Mourns for Adonis" folks had exported humans to Alpha Centauri -- maybe he thought the same for the Tellarites and Andorians. But that would leave them looking pretty alien, even for Greeks (though Circe did have a thing for turning men into pigs...). The direct association between those graphics and the Andorians/Tellarites wasn't made until (I believe) Geoff Mandel in either his Officers' Manual or the Star Trek Maps. I agree it is a lengthy stretch to make them work for that purpose.
You can either abandon them altogether, adapt them to Andor and Tellar by altering them, or reassign them to Earth colonies in those star systems and come up with something wholly new for Andor and Tellar.
In which case the gleep is looking like a leading candidate for the Tellar crest.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
How about incorporating this design
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
It needs nacelles and a deflector...
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
quote:Originally posted by aridas: It's hard to believe Franz Joseph intended these crests and flags as being applicable to Tellar or Andor.
If that's true, why did he choose those particular stars? I wasn't active in organized fandom back then, but I've always assumed that astronomer fans had assigned those stars to the respective races and that FJ used the stars after learning about them through his fan daughter. if the stars weren't intended to be the homeworlds of the big three alien allies, whose were they intended to be?
Anyway, here's the map I mentioned earlier. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v22/Masao/2155map.jpg (844 kb) This is supposed to show interstellar routes and system ownership before the Earth-Romulan War. This was done for my website, so I've stuck to my view of the available technology and have completely ignored Series V. During this time, the fusion-powered ships were limited to trips of about 2 parsecs without midflight refueling or severely limited payloads. All the stars are real with their true positions and distances. Because humans started colonizing later than did other races, they found that many nearby systems to the west, south, and north were already claimed, and there was a stellar desert to the east (from where the Romulans were soon attack). So, they started expanding upward (in the z-axis). I've used the UN emblem for Earth, the Enterprise Andor emblem, and FJ's Vulcan pennant (I intend to redraw as the emblem alone). Tellar's emblem is pending (I'm thinking that something to reflect the twin stars of the home system might be good).
Posted by HerbShrump (Member # 1230) on :
Maso, where did you get that map? If you made it yourself, what maps did you use as references? I've wanted to make my own map of the local neighborhood. I've found a few sites, but not a whole lot of information.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
Masao, I seem to remember in a couple fandom & possble RPG sources something about the Tellarites buuilding a massive orbital tether. I'd buy it as it keeps in line with the idea that Tellarites have an engineering bent to their nature & culture (almost as much as the arguing).
I mention it only because I could see something like that being on their logo as an interstellar body, maybe the tether rising up in forced perspective to a point of nothing with the twinned suns.
Posted by MinutiaeMan (Member # 444) on :
Shik: That's an interesting idea, except that I'm envisioning it as a giant inverted wang. (Shows where my mind is, I guess... but then, I just watched Austin Powers the other day...)
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Try watching Euerka Seven sometime- flying surfboards shaped like a giant penis....
Ah, Japanese pop culture.
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
quote:Originally posted by MinutiaeMan: Shik: That's an interesting idea, except that I'm envisioning it as a giant inverted wang. (Shows where my mind is, I guess... but then, I just watched Austin Powers the other day...)
I was thinking more of a "I'm standing at the bottom looking up" & the think disappears up at a shapr rate. The suns could be off-centered & not connected to appear less tezzy-ish.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
quote:Originally posted by HerbShrump: Maso, where did you get that map? If you made it yourself, what maps did you use as references? I've wanted to make my own map of the local neighborhood. I've found a few sites, but not a whole lot of information.
I drew it myself, on the basis of information and maps from Winchell Chung ( http://www.projectrho.com/starmap.html especially the "actual maps" page ). I also used info from the Internet Stellar Database and Christian R�hl's site. I've got various versions dating back about 3 years. But this is the first where I've tried to figure out likely areas of expansion on the basis of stellar distances.
The home planets (Vulcan, Andor, and Tellar) and from ancient fandom. ST:E put Andor on Procyon to encourage conflict with the Vulcans.
Ah, so you went for Epsilon Indi as the Andorian home system, well, Dan used Zeta Tucanae for it, a top choice still. Equal distance to Earth and Vulcan.
The Tellar Space Elevator mentioned earlier is also from LUG's "Planets of the UFP".
Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
Masao, mate if you want I could send you the original vector files of those logos to alter as you see fit.
As for the Tellar logo, I might draw one up based on that unclaimed Khitomer banner, up to you if you want to use it or not of course.
Posted by HerbShrump (Member # 1230) on :
Kobi: Epsilon Indi is the "traditional" fandom homeworld for the Andorians, so I decided to stick with it.
Herb: Winchell's Chung's site is great in all respects. He even fixed me up with some 100-ly diameter maps I requested.
Rev: Which logos? I have my own versions of the Vulcan, United Nations, and Andor logos. The Tellar Khitomer banner reminds me too much of a Japanese Zero fighter. It might be a bit too simple. I emailed Geoff Mandel to see if a Tellar emblem was designed but I haven't heard back from him yet.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
For those of you trying to design a Tellar emblem, please note that 61 Cygni is possibly a three-body system, with 61 Cygni A, about the same size as the Sun, and 61 Cygni B, about 75% the diameter of the Sun orbiting each other at a distance of 51 to 121 AU; an unseen third body, 61 Cygni A, might be orbiting 61 Cygnia A at a distance of 4 AU. It's diameter is less than 10% of the Sun's, making too small for a star.
quote:Originally posted by Masao: Rev: Which logos? I have my own versions of the Vulcan, United Nations, and Andor logos. The Tellar Khitomer banner reminds me too much of a Japanese Zero fighter. It might be a bit too simple. I emailed Geoff Mandel to see if a Tellar emblem was designed but I haven't heard back from him yet.
Well I was referring to the 40 Eridani logo really. Thought it'd save you the effort of redrawing it just to get shot of the banner.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Thanks anyway, Rev.
Here's a quick idea a knocked together. it's a graphic represenation of the Tellar trinary home system. I decided on the top view, since a side view ended up looking too much like the Andor emblem. I'm not completely happy with the colors, but I sort of like including purple.
By the way, Aridas mentioned some Andorian script. Where might I see a sample?
[ April 10, 2007, 08:45 PM: Message edited by: Masao ]
Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :
I dig it.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Some variations, but some are getting to look a bit Muslim, which would be inappropriate for a race that look like walking pork products. Posted by Kobi (Member # 1360) on :
Not to put you in any direction, but here is the Tellarite Standard I came up with based on the LUG image:
quote:Originally posted by Masao: Some variations, but some are getting to look a bit Muslim, which would be inappropriate for a race that look like walking pork products.
That last one is the favourite so far. Perhaps tone down the colours a bit, add some detail like double rimm some of those circles, surround it with some Tellarite text and maybe mount the whole thing on an oval shield. Maybe a vertically orientated oval would balance it out.
Tell you what, I'll sketch something out when I get home.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I call Jihad on your porkine race!
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
Thanks, all. You've all been helpful, except for the wee-model�building Abbadon fellow (I kid! I kid!)
Speaking of "Jihad," I learned this word from TAS.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Hey, I like my proposed (if copywright protected) logo. It'd make a cool T-Shirt, if I'd bothered to put a starfleet uniform on Porky.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
(No Gorillas though.)
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
