Post A Reply
my profile
|
directory
login
|
search
|
faq
|
forum home
»
Flare Sci-Fi Forums
»
Community
»
The Flameboard
»
Sit Back, & Watch The Fireworks
» Post A Reply
Post A Reply
Login Name:
Password:
Message:
HTML is enabled.
UBB Code™ is enabled.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Malnurtured Snay: [QB] [QUOTE]It's the PEOPLE, not the machine.[/QUOTE] Or, "guns don't kill people, people do." Even better: "Fingers don't kill people, bullets do." Even Rob can't deny that guns make it a lot easier to inflict harm. Guns provide enhanced ability. Are you aware the most successful suicides are those who use firearms? For anyone feeling murderous (kids at Columbine, that office worker, a guy we had running around in Baltimore about a year and a half ago, Palcynski something), guns make it very easy to attack physically bigger people, many people, at a distance, hidden, and so on. C'mon, how many people would rob a bank with a knife? Give a person a gun ... you've got a different story. [QUOTE]See, if you date someone, and they turn into a stalker, and come to your house to kill you, and you kill them first, that would be counted in the statistics you posted, because they took place in the home where the "victim" was known to the shooter, and vice-versa.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]But most damagingly, the FBI deems only 1 percent of all murders to be "justifiable homicides" using a firearm. Statistics from the nation's largest crime survey also show that a gun in 19 times more likely to be used in nonfatal crime than in nonfatal self-defense.[/QUOTE] Rob, the study only showed that if you owned a gun in the home, you were *more* likely to die from gun violence then if you didn't. I posted the link about -- you should take a look at it. As for Julie's brother, do you know the laws in PA governing how you may lawfully use your firearm? Are you aware that in '93, the FBI counted 24,526 murders? 251 were justifiable homicides by handguns. That's one percent. (Don't bring up 'Excuseable' Homicide ... if you have to draw your gun and shoot someone when they bump into you, or in the heat of passion or rage, you don't deserve one -- and it certainly doesn't count as 'justifiable'). And the study controlled for domestic violence. [QUOTE]So you're counting positives as negatives. Skewed data leading to a previously-determined conclusion. Poor science.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]What this objection is asking us to imagine is this: a gun prevents a murder from happening in, say, nine cases. But on the tenth it fails (by necessity, to produce the murder victim in question). If guns really provided this kind of protection, we could easily imagine that one of the previous nine murder attempts would have been successful, had the victim not possessed a gun. In that case, non-gun owners would have seen a higher murder rate. This is something the study would have found (see point 1), but it did not; it found a higher murder rate among gun owners. Pro-gunners might then argue that an individual facing a likely threat sought protection by buying a gun, hence the higher correlation. But this is the same argument rebutted in point 3. Ultimately, the pro-gunners starting assumption is incorrect. Guns do not prevent a series of threats, one of which ultimately succeeds; rather, guns enhance the possibility of murder.[/QUOTE] [/QB][/QUOTE]
Instant Graemlins
Instant UBB Code™
What is UBB Code™?
Options
Disable Graemlins in this post.
*** Click here to review this topic. ***
© 1999-2024 Charles Capps
Powered by UBB.classic™ 6.7.3