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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Raw Cadet: [QB] I will try to respond to you, Ryan McReynolds, with my knowledge of the Roman Catholic Church, in which I am fairly well versed, and with my information on other religions. Please note that if this post comes across as inflammatory, that was not my intention. I would not spend an hour putting this together if I did not respect the respondent. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ryan McReynolds: [qb] Religion as a whole [i]has[/i] to keep people--not only children--ignorant of certain things lest they realize that it's illogical.[/qb][/QUOTE] As you clearly stated, you are not implying that (most) religions have a vast underground conspiracy to keep people ignorant. But what exactly are you implying? I hope you would grant that if you asked most religious clergy, clerics, educators, etc. if they are keeping people ignorant they would honestly answer no (even if they are, in your opinion; they do not consider it ignorance). If one grants that a higher power exists (as these religious do), what is ignorant and illogical to one might be inspired and sensible to another. [QUOTE][qb]It's merely a [i]tradition[/i] of ignorance, extending back millennia.[/qb][/QUOTE] Unfortunately, that was true, but many of your current beefs are off base. The Catholic Church states that the theory of evolution is not in conflict with Church doctrine (provided, of course, you grant that the big guy upstairs started it all ;) ). I do not know what other religions have to say about this. As for the "soul," I doubt you could find a legitimate contemporary Catholic cleric, or one of any denomination, for that matter, who would say it is a discoverable region. The mind is a complex and fascinating component of humanity, and (most) religions encourage its scientific study. [QUOTE][qb]Religion prevents millions of people in Africa, and elsewhere, from protecting themselves from being ravaged by AIDS..[/qb][/QUOTE] You are undoubtedly referring to the Catholic Church's stance against artificial birth control. Yes, the Church is against it. No, the Church is not in charge of condom distribution in Africa; I wonder where you got the idea it prevents people from protecting themselves. By the way, I believe most other religions allow artificial birth control, so your "religion . . . " claim is a bit broad and unfair. Africans are being ravaged by many things, however, and the Church has devoted many resources to combatting hunger, human rights abuses, and lack of education, among other things. Meanwhile, the United States sits back and allows racial genocide to go unchecked, costing millions of lives. [QUOTE][qb]Religion makes thousands of people afflicted with chronic illnesses spend their time and money on uneffective faith healing, when they could be spending it on treatment.[/qb][/QUOTE] I am not quite sure what you are referring to. There are stories of parents withholding medical treatment from their children for "religious reasons," but I can assure you no Catholic (or Hindu, or Jew, etc.) approves of such a decision. Also, anyone who lives in a major city probably knows of at least one professional, scientific hospital run by a religious organization. [QUOTE][qb]Religion forces people to die horribly from painful afflictions rather than offer them the option of ending the pain.[/qb][/QUOTE] Just as no religion has control over the African condom supply, no religion can control how and when you die. John Ashcroft is trying to force people to die horribly; John Paul II, though he disapproves of suicide, cannot stop you. [QUOTE][qb]Religion prevents us from potentially curing dozens of horrible diseases with the knowledge that could be gained from cloning and stem cell research.[/qb][/QUOTE] Once again, religion has no direct control over this matter. I am sure Vatican Cardinals were having coronaries over the news that a human had been cloned. Do you not think they would have stopped it if they could? The main problem with each of your claims, as I pointed out above, is that they hold religion responsible for things it has little control over. It also shows an ignorance of a very important aspect of my religion. In the papal encyclical "Humanae Vitae," released by Pope Paul VI, it is stated that the morality of decisions are ultimately determined by a well developed conscience, not dogma. Thus, if in good, well developed conscience one can use a condom during sex, commit Euthenasia, and destroy embryos to advance medical science, then one may do so and still "face God on 'Judgement Day' with a 'clear conscience." [QUOTE][qb]And religion offers hope. Nobody, atheist or otherwise, can deny that. But at what cost? Imagine, just imagine, the achievements that mankind could have experienced if all of the hours spent in prayer and the money spent in tithe could be put towards science, or medicine, or even buying food for the hungry. Imagine where we'd be if countless scientists and doctors throughout history had been heralded as heroes instead of hated for their heresy.[/qb][/QUOTE] Oh, come on. Prayer can be used as a form of meditation or relaxation. Are you "against" meditation? As for "the tithe" (Catholics stopped tithing a long time ago; I think Mormons still do), where do you think the money goes? The various religions of the world feed millions, and contribute invaluable information through the research at religious institutions, with the funds they receive. P.S. Forgive me if I was patronizing at any point; as I said, that was not my intention. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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