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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Raw Cadet: [QB] Not necessarily, Sol System. Maybe if we just ignore him, we can continue to have a civilized discussion (to be fair, his first post here is civilized). O.K. I will be the first hypocrite. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Omega: [qb][i]you perhaps think humanity's progress would march forward without the old ball-and-chain of religion holding it back. I think that is both true and false. Certainly, in the past, the notion was true. My own religion, back when it "ruled the world" (ah, the glory (or should I say gory?) days) was a notable offender.[/i] Yes, to some degree, but WITHOUT the church there would never have been a Renaisance, nor would the Germanic tribes been civilized as quickly. It was a unifying, stablizing influence in all of Europe.[/qb][/QUOTE] First of all, that quote was from me, not Ryan. Second, in a way, the Catholic Church had little influence in Europe, and certainly not a "unifying, stablizing" one. I have no doubt that without the Church the depraved, greedy, power-hungry Middle Ages leaders of Europe would still have gone to war as often as they did. However, if the Church had been influential in the way it should have been, it would have tried to bring about peace, perhaps by playing the "don't kill your fellow Catholics (just Muslims)" card (which it did, but not often enough). As it was, the "influential" Popes were often as depraved, greedy, and power-hungry as the European leaders, and often welcomed war. One cannot deny that the Catholic Church was a crucial, integral part of the transition from the ancient world to the modern world. However, the Church could have tried to make that transition a lot more peaceful than was. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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