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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Peregrinus: [QB] I was avoiding jumping into this thread and flailing about, but it looked like sooo much fun... The idea that "they" (whoever they may be) found further thresholds above warp 9 and below the (previous) warp 10 and reassigned warps 10-13+ to those thresholds while infinite speed was given a new number (if at all, maybe at the time of AGT, infinite speed was simply referred to as Eugene's Limit...) is the one that is the most internally consistent of the rationalizations surrounding Riker's line in AGT. Okuda produced Tranwarp-compatible displays for the E-A in ST IV before the Great Bird decided transwarp hadn't worked. These displays are in fact reprinted in Mr. Scott's Guide, although Okuda initially denied it, saying they were doctored by Shane Johnson, before finally admitting it. The whole cloaking thing was a result of the Great Bird declaring that our heroes shouldn't "sneak around". Between the stolen Romulan cloak and the Klingon (or Romulan, depending on how far one wants to reach) Bird-of-Prey they hauled up from the bottom of the Golden Gate, Starfleet engineers had plenty to work with. It's still uncertain whether the Treaty of Algeron was the treaty that ended the Romulan War or some treaty signed (or amended) just before or just after the Tomed Incident, but that that treaty stipulated the Federation eschewing cloaking technology is not uncertain. In the AGT future, they were at war with the Romulans (or at least exchanging harsh words), so it makes sense that the treaty would no longer be a consideration. And depending on when this treaty -- or more specifically, this stipulation -- had effect, there might have been developments in Federation cloaking tech between ST IV and 2311. And some branches of tech fandom follow that idea. I don't know if I do or not, but it's certainly a fun area to play around in... And as for the GR rules of ship design, those are purely a result of the falling out between GR and Franz Joseph. The whole story there is available for perusal, but the end result was GR declaring that ships have even numbers of nacelles (invalidating the Hermes, Saladin, and Federation classes FJ created), nacelles should have at least 50% "crosstalk" space between them (invalidating the Ptolemy and Federation classes FJ created), the ramscoops should have at least 50% unobstructed forward view (invalidating the Hermes and Saladin classes FJ created)... you get the idea. These "rules" have been violated again since, so the current party line is that either the odd nacelle has two sets of coils inside (which I have a hard time swallowing), or that there are periodic experiments with odd numbers of nacelles when there is a significant enginery advance -- it works, it just doesn't work WELL... And lastly, I don't know WHERE that "warp 1 = .75c and all warp factors after that are between .75c and c" comes from, but that ain't what's onscreen by a long shot. Ignoring for the moment the "fact" that a ship is sublight within its own warp envelope and dealing with apparant speeds... From the very beginning, warp 1 was c. Whichever scale and system was involved, everything higher than warp 1.0 was FTL, and we have the travel times to prove it. In the current era, warp 10 is the number assigned to the theoretical, and unattainable (the excrecable "Threshold" aside), infinite maximum -- which by definition means you are occupying all points in the universe simultaneously. I'll stop there to give all parties a chance to respond... --Jonah [/QB][/QUOTE]
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