posted
Well, that brings Flameboard arguments to a whole new level. LAWYERS?
And, if we aren't careful, we will create another disaster there by not allowing aid agencies to feed the starving and homeless Afghans.
Excuse me? You're worried about an absurd hypothetical situation. I can't think of any circumstance, off the top of my head, where we wouldn't allow aid to Afganistan. Heck, we're dropping food ourselves! Those people are probably eating better now than they ever have.
Our goal should be more than the destruction of our enemies, it should be the relief of their victims.
It IS. Haven't you been paying attention?
Isn't 'compassionate conservative' an oxymoron?
I think you mean "redundancy".
-------------------- "This is why you people think I'm so unknowable. You don't listen!" - God, "God, the Devil and Bob"
posted
Uh, hardly. Compassionate liberal is a redundency, compassionate conservative makes about as much sense as "Join the KKK! We love African-Americans!"
As for the food aid in Afghanistan, I think T.E. is speaking for his hope that our aid there continues after the end of the conflict. Given that we're not dropping a whole lot of food to them now (given the size of the Afghani population), its not an unreasonable request.
posted
And how many millions of people are in Afghanistan Rob? Why not look at ratio of food packets to people (and remember that food *won't* last long) per day ...
... not cruise missiles to food packets (which really doesn't tell you anything).
But, hey, like you said, 'let's not let facts get in the way of good pontificating.'
posted
Go find out how many cruise missiles we've fired, and do the math yourself.
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
Someone got up on the wrong side of the bed.
The population of Afghanistan is about 26 million.
Now, Rob says we're dropping 10,000 food packets per cruise missile. Although cruise missiles are fairly cheap -- $600,000 -- we would have to be firing 2600 cruise missiles (at a cost of, for what I calculate it to be, $105,456,000,000,000 -- correct me if I'm wrong) $per day to make certain the population of Afghanistan got food. Somehow, I doubt that is happening.
Now, I've done my bit. Rob, you dig up somewhere that the U.S. has fired 2600 cruise missiles since the campaign in Afghanistan began (at the cost of $105 trillion per day), and I'll shut my mouth. Otherwise, shut yours.
You'll remember that what you got irritated at was that I said we weren't dropping a lot of food to them given the size of their population ... you then blathered on about the food packet/cruise missile ratio, and when I suggested it would be better to look at the population per-day/cruise missiles ... well, you were 'cross'
And now you've been beaten into the ground! Woo-hoo!
[ December 04, 2001: Message edited by: Malnurtured Snay ]
posted
So what, you want welfare for Afghanistan, now, too?
Why should we be feeding the ENTIRE population? They're not ALL refugees, and they weren't ALL starving before we showed up, most of them don't need our food. Your statistics are pure bunk. I mean, you're counting in the TALIBAN, for crap's sake!
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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Starring: Fat Tony: as the CIA First: as Pakistan Omega: as BinLaden Snay: as The WTC
Fat Tony doesn't like the climate in Baltimore. So he gives First $500 and tells him 'Make Baltimore a nicer place to live. First snickers, and gives Omega the $500, and Omega goes and acts according to what HE thinks would make Baltimore a better place, buys a gun, and becomes a vigilante. By happenstance, Omega runs into Snay, Fat Tony's acquaintance, on the street, dislikes him, and whacks him.
Is Fat Tony culpable in the whacking of Snay?
[ December 07, 2001: Message edited by: First of Two ]
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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First, you need to get a grip. Target Employee asked whether we were doing enough in Afghanistan. You said "Of course we are! We're dropping 10,000 food packs for every cruise missile!" I pointed out that wasn't a whole lot, and you got very snide.
Let's assume we only want to feed one million Afghans with the food drops, okay? We've still got to fire a hundred cruise missiles a day (assuming 10,000 food packs per cruise missile). That's $60 million in cruise missiles per day times the number of days we've been in Afghanistan. We've been there for what, a month and a half? Okay, so $60 million times lets say 45. That's $2,700,000,000.
You believe that? Wow. That's just to feed one million Afghans.
Rob, the original question wasn't "Why aren't we giving any aid to the poor Afghans?" If it was, your ranting would be logical and you'd win. The question was 'Are we doing enough?' You seem to think that because we're dropping 10,000 food packages per cruise missile, we are.
But given the population of Afghanistan, its like trying to feed a hundred cats with one can of cat food. The original question also expressed Target Employee's hope that when the Taliban is gone and Bin Laden is dead or captured, that we won't just get the hell out of Afghanistan and not look back. You ignored that part.
And so you believe that when the United States gave Pakistan cash to fight the Soviets, they didn't know what the money was being used for? Oh, please. Your moral quandry goes more like:
quote:Fat Tony doesn't like the climate in Baltimore. So he gives First $500 and tells him 'Make Baltimore a nicer place to live.' First snickers, and is aware Fat Tony doesn't like Snay and has expressed his wishes many time that Snay be killed, and gives Omega the $500, and Omega goes and acts according to what HE thinks Fat Tony thinks would make Baltimore a better place, buys a gun, and becomes a vigilante. By happenstance, Omega runs into Snay, Fat Tony's acquaintance whom he is aware Fat Tony wants dead, on the street, dislikes him, and is aware Fat Tony wants him dead and whacks him and Fat Tony tells him 'thank you very much'.
And if I've kicked your butt in this arguement where you've got to resort to not very cleverly expressing your wish I was dead ...
[ December 07, 2001: Message edited by: Malnurtured Snay ]
posted
1. We're doing more than we have to do, therefore we're doing enough. Food drops do not help us win the war. They may hinder us, if the food falls into the hands of the people we're fighting. The drops may make us look good to the international community (none of whom would take such a benign action), and it may make our touchy-feely left wing more amenable to carrying out the necessities of the war, but other than that it serves no useful purpose.
2. I agree that we should maintain a presence and rebuild Afghanistan. I have said so repeatedly. I only ignore other people saying that to me, because I've already covered it.
3. You're assuming that the 'food packs' only feed one person one meal. Is that true? I'd bet a subsistence-level person could stretch what Americans consider a 'meal' into at least a day.
4. Your attempted rebuttal of my analogy makes zero sense, since I cast you in the part of the World Trade Center, and I know damned sure the CIA (Fat Tony) didn't want the WTC destroyed. Talk about not reading stuff...
5. Don't flatter yourself. You're not important enough or enough of a factor in my life for me to want you dead. You're a silly, silly person at the other end of hundreds of miles of wire. There's only one person I've ever been angry at enough to WANT him dead (not including the people who abused Julie, who have been dead for some time). Fortunately, I was prevented from dispatching him when I wanted to, and I've since grown less angry at him.
[ December 07, 2001: Message edited by: First of Two ]
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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posted
Incidentally, I used the personal names I did because:
First (me) fits the model of a not-exactly-benign government = Pakistan.
Omega fits the model of a religious fanatic = Bin Laden (sorry, Omega)
and Snay fits the model of someone who I or 'Fat Tony' might not want eliminated, might even LIKE, but whom "Omega" might be maddened enough by to whack, hence the WTC. In fact, Fat Tony and Snay are intended to be on the same side.
Actually, Fat Tony should be mad at First for giving the money to Omega, (especially if he suspected that Omega couldn't be trusted) and incensed at Omega for offing his pal. First's only defense is 'hey, you never said NOT to give the money to Omega!'
Probably not enough guilt for Fat Tony to have First whacked as well as Omega, but enough to have his boys rough First up a little.
-------------------- "The best defense is not a good offense. The best defense is a terrifyingly accurate and devastatingly powerful offense, with multiply-overlapping kill zones and time-on-target artillery strikes." -- Laurence, Archangel of the Sword
Registered: Mar 1999
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quote:We're doing more than we have to do, therefore we're doing enough.
That's rather ... interesting logic.
quote:and it may make our touchy-feely left wing more amenable to carrying out the necessities of the war, but other than that it serves no useful purpose
Not to mention giving you and Bush and who knows who else the ability to say: "Look! We're feeding the Afghanis! Aren't we kind? Why are you asking if we're doing enough? Questioning authority now is treason. Fuck off."
quote:I only ignore other people saying that to me, because I've already covered it.
T.E. wasn't commenting to anyone in particular, he was simply stating his views.
quote:You're assuming that the 'food packs' only feed one person one meal. Is that true?
My math is based on one per person per day. Otherwise feeding 1 million Afghanis per day would jump to $180 million dollars.
quote:Your attempted rebuttal of my analogy makes zero sense, since I cast you in the part of the World Trade Center, and I know damned sure the CIA (Fat Tony) didn't want the WTC destroyed. Talk about not reading stuff...
Then your analogy makes no sense at all. Perhaps is Fat Tony (the U.S.) gave you (Pakistan) the money to fund an operation in Baltimore and you funded Omega (Mujhardeen), who later turned around and shot Fat Tony's Lieutenant (WTC).
quote:Don't flatter yourself.
And yet you just devoted a whole paragraph to me. Thanks
posted
You guys are missing one very important things...
Muslims don't eat a whole lot during the month of "Ranmandon" (spelling?)
-------------------- "George Washington said, 'I cannot tell a lie.' Richard Nixon said, 'I cannot tell the truth.' Bill Clinton said, 'I cannot tell the difference.'"
-- comedian TOM SMOTHERS, from his latest stage act with brother DICK SMOTHERS.
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