Flare Sci-fi Forums
Flare Sci-Fi Forums Post New Topic  Post A Reply
my profile | directory login | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Flare Sci-Fi Forums » Sci-Fi » General Sci-Fi » So...Matrix: Revolutions (Page 1)

  This topic comprises 7 pages: 1  2  3  4  5  6  7   
Author Topic: So...Matrix: Revolutions
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

 - posted      Profile for Jason Abbadon     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I just saw it and am still thinking on it.
I was'nt blon away like I was in the second movie...a lot of things I thought would get resolved, dont.
... and some things I was hoping for didint happen.

Still....as the end of the trilogy, it's very well done, although it raises quite a few questions all of it's own.

Despite reviews (that I've waited untill now to read), I found the acting on Reeves' part to be very well done (and fitting his character).


**********And now for the SPOILERS*********


I was suprised that Morpheous and the good sheep in Zion dont get an explanation of what Neo did to save them all.

I was equally suprised that the issue of thousands (if not millions) of humans were still used as batteries by the machines at the end.

And no resoultion of the whole "eternal cloud of darkness" over the world thing.
So at the end I'm left with some big questions:
1.) Are all the humans used as batteries connected to the Matrix?
If so, were they all turned into Agent Smiths untill Neo does his thing?
2.) assuming all human batteries are in the matrix, does that mean they die in parts I-II when killed by trinity and co?
If they're all humans, how did the Upgrade Agents take over them in the chase scene in Reloaded?
3.) What was up with the Council? From the Councilor's talk with Neo, I expected some majo revelation about them and the human/ machine relationship.

Your thoughts?

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Da_bang80
A few sectors short of an Empire
Member # 528

 - posted      Profile for Da_bang80     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
It blew my mind. I like the soundtrack. The APU's were cool. I don't wanna spoil it in any way, so I'll say that it rocked.

It does raise a few questions, seems to have been left open for another movie.

--------------------
Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
The courage to change the things I cannot accept.
And the wisdom to hide the bodies of all the people I had to kill today because they pissed me off.

Remember when your parents told you it's dangerous to play in traffic?

Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

 - posted      Profile for Jason Abbadon     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The kid saved the whole day: him and that seargent in the mech.
Probably the best part (and acting) of the movie for me.

I agree that the soundtrack is by far the best of the trilogy (excepting the Crystal Method theme from part I).

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Austin Powers
Slightly warped
Member # 250

 - posted      Profile for Austin Powers     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I haven't seen it yet as all shows are sold out for weeks at our local multiplex.

But I can wait, as I didn't enjoy Reloaded. I just hope Revolutions doesn't suck too much.
My tactic: go in with low expectations. That way you are less likely to be disappointed.

--------------------
Lister: Don't give me the "Star Trek" crap! It's too early in the morning.
- Red Dwarf "The Last Day"

Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
aneurysm
Member
Member # 906

 - posted      Profile for aneurysm     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
As for some of the questions you raise this is he impression I got from the film...

The architect said that people will be released right at the end in his conversation with the oracle. I assume it wouldnt be too hard for the machines to create towers with solar power facilities on them, after all, if the logos can go high enough to go above the burned skies I'm sure the machines would find a way.

Cojo, I'm not sure what you mean with 2), your babbling a bit there.

The sargeant in the APU was called Mifune and got a laugh out of him calling the kid a "pod born pencil neck".

I thought Neo was reduced in role in this film. in the second film it was all about him. In this film he seemed nothing more than a cast character.

How empty was Trinity's death? Ship died when she crashed the ship and not when she was making a big sacrifice or anything. Waste.

I personally thought the soundtrack in this film was well below reloaded and even the first film was better. revolutions was, well, unispiring in the least, and I'm trying to be generous.

And I really cannot see there NOT being a fourth film to tie up some endings, or at least possibly another Animatrix style project.

Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
The Mighty Monkey of Mim
SUPPOSED TO HAVE ICE POWERS!!
Member # 646

 - posted      Profile for The Mighty Monkey of Mim     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hated it. HATED.

Bad drama, bad writing. Not nearly all of the questions deliberately brought about by the second film were answered or even touched upon in the third. Like poster above said, Trinity's death had no dramatic significance attached to it. The ending was pretty much a cop-out IMO. All action and no explanation. Yuck.

-MMoM [Big Grin]

Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

 - posted      Profile for Jason Abbadon     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by aneurysm:


Cojo, I'm not sure what you mean with 2), your babbling a bit there.


I mean this: Are all the human "batteries" active participants in the Matrix?
Are all the security guards that get killed by Trinity and Neo when they rescue Morpheus in the first film killed in the real world?
Or are they like Agents (constructs created by the Matrix as a kind of immune system)?

I caught the architect's line about "all those that wish to leave" being allowed, but that would imply they are going to blow the Matrix's cover and reveal that the world the batteries know is false.
I see a LOT of blue pills being taken if the Matrix looks as idyllic as at Revolutions' end compared with the grime and hardship of rebuilding Zion.

If machines could have developed alternate power sources why keep humans around at all?
It makes more sense that the machines are using the humans as processors than that the machines need humans as a bio-electric power source.
I mean, there are still oceans: they could have created hydroelectric or nuclear power sourses. [Wink]

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Paladin181
Member
Member # 833

 - posted      Profile for Paladin181     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The Matrix Online, the next matrix game coming out, deals with life after Revolutions in the matrix. Players get to decide which side they'll fight for, Zionists or Machines. So the matrix remains active, only it seems people become aware of its falacy. ((I found this out before the film released when the games developer leaked it, so it kind of spoiled the ending for me))

I'm not sure how I feel about the movie, better then 2 not as good as 1, yet better than 1. CAPTAIN Milfune ((I believed named after Tishiro Milfune, the Japanese actor from Seven Samurai ect..) and the APU's made the film. Yet so much seems like goobly-gook and more obscure sureal whatnot.

The part that bothers me the most is the Trainstation and the aptly named Trainman; can you say useless??

Registered: May 2002  |  IP: Logged
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

 - posted      Profile for Jason Abbadon     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Paladin181:
The Matrix Online, the next matrix game coming out, deals with life after Revolutions in the matrix. Players get to decide which side they'll fight for, Zionists or Machines.

So the Machines think it's all a Zionist consparicy?

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Dax
Paradox
Member # 191

 - posted      Profile for Dax     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Saw Revolutions today and wasn't all that impressed. Reloaded was already a bit disappointing but Revolutions did even less for me. I can't help but wish they would've just left it with the original. The first movie stood alone quite well and all the sequals have done is weaken it.

--------------------
"I exist here."
- Sisko in "Emissary"
Dax's Ships of Star Trek

Registered: Jul 1999  |  IP: Logged
Bond, James Bond
Member
Member # 1127

 - posted      Profile for Bond, James Bond     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jason Abbadon:

I was equally suprised that the issue of thousands (if not millions) of humans were still used as batteries by the machines at the end.
__________________________________________________

Sorry if this has already been answered but, at the end the Architect and the Oracle act almost as if they have just ended a long chess match and since she won she sets the terms.

She said all humans who choose to leave can. No mention is made of how they are informed of this. Do they just sit there until contacted by people from Zion? Are they going to blow the Matrix cover story? If so, why bother with the simulation?

Zion seems unable to sustain large quantities of refugees given it's limited space and survival on the surface is impossible so I don't see how they could free more then a few people at a time until something can be done about the atmosphere. But then you've got the same pesky machine problem.

Plus, a lot of people probably would choose to remain in the Matrix instead of face the harsh reality.
__________________________________________________

So at the end I'm left with some big questions:
1.) Are all the humans used as batteries connected to the Matrix?
If so, were they all turned into Agent Smiths untill Neo does his thing?
__________________________________________________

Yes and yes. Remember the scene of all the Smith's detonating in streams of light as it spread out throughout the city? And the weird behavior of the scrolling code displaying the Matrix? Smith took over everyone in the Matrix.
__________________________________________________

2.) assuming all human batteries are in the matrix, does that mean they die in parts I-II when killed by trinity and co?
__________________________________________________

At first I thought they did, which kind of ticked me off at Morpheus and company for their calous treatment of innocent civilians (at the end of Reloaded Neo kills about 10,000 people in the cars he flung in the air in his wake). I based this on Morpheus's statement that if you die in the Matrix, you die in the real world because the mind just shuts down. But I bet that only applies to people outside the machine's control.

The Machines have total medical functional control the bodies of the people still under their control, so I don't see why it wouldn't be possible just to restart them in a new "avatar" inside the Matrix. They get a new life, hence the bright light when you die, and whalla, reincarnation.
__________________________________________________

If they're all humans, how did the Upgrade Agents take over them in the chase scene in Reloaded?
__________________________________________________

They're just avatars, digital recreations of the people in the pods, so an Agent could just hack into them like their software.
__________________________________________________

3.) What was up with the Council? From the Councilor's talk with Neo, I expected some majo revelation about them and the human/ machine relationship.
__________________________________________________

That really disappointed me. I was expecting some sort of revelation discovered by Neo that the humans actually couldn't destroy the machines because they needed them to survive and so they would have to form a more equal symbiotic relationship. But no dice.

Many of the big questions posed at the end of Reloaded just went unanswered or were given unsatisfactory answers.

Why could Neo stop the Sentinels outside the Matrix? I'm expecting the answer to be something profound like Zion and the "real world" is all just another layer in the Matrix. What do we get? A half-assed explanation that the One's powers extend into both the real world and the Matrix. What the Hell? So, magic is possible? Why not just make it frickin' Lord of the Rings then? Neo the Grey uses his powers of sorcery. Weak.

And when exactly did the Merovingian have a chance to catch Neo in between the real world and the Matrix? Yet Morpheus and Trinity got out fine, even though they were all togather. Lame. Half-assed again.

Trainman, the Train Station to nowhere, the chics playing "Tune in Tokyo", and the showdown with the Merovingian and his legion of S&M henchman (I kept wanting to say "Bring out the Gimp) were contrived and pointless to the overall story. And Persephone's role is reduced to one line and monstrous cleavage (not that I'm complaining).

Trinity's death was unnescessary and completely pointless. She's the Tasha Yar of the Matrix.

The fight between Neo and Smith was dumb and lasted way too long. They barely even did any of the cool martial arts we have come to expect. They basically just punched eachother in the air, in water, in buildings, underground.

The one, and I mean the one, redeeming factor was the battle for Zion.

Niobe is a friggin' badass, and I usually can't stand Jada Pinkett Smith (she gets a tad hyper and annoying around her husband). The piloting of the Hammer was one of my favorite parts even though it was very reminiscent of "Final Flight of the Osiris".

The guy who played Bane had Smith's mannerisms and inflections down to a science. Good job on his part. I wonder why Neo didn't use any of his nifty real world powers to fight him though? Plus, he actually learned martial arts in his mind, he has the memory of it, why didn't he use it to fight Bane? He's like the Karate Kid, he forgets all the skills in every movie and Mr. Miagi has to teach him new stuff each time.

Captain Mifune is a friggin' badass. The APU Corps was awesome.

They even gave Annoying Kid and Link's wife major roles in the battle.

Locke wasn't killed which makes us aggravated, very aggravated. [Wink]

I'll be kind and give the movie a "B" because I'm in a good mood and I'm grading on a curve with Matrix and Reloaded which were both far superior. As a trilogy it's great, as a stand alone movie, Revolutions was really disappointing.

--------------------
"You must talk to him; tell him that he is a good cat, and a pretty cat, and..." -- Data
"I will feed him" -- Worf (Phantasms)

Registered: Sep 2003  |  IP: Logged
Jason Abbadon
Rolls with the punches.
Member # 882

 - posted      Profile for Jason Abbadon     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I liked when Captain Mifune called the kid a "Pod Puke".

...looks like most of Zion's inhabitnts are NOT taken from the Matrix: that's the only reason there is not more sel-outs like (cant recall the actor's name!) from the first film.

Gotta say, the fight scenesin Reloaded were FAR superior.
Only the EXTREMELY brief scrap at "Merv"'s tablr was truly spectacular.

BTW, as per the other thread: The Black Cat is still my favorite character!


...and what the FUCK was with Oracle's little "I think we might see him again" line o' bullshit at the end?
I'd have paid real cash if the little girl would have just told her "Shuuut up."

--------------------
Justice inclines her scales so that wisdom comes at the price of suffering.
-Aeschylus, Agamemnon

Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Paladin181
Member
Member # 833

 - posted      Profile for Paladin181     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I think the oracle said that because the systemic anomely inherhent to the Matrix is still congruent with the modus operandi of the matrix, eirgo the 99% wilingness of the human conscience will be willing to accept the matrix on some subconscience level, but that 1% anomely is present in the code visa vie... therefore... in congruence with... I want a cookie...

I still believe that everyone in the matrix (save the programs) are humans. Neo's chaotic flight through town was a act of rage/passion so he probably cared little about who and what was hurt on the way to save Trinity. And all the other killings are done to save humanity, the old lesser of two evils mentality takes over. But I agree with Bond that the machines have controll over the humans and use them more like rechargable batteries than your average Duracel.

I'm not sure how the Matrix Online explains the release of peoples minds, I just knew the matrix would survive. Now I think the humans and machines have to enter an awkward peace since the humans want to be free and free others and the machines want batteries. So I would see a more symbiotic relationship now that one needs the other more. Of course this would have been nice to know if they had explained it in the movie... AND THUS CANON WOULD BE BORN!!! Oh well.

Registered: May 2002  |  IP: Logged
The_Tom
recently silent
Member # 38

 - posted      Profile for The_Tom     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Just got in. That movie was utter shite.

--------------------
"I was surprised by the matter-of-factness of Kafka's narration, and the subtle humor present as a result." (Sizer 2005)

Registered: Mar 1999  |  IP: Logged
ubermetroid
Member
Member # 729

 - posted      Profile for ubermetroid     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Not as good as the last 2, but still pretty good. Where were the Twins? And it also seamed like all the points maind in #2 were pointless, they had no effect on the #3. In fact Neo never told anybody that they live in Zion #6 did he? They all still believe that the war is just over 100 years old...

--------------------
"That's the problem with nature. Something is always stinging you or oozing mucous on you. lets go watch tv." - Calvin & Hobbes

Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
  This topic comprises 7 pages: 1  2  3  4  5  6  7   

Quick Reply
Message:

HTML is enabled.
UBB Code™ is enabled.

Instant Graemlins
   


Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


© 1999-2008 Solareclipse Network.

Powered by UBB.classic™ 6.7.3