Flare Sci-Fi Forums: The chain of command

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Posted by Xanthi on :

Ok I'm Australian so I may be a little behind here since the last Voyager episode we've seen is 'imperfections', so forgive me if what I say is out dated.

Do you ever wonder why Harry Kim is still an ensign?(at least he still is at the point which we're up to). I mean the guy has died for the ship, been eaten inside out, been imprisoned, and nearly been killed hundreds more times. Yet he is still only an ensign. What does he have to do to make Lieutenant!

Janeway was very quick to demote Paris for screwing up, it's a shame she doesn't do the job so well in reverse.

If anyone deserves a promotion Harry does

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Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :

But.. "Star Trek *needs* and ensign, else it wouldn't be Star Trek". At least that seems to be the opinion of the producers. Apparently the Star Trek formula requires the titular junior officer, who would go through the coming of age stuff, the inexperienced stuff, and the stuff that happens only to the young guys. Look at Star Trek history. Who gets the most pain inflicted on them? The most limbs blown off? The most botched love affairs? Lots of wierd anomalies thrown at them? That's right - the ensigns. Checkov, Wesley, Ro, Nog, Kim.

With Kim specifically, they apparently *need* an Ensign to beat up on, and it's him. Kim gets to tell everyone and his parents that there are "limited command positions" on the ship. But Paris gets semoted, and then RE-promoted for good behaviour. Tuvok gets promoted. And in both those cases, it measn absolutely NO change in their responsibilities aboard ship. Who's left in the lurch? Kim.

Mark

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"Why build one, when you can have two at twice the price?"

- Carl Sagan, "Contact"

Posted by Omega (Member # 91) on :

Don't forget O'Brian. He wasn't even an officer, and we all know how much the writers loved torturing him.

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"How do you define fool?"
"I don't attempt it. I wait for demonstrations. They inevitably surpass my imagination."
- CJ Cherryh, Invader

Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :

It's what I & my former roommates called the "Chekov Syndrome." Every series needs a screamer who basically gets physically &/or emotionally raped every third week. For TOS, it was Chekhov. For TNG, it was Geordi. For DS9, it was O'Brien, & for VGR, it's Harry.

For Series 5, my bet's either on this "Mayweather" dude or the hot Japanese chick.

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"I�ll never fall in the arms of someone sincere
I fall just the same
And like before, it's just too hard."
---Kim Leaman, "Sincere"

Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :

It was explained in one episode this season. Kim says that he understands Janeway needs to maintain a command structure aboard the ship. In other words, she can't continue to promote everyone who deserves it because there's no where for them to go. She'd have a ship full of Lt.s and Lt. Commanders afore long.

Kim stated that, if they were home, he might have made Lt. Commander by now. Wishful thinking if you ask me, but that's what he thought.

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"The sons of the Prophet were valiant and bold,
And quite unacustomed to fear.
But, of all, the most reckless, or so I am told,
Was Abdulah Boul Boul Ameer."
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Posted by TheF0rce (Member # 533) on :

the discrimiante
end of story LOL

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Aban, actually, I don't think it's that unrealistic, especially during a war of the magnitude of the Dominion War. Granted, he'd only make the rank if he survived, but ...

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Average Rated 8.32 out of 10 Smileys by Fabrux (with seven eps posted)
***
"Oh, yes, screw logic, let's go for a theory with no evidence!"
-Omega 11:48am, Jan. 19th, 2001
***
Card-Carrying Member of the Flare APAO
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"I think this reason why girls don't do well on multiple choice tests goes all the way back to the Bible, all the way back to Genesis, Adam and Eve. God said, 'All right, Eve, multiple choice or multiple orgasms, what's it going to be?' We all know what was chosen" - Rush Limbaugh, Feb. 23, 1994.

Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :

That's true, Jeff. When a lot of people get killed, alot of people get promoted.

They crew knows about the Dommie War by that point, so Kim may have been referring to his possiblities due to the war.

I was just thinking about how Data said he spent 8 years in the Lt. ranks. But, that was during peace time.

Posted by Ritten (Member # 417) on :

And Data may have been doing other things than trying to get promoted.... He's multi-tasking, but for a thing that can last forever there wouldn't seem to be a rush, plus he may have been overlooked, being and android and all....

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Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Yes, somehow, I don't see Data "pushing" himself as hard as a human cadet who knows they'll be retiring in forty years or so. Considering Data spent 10 years as a Lt. Commander prior to TNG ("DataLore"), he's been that rank for almost a human's entire career!

Actually, if I ever get around to picking up on Gamma Quadrant, Year Two will feature a new character from a race who lives almost one thousand years. They're very laid-back to human standards, and this character will be rather young for his people -- 300 or so years, with half of that in Starfleet: and he's only a lieutenant. The reason being is that he's in no rush: he'll be happy if he makes it to lieutenant commander by the end of the 25th Century, and is in no hurry to get promoted.

[This message has been edited by JeffKardde (edited May 09, 2001).]

Posted by David Templar (Member # 580) on :

For TOS, it was Chekhov. For TNG, it was Geordi. For DS9, it was O'Brien, & for VGR, it's Harry.
---
A (suppose to be) Russian, a African-American, an Irish, a Korean. My gosh, Trek is being totally racist! ^_^''' At least those red shirts just die and stay dead, these guys have to take these treatment seasons after seaons!

My friend Chekhov over there will have another brutal beating by a large looking alien, a good ol' mind violation for my black friend there, another prison term for the good Chief, and a double AAAAHHHHHH-it-is-eating-me-from-the-inside for the young Mr. Kim.

On a positive note, Chekhov does get to do some torturing in B5 as Bester. ^_^

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"God's in his heaven. All's right with the world."

Posted by Teelie (Member # 280) on :

As you can see, Trek is indeed going around and indiscrimanately choosing it's victim's one by one.

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�

Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :

Hmm... Paris took things almost as bad as Kim, actually. There was a website documenting all the times he's been made bleed on the show, wish I could find it now. And there was the small matter of the Salamander, no?

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"And as it is, it is cheaper than drinking."
-DT on arguing with Omega, April 30

Posted by Deanna Troi on :

I am new to the board and a new-ish trekker, and this cracked me up because it has bugged me for awhile watching Kim not really grow as a character. He ends up looking inferior by the simple fact that he is about 35 years old and never moves up season after season, they drag his ass through ep after ep, just getting dumped on.

This is a great board, I'm enjoying the read.

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Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

More like 28 years old, methinkith.

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant
Average Rated 8.32 out of 10 Smileys by Fabrux (with seven eps posted)
***
"Oh, yes, screw logic, let's go for a theory with no evidence!"
-Omega 11:48am, Jan. 19th, 2001
***
Card-Carrying Member of the Flare APAO
***
"I think this reason why girls don't do well on multiple choice tests goes all the way back to the Bible, all the way back to Genesis, Adam and Eve. God said, 'All right, Eve, multiple choice or multiple orgasms, what's it going to be?' We all know what was chosen" - Rush Limbaugh, Feb. 23, 1994.

Posted by Deanna Troi on :

Hmm...I guess I should look it up. I was told the actor was 38, but I don't know about the character.

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Posted by The_Tom (Member # 38) on :

Kim is 28 or 29. Wang turns 33 in December.

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"And as it is, it is cheaper than drinking."
-DT on arguing with Omega, April 30

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

Deanna, a welcome to the forums from Nimrod.

I hope you are a girl, cus why would a guy want to be named after a female counselor?

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Don't kill me, I'm charming!

Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :

Maybe he's confused. But he need fear not, if he's American - I gather they now have camps where they can torture such feelings out of you. Ahh, the land of the free. . . 8)

[This message has been edited by Vogon Poet (edited May 14, 2001).]

Posted by Deanna Troi on :

LOL-yeah, I'm a girl. Thanks for the welcome Nimrod.

Are there other women here on the board?

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Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :

Loads. You got Jubes - Jubilee McGann - when she's around that is. . . Tora Ziyal, MsChris, MaGiC. . . okay, four. Liam's a big girl's blouse though, does that count? 8)

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Phasers

Posted by Shik (Member # 343) on :

You forgot Liz-chan...

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"Boinky ensued, and a great time was had by all." --Book of Nigel, Chapter 4, verse 32

Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :

Oh yeah. Her.

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Phasers

Posted by Xanthi on :

I'm a female also

Welcome Deanna

Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :

Big wow. Seven women.

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Phasers

Posted by Deanna Troi on :

Thanks Xanthi, good to meet you:-)

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How come they picked you to be an astronaut? You got such a great sense of direction? --J. Mason

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

LOA, Ziyal, Jubilee, MsChris, An'on, MaGiC, Deanna, Xanthi... Yeah, eight... That's gotta be some kind of new record... *L*

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Lister: "Drop dead, Rimmer."
Rimmer: "Already have done."
Lister: "Encore."
-Red Dwarf, "Kryten"

Posted by David Templar (Member # 580) on :

Though this thread did not break the record for shortest time it took to go off topic, the way it did it is notable.

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"God's in his heaven. All's right with the world."

Posted by Teelie (Member # 280) on :

8 women? Just 8 women? In the 3 or so years this place has been around? Obviously you don't visit Flare to pick up women.

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�

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

Yes, but wheras the TrekBBS has lots of women, we at Flare prefer the quality of our women to quantity :P

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

TLE: There are others who have come and gone... Illyria, Dani (who could probably still reappear at any moment)... um... I'm sure there are others...

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Lister: "Drop dead, Rimmer."
Rimmer: "Already have done."
Lister: "Encore."
-Red Dwarf, "Kryten"