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Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :

I just recieved the latest issues of star trek fact files yesterday. To my big surprise, there is a chart with standard ship-silouettes showing which starship-classes participated in the task force liberating DS9.
It states, apart from the standard ship-classes, that these classes were present: Ambassador, Miranda-class variants, Constitution-refit.
Now, I realize that this could be either an error on part of the magazine, or that the ships in question could be way back.
My question is this, has anybody seen this onscreen?

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"The Starships of the Federation are the physical, tangible manifestations of Humanity�s stubborn insistence that life does indeed mean something."
Spock to Leonard McCoy in "Final Frontier"

Posted by Alpha Centauri (Member # 338) on :

If I recall it correctly, I did see some Mirandas. But Ambassadors? Constitution-refits? Nope.

CONSTITUTION REFITS????!!!!

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Signature.

Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :

We wish...

There was also an erroneous diagram seen in "Favor the Bold" (and reprinted in the DS9 Tech Manual) that depicts Nebula and Norway class ships being part of the force that retook the station. However, we know that these CGI models were not used i nthe fight scenes. I believe that the Fact Files are making assumptions yet again.

Not that it's a BAD assumption or anything... If they had usable Connies in orbit around Qualor II or something, I'm sure they'd drag 'em into service.

Mark

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"Why build one, when you can build two at twice the price?"

- Carl Sagan, "Contact"

Posted by Michael Dracon (Member # 4) on :

SOME Miranda's???

The ship variants seen in the DS9 Tech manual are all supposed to be in the episode 'Time to Stand'. At least two were found, the others are most probably in the back of the 'fleet' seen in the very first scene of the episode.

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"That's your plan? Wile E. Coyote would come up with a better plan than that!"
- Crighton, Farscape.

Posted by Michael Dracon (Member # 4) on :

And there were no Ambassador class ships at all visible in the war.

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"That's your plan? Wile E. Coyote would come up with a better plan than that!"
- Crighton, Farscape.

Posted by Fabrux (Member # 71) on :

Just because we didn't see them doesn't mean they weren't there...

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Chickety china, the chinese chicken, you have?

Posted by Alpha Centauri (Member # 338) on :

Yeah... this wish was expressed several times before now, but I can't resist saying it: it would be good to see an Ambassador again. *sigh*

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Signature.

Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :

Mark: IIRC, there weren't any Norways in the battle scenes, but there were one or two Nebula CGI's.

I have an Okudagram I found somewhere which basically shows the same chart as in the episode and in the tech manual, but with one small exception: The last ship looks to be yet another Intrepid variant. It has the same saucer and secondary hull as an Intrepid, but directly underneath the engineering hull is what appears to be an upside-down Constitution nacelle. It's kinda small, and I can't prove if it's an authentic O-gram. It looks pretty authentic, though.

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Star Trek: Legacy

Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :

Yeah, I know there *are* nebbies around. But In "Favor the Bold" (the one that graphic was ment for)and "Sacrifice of Angels", there weren't. A Nebula didn't show up until the USS Honshu in "Waltz", and then not again until the final few episodes.

Ooh, do you have this graphic online? Might we be able to see it? There's an Intrepid variant in the DS9 manual that has an Intrepid spoon section mated to a Connie secondary hull, with Miranda nacelles attached to them by oversized Danube engine housings. Is that the one?

Mark

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"Why build one, when you can build two at twice the price?"

- Carl Sagan, "Contact"

Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :

I have also seen this graphic and no, it isn't the proto-intrepid (which I like to think is the bradbury-class) seen in the DS9 tech manual. Thie one is literally just a side view of the intrepid with what looks like a small pod directly attached to the underside of the secondary hull. It is similar to strapon modules featured on the New Orleans-class.

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We attack tommorow, under cover of daylight!

Posted by Bjoern R on :

First of all, hi to everyone!

To Mark: Yes, it is true that there was no Nebula in "Favor the Bold" and no one in the battle sequences in "Sacrifice of Angels" but iirc, there was one Nebula docked to DS9 to the very end of SoA after DS9 was recaptured.

Bj�rn

Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :

Tou-shay, sir, and welcome!

Not in the battle scenes of "Angels", then. But yes, they were there.

Mark

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"Why build one, when you can build two at twice the price?"

- Carl Sagan, "Contact"

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

And a big, beautiful one in that horrible baseball-ep!

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Here lies a toppled god,
His fall was not a small one.
We did but build his pedestal,
A narrow and a tall one.

-Tleilaxu Epigram

Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :

...Which is a re-use of the Prometheus footage from "Second Sight".

Mark

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"Why build one, when you can build two at twice the price?"

- Carl Sagan, "Contact"

Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :

I'd be happy to post the chart, if someone could please give me the link to the Flare upload page. I seem to have forgotten the address.

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Star Trek: Legacy

Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :

http://flareupload.hypermart.net/psupload.htm

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"Second star to the right, and then straight on till morning."

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

What's the size limit for those two fileslots?

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Here lies a toppled god,
His fall was not a small one.
We did but build his pedestal,
A narrow and a tall one.

-Tleilaxu Epigram

Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :

What do you mean?

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"Second star to the right, and then straight on till morning."

Posted by Harry (Member # 265) on :

I'm not sure what the max. size is, but my guess is that it can handle enough for any picture. Just try.
If it doesn't work, mail it to me, and I'll dump it on my server. (E-mail adress is in profile)

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To know a thing well, know its limits. Only when pushed beyond its tolerances will true nature be seen.
The Amtal Rule (Dune)
---
Titan Fleet Yards - Harry Doddema's Star Trek Site

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

Thanks, that's nice. I just wondered, in case I see the need to post one later...

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Here lies a toppled god,
His fall was not a small one.
We did but build his pedestal,
A narrow and a tall one.

-Tleilaxu Epigram

Posted by Gaseous Anomaly (Member # 114) on :

Does that...thing...Fitz posted work with any image?
(rubs hands with eager expectation)

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"Sack me!? I MADE the BBC!!"

Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :

Yes, upload of every file-type is possible.

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"Second star to the right, and then straight on till morning."

Posted by Gaseous Anomaly (Member # 114) on :

o_0

Just posted something silly. Always makes me laugh, anyway!

http://flareupload.hypermart.net/files/

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"Sack me!? I MADE the BBC!!"

[This message has been edited by Gaseous Anomaly (edited January 30, 2001).]

Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :

Here ya go:

As you can see, the last ship is a standard Intrepid saucer/engineering hull, but instead of Intrepid nacelles, what looks to be a smaller, upside-down version of a Connie nacelle is stuck to the bottom of the ship.
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Star Trek: Legacy

[This message has been edited by Dukhat (edited January 31, 2001).]

Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :

And that Akira is missing its pod...

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My new year's resolution is the same as last year's: 1024x768.

Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :

So, where did this okudagram come from?

Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :

Unfortunately, I don't remember where I found it.

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Star Trek: Legacy

Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :

Man, those Commbadge-class ships look BIG. . . 8)

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"Businesses used to be like Christianity; if you were faithful and obedient, you could obtain bliss in the afterlife of retirement. Now it's more of a reincarnation model. If the worker learns enough in his current job, he can progress to a higher level of employment elsewhere."

- Dogbert

Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :

That image looks like it's from the DS9TM, but for some reason, I don't remember seeing that last ship there. I would have thought I would have seen it!

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Me: "Why don't you live in Hong Kong?"
Rachel Roberts: "Hong Kong? Nah. Oh, but we can live in China! Yeah, China has great Chinese food!"

(discussion with fellow classmate, 9/5/00)

Mustang Class Starship Development Project

Posted by Spike (Member # 322) on :

Yes, there's a similar okudagram in the DS9 TM, but there's an Saber instead of this Intrepid variant.

Could be a fake IMO.

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"Second star to the right, and then straight on till morning."

Posted by Malnurtured Snay (Member # 411) on :

UIRW, it's from DS9's TM.

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Star Trek Gamma Quadrant
Average Rated 6.83 out of 10 Smileys by Fabrux
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Posted by Toadkiller (Member # 425) on :

Not only is the Commbadge class the largest in the starflot they also have quadroquantum torpedo phasers.

They are:
1124343 long
3345 wide
and go warp 9.99999999999999999994

T"ds"K
I think I'll lie down now, just until the feeling passes....

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TK

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

Oh no, don't encourage Ultra!!! IT WILL NEVER EEEEND!!!

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Here lies a toppled god,
His fall was not a small one.
We did but build his pedestal,
A narrow and a tall one.

-Tleilaxu Epigram

Posted by Ritten (Member # 417) on :

No, they are...
1124393 long
3340 wide
and go warp 9.9999999999999999999999998

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"One's ethics are determined by what we do when no one is looking" Nugget
Star Trek: Gamma Quadrant
Star Trek: Legacy
Read them, rate them, got money, film them

"...and I remain on the far side of crazy, I remain the mortal enemy of man, no hundred dollar cure will save me..." WoV

[This message has been edited by Ritten (edited February 01, 2001).]

Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :

Well, speaking of constitution-refits, how about this pic from Pedro�s: http://www.shiporama.org/images/fleet/fleet1.jpg

That "whiter" ship in the upper left, what is that?

Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :

I'd say a Steamrunner. The primary hull is a spade instead of a saucer, and the secondary hull seems to be as far aft as it can go. In a Connie, it would be farther forward, so close to the primary hull that you couldn't see a gap between the hulls even if the neck part was painted pitch black.

It could be a kitbash, too, considering it's so far away that the VFXers need not have bothered with making it look good.

Timo Saloniemi

Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :

I assume you don't mean the really upper-left obvious Excelsior, but the white ship below and to the right of it? Akira or Steamrunner.

- Dogbert

Posted by Michael Dracon (Member # 4) on :

It's a Steamrunner class.

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"That's your plan? Wile E. Coyote would come up with a better plan than that!"
- Crighton, Farscape.

Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :

D'you know what else you notice in that pic? GALAXY WINGS! Yes! You see a Galaxy-class starship, with two Excelsiors, two Mirandas, and at least a couple other ships forming up around each of them. Best of all, it's in a 'wing' like formation! Galaxy WING!

Mark

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"Why build one, when you can build two at twice the price?"

- Carl Sagan, "Contact"

Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :

I just thought of something. Everyone remembers the line "Galaxy wings 9 and 12" (I forget the exact numbers), that Sisko said in "Sacrafice of Angels". Well, what if he meant the USS GALAXY? The Galaxy would serve as mothership, and have multiple "wings" under her, which would be comprised of multiple types of starships. Sort of like how aircraft carrier "fleets" are called by the name of the aircraft carrier, and then they have multiple subordinate ships under them.

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"No, 3 & 6 are mandatory, so you can do them if you want"

Alex, fellow classmate, trying to explain an assignment (2/2/01)

Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :

Does it matter if it's THE Galaxy or just A Galaxy?

Anyway, I think this image or one quite like it was in "Favor The Bold," and was probably reproduced in the tech manual.

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I will shout until they know what I mean.
--
Neutral Milk Hotel
****
Read three (three!) chapters of "Dirk Tungsten in...The Disappearing Planet"! Then, go insane!

Posted by The359 (Member # 37) on :

The difference is most people believe that Galaxy Wings 9 and 12 or whatever means that there were 12 Galaxies in the battle. If they meant USS Galaxy, then it's less then that.

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"No, 3 & 6 are mandatory, so you can do them if you want"

Alex, fellow classmate, trying to explain an assignment (2/2/01)

Posted by Ritten (Member # 417) on :

I figured that it was Galaxy Class lead wings.

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"One's ethics are determined by what we do when no one is looking" Nugget
Star Trek: Gamma Quadrant
Star Trek: Legacy
Read them, rate them, got money, film them

"...and I remain on the far side of crazy, I remain the mortal enemy of man, no hundred dollar cure will save me..." WoV

Posted by Michael Dracon (Member # 4) on :

Uhm, I remember it to be "Have Galaxy wings 9-1 and 9-3 engage those destroyers!".

I will check tomorrow, when I have the time...

I'll also check which fleets were there. With the 9-1 and 9-3 numbers you'd may expect it to be part of the 9th fleet, if the numbers are correct that is...

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"That's your plan? Wile E. Coyote would come up with a better plan than that!"
- Crighton, Farscape.

Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :

Actual dialogue:

Sisko: "Ensign, have Galaxy Wings nine-one and nine-three engage those destroyers. All other ships..."

Anyone ever wonder that it was wierd that Sisko seemed to command huge fleets from the MIDDLE OF BATTLE in the tiny little Defiant? Believe it or not, the explanation ties into the Galaxy wing thing.

My belief is that the fleet of 600 was divided into several large attack forces, and Sisko commanded one from the Defiant. If Sisko commanded, say, the ninth attack force, he may have had three "Galaxy wings" in his charge. At the beginning of the battle, he ordered two of his big-guns ships and their entourages to engage the Cardassians, while the rest of his forces made for the opening. The rest of the fleet would have been under the command of some Admiral or other Captain(s) and engaged the Dominion fleet while Sisko's group made the big push.

Sisko commanded only his group in the battle-proper, thus rationalizing why he was flying and fighting at the same time. Ditto would go for the other times he's engaged in fleet-level battles. Only in the last episode did this theory ring true, when it seemed that Admiral Ross had command of the Federation fleet.

Mark

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"Why build one, when you can build two at twice the price?"

- Carl Sagan, "Contact"

Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :

Sisko could also have been tasked with command of wings of fighters. Perhaps several wings (each comprising perhaps half a dozen fighters) were embarked on USS Galaxy, or aboard Galaxy class ships in general, and once these were deployed, Sisko was in command of them.
He could also humbly call for some starships to perform some maneuvers for him. And since he had formulated this whole plan, he could have been given special powers to make general sweeping statements like "battle starts now!" or "all forces, unto the breach now!" or "start phase three!". He would not command the actual mechanics of starship battle, though, but would leave that to properly trained flag officers aboard properly equipped command ships.

After all, Sisko did primarily order around those fightercraft, both in "SoA" and "What We Leave Behind"...

Timo Saloniemi

Posted by Michael Dracon (Member # 4) on :

Nope sorry. Good theory, but it isn't what happened. The special effects were very consistant with what was said. Sisko ordered the Galaxy wings to engage the Galor class destroyers. And after that we actually saw several Galaxy class ships shooting the crap out of a Galor class.

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I thought a professional demon chaser like yourself would've figured it out by now. I'm the Slayer. Slay-er. Chosen One. She-who-hangs-out-a-lot-in-cemeteries? Ask around. Look it up: "Slayer, comma, the."
- Buffy, Buffy the Vampire Slayer

Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :

Man I gotta watch that ep again, really take in the details of it. We need to savor the few action scenes we're given...

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Here lies a toppled god,
His fall was not a small one.
We did but build his pedestal,
A narrow and a tall one.

-Tleilaxu Epigram