Can someone ask hiim if he can post the lunar ship from the credits??
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Awww yeah,...I'm inspired to make a DS9-era version. I've got an extra Norway primary hull that would serve nicely..
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
pinasov posts there - he doesn't post here anymore - or is it someone who has changed names?
Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :
Actually I do, but it�s Starship Freak nowadays. I�m pinasov there.
I�ve already posted a little wishlist of my own to Rob, so I�ll back of a little now. He got a deluge of requests after he posted some pics. You know, same old story, he gives a little, and we start to demand everything now. I think it�s best to lay low a while, so that he doesn�t start to think us ungrateful bastards.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
hey! Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
Yep, every other poster has their own request, although everyone's being respectful and not pushing too hard.
Seeing all these models is a real privilege. The "delta" was already one of my favourites, these pics just make it look even cooler. It's a lot more detailed than I expected.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Oh, if only it'd been labelled as the Iceland. . .
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Photoshop, my son...
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Yeah, but I'd know. . .
Posted by Guardian 2000 (Member # 743) on :
Those blue ramscoopy-things on the back of the nacelles are odd (and not just because one's brighter than the other).
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Probably experimenting with textures, the fronts are the same way.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Mabye that's why there's only one of them- warp imbalances. Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Wheee!
Intriguing detail on the underside. Landing gear doors? RCS clusters? Weapon installations?
Red and green hull running lights only visible from forward: nice naval tradition that makes little sense in 3D... Nacelle lights compensate.
No obvious bays for auxiliaries. This baby probably CAN land and take off.
Intriguing "spine" detail. The thing just ahead of the aft cutout looks like a single tiny "plasma recharger" (P-38 turbocharger cap) similar to the two on the NX-01 booms... Does the spinal structure aft of the bridge perhaps swivel for docking?
Where did beams emerge from when these were seen in action?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
My drool is soaking my keyboard... This is like pr0n for geeks.
Posted by Nim (Member # 205) on :
The upper-rear pose really makes her look like the Norway class.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
I put together a light-adjusted, to-scale orthographic composite if anyone wants it.
Posted by Irishman (Member # 1188) on :
Very very drool-worthy. Gotta love that lifting body
Posted by Trimm (Member # 865) on :
I wonder what those two box like details on the foreward part of the lower side are.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
Either Voyager-esque sensor palates...or possibly non-skid bottoms for retracted landing gear?
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Or lift engines. There are several such clusters across the belly, and they seem to feature pairs or triplets of roundish nozzleish things. If you squint right.
Of course, CoG issues would require some sort of vertical propulsion farther aft as well. Perhaps the actual impulse engines can vector down? Their construction certainly is intriguing, as if they were meant to slide in and out, or pivot around a vertical axis, or something. But tilting down is also a possibility.
The model seems to lack armament, but there are small squarish hatches in several places... It makes sense for an aerodynamic ship to have cover plates on the plasma and phase cannon banks. Did the ship ever fire anything else besides a phase cannon beam from the general bow area?
No nav deflector, either, but there are those four round yellow things below the bridge that need not be windows...
Finally, this is a big ship! For a reasonably sized bridge, it seems we need total length in the 150-180 m brackets. There's probably more volume inside the delta than there is in a Constitution saucer.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
I'm going to hazard a guess that with all this talk about Lifting Bodies - that it was built with atmospheric flight in mind. Easier to land it sometimes than send down shuttles or use the unreliable transporter. It mightn't have even been fitted out with a Transporter.
To me, the side view looks Sabre-esque.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
My guess would be that is has a cargo transporter, but nothing that's approved for organic matter. Remember, that tech was brand new in "Broken Bow" and it might not have filtered down to the older ships yet, particularly since it would likely require them to make room for new equipment.
Even if the ship was designed to land, I've got to believe they have some kind of aux craft aboard. There's what appears to be a lauch observation dome on her belly like the one on Enterprise. Perhaps there's only 1 door instead of the four that Enterprise has.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
Hmm, this does recall the saber as much as the Norway classes...
The greeblies on the bottom must be sensor palettes a la Voyager and basically everyone else. I'm also in favor of a shuttlebay of SOME sort being on the ship, though it's likely that they just didn't think anyone would be looking close enough - and they'd be right.
Mind you, these ships HAVE received upgrades too - when we first see 'em, they're blazing away with phase cannons as if they'd never had plasma weaponry. I see no reason why they wouldn't have torpedoes, fully-rated transporters (the Sarajevo from later on apparently did), and a slightly faster than warp 2 engine (given the implication that even old freighters could be easily upgraded).
I favor the two boxes on the ventral side as the deflector. Just like the saucer deflector of the Galaxy.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
The lack of a Big Brass Dish deflector is probably as solid evidence as any that this is the older of the two designs between this and the Intrepid style ship. Perhaps deflector tech hadn't taken that step yet when then Delta was built.
Posted by Manticore (Member # 1227) on :
Well, it seems to me as if the entire forward part of the superstructure appears to be the bridge. If you look at the window size, it seems like it's one deck, maybe two on the outside.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Appears so. There are no corresponding windows on the Intrepid's upper dome, but there are on the NX-01's.
Posted by Jason Abbadon (Member # 882) on :
I think the "Iceland" would have to have an inset bridge with a tiny sensor dome up there- otherwise it's a huuuuge ship (and we get into the whole size-problem with the Excelsior thing again).
Why does the intrepid's bridge look... smushed from the side?
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
That's a front view of the Intrepid's bridge. The Bussard Collector blocks it in the side view.
Posted by The Ginger Beacon (Member # 1585) on :
I second Jasons idea - although there's no reason for it not to be a large ship - I mean older tec tends to be bigger and clunkier.
I favour a smallish, slow ship with a recessed bridge and a relativly large crew, as less stuff is automated. As for EVA, I go for the ship being able to land, but not very often. It should have shuttles, and they never put a bay on when they drew it. Quick Robin, lets play with photoshop...(batman theme plays)
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
I'd like to see the "opening credits version" of this vessel before deciding on the scale. If the two ships are similar enough, I'd then like to assume that the modern one is built on the same basic keel as the predecessor and has the same general dimensions. The credits ship might have clearer scale-defining features...
I could see these lifting bodies acting as Sol system watchdogs, never loitering deep enough to interstellar space to actually need shuttles. They could be based off Mars, where landings and takeoffs would be less of a strain. No multimissionality, no flexibility, no credibility in the interstellar scene.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Possible. The only time we saw it show up was after Enterprise had returned to the Sol System. Can't remember if it was in the rag-tag fleet of the alternate timeline, but if it was, they were in pretty desperate straights and wouldn't really care if the ship was "meant" to travel outside the system. They'd use whatever they had.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Yup, there was one in the RTF. And yup, the poor ship probably had no choice...
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
I'm hip to the "Iceland" being an in-system ship. We've seen plenty with warp nacelles; even that research ship in "Regeneration" could have used warp purely for interplanetary travel.
Scale-wise, how close have we seen one to the Enterprise? Maybe they just have tiny portholes, a la Concorde..? And if it's that small, it could easily land on Earth too, again like that research ship. Antigravity is a wonderful thing...
Mark
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
Definitely a need for warp in defending Sol against evil interstellar intruders. Even if they are all as nice as the Borg and slow down to impulse before Saturn, only a warp-capable ship could intercept them before they reach torpedo range. And it's nice to have interstellar capabilities as an option, even if a largely theoretical one.
Both the Klingon battle and RTF scenes suggest a ship roughly similar to NX-01 and Intrepid in size. Perhaps a little broader, even. But nothing definite there, AFAIK - the ships in the RTF are fairly distant, and there's no telltale overlap wrt ships of known size.
Speaking of which, how big is that arctic research team's ship? Bernd suggests just 50 m in his listing. Did we see tiny CGI stickmen scurrying around her, or is the estimate based on space scenes?
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Just for my own knowledge, can some one give me a list of all the othos Bonchune has provided for Hobby Talk?
Posted by B.J. (Member # 858) on :
B.J.
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
Thanks
Posted by Mark (Member # 1819) on :
Does anyone know of a way that i could increase the image size of these renders without loosing too much image sharpness?
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Can someone ask hiim if he can post the lunar ship from the credits??
You mean the USS Emette eh?
m.
Posted by Irishman (Member # 1188) on :
USS Emette? Where'd you get that from??
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
From looking at a screenshot of the model sitting in LW.
M.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
So you're saying that wasn't CGI, that scene? Got any proof?
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
LW = Lightwave. So it's CG.
And you guys have already fogotten Matt?
Mark
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Matt who? Seriously.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Me? I just turn up from time to time to correct you lot. And to hunt down idiots who steal my artwork for their geeky webpages.
Memories are obviously short.
A for the USS Emmette: 276314 polygons to be precise.
M.
Posted by Topher (Member # 71) on :
Any chance of getting some pictures of the USS Emmette? Pretty please? Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
maybe.
Posted by machf (Member # 1233) on :
Why do people keep calling it "lunar ship", BTW? I thought it had been established it was an early warp vessel orbiting over a colony...
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
I've always thought of it as a Lunar colony seen below. But the nacelles seem to suggest a warp ship. And the fact that the ship shown right before looks very earth-based, it would be reasonable that the "lunar" ship is showing the first steps outside the Sol System.
Posted by Mark Nguyen (Member # 469) on :
And I, as someone who actually remembered Matt from our previous Calendar discussions et. al., would like to politely ask if he could whip something up of the Emmette as well, sorta like how we've seen views of the Intrepid et. al. I hereby recommend the use of Andy's firstborn as payment.
Mark
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
Pictures or no pictures, though, I'd like to know why it's the U.S.S. Emmette as opposed to just the Emmette. If this ship predates the NX-01, why would it have a USS prefix? Was it still supposed to part of some kind of combined Earth military force?
Oh... and what's the registry on her (if there is one)?
Posted by Captain Boh (Member # 1282) on :
Perhaps its just a behind the scenes nickname?
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:Pictures or no pictures, though, I'd like to know why it's the U.S.S. Emmette as opposed to just the Emmette. If this ship predates the NX-01, why would it have a USS prefix? Was it still supposed to part of some kind of combined Earth military force?
Perhaps the U.S.S. stands for United States Ship, just like naval vessels. Between First Contact and ENT, the United States obviously still existed, so maybe it was an American spacecraft.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
MattC:
(1) Remind me who you are again? (2) Are you serious about the ship being called Emmette? This is the official CGI model used on the show that we're talking about? (3) Is the "U.S.S." prefix on the model or did you just add that?
Thanks, -MMoM Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
I'd like to know where all this info about the lunar ship is coming from. I mean what is Lightwave, some sort of 3d model viewing program? And how did MattC gain access to the mode? And is the ship really called the Emmette? Does even have markings? I mean why write a name on the ship if it isn't even going to be visible. I liked to know the source of this info.
Posted by TSN (Member # 31) on :
"I mean why write a name on the ship if it isn't even going to be visible."
Well, by that logic, why even build the front half of the ship, since the credits sequence only showed it from the back?
It's not like it's difficult to slap a name on there. I'm sure whoever made the model just felt like it.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mars Needs Women: I'd like to know where all this info about the lunar ship is coming from. I mean what is Lightwave, some sort of 3d model viewing program? And how did MattC gain access to the mode? And is the ship really called the Emmette? Does even have markings? I mean why write a name on the ship if it isn't even going to be visible. I liked to know the source of this info.
First of all, yes, Lightwave is a modeling program. Second, from looking through his post history, it appears that Matt is a CGI modeler who has worked on the Trek calendar projects. Apparently, he knows Mojo. Those guys have access to this stuff for reference.
As for whether the information about the alleged Emmette is true, we'll have to wait for him to come back and tell us in order to find out. I am hoping for pictures, too.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
Oh, geeze. Guys, you need to calm down.
The model is labelled 'USS Emmette' in LW. Why? I have no idea. That's just what's it called.
As for the calendars, well, this year was TOS only, but I should have some stuff in next years (Ambassador, Excelsior and one or two other things).
I'll post stuff when i come back from holiday
m
Posted by Pensive's Wetness (Member # 1203) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC: Oh, geeze. Guys, you need to calm down.
The model is labelled 'USS Emmette' in LW. Why? I have no idea. That's just what's it called.
As for the calendars, well, this year was TOS only, but I should have some stuff in next years (Ambassador, Excelsior and one or two other things).
I'll post stuff when i come back from holiday
m
but sir? it's normal for everyone to be ape shit-ish here
but we look forward to pics Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Yes, Essentially MNW best expressed the most-common sentiments around here regarding such matters, which some of us had already skirted around - who, why, where, when, what, how, that sort of thing. I don't think we're quite all affected by the Drought Of Trek to the extent that we're going to obsess about a ship seen for two seconds in the credits of the Show That Killed Trek.
Posted by Aban Rune (Member # 226) on :
I will.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
I'll post an image when I come back...as long as it doesn't end up elsewhere again (i.e. http://www.stguardian.to/) without asking first.
m.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
It's a public forum, we can't guarantee that some lurker won't see it and post it in such a place, or someone here will send an acquaintance the link, and said acquaintance will then post it elsewhere.
Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :
MattC: I�m the webmaster of that domain, and I have always asked permission to post images and always credited the creators of the images with links to webpages or names. So I resent that accusation actually. But if someone emailed me pics which belonged to you without telling me, please name those pics, and I�ll credit you instead. I work hard to maintain my page, and get contributions from all over.
And btw, why single me out? Am I really the only one on the entire internet which have posted pics which belong to you?
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by Starship Freak: And btw, why single me out? Am I really the only one on the entire internet which have posted pics which belong to you?
There's 3. I don't recall you asking me permission to repost them elsewhere. Mind you, my memory is somewhat hazy these days.
M.
Posted by Starship Freak (Member # 293) on :
Hmm, I got those in my hotmail-adress from a fellow who called himself Matthew, that�s not you?
Ok, there�s no need to use the board for this, you and I can pm eachother, but if I credit you for these pics, can I keep them? And if I can, how? If not, I�ll take them down.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
I don't recall sending anything but like I said, my memory is hazy. We'll continue this in a pm. m
Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
quote:Originally posted by Starship Freak: MattC: I�m the webmaster of that domain, and I have always asked permission to post images and always credited the creators of the images with links to webpages or names. So I resent that accusation actually.
And btw, why single me out? Am I really the only one on the entire internet which have posted pics which belong to you?
Yup, I remember you emailing me for permission a couple of years back for some pics from my site. Most webmasters wouldn't have bothered.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Hey Mark, leave my firstborn or any-born out of your darstedly deeds! You could use Jason's 1:2500 clone! Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
Tells us the outcome of the battle over these pics.
Just ABOUT those pics anyway - never seen them before - was this model used on film - i.e. was this used in Generations or was that just all model work?
The Nacelles of the Excelsior class are interesting - never really seen an image of the Excelsior from above and from the back like that before. That pod that the nacelle pylons go into... do you think that whole assembly can lift out of the main body?
That third pic - the Ambassador says it's by a Matthew - is that you? The E-B and E-D is by someone else. It'd be nice to see the E-B lit like the other two ships are in that diagram. The Ambassador looks like the Ambassador done by those people over at that Scifi 3d art page that now can be seen in Ambassador Class investigation on Bernd's page. I think it was Tachy and Pedro who made it (Is the name "Tachy" allowed to be said around these parts yet or is it still atouchy issue?)
Andrew
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
We still get to see pics of the Emmette, right?
Posted by Mars Needs Women (Member # 1505) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC: Oh, geeze. Guys, you need to calm down.
The model is labelled 'USS Emmette' in LW. Why? I have no idea. That's just what's it called.
As for the calendars, well, this year was TOS only, but I should have some stuff in next years (Ambassador, Excelsior and one or two other things).
I'll post stuff when i come back from holiday
m
We'll, you know how I get when I don't take my pills...
The post I made wasn't in anger of frustration, I just wanted some concrete proof. All to often, I find that what is considered source material can be intermingled with conjecture or fan-fiction to the point that what was never really said/heard/seen on Star Trek can somehow be interpreted as canon. My apologies if I came on to strong but I just wasn't sure of just who you where MattC and wanted to make sure this wasn't bad or made up info.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Tells us the outcome of the battle over these pics.
The Nacelles of the Excelsior class are interesting - never really seen an image of the Excelsior from above and from the back like that before. That pod that the nacelle pylons go into... do you think that whole assembly can lift out of the main body?
Andrew
There's no battle. I'd just rather not have anything posted anywhere right now. I'm sick of being ripped off by the RPG clowns basically.
The Ambassador was built by Simon Coles and me with the kind input of Rick Sternbach, Lee Stringer and Ed Miarecki (who designed and built the minature). It weighs in around 800000 polys these days (in LW of course) with all lifeboats labelled indivually, hatches, warning labels, etc. Took me a while. Breaking my scaphoid in 3 places didn't help matters either. We're thinking of a version 3.0 at the moment. Depends on the workload really. As a side note, Doug Drexler (Ex-FI, Ex-Eden, designed the NX-01) went nuts when he saw it. Rick and Ed were quite touched as well. So, that was a good thi
Alain Rivard built the B, I textured it (it was nowhere near finished when those images were posted here). It's never been seen anywhere though it should be in a couple of publications coming up soonish. No idea about the pod. I do this for fun, not to analyse the engineering feasability of it all. I do that for my day job and that's enough for me (i design navigation systems for warships/subs/etc). Maybe, if you're lucky, I'll post up an image of the Excelsior (both NX and NCC versions) that Simon and I recently completed.
The Galaxy was built by Dave Clark with considerable work done to it by me to fix the multitude of geometry problems. It weighs in at 900K polys for the normal one, 1.2 million for the AGT version.
Tachy and Pedro's versions whilst amusing are low poly (though they're nice for distance shots). Mind, well, lets just say they hold up to having the camera a meter away from the surface.
Things have moved on since then.
m
Posted by Reverend (Member # 335) on :
I can tell you from experiance that the only whay to stop people nicking your work for there sites & RPGs is to not post them and keep it all on your hard drive, which is of course rather silly, for what would be the point of doing the work for free if you can't share it with the world.
It's one of the realities of doing such work on the net that once it's out there, it's no longer under your control. You just hope that not too many people crop or edit out your credit stamp that even though the site doesn't credit you, it's still on the image itself, which at the end of the day is what's going to end up on people's hard drives.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC: [QUOTE]Originally posted by AndrewR: [qb] Alain Rivard built the B, I textured it (it was nowhere near finished when those images were posted here). It's never been seen anywhere though it should be in a couple of publications coming up soonish. No idea about the pod. I do this for fun, not to analyse the engineering feasability of it all.
Tachy and Pedro's versions whilst amusing are low poly (though they're nice for distance shots). Mind, well, lets just say they hold up to having the camera a meter away from the surface.
Things have moved on since then.
m
Moved on? Techniques have become more advanced or you knew of their model/gave input or something? I'm gathering you mean techniques in CGI modelling.
You can put the camera up close - awesome - so that means you could do a shot say up against the hull and all the info is still there - i.e. textures/hull plating etc? Wow.
I've always wanted to see a picture of someone looking out of one window (say on the Enterprise D and looking up to someone in another window nearby - there are a few places on the D where that works. Or looking out one window and seeing part of the hull. I wonder if we should have seen the rest of the hull receeding away when looking out Janeway's ready-room windows and the obs-lounge?
Oh the pods thing - that was a general statement to start a possible discussion on such things, we've got to do SOMETHING around here, y'know!
Publications? Can you give us any ideas about things that are coming up that this work is for - just the Calendars?? Any chance of Unseen Frontier being back on the cards!?!
What other starships have you worked on?
Do you get to view the original models when you are designing/working on these ships or is it all from sketches/screen caps etc? Any work done on the obscure-esque Wolf-359 ships like the Challenger or the Cheyenne?
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:I can tell you from experiance that the only whay to stop people nicking your work for there sites & RPGs is to not post them and keep it all on your hard drive, which is of course rather silly, for what would be the point of doing the work for free if you can't share it with the world.
However, there was an instance here (I know this because I was directly involved) where someone (We all know who now, but I promised to always keep my source anonymous) sent me the photos of the DS9 Tech manual kitbashed models, and instead of posting them openly, I invited Flare members to PM me with their email addresses, so that I could send the pics to them in one or two lump emails, with the proviso that they were not to be posted on the net. Eventually said source allowed public viewing, but my point is that it did work as far as keeping the pics under wraps.
I think it goes without saying that we all want to see the pics of the Emmette, but we also understand MattC's dilemma as well. Hopefully there can be a way around this that makes everyone happy.
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: Moved on? Techniques have become more advanced or you knew of their model/gave input or something? I'm gathering you mean techniques in CGI modelling.
You can put the camera up close - awesome - so that means you could do a shot say up against the hull and all the info is still there - i.e. textures/hull plating etc? Wow.
I've always wanted to see a picture of someone looking out of one window (say on the Enterprise D and looking up to someone in another window nearby - there are a few places on the D where that works. Or looking out one window and seeing part of the hull. I wonder if we should have seen the rest of the hull receeding away when looking out Janeway's ready-room windows and the obs-lounge?
Oh the pods thing - that was a general statement to start a possible discussion on such things, we've got to do SOMETHING around here, y'know!
Publications? Can you give us any ideas about things that are coming up that this work is for - just the Calendars?? Any chance of Unseen Frontier being back on the cards!?!
What other starships have you worked on?
Do you get to view the original models when you are designing/working on these ships or is it all from sketches/screen caps etc? Any work done on the obscure-esque Wolf-359 ships like the Challenger or the Cheyenne?
Move on as computers now support models of millions of polygons.
Yes, you can get that close. Quite neat really.
Other ships...plenty. All 7 enterprises in one way or another. Couple of Romulan things, Klingons, Cardassians, Borg. Having a break from it at the moment though.
And no, I don't get the originals, though folks are usually kind enough to supply me with adequate reference. John Eaves and Lee Stringer have been particularly helpful on that front.
Publications, well there's the calendars. I know there's a Yesterday's Enterprise image in the 2007 one (it has my Ambassador in it). AS for other publications, I know there's another book coming. 126 pages of CGI starship goodness. But that's all I know (well, apart from the fact that the Excelsior, Ent-B, Galaxy and Ambassador we did are in it).
Anyway, back to my vacation.
M.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
One more question to pluck you from holiday goodness...
Did you use Bernd's evaluation of the differences between the Enterprise C and the ??Yamaguchi/Excalibur" when doing the YE pic for 2007? I never realised there were so many differences between the two.
Andrew
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
quote:Originally posted by Dukhat: However, there was an instance here (I know this because I was directly involved) where someone (We all know who now, but I promised to always keep my source anonymous) sent me the photos of the DS9 Tech manual kitbashed models, and instead of posting them openly, I invited Flare members to PM me with their email addresses, so that I could send the pics to them in one or two lump emails, with the proviso that they were not to be posted on the net. Eventually said source allowed public viewing, but my point is that it did work as far as keeping the pics under wraps.
You make it sound so. . . inclusive. The reality was anything but. In fact, it was made quite clear that the pics were going to be disseminated only to a chosen few who'd then quite happily discuss them openly, while those of us not blessed to be Acolytes Of The True Church Of Fanwankery were left to grovel in the dirt hoping for maybe a chance to touch the hems of your garments. It was the sheer outrage which that policy generated that led to the eventual widespread publication of the images - that, and the fact that one of the Chosen Few didn't agree with the policy and sent them to the rest of us anyway.
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Erm...why are we taking the conversation in this direction, guys?
I, for one, would actually like to *see* these pics that Matt has!
And you wonder why Okuda and Sternbach don't post here...
-MMoM Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
quote:Originally posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim: I, for one, would actually like to *see* these pics that Matt has!
Matt said, after his holidays. Now shush! Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
I'd like to see them as well.
But - I'm not going to jump through hoops for the privilege! Matt, it's your choice - either publish them or don't.
And, why do we have to keep beating ourselves up because Mike'n'Rick prefer TrekBBS or whatever? Historically it's always been the dominant discussion Forum, while we've remained an eccentric alternative. The likes of Okuda et al made a decision a long time ago to generally stick to one Forum rather than try to follow several, and who can blame them, they're busy people. . . We might not agree with their choice (and we don't have a hope of them altering it) but we should understand it.
It's also a circular process - O&S post there because it has lots of members and discussions, and there are lots of members and discussions because O&S post there. Mind you, I don't know how they keep track of it all, because most of the members are idiots and the discussions are shit.
Sorry, this is all getting off-topic, I'm sure to have someone anxiously wringing their hands that I'm driving off yet another valuable source! But I will say this: I know the (bad) reputation Flare has in some circles. I also know that over the years I've probably played more than my fair share in creating that reputation! But any Forum like this remains the sum of its parts, and I've never found anywhere else with as many amusing, interesting and well-informed people as we have here. Give me that over illegible posts by sycophantic illiterates any day.
So, I'm going to come out and a- a- a- *grits teeth* a-pol-o-gise to Matt. I wasn't trying to be adversarial in any responses I might have made to your posts. We just have a history of demanding proof for what (to us) appear to be sweeping statements that we should just accept. I'd love to see photos of the USS M. Emmett Walsh but failing that I'd say that in this situation your credentials are enough for me to provisionally accept the ship as having that name.
Posted by Masao (Member # 232) on :
quote:Originally posted by MattC: AS for other publications, I know there's another book coming. 126 pages of CGI starship goodness. But that's all I know (well, apart from the fact that the Excelsior, Ent-B, Galaxy and Ambassador we did are in it).
Hmm, that's the second time in the last 12 hours I've heard mention a new CGI ship book. Meni mentioned at Trek BBS that Mike Okuda had written up a description of his SotL calendar USS Bonaventure (NCC-1000) for inclusion in a book.
Posted by Jim NCC1701A (Member # 1021) on :
quote:Originally posted by Johnny: Yup, I remember you emailing me for permission a couple of years back for some pics from my site. Most webmasters wouldn't have bothered.
And he asked me if he could use a scan I took of Andy Probert's Klingon Scout from an old Starlog.
Hmm, but I didn't ask Starlog if I could scan it... Opps Posted by Johnny (Member # 878) on :
Yes, well that's something that concerns me on some pages, where people with scanners are credited for other people's work. It's not as though scanning a page from the Star Trek Magazine is such a huge accomplishment, although if someone tracks down a rare publication then that's something different.
In my case I took some photos of models at a Trek exhibition in London.
Anyway, on the subject of SotL 2007, Andy Probert's posted a teaser for his contribution.
The slanted walls might give an idea of what part of the ship it is. I'm hoping it's the main shuttlebay, but the few clues on the page make it sound like something more obscure. Maybe even dolphin obscure.
Posted by AndrewR (Member # 44) on :
The question asked is "what are these people looking at" - I think it's just Spot taking a dump on the carpet! Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Him: "Yup, the sign definitely says *CAUTION: WET CEMENT* in Betazoid." Her: "Bugger! I don't speak that!"
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
quote:You make it sound so. . . inclusive. The reality was anything but. In fact, it was made quite clear that the pics were going to be disseminated only to a chosen few who'd then quite happily discuss them openly, while those of us not blessed to be Acolytes Of The True Church Of Fanwankery were left to grovel in the dirt hoping for maybe a chance to touch the hems of your garments. It was the sheer outrage which that policy generated that led to the eventual widespread publication of the images - that, and the fact that one of the Chosen Few didn't agree with the policy and sent them to the rest of us anyway.
Lee, i can see why you and others would think that way. But there was a bit more going on than what you knew. And since the matter has been over for some time, I'll just explain now:
When said person sent me the pics, the first thing I did was to ask him for permission to post them on Flare. He was reticent at first, so instead I sent the pics to Bernd & the rest of the then "Wolf 359 Research team" not because I was trying to be an "Acolyte Of The True Church Of Fanwankery" as you so distinctly put it, but because Bernd et al. would have been able to make computer graphic diagrams of the ships so that you all could at least see what they looked like, if not to view the actual models themselves. I don't know how to make computer diagrams. They did. If I did know, I'd have done it without showing the pics to anyone. And yes, I also knew that I could trust them not to distribute the pics. Not that I wouldn't trust anyone else at Flare, but in my mind they were the logical people to send the pics to at the time (because of our loyalty to other sources like Okuda & Sternbach who sent us pics in the past)
In the meantime, while this was going on, I was still in contact with my source, & was still asking him if I could make the pics public. But by that time, everyone was acting like such children about it (and please don't say you all weren't, because you were), that someone just showed the pics anyway.
The reason I'm writing this is because your post seems (to me anyway) to be a personal attack on me and the few others who make up the group, and I'm simply defending myself. Should I have done things differently? Maybe. But I was the one who contacted the guy, and I was just trying to do the right thing while trying my best to let you guys at Flare be in on everything step-by-step. In the future, I'll just keep my mouth shut when I get a picture of something until I get permission to show it.
NOw back to our regularly scheduled Flare topic: The Emmette! Posted by Sol System (Member # 30) on :
Maybe the sign says "Hey ladies, this season the hot hairstyle mimics a nun's wimple!" and the woman is thinking "I'm in on the ground floor on this one."
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
It's a toilet.
Posted by Lee (Member # 393) on :
Nah, there are just some things that aren't done. Toilets on Trek? As if.
Once again I have to disagree with Duckie, although I don't like having to do so if it's going to be interpreted as a personal attack when it's not intended to be. But the facts are: a) the pics didn't just remain within the W359RT, but were sent to others who were deemed worthy; and, b) this supposedly-select group then proceeded to carry out a discussion in a public forum when it could just as easily have been conducted via e-mail, IRC, ICQ, whatever.
You were right not to publish them without first securing permission (I use the word publish because this is, after all, a public forum, no login is required to view, and we do have lurkers; anything posted here is immediately in the public domain and you won't have any real control over it from then on in). What we found unforgivable was the sheer disrespect that was shown by just acting like you could all happily chat away on your own private matter, ignoring the rest of this community. And that's what was going on.
Posted by Timo (Member # 245) on :
While I think this is highly relevant to the subject at hand, it might better be discussed on some other forum - if there's any escalation of controversy, that is.
Not yet, though. Not yet. I'm very much looking forward to hearing whether MattC can provide pictures, whether he wishes to do so, and whether a workable way for doing so can be found.
Timo Saloniemi
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
I see you guys have been using your time constructively...
Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
quote:Originally posted by AndrewR: One more question to pluck you from holiday goodness...
Did you use Bernd's evaluation of the differences between the Enterprise C and the ??Yamaguchi/Excalibur" when doing the YE pic for 2007? I never realised there were so many differences between the two.
Andrew
Nope. I had a copy of the list that Ed Miarecki made for me over the differences.
It doesn't precisely follow the Ent-C minature, primarily because that thing was underdeveloped. And since I work with a few shipyards (for my day day) I just use the excuse of design changes within the yard as each hull is built.
Meanwhile, I'm enjoying my vacation.It's 9:15 on a saturday night, my gf is in the jacuzzi gesturing...so I gotta go.
m.
m.
Posted by Dukhat (Member # 341) on :
So, Matt...home from your vacation yet? Posted by MattC (Member # 1391) on :
yeah, but I'm real busy at the moment.
m
Posted by The Mighty Monkey of Mim (Member # 646) on :
Tease.
Posted by Lurker Emeritus (Member # 1888) on :
Re: the missing part of Proberts teaser.
Since Enterprise season 3 I've been rethinking that bit on the Enterprise D plan that says Cetacean ops.
Aquatic Xindi, anyone?
Posted by Mikey T (Member # 144) on :
Well I guess we are about to see one version of it on the calendar.
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